Heartbreak hotel

Delphinus · #1 12-10-2007, 05:19 AM

My latest casualty.... and maybe a new record. Not even two weeks in my system and it's kicking off ... Wednesday will be 2 weeks and the rate this guy is dissolving I'll be surprised if there's anything left by then.

With flash, doesn't look too bad at first. But this should be a hairy millepora, the lack of polyp extension is pretty evident.

Without flash, same angle as above, the damage is more evident:

Another view, from underneath looking up, even more evident how badly it's sloughing off tissue:

The worst part is that there's an acro crab in there which I suspect will be a goner when the coral goes.

I'm not sure what's up with this phenomenon. I've invested heavily, both heavily and emotionally, into testing equipment to try to nail down a potential cause. Ultimately, I moved into my house in 2004 and I've never been able to keep an SPS alive ever since. It's the most demoralizing thing. People who complain about brown SPS have no idea how jealous I am of them ... I'd take brown over dead.

Parameters:
Ca = 400
Alk = 3.4 meq/l (~9.5 dKH)
NO3 = 5ppm
PO4 = <0.04

Not really the smoking gun one would hope for.

Really not sure what the next step is. I wish I knew what I was doing wrong...

Delphinus · #2 12-10-2007, 05:34 AM

Just to show that there was once a day where I thought I knew what I was doing when it came to SPS, here's a FTS of my 75g taken in January 2004 shortly before I moved.

Sigh, the good old days.

danny zubot · #3 12-10-2007, 05:42 AM

What kills SPS but leaves all other corals alone?

I guess if there were any significant levels of heavy metal the other corals would be dead right now as well. Or would they? What if you had a toxin in there that was at a low enough level that it doesn't really affect your softies, but still high enough to affect the more sensitive SPS? I don't really have anything to back this up with, it's just a theory, but if anyone else wants to chime in we might get this figured out.

untamed · #4 12-10-2007, 05:47 AM

I wish I could help... I'm sure you've gone over this in your own mind hundreds of times.

You're right, I don't see anything deadly in those water parameters. Not listed are: SpG, Temperature...but I'm sure you have those in control.

That leaves me with Lighting, Flow, some sort of element deficiency, or some sort of toxic contaminant/bacterial/viral agent.

None of this has been helpful to you at all...sorry.

Delphinus · #5 12-10-2007, 05:58 AM

I'm sort of wondering if it could be bacterial. Sort of like the brown jelly that usually attacks Euphyllia? But I have no idea, just a grasp on my part.

FWIW, I run my SG at 1.025 and temperature I try to keep at 26C (about 78-79F I think? If I have my conversions straight).

It is pretty uniformly SPS across the board. Softies, LPS (well, actually, I don't have many LPS. But I do have a bubble coral, and two Blastomussa's), anemones, and clams don't seem to be an issue.

This is now spanning two different systems. But one thing the two systems have in common are some rather large anemones. Two gigantea carpets in one tank, and one ridiculous ritteri in the other. It feels a bit of a desperate grasp though, to me, as there are tanks out there with these species with SPS that seem to do well.

Skimmin · #6 12-10-2007, 06:07 AM

I'm no expert on sps but... My tank is mainly dominated by softies but I do have a few lps and sps that seem to be doing quite well. Do you run carbon or phosphate remover of any kind? I believe carbon and even phosphate removers can help remove organic toxins. Ialways try to have atleast some carbonin my tank.(thats actually the only mechanical filteration I use) I know that softies can excrete a fair bit of toxins which can be potentially harmful to sps. Sorry I can't offer anything else.

danny zubot · #7 12-10-2007, 06:10 AM

How would you be able to determine if you had such an invader in your tank? I wonder if you could send a water and sand/rock sample to a lab for analysis? You know, someone who knows what to look for.

Salmon King · #8 12-10-2007, 06:22 AM

I have ventured into a few sps .Some do good/some turn brown some die.Asked Jaws about this and said luck of the draw so I dont think it is anything you do.

Samw · #9 12-10-2007, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delphinus

I'm sort of wondering if it could be bacterial.

This gets my vote.

Delphinus · #10 12-10-2007, 04:25 PM

FWIW this coral pictured is in an isolated tank now (the pictures were taken a day after it was moved into a 20g - the only thing it shares the tank with are an abalone, some cowries and the patch of zoos you see - which I threw in the tank a couple of weeks ago as a sort of canary to let me know if it's cycled or not). It might be too late though.

I actually gave up on the idea of ever putting SPS into my 75g. This coral was put into a separate system, which is why the same symptoms really surprised me. I was really hoping for a different outcome. Let's face it, my ritteri tank is actually quite void of diversity. 3 fish, 2 clams (well, 4, 2 are being babysat), and then some GSP that hitchhiked on a rock one of the clams is attached to.

But, I recently moved a Platygyra out of the 75g into the 115g because it was receding in the 75g, in the hopes to stem that loss. And there are plenty of other things that I do (ie. use the same turkey baster to feed), that for a pathogen would make for a convenient pathway to cross-contaminate the tanks. I know I'm reaching on this, but I do really wonder if there's something to this.

"Fail" is such a strong term BTW. I don't know if I consider my tanks as completely failed even if they can't support SPS. There are plenty of other things about them that aren't all doom and gloom. There's just.... "room for improvement" shall we say. Ok, no, I guess they're partially failed.

Sigh. I did call this thread "heartbreak" for a reason.