ICh

[bulletsworld]

Originally Posted by hawk

By raising temp the ick lifecycle and reproduction may be happening faster but all it will do for the fish is to make it even harder to breath. At one time raising temp was the norm, a left-over from treating fw ick where it does have some merit but marine ick is different. Temp manipulation is discussed briefly here, as well as uv and other treatments. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...2004/mini4.htm Good-luck

Thats right, it may speed the lifecycle of the parasite but is harder on the fish. Making the fish not only breath heavier, but make the fish exhausted. Again the reproducing of the Ich also comes faster. Turning the heat up, is not a cure, its speeding up the process. After your main tank is empty then turning up the heat is good, but not before. Understanding the lifecyle of the parasite is key.


Turn off your lights. I tell ya, it works. This is only to buy you time till you treat the ich. If you turn the lights on before the 10 days. Your fish will be the most infected, as ich moves towards the light.



Hope this helps ya.

[midgetwaiter]

If you already have the UV then great but I don't think it's gonna fix this. Stinky has the right idea here, it is somewhat tricky to use copper on these fish but it is not impossible. Given the gravity of the situation I'd say it was time.

This isn't for everybody but given your experience with fish you can manage it. Either go see Albert about it or PM me your number and I'll give you a call.

[Salmon King]

I have been in saltwater fish for 16 years.In the first few years almost every fish I bought had ich.I have treated boxfish and puffers with no loss of either species.UVsterilizers wont do the job.Raising the temp does speed up the reproduction of parasites .If you have a copperbase medication raising the temp does help.You should of got the fish out of your main tank /freshwater dipped them and put them in a clean quaratine tank that had a copperbased medication.They would of had a fighting chance then.Talk to any pet shop owner and grill them into what works on ich.They always say copperbased medications are the only thing that really works not these snake oil medications or food addtives.I know people are trying to help but alot of fish are dying needlisly.As always aquaratine tank will save you alot of moner and fish in the long run.

[RD]

Hey Tim, sorry to hear about your ich outbreak. Some good advice given in this thread, hopefully you'll be successful in saving your fish.

Regarding garlic, garlic has indeed been proven to have anti-bacterial, anti-fungal, anti-parasitic, and antiviral properties (Bartelme, 2003 and Cortes-Jorge, 2001). Over the past decade there has been a number of studies involving garlic and fish food and the anecdotal evidence with regards to feeding fish allicin complex (the active ingredient in garlic) to rid them of parasites appeared to be quite strong. The following is a link to a more recent study that confirms what some people have been saying all along.
http://www.scielo.br/pdf/jvatitd/v12n2/v12n2a03.pdf

A. M. Shalaby et al. EFFECTS OF GARLIC (Allium sativum) AND CHLORAMPHENICOL ON GROWTH PERFORMANCE, PHYSIOLOGICAL PARAMETERS AND SURVIVAL OF NILE TILAPIA (Oreochromis niloticus). J. Venom. Anim. Toxins incl. Trop. Dis., 2006, 12, 2, p.196


In this particular study the inclusion of garlic powder at a rate of 3% was shown to increase the overall digestibilty of protein, carbohydrates, and fat, as well as to lower the total bacteria count within the intestine, muscles, as well as the tank water itself.

Garlic is a great preventative solution to keeping your fish (and water) free from outbreaks of various disease causing pathogens, and while on its own it certainly won't cure a case of ich, it's no snake oil either.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by RD

Hey Tim, sorry to hear about your ich outbreak. Some good advice given in this thread, hopefully you'll be successful in saving your fish.

Regarding garlic, garlic has indeed been proven to have anti-bacterial, anti-fungal, anti-parasitic, and antiviral properties (Bartelme, 2003 and Cortes-Jorge, 2001). Over the past decade there has been a number of studies involving garlic and fish food and the anecdotal evidence with regards to feeding fish allicin complex (the active ingredient in garlic) to rid them of parasites appeared to be quite strong. The following is a link to a more recent study that confirms what some people have been saying all along.
http://www.scielo.br/pdf/jvatitd/v12n2/v12n2a03.pdf

A. M. Shalaby et al. EFFECTS OF GARLIC (Allium sativum) AND CHLORAMPHENICOL ON GROWTH PERFORMANCE, PHYSIOLOGICAL PARAMETERS AND SURVIVAL OF NILE TILAPIA (Oreochromis niloticus). J. Venom. Anim. Toxins incl. Trop. Dis., 2006, 12, 2, p.196


In this particular study the inclusion of garlic powder at a rate of 3% was shown to increase the overall digestibilty of protein, carbohydrates, and fat, as well as to lower the total bacteria count within the intestine, muscles, as well as the tank water itself.

Garlic is a great preventative solution to keeping your fish (and water) free from outbreaks of various disease causing pathogens, and while on its own it certainly won't cure a case of ich, it's no snake oil either.

Where did snake oil even come into this???

Great information there. I think this is actually what my brother based a lot of his research on, as well as his own experiments.

[Salmon King]

Rudy lost his fish.Garlic didnt work.How come they took treatment for parasites off the label.I guess they didnt want to get sued for peoples fish dying

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by Salmon King

Rudy lost his fish.Garlic didnt work.How come they took treatment for parasites off the label.I guess they didnt want to get sued for peoples fish dying

If this is directed at my post, read it again...maybe slower. I never said it cures ich. It helps fish fight ich by boosting their immune system. You can't be sued for peoples fish dying even if you do claim it is a medication for ich. As for the label, I have never seen a label on garlic. My grocery just sells it in bulk.

I have no problem if your saying you have had bad luck with trying garlic, or even dont recommend it but unless you have scientific proof to discredit the scientific proof given above, do not tell people its useless. On its own, it will not rid your tank of ich, I do not think anyone is claiming that. But it can help and certainly does not hurt anything. My fish are fed food soaked in garlic everytime they eat.

What exactly have Marine Biologists told you? Who were they?

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by Salmon King

I have been in saltwater fish for 16 years.In the first few years almost every fish I bought had ich.I have treated boxfish and puffers with no loss of either species.UVsterilizers wont do the job.Raising the temp does speed up the reproduction of parasites .If you have a copperbase medication raising the temp does help.You should of got the fish out of your main tank /freshwater dipped them and put them in a clean quaratine tank that had a copperbased medication.They would of had a fighting chance then.Talk to any pet shop owner and grill them into what works on ich.They always say copperbased medications are the only thing that really works not these snake oil medications or food addtives.I know people are trying to help but alot of fish are dying needlisly.As always aquaratine tank will save you alot of moner and fish in the long run.

No freshwater dip. Especially with puffers. Its entirely unnecessary if your about to quarantine them with copper. Freshwater dips can lead to osmotic shock and the long term affects do not always show up right away. I would highly recommend hyposalinity with puffers, as copper can be very harsh on scaless fish. I have had a Dogface die because copper levels spiked. If you do use it, you need to be testing the copper with a high end test kit about 3 times a day...with a puffer, maybe double.