Any Help.

[780Matt]

Hey fellow reefers,,


I was wondering if someone can shed some light. I have been into saltwater aquariums for about 9 months now. My water conditions were PERFECT. I even had an experienced store check it out for me. I had a clownfish with what looked like Ick. As per one store they told me to use Formalin. I followed the directions to a "T" I explained exactly what livestock and corals I had in the tank to make sure everything was good. I treated the tank last night with 2 drops per gallon as it indicates on the bottle. When I woke up my clownfish " the reason for treating the tank" had died and my scopas tang is now looking like its been bleached but yet he acting normal etc. my anenome was about 7-8 inches across and it shrunk to about 2. my xenia looks like it survived a fire. the only resource i had at 5am was to do a water change of 25% which i did. are my fish gonna die and are my anenome and xenia dead? Any advise would be great.

if they die its my 3rd crash in 9 months. maybe i should quit lol

thanks for your help

[christyf5]

Did they tell you to treat the entire tank or just the fish. Formalin is a pretty nasty chemical and crosslinks proteins permanently (ie, kills the outer layer of tissue as far as it can penetrate). It is also extremely harsh on fish gills and that is likely why your fish are struggling. Granted only 2 drops per gallon isn't that much but most corals and anemones won't tolerate any chemicals at all.

A better recommendation would have been to remove the fish and treat in a separate tank.

Your scopas tang is probably ok but stressed, they often get a very dull washed out coloration after the lights are out (ie when they're "sleeping")and when they're stressed out.

What to do now? Run carbon (not sure if carbon gets out formalin but it will help clear the water). See how things go and possibly do another water change later on today. Make sure there is plenty of surface agitation.

In the future for treating ick you might want to use something that is "reef safe" (ie, can treat the whole tank) or get yourself a 10 gallon tank to treat fish separately.

Good luck!!

[whatcaneyedo]

I've always caused more harm that good by treating a tank for a minor parasite or problems. Tearing everything apart to catch a fish and remove it to a QT tank seems to stess everything out even worse as well. I've found that if I just leave everything alone but maybe improve my fishes diet for a few days they can get over Ick on their own if they were healthy to begin with.

Just this last week someone gave me a Vagabond butterfly to store in my massive sump because it was eating all of their coral. Within a day or two of adding it to my tank my purple tang got ick. So all I did was feed it a little more often than I normally do and slowly the little white spots have disapeard. Maybe I'm just lucky, I dont know.

[Ryan Joel Smith]

I'd have to agree with "Whatcaneyedo". Try your hardest to keep your water quality in check and never use chemicals to try and correct nature because generally whatever problem you address by using chemicals will only be side tracked and often come back; a lot of times even worse than the first time. Some fish are just weaker than other others (immune system is not as strong) but it's safe to say if all parameters are in check and fish aren't stressing eachother out most sicknesses will just run their course similar to the swine flu :S (No need to spend millions on vaccines). Another good asset is a gang of cleaner shrimp and a cleaner wrasse.

[Delphinus]

I've never heard of using Formalin in anything but a temporary dip. I beleive formalin is basically "formaldehyde" so I'm afraid this could have a very bad outcome. Run large amounts of carbon, continue to do water changes maybe.

It might even be better to remove the livestock to a new system. See if the store that sold you the formalin can help out with that, at least with the fish and anemone.

Good luck.

[naesco]

Formalin will kill everything in your tank except the fish. Run carbon, do huge water changes and check to see if your tank is going to recycle again.

When you use formalin, which you should use only in a separate tank for medicating the fish, it depletes the oxygen which is probably why your fish died.
Put a air diffuser in the tank to bring up the oxygen levels.

Good Luck

[780Matt]

Well ,

So far... I have done 2 big water changes all my coral have died except the anenome looks like its at its original size but still under stress. my kenyan tree looks ok. but might be too soon to know if it will survive. So ill see what happens. I had called the store and they told me its my fault. Which it is but i would think that they would at least offer me advice on what i could do to save what i had as I have bought all equipment and over $2000 in livestock from them. but i guess it was best to hang up on me..

i wanted to cycle my tank for another week or so.. does anyone have any corals that they might be looking to get rid of.

thank you everyone for your help.
Im happy i was referred to this site.

[dsaundry]

Agree with all that has been stated so far, I personally don't use"Formulin", My Hippo Tang has gone through a few bouts and so long as he seems to be eating well I usually don't get too worried. As for your Clownfish symptoms, did they look like little tufts of cotton? if so I went through a similar situation a couple of years back. I did put them in my qt tank and treated it with "Medic" sold at J+L but I also made sure they were eating and water temp a little cooler than normal {don't know if that made a difference} and just watched them. within a week the tufts were gone and I returned them to the tank they have been happily living in for the past 2 years. Never really found out what it was but "Medic" is supposed to be coral safe as well. Don't be too quick to restock your tank until you are sure all the "Formulin" is out of the system.

It could have been a few things like flukes, ancor worms which a simple fresh water dip for a few minutes would have made most of them drop off. Could have been Ick or Brooklynella which fresh water dip would have helped him in the short term as you have to treet these diseases. Some articals to read do your research, it helps and you will not make as many rushed disitions. researching will slow you down and make you think about the situation. remember slow is always better. It is better to go slow and not loss every thing.
As for your soft corals if there is a little bit of a scrap left it may grow back.

Here anything with copper, formaldehyde is dealy to saltwater fish in higher dosage and corals low dose. There is many chemicals that are sole to treat fish that you can not introduce to corals as they will kill them, so be very carfull.

formaldehyde is used to treat Brooklynella it is the only thing that will kill the parisite.

Brooklynella is a type of saltwater ich caused by an infestation of the ciliated protozoan Brooklynella hostilis. It is most closely and commonly associated with subfamily Clownfish members of the Damselfish family, and therefore is typically referred to as Clownfish Disease. Although this parasitic scourge similar to others requires a fish host to survive, it is not particular in its quest to find one. Angelfishes, tangs or surgeonfishes, wrasses, jawfishes, and seahorses among others will host Brooklynella.

These protozoa reproduce asexually by means of simple binary fission through conjugation, which is why they are able to multiply so much more rapidly than Cryptocaryon (Marine Ich/White Spot Disease), and Oodinium (Velvet/Coral Fish Disease), and why it can kill fish within a few days and even hours upon recognition. For this reason accurate diagnosis and immediate treatment of all fish exposed to these life-threatening organisms is critical.

The above exert was cut and piasted form one of the articals below. This disease has been miss diagnosed for decades and treated wrongly acording to other articals I have read on the net. I believe I found a link on 3reef to the artical.

http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/ich...ooklynella.htm
http://saltaquarium.about.com/lr/saltwater_ich/34343/1/
http://saltaquarium.about.com/lr/hyposalinity/34343/3/
http://saltaquarium.about.com/lr/fish_diseases/34343/2/

I hope this helps someone,
Bill

[christyf5]

Originally Posted by 780Matt

Well ,

So far... I have done 2 big water changes all my coral have died except the anenome looks like its at its original size but still under stress. my kenyan tree looks ok. but might be too soon to know if it will survive. So ill see what happens. I had called the store and they told me its my fault. Which it is but i would think that they would at least offer me advice on what i could do to save what i had as I have bought all equipment and over $2000 in livestock from them. but i guess it was best to hang up on me..

i wanted to cycle my tank for another week or so.. does anyone have any corals that they might be looking to get rid of.

thank you everyone for your help.
Im happy i was referred to this site.

First off, I wouldn't be going back to that store ever again

Secondly, I would hold off before restocking the tank with corals. Its likely there is some residual formalin still in your tank that could affect them so it would just be a waste to add them if they're going to die. Its also likely your tank will need more time to recover if it does need to cycle. I would wait close to a month at least with weekly waterchanges and keep running carbon (change it out every week or so) just to make sure you're starting from the best point possible.

And definitely don't hesitate to post here first if you are having any issues at all, this is a pretty busy board so you'll probably get a quick answer