Nano Bubble Injection

[soapy]

I'm not sure why you guys are calling this idea a gimmick? Maybe the silly terminology or the tacky feel to that first linked website. Which by the way I have no affiliation with. Nor am I selling anything. Those people don't even have their gimmick device in production yet. I am not trying to trick anyone into doing anything stupid to their tank. Perhaps this thread got off on a wrong footing?

I am merely interested in the effect and use of small bubbles on a reef tank in addition to what is already happening in a skimmer. Is it not reasonable to explore what affect fine bubbles have on fish, corals and the water column? Every day at low tide large parts of many reefs are pounded with waves and submerged in fine bubbles, how is that a gimmick not worth considering? Isn't this hobby about recreating a small slice of ocean in a little tank and everything we do works towards that simulation, so why not bubbles? The idea might be total junk or its implementation unreasonable but I would love to hear exactly why, with reasons, proof, science, that sort of discussion. Lets weigh the pros and cons, do a cost benefit analysis and see what we have here. Sometimes people learn by looking at the most ridiculous of ideas no?

[soapy]

Here is a potential real world application for a micro bubble injection system, an automated frag tank or non-photosynethetic high feed system. This is not your grandmothers fresh water plastic diver bubbler, these are bubbles reduced in size by the shearing action of a high speed return pump. There are various other micro bubble technologies being used used and tested in the water treatment industry perhaps one of these could be utilized in an industrial scale frag operation if bubbles are shown to be beneficial or at the least harmless. We know what they do in a skimmer right?

I believe the high walls and raised lighting solves the problem of bubble spray in this design. The problem of popping bubbles I do not think is as great as one might imagine in any case. Furthermore if your frag operation is located in an industrial space or unfinished basement is salt creep a huge issue?

The idea is to feed on a timer and then blast the tank with bubbles and flow a set time after feeding to cleanse the tank. This cycle could run multiple times a day. For low flow loving corals it could alternate long low flow periods with shorter high cleanse ones?

[Aquattro]

Sure, bubbles will work as you propose. Waste water treatment uses the exact method in aeration tanks. However, I wouldn't be interested in making my entire tank into a skimmer. I have a skimmer that performs that function already. Most hobbyists go insane now with any microbubbles in the tank, adding them on purpose isn't going to sell well.

Also, cost vs return is probably very high. I can't see a huge benefit to this over a high end skimmer. Salt creep would be an issue. I have enough of that now with surface agitation.

I just don't see this becoming mainstream for hobbyist tanks. It's just not something I would even consider.

[soapy]

I am glad to see you are beginning to warm up to the idea. Agreed, even if this thing makes sense at some point for a display it would be awhile before it is ready for primetime. Maybe never.

These guys may want to turn their entire tank into a skimmer a few hours a day:
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2002/1/aafeature Those are butt ugly tanks anyway.

I don't see cost being a huge problem since you would be generating bubbles with the same technology as a skimmer? A return pump fed air by a limewood airstone and air pump makes a ton of small bubbles. That brings up the question of optimal bubble size, which could greatly affect cost.

[Aquattro]

Originally Posted by soapy

I am glad to see you are beginning to warm up to the idea.

No, I agreed the technology worked well in waste water treatment. I think this, for tanks, is dumb. There's a difference

Fun Fact. Don't ever fall into the aeration tank at a sewage treatment plant. You will sink to the bottom and drown. Too much air to float, not enough to breath.

[MitchM]

Reef Central had a tank of the month, 8 years ago, that used intermittent air injection.
Pic and diagram of the setup is about half way down the page.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-04/totm/index.php

I'm not crazy about the idea if you run air injection 24/7, intermittent probably wouldn't hurt anything as long as you had strong enough flow otherwise to dislodge the bubbles from the corals and live rock.

.

[soapy]

Originally Posted by MitchM

Reef Central had a tank of the month, 8 years ago, that used intermittent air injection.
Pic and diagram of the setup is about half way down the page.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-04/totm/index.php

I'm not crazy about the idea if you run air injection 24/7, intermittent probably wouldn't hurt anything as long as you had strong enough flow otherwise to dislodge the bubbles from the corals and live rock.

.

Hey thanks Mitch, great link. Interesting setup on that tank.

I agree running 24/7 would not be good. Other places I've read that guys are running for a couple hours in the evening. I see that TOTM guy does 1 minute bursts every 3 hours. I was thinking it might be good for 1/2 hour or an hour twice a day, low tide twice a day like on a reef?

In my short tests Ive found that the bubbles don't really stick to the coral flesh or the rocks unless there is an overhang that can trap it. Algae on the other hand gets lots of bubbles caught up.