What is your opinion on the hobby's status?

[jorjef]

Originally Posted by sphelps

Second if you've ever been around your LFS at shipment day then you've seen the countless boxes of wild caught specimens which arrive regularly. If you consider the thousands of retail locations around the world you'd be unwise to suggest this has little impact on the sensitive ecosystem supporting this business.

This comment I believe supports why we are seeing a lot of livestock way smaller then in the past...Few example Fungi plates, Aussie scolly's, some species of fish hippo, yellow tangs, blue green chromis, I saw a six line that I swear was a 1/2" long , maybe even clams.

If the collectors don't have the means or legally can't reach out to new collecting sites I would suggest due to demand the area they have historically collected from doesn't have time to produce the same sizes say... fungi or scollys we were use to in the past... Just a theory.

[gobytron]

I'm not sure those of you who say that our hobby is drop in the proverbial bucket have really done much research into just how destructive this hobby is.

It's well worth doing some looking into.

Don't just consider the depletion of fish and coral populations, but the massive amount of power that is used and consumed to enable us to enjoy them.

That being said, whether you believe we have a negative affect or not, ocean acidification is real and documented and speeding up.

Nobody knows better than we do what drastic fluctuations in PH means for living reefs.

[Scythanith]

Gobytron, please research what's more destructive, harvesting coral from the coral reefs, or harvesting coral reefs for the use in concrete production.

Honestly though any hobby has it's impact on the environment. Hikers wear gear made of synthetic materials that have toxic byproducts during construction. Standup Paddleboarders have foam and fiberglass boards. People who drive electric cars still roll on rubber tires and utilize chemically hazardous battery packs. Not to mention if they don't charge their batteries purely off of sustainable power sources they are hypocrites. The construction of solar panels is still pretty bad for the environment.

Am I saying we shouldn't be doing everything we can to lessen our footprint, not at all. But there is no perfect solution. I believe we are making an impact, but nothing compared to other industries. Think about this. How much energy does Wal-Mart use for their store lighting alone? Reefers are quick to adopt new technology. How many reefers switched to LED's to save on energy alone? What impact could Wal-Mart make if it switched to solar-tubes and LED's? Let alone the amount of bulbs they replace and add to the landfills a year.

Acidification of the oceans will change the game for sure. Like I always say, humanity may wreck the earth to the point we cannot exist on it anymore and we leave or go extinct. But the Earth will adapt, animals will evolve, and the blue marble will keep on spinning without us.

I love discussions like this

[gobytron]

Originally Posted by Scythanith

Gobytron, please research what's more destructive, harvesting coral from the coral reefs, or harvesting coral reefs for the use in concrete production.

Honestly though any hobby has it's impact on the environment. Hikers wear gear made of synthetic materials that have toxic byproducts during construction. Standup Paddleboarders have foam and fiberglass boards. People who drive electric cars still roll on rubber tires and utilize chemically hazardous battery packs. Not to mention if they don't charge their batteries purely off of sustainable power sources they are hypocrites. The construction of solar panels is still pretty bad for the environment.

Am I saying we shouldn't be doing everything we can to lessen our footprint, not at all. But there is no perfect solution. I believe we are making an impact, but nothing compared to other industries. Think about this. How much energy does Wal-Mart use for their store lighting alone? Reefers are quick to adopt new technology. How many reefers switched to LED's to save on energy alone? What impact could Wal-Mart make if it switched to solar-tubes and LED's? Let alone the amount of bulbs they replace and add to the landfills a year.

Acidification of the oceans will change the game for sure. Like I always say, humanity may wreck the earth to the point we cannot exist on it anymore and we leave or go extinct. But the Earth will adapt, animals will evolve, and the blue marble will keep on spinning without us.

I love discussions like this

No one is saying that the hobby is the worst out of all of the things humans do to kill their home.

You're missing the point here.

Sphelps probably said it best in his post above.

[Bayside Corals]

Originally Posted by jorjef

This comment I believe supports why we are seeing a lot of livestock way smaller then in the past...Few example Fungi plates, Aussie scolly's, some species of fish hippo, yellow tangs, blue green chromis, I saw a six line that I swear was a 1/2" long , maybe even clams.

If the collectors don't have the means or legally can't reach out to new collecting sites I would suggest due to demand the area they have historically collected from doesn't have time to produce the same sizes say... fungi or scollys we were use to in the past... Just a theory.

Smaller sized fish are ordered on purpose because that's what the majority of customers want. If someone is looking for larger fish just ask and they can be ordered. There are no shortage of Larger fish from the collectors. It's just a trend right now where most people either have smaller tanks so they want smaller fish or they have a larger tank but still want a small fish to watch them grow.

When it comes to corals the smaller sizes are due to them being fragged right from the collector so they can maximize profit. Or for the not easily fraggable corals like fungias and brain corals it all comes down to color. They collect only the colorfull corals no matter the size.

In the old days people wanted nice big corals to put in their big tanks (because nano tanks were impossible to keep or not widely known about) So they collected mostly medium to large sized corals but in every color including a large portion of brown corals. It was the size of the corals that used to matter and not as much the color.

Now most people don't care about the size to a point. They just want the newest craziest color possible. It's all about what the customers want. Trust me if customers wanted big brown/average colored corals we could make that happen. but that's not what most people want.