travisc's ultimate new-to-the-hobby newbie build. Dig it!

[Myka]

Originally Posted by travisc

Yes I'd say the total water volume in the tank full would be roughly 591 gallons. The sump is 60 × 19 × 15. So 74 gallons but it's not full and with the pump and skimmer in it would be roughly 50 gallons. Then if you count the 55 gallon refugium tank... say a total of 680 gallons of water. I also have an Eheim professional 3 1200XL (well actually 2 of them....the first guy that was helping me out told me to purchase them...) which will be installed for basically media filtration but may also filter the water and take some of the work load off the skimmer?

Why don't you sell all that stuff, and buy a bigger skimmer? Cut your losses now. A skimmer that is too small on a tank that is this big will be a really big problem. Trying to clean up that much volume after the fact will be very, very tough and expensive.

I'm being really persistent not because I want to be right, but because I really think you're making a mistake, and as a newbie I really don't want you to fail or be so frustrated that you quit. Shell out a few more bucks now, and you will have things much easier on yourself in the long run. Of all things, please don't cheap out on the skimmer. PLUS, I really want to see this tank look REALLY sweet!

[travisc]

I appreciate your concern. Would have been nice to have had all this info and help before purchasing everything. I can't blame anyone but myself for not doing my own due diligence. It's a hard pill to swallow spending $800 on the skimmer and $900 for the 2 cannister filters. Then plus even if I would be able to sell any of it (not likely anyone would want those canisters ) I'd be taking a big hit on that as well. I looked at the link you posted to the bubble King and 1900 euros. ... which would be roughly $4000 cad plus shipping. ... ouch

What about adding a 2nd ATI to the sump? Would that be a possibility? There is room for 2 plus cost effective. ...?

[Myka]

Originally Posted by travisc

I appreciate your concern. Would have been nice to have had all this info and help before purchasing everything. I can't blame anyone but myself for not doing my own due diligence. It's a hard pill to swallow spending $800 on the skimmer and $900 for the 2 cannister filters. Then plus even if I would be able to sell any of it (not likely anyone would want those canisters ) I'd be taking a big hit on that as well. I looked at the link you posted to the bubble King and 1900 euros. ... which would be roughly $4000 cad plus shipping. ... ouch

No, no you don't order direct from Bubble King. Here's a link for the Supermarin 300 at Reef Supplies which is a Canadian supplier and Canreef sponsor. Keep in mind the Canadian dollar has plummeted though, so the pricing ($2430) is probably not totally accurate. It's not in stock, but it could be ordered unless he's not carrying BK anymore for some reason (I see he only has one BK currently in stock). http://www.reefsupplies.ca/online-st...n-Skimmer.html If that doesn't work for you, PM me.

Where did you buy the canisters and the skimmer from? Were they special orders? Did you get them wet yet? How long ago did you buy them? Maybe you ca take them back just for a re-stocking fee? If all else fails, if you buy your new skimmer through the same place, then if they are a reputable dealer they should be willing to let you trade it back in for a re-stocking fee if it wasn't a special order. If it was a special order, you're probably hooped and would have to sell it yourself.

Originally Posted by travisc

What about adding a 2nd ATI to the sump? Would that be a possibility? There is room for 2 plus cost effective. ...?

That's not a terrible option. You might need to modify the sump a bit so that the skimmers don't share a chamber so they aren't skimming water that the other just skimmed. I could draw you up a design...

See what you can do about taking those canisters back or selling them. They really aren't going to be much use to you and are worth more unused. Even if you sold them for $500 you could buy reactors with that money to run media and they would be way, way, way easier to work with than canisters.

[sphelps]

Love the tank size and how low it sits, pretty sweet.

I'd suggest rather than upgrading the skimmer now is just running it for a while and adding a second one later. Why not run two small skimmers instead of one large? Actually makes more sense in a lot of ways when you think about it. Looks like you'll need a bigger sump to fit two but I'm pretty sure you probably need a bigger sump anyway . If you loose just an inch off the main display that's 21+ gallons alone plus the extra volume from plumbing, skimmer and the other tank you're setting up. Doesn't quite add up properly in my head so be careful of that, might need check valves as a minimum.

[travisc]

Thanks Sphelps!

I purchased everything from Golds. They had to order in everything tho...
the skimmer has been in fresh water for 2 days as we water tested. The 2 cannister filters are new in box (well one in the box as the 2nd box was taken out with the recycling this morning. ..)

I like the idea of adding another ATI skimmer then having to try to sell everything. One of the cannister filters were opened before I received it and the tubing and hoses were removed. I called Golds to see if I could exchange it for store credit for fish since I don't need the second one and that it was opened with parts removed. He said he would check with his supplier...so I don't think taking everything back is an option

[Myka]

Originally Posted by sphelps

Looks like you'll need a bigger sump to fit two but I'm pretty sure you probably need a bigger sump anyway . If you loose just an inch off the main display that's 21+ gallons alone plus the extra volume from plumbing, skimmer and the other tank you're setting up. Doesn't quite add up properly in my head so be careful of that, might need check valves as a minimum.

Yeah, there's a few things about the sump too...

Like you said, there's probably not enough volume to catch the back flow from the plumbing, but also those 2 filter socks are going to plug up FAST with that much volume of water. Looks like a Concept built sump...they are good to deal with.

Originally Posted by travisc

I purchased everything from Golds. They had to order in everything tho...
the skimmer has been in fresh water for 2 days as we water tested. The 2 cannister filters are new in box (well one in the box as the 2nd box was taken out with the recycling this morning. ..)

I like the idea of adding another ATI skimmer then having to try to sell everything. One of the cannister filters were opened before I received it and the tubing and hoses were removed. I called Golds to see if I could exchange it for store credit for fish since I don't need the second one and that it was opened with parts removed. He said he would check with his supplier...so I don't think taking everything back is an option

You should be able to at least take the one back for store credit since it was not complete. There's no reason you should be stuck with it.

[travisc]

Skimmer....sump...ugh!! Thanks for the extra grey hairs!! Lol

[Myka]

Originally Posted by travisc

Skimmer....sump...ugh!! Thanks for the extra grey hairs!! Lol

You should have come here first!

Sorry, this always happens on someone's first build, it's just that your first build is huge so your mistakes will be huge.

[travisc]

I texted Matt at concept to see if the sump is large enough to hold a second skimmer. Physically there is room in the compartment for another ATI 250. Cost wise it would be another $800 ish to purchase another one. Then there would be no haste of returning or trying to sell equipment. The 2 skimmers then should be more then enough? Then really the only concern would be keeping a good eye on the socks ?

I really appreciate everyone's help, advice and praise on the tank. It may be a bit discouraging now but benificial in the long run. I may need a week on the beach to distress before I finish the set up though! Lol

[Myka]

Originally Posted by travisc

I texted Matt at concept to see if the sump is large enough to hold a second skimmer. Physically there is room in the compartment for another ATI 250. Cost wise it would be another $800 ish to purchase another one. Then there would be no haste of returning or trying to sell equipment. The 2 skimmers then should be more then enough? Then really the only concern would be keeping a good eye on the socks ?

I really appreciate everyone's help, advice and praise on the tank. It may be a bit discouraging now but benificial in the long run. I may need a week on the beach to distress before I finish the set up though! Lol

Travis, the concern with the sump size is when there is a power out or the return and skimmer is shut off there will be back flow into the sump. The operating water level of the tank will be higher than the non-operating water level of the tank. All that volume, plus the volume in the pipes will back flow into the sump. Your sump size compared to the size of the display tank is very small, so there is a concern that you do not have enough empty volume in the sump to hold the back flow without the sump overflowing. Some people use check valves to prevent back flow, but they need to be cleaned regularly or they will leak, so a long power outage would mean a wet floor. The best option is to have a sump large enough to hold the full volume of back flow.

As far as the 2nd skimmer goes, you would want to run the skimmers in parallel rather than putting them both in the same chamber. If you put them both in that same chamber then they will be re-skimming water that the other has already skimmed and will thus be less efficient. The footprint of the skimmer is just over 16 x 10"? So if the sump is say 22" wide then you could put the skimmers beside eachother with a divider running between them and the water would flow through each section separately and prevent them re-skimming.

If you can forgive my prehistoric 2 min drawing...this is what I mean (use your imagination for the baffles between the skimmers and the return pump haha).