Legality question

[saltcreep]

It's been pretty much covered. All scleractinia require CITES permits, be it an export or re-export permit.

Since these corals are not endemic to the US, a re-export will be required to be obtained prior to shipping from the US. With that application the original export permit (from the original country of origin) will be required to be supplied to the US Fish and Wildlife.

It's a little blurry when dealing with cultured product as in many instances, tracing the original import to the US is almost impossible.

Yes, when dealing with CBSA (or Canadian Wildlife) they do not have the resources nor the knowledge to adequately deal with imports of coral. Further complicating things will be the new legislation coming into force in December that will oversee imports of fish (but that's a whole other ball of wax).

[naesco]

A couple of points need to be re-stated and comments made.

It is simply illegal to import SPS into Canada without CITES permits accompanying the shipment.

If you attempt to do so you will be charged with a serious offence and the Courts will deal with you severely.

A hobbyist who imported a butterfly and got the exporter to falsify the invoice was fined $25,000.00 and the courts comments were harsh to him.

The comment that border staff would not be able to tell a softy from and SPS is not true.
Wildlife have experts on staff who can do a better job at identifying coral than 99% of us on this board.

If you get horny over a certain coral picture, print it out and take it to your LFS. They will find an exporter who will ship them one for you.

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by naesco

A hobbyist who imported a butterfly and got the exporter to falsify the invoice was fined $25,000.00 and the courts comments were harsh to him.

I assume you are talking butterfly fish? A few people posted earlier that fish don't require cites yet, why would someone falsify a document to say otherwise? Was this an endangered one? Just curious as I prefer to buy fish after only seeing them first hand anyway.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by intarsiabox

I assume you are talking butterfly fish? A few people posted earlier that fish don't require cites yet, why would someone falsify a document to say otherwise? Was this an endangered one? Just curious as I prefer to buy fish after only seeing them first hand anyway.

No it was a butterfly on the CITES list that the collector imported. Marine fish that we import do not require CITES yet. There was talk about putting the Bangaii Cardinal on the List but it was not approved.

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by naesco

No it was a butterfly on the CITES list that the collector imported. Marine fish that we import do not require CITES yet. There was talk about putting the Bangaii Cardinal on the List but it was not approved.

Wow, that turned into one expensive bug!

[Myka]

Originally Posted by naesco

If you get horny over a certain coral picture, print it out and take it to your LFS. They will find an exporter who will ship them one for you.

That's what I do!

[saltcreep]

Originally Posted by naesco

If you get horny over a certain coral picture, print it out and take it to your LFS. They will find an exporter who will ship them one for you.

But that product still may not be able to be shipped to Canada. Again, there are issued with obtaining re-export permits from USFW for some cultured corals.

[lastlight]

Wholesalers just need to stumble upon similar looking corals with no specially described lineage right?

[saltcreep]

Sure can...as long as you are able to obtain permits. This is essence is the entire point of the thread. It is actually pretty black and white.

[lastlight]

I mean a wholesaler is always getting corals in. If they spot something that looks just like a red planet on a dive could they just bring that in via the same process they bring us Canadians all the other stuff we get? It would not be stamped ORA...