Suggestions for a FW setup?

Delphinus · #1 08-09-2006, 09:37 PM

I'm tired of looking at my FW tank, which I think I've seen cleaner sewage treatment plants ... so I'm thinking I'd like to tear it down and start a new setup, one where I don't concern with trying to grow plants because that's where it seems some magic threshold got crossed, before I tried growing plants it was "so-so" but now that I have plants in there it's more in the category of "utter abomination".

So I'd like to keep my current fish, and design a setup around them (minus real plants, fake plants may be OK though), and maybe have some schooling fish of some sort (tetras?) or at least, fish that occupy the middle part of the water column because all I have right now are ever-invisible bottom dwellers.

Fish are:
- 2 clown loaches (which at the 6 or 7 year old mark, are in the size category of "miniature trout" - seriously, about 5" in size)
- 1 bristlenose plec (I had a pair, but I recently lost my female)
- 1 butterfly loach (sometimes called "UFO plec")

For free swimming fish I was thinking some tetras of some kind, or some other kind of reasonably peaceful open water swimmers.

I was thinking maybe a 50g, 48" wide. Currently the tank is a 30" 30g. I can't go too large as the spot it sits on is above the garage in a bonus room so shoring up the floor is not an option. But I figure something like a 50 would work because it gives the fish some swimming room without stepping up the volume too drastically. (I think I once heard you can go up to 75g usually without needing to reinforce the flooring underneath..)

I'm not 100% sure what my question is.. I guess. ... do you think this could work? If not, what are some good ideas for a setup for some larger clown loaches that I could consider?

I was also maybe thinking of going with a small sump, since then I could access filters a little better (maybe even {gasp!} make use of bioballs), hide things like the heater, not worry about water fluctuation because I could use a float valve, etc. etc.

Maybe even a sort of closed loop with the input and outputs on opposite sides to get some sideways unidirectional flow, to kinda/sorta mimic a river setup (although now I'm just dreaming, but I still think it's a neat idea).

Any thoughts?

midgetwaiter · #2 08-09-2006, 11:12 PM

The combo of the clown loaches and the butterfly loach is interesting. The butterfly loaches prefer cooler (higher oxygen content) water and the clowns usually much warmer. What temp do you keep your tank at?

A sump sure makes life easier with FW too, worth looking at if you don't mind spending a bit more money on the setup. A river tank is a neat idea but if you crank up the flow rate mid water swimmers will be tricky, most of the little schooling tetras are from pretty slow moving streams and pools. I'm actually having a pretty tough time thinking of something to suggest.

Your loaches are still babies, just wait until they get over a foot. Your ideas are all solid though, should work out fine.

trilinearmipmap · #3 08-09-2006, 11:13 PM

I have always wanted a dedicated clown loach tank, they are IMO about the nicest FW fish. I got rid of the clown loaches in my plant tank because they eat snails, and snails IMO are essential for a plant tank.

Anyway one of the nicer FW tanks I ever remember seeing was about 15 years ago in a restaurant, there were three things: a school of clown loaches, a school of silver dollars, and high current. The clown loaches love to play in the current and appreciate the high oxygen content.

I suggest some streams or seios to set up a good current, a large driftwood piece, and maybe some Java Fern on the driftwood. I would go for as big a tank as possible, full-grown clown loaches probably want the same size tank as a full-grown Tang would.

doublette · #4 08-09-2006, 11:20 PM

Have you thought about Rainbowfish? They swim at all levels of the tank, are active, not shy and most of all - beautiful fish! We have some Banded Rainbows (Melanotaenia trifasciata), Boesemani (Melanotaenia boesemani) and New Guinea Reds (Glossolepis incisus) in our 135G with a pleco, clown loaches and balas.
As for decorating...very interesting things can also be done with driftwood and maybe a fake plant or two.
Debbie

SeaHorse_Fanatic · #5 08-09-2006, 11:33 PM

Yes, I love my Rainbowfish too. I have Red Irians, Bosemannis, Turquoise & Neon Dwarfs. I also have a small school of Long fin Rosy Barbs & Congo Tetras. These are all nice, colourful fish that should go well with what you already have.

Anthony

Cap'n · #6 08-10-2006, 02:59 AM

The large clown loaches are going to make it difficult to keep smaller schooling fish. I like the ideas of rainbowfish and especially the silver dollars. Add in a pair of severums and you have a similar setup to the one I am planning to change my tanganyikan tank to.

What about a pair of firemouth cichlids? Not the school you were thinking of but they would go great with the loaches and would be very visible.

Delphinus · #7 08-10-2006, 08:23 PM

Cool, thanks for the suggestions. yeah, maybe "schooling" isn't quite what I meant, I meant something that "doesn't sit on the bottom and hide all day long".

Midgetwaiter, I keep my temp around 23. I didn't realize that the two loaches were incompatible (at least in the water temps they prefer). You can tell that the butterfly loach likes fast flow. I dunno, I've had this guy at least 5 years or so now. I haven't a clue what he eats, never comes out for food, but I see him at night darting about. I kind of wonder if I did go to a cleaner setup whether he'd have a harder time, maybe he's subsisting on the cyanoslime I get growing on my plants all the time.

Yeah, I know my loaches are pretty wee all things considered. They are pretty comical fish, it's too bad they make keeping any kind of snail impossible. Every now and again I'll throw some excess snails out of my outdoor pond barrell into the tank for them to go nuts on. Kinda mean to the snails I guess but there are hundreds of them in that barrell anyhow, they hitchhiked in on some cattails, the cattails never lived through the winter but the snails sure did.

midgetwaiter · #8 08-10-2006, 11:16 PM

That's a comfortable temp for the butterfly but lower than most people keep clown loaches. A big part of that is that the clowns seem to resist ich better at those temps and being scale less and wild caught that's always a bonus. If you aren't having trouble though don't mess with it.

StirCrazy · #9 08-11-2006, 01:03 AM

First, you should find the clown loaches a new home as that tank is way to small for them.. at that age they should be 12 to 14" long, but all that aside why not fix the problem for the live plants instead of scrapping them? got to be some reason why they don't do well.

Steve

Delphinus · #10 08-11-2006, 04:10 AM

If someone could tell me what I was doing wrong for the plants, I'd be all over it. Seriously, I've given this a go for a few years now, it's just degrades way too fast. I've tried CO2, no CO2, more light, less light, more flow, less flow, more fertilizer, no fertilizer, etc. etc. etc. etc. When I ask people for advice on how they keep their FW setups top-notch, usually I get vague answers like "oh I don't really do much."

All things considered, I'd rather have the loaches than the plants anyhow.

12" to 14" long at 5-6 years? Ok they're not that big yet but they're big .. and growing still ... agreed they need a bigger tank, but that's sort of why I was wondering if say a 48" 50g would be a better choice than say a 36" 65g (Ok maybe I didn't come out and ask that specifically yet, but I am now, wouldn't a 50g but 48" tank be better than a 65g but 36" tank? Given that I don't want to go heavier than say 70g total water volume in the spot the tank occupies.)