Using GFCI with power bar

[Winters]

Hello! I've got a 90g with 20g sump, skimmer, pump, two 250W MH pendants, etc. Am planning to install two GFCIs, replacing the standard outlets. I'm not sure how everything should get plugged in for best efficiency and safety. Should I not get a power bar and just try to plug everything into the outlet straight? (That could be a problem) Or should I get a good powerbar with a surge protector just for the lights and pump?

What would spread out the electrical input best? And is it still safe to have a surge protecting powerbar on a GFCI? Will the GFCI still trip if a short happens even if the lights are plugged into a powerbar on the GFCI outlet?

Thanks in advance!!

[snaggle]

As for GFCI it will still trip if the power bar dosnt so it as nother levle of safty. I would try and sped out the power a little bit if you can you will have to check the plugs are not on the same curcit in the hole room though. if there are you can you one or two plugs ( two is better then one). a surge protector will also help protect your light and pump ( they are not cheap ) I hope this can help you out little.
this is just my $0.02 I am by no means an eletrical expert of any kind.

Brad

[KrazyKuch]

Snaggle is right a GFCI is another level of safety and will trip even with a power Bar plugged into it....I surge protector is a very good idea but as mention are very pricey, but if your gonna get one do buy the cheapest one out their cause you'll regret it in the long run!!!

As for power distribution i would try and spread it out as much as possible as in try and split the higher current suckers i.e (pump and MH) but I don't know of to many house that have 2 circuits to one room....I personnaly ran a dedicated 20Amp circuit to my tank so as to not have to worrie about over loading!

[Winters]

Originally Posted by KrazyKuch

As for power distribution i would try and spread it out as much as possible as in try and split the higher current suckers i.e (pump and MH)

Sounds good! I'll try to plug in the two MH pendants into a surge protecting powerbar on one of the GFCI outlets. As for the pumps and heater, I'll plug them into a second surge protected powerbar on another GFCI outlet.

Now, I would like the lights to be on a timer. Should I simply plug two timers into the powerbar and plug the two lights into the (two) timers? I also have a grounding probe that needs to be plugged-in. Should this be plugged into the GFCI outlet directly or is it okay for it to be plugged into the power bar which is then plugged into the GFCI? Or should the probe not be plugged into the GFCI outlet at all?

Thanks in advance!

[powerboy]

Basically everything downstream from the GFCI is protected.

[KrazyKuch]

Yeah everything after te GFCI is protected.....To make things cheaper for you plug both MH into one surge protected power bar and the plug that power bar into the timer then the timer into the GFCI....just make sure that you only have the lights on that power bar!!!

[Winters]

Originally Posted by KrazyKuch

Yeah everything after te GFCI is protected.....To make things cheaper for you plug both MH into one surge protected power bar and the plug that power bar into the timer then the timer into the GFCI....just make sure that you only have the lights on that power bar!!!

Sounds good! I've gotten the digital timer and a good surge bar, etc. now.

Ok.. I have another question about power, and a couple of other semi-related questions:

1. Is it possible to get a surge protector (or something) that has maybe an hour or so of backup power in case of an outage? (Something like a mini UPS)

2. I'm trying to affix my (new!) AquaLine OceanLight 250 HQI pendants on to my canopy's fold-up lid. Thinking of using galvanised steel L-brackets. Does this make sense? Will this rust out or rot the wooden lid?

3. I'm planning on attaching some fans to the back part of my canopy (fairly large open space in the back) for cooling down the HQI pendants. If I get maybe four computer fans, does anyone know if I can wire them all to a single plug?

Will my questions ever end? Perhaps one day. Until then.. thanks to all for the help.

[beaker020]

1. Is it possible to get a surge protector (or something) that has maybe an hour or so of backup power in case of an outage? (Something like a mini UPS)

almost all UPS have surge protection built in however you would need a not-so-mini UPS to supply enough power to run your lights for more that a few minutes. UPS's are only designed to run a computer for long enough to save your work and safely shut down. If you're going to go that route then only plug in a few power heads and maybe a heater into the UPS. Your tank can do without lights for a few hours.

2. I'm trying to affix my (new!) AquaLine OceanLight 250 HQI pendants on to my canopy's fold-up lid. Thinking of using galvanised steel L-brackets. Does this make sense? Will this rust out or rot the wooden lid?

Galvanised steel will rust eventually, so will stainless steel. Use brass.

3. I'm planning on attaching some fans to the back part of my canopy (fairly large open space in the back) for cooling down the HQI pendants. If I get maybe four computer fans, does anyone know if I can wire them all to a single plug?

Computer fans are generally 12Volts DC so you will need an adapter or 'wall wart' to run them. As long as the TOTAL current draw for all the fans does not exceed the current the wall wart can supply then they can all be hooked together. 120V AC fans are better and can all be hooked to ione plug without any problems. (With both AC and DC fans, make sure they are connected in parrellel) Also, Install all your fans blowing IN not out. Blowing is more effective than sucking and this avoids drawing moist, salt laden air thru an electrical component.

Just my $0.02

[Winters]

Originally Posted by beaker020

If you're going to go that route then only plug in a few power heads and maybe a heater into the UPS. Your tank can do without lights for a few hours.

I see. I was actually only planning on putting the main pump into the UPS but now that I think about it, maybe I won't, because (a) it looks like it will be relatively costly to get a UPS, and (b) using the UPS will also take away the safety benefits of the GFCI that it's plugged into. Oh well.. will just get a battery powered pump.

Originally Posted by beaker020

Galvanised steel will rust eventually, so will stainless steel. Use brass.

Really? This is quite a surprise! I would've sworn that brass would be just as ineffective as steel. Are you sure about brass? Ok then.. will get some brass L-Brackets. Mind you, I don't know what the actual pendant is made of - I would suspect stainless steel. And I have a feeling it has just standard metal screws in it. Should I be worried that it may rust?

As an added precaution, I'm also affixing a couple of lengths of nylon-coated galvanised steel strapping around the pendant. (The stuff that plumbers use to attach pipes to walls) Should this be okay in there, or should I get the standard galvanised steel kind? I don't know if this nylon coating may melt under the lights.

Originally Posted by beaker020

120V AC fans are better and can all be hooked to ione plug without any problems. (With both AC and DC fans, make sure they are connected in parrellel)

Hmm.. ok. Good advice! Now.. where does one find 120V AC fans? (I'm assuming these would look identical to the standard small'ish computer fans) Also, should I do something special with wiring these fans for use inside a saltwater aquarium canopy? Any safety or corrosion issues?

Originally Posted by beaker020

Also, Install all your fans blowing IN not out. Blowing is more effective than sucking and this avoids drawing moist, salt laden air thru an electrical component.

This seems to be a controvercial topic! I have had people tell me all sorts of differing opinions on the number of fans, their locations in the canopy, and whether they should be blowing air in or taking it out.

I was planing on having three or four fans in the back of my canopy (since the back side is open). I was going to have two fans (one on each side of the back) blowing air in, and a fan (or two) in the middle sucking it back out. I was advised this at my LFS and, admitedly, it did sound sensible.

Now, if I only have a couple of fans blowing air in from the back of the canopy, where will the hot air escape?

I was also told that it may be just as effective to have fans installed on my sump instead of the main aquarium, although this doesn't sound logical as surely the lights above the aquarium is what is causing the heat and it makes sense to have something attacking this issue directly rather than trying to cool off the sump. Is this correct?

Thanks again for the help!

[beaker020]

Brass stands up fine in salt water. It goes without saying that it should not be immersed in water or let water drip from the metal into the tank. The pendants themselves are painted or enamaled to protect from corrosion. I'm not sure I understand what you are going to use the strapping for. (Actually, come to think of it, Stainless steel would probably work fine for this application as well. I use SS screws to hold my reflectors in place and SS nuts and bolts to mount my fans)

120VAC fans are available from Radio Shack, Princes Auto and electronic supply stores. The most common size is 120mm or about 4.75 in. ( some people would call this a 4" fan because the blades are 4" across) Heat shrink tubing on the connections or wire nuts (marrets) filled with silicone sealer or vasaline will protect the wire.

For a 90gal tank, one fan on either end should be suffice.

Simply put, blowing gets the moving air where you want it the most and causes the most directional movement of air. Look at it this way; when you want to cool off your soup or your coffee what do you do? You blow on it! Fans can only move a certain amount of air at any given time so having one fan blow and another fan suck doesnt move twice the amount of air. Have all your fans blowing in and as long as you provide plenty of escape routes for the air (ie. open back, vent holes, cracks along the lid/doors etc) it will find its own way out. Like I said earlier; sucking moist, salty air thru an electrical component is a safety and reliability issue.

The main purpose for fans in the canopy is to keep your lights cool and to PREVENT the heat from the lights from heating the tank. A fan in the sump is a good idea to get rid of extra heat if you find your tank is still getting too warm. One word of caution on blowing air onto the lights; some metal halide bulbs (especially cheap ones) dislike having air blowing directly on the bulb. This is usually not a problem with pendants but may be a problem for others. Air deflectors or repositioning of the fan or bulb may be neccesary.