"What if"

[Oceanic]

I would like to continue this thread as I personally use baking soda as well as DOW flake (driveway melt) with no issues what so ever. I have also used Epsom Salts from Walmart for Magnesium.

I am sure there are many others here that use readily available hardware or grocery store chemicals and or buy their chemicals in bulk either from ChemMaster or Bulk reef supply. The costs associated with this hobby can be high. I see nothing wrong with people finding cheaper ways to be successful, I don't think everything has to have a fancy label in a small package to be considered safe!

I also know people that are very successful with dosing Vodka. I don't think people should be scared into thinking they will crash their tank if they use anything other than aquarium specific products.

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

[kien]

Ya.. all that thread did was confuse me! First it talked about reef salts vs diy salts then talks about baking soda then other chemicals, hehe. I guess I'm just not smart like that. I didn't know people made their own salts. Anway..

I use baking soda (from the supermarket) and do not have any nuisance algae issues. Maybe because my baking soda doesn't look like poo ? Parameters are at the correct levels and everything is thriving

Also buy my calcium and mag bulk from the chem dude. Gets the job done and works great.

[Oceanic]

Originally Posted by kien

Ya.. all that thread did was confuse me! First it talked about reef salts vs diy salts then talks about baking soda then other chemicals, hehe. I guess I'm just not smart like that. I didn't know people made their own salts. Anway..

I use baking soda (from the supermarket) and do not have any nuisance algae issues. Maybe because my baking soda doesn't look like poo ? Parameters are at the correct levels and everything is thriving

This is the problem, it should not be confusing. Continue what you are doing if you are successful! Don't let threads like this scare you into thinking you need commercially marketed chemicals to adjust simple water perimeters.

The definition "salts" means the chemicals added to the aquarium, baking soda is one of the additives being labeled as such.

[imisky]

i too have used baking soda for adjusting alk, epson salt for mg but never found any dow flake locally to try it with ca, and i too havent encountered any issues with using the chemicals.

i can see the arguments presented in that thread and to a certain degree it makes sense, but the idea originated from somewhere, whether it was people looking for a local source of calcium or alk or vodka for example it originated from products which wasnt made for sw tank use.

and IF the commercialization of vodka aka carbon dosing never happened we would all still be dosing vodka and if used correctly it would not cause any issues (makes you wonder why vodka companies dont just slap a lable on the vodka bottles with additional information for incase used for fishtank) and the same imo applies to other parts of the industry.

if a method some random hobbist came out with that was not successful in doing what we want to achieve, it'll be pretty unlikely to see it become a commercial product. i dont know but those are my thoughts

[lastlight]

That thread came off as the sort of scare-tactics news you see on FOX or something. While I found it amusing I thought it was pretty silly it was closed by the author after 2 people posted.

[Myka]

I use commerically prepared calcium and alkalinity buffer, but I do use Littlesilvermax's 8.5:1 magnesium mix.

I wouldn't use plain magnesium sulfate (epsom salt) permanently on my tank. I would only use it in an emergency or if I was using it against Bryopsis where the sulfate is needed. Magnesium chloride should make up the bulk of the magnesium dosing.

I have always found that commercially prepared chemicals work better in my reefs than bulk chemicals. I can't explain why. I notice no difference using a magnesium mix though. I also can't explain why. I know I don't get.

I know there have been discussions on various boards in the last while regarding ionic imbalance from dosing too many products/chemicals with chloride in them which increases chloride too much in our tanks. Of course our test kits and refractometers don't know the difference so we think our dosing or salinity levels are correct. There are vendors coming out now with chloride-free salts.

Also, fyi these days when people say "salts" they may be referring to balling salts. Magnesium chloride, calcium chloride, sodium (bi)carbonate are all salts. So be sure you understand whether the person is referring to a salt mix or balling salts.

Originally Posted by lastlight

That thread came off as the sort of scare-tactics news you see on FOX or something. While I found it amusing I thought it was pretty silly it was closed by the author after 2 people posted.

Agreed.

[StirCrazy]

there are valid points both ways, but I didn't like the article Aqua Digital wrote as it was scare tactics. RHF has done testing on several chemicals we can find in department stores, some are good for frequent use, some for occasional and some for emergency's. as for Vodka dosing I personally think it is stupid and alcohol abuse should go in the belly not the tank

I do like the custom products for there purity and convenience for setting up a custom blend, but the prices are outrageous on a lot of them. One thing you do have to watch out for is products containing sulfates, using them to much will build up the sulfate level in your tank which isn't good. there have been several studies over the years on the build up of heavy metals, sulfates ect and the problem comes from a lot of the "department" store products we try use are not 100% pure so in the short term they don't hurt, but in the long term depending on what ones you are using and how much you may get build up of undesirable chemicals.

so I go both ways on this debate, I feel the manufactures of these products could easily drop there price in 1/2 and then the merchants and so on which would still get them a profit and make them much more affordable resulting in more people using them and probably more profit made through volume sales, but until then people will continue to look for lower cost alternatives.

Myself, I am the king of cheapness when it comes to stuff like this, I even did experiments using dolomite as a DSB and would have used it but it compacted into a rock hard bed so it was not suitable, but I do like the convenience and preciseness of the balling system, and there are also somethings I don't cheep out on anymore and it they are related to water chemistry and light then I spend the extra. now I don't mean that I will run out and buy the most expensive lighting fixture thinking I have the best set up, what I mean is I do my research and make sure I am getting exactly what I am looking for. If it doesn't meet up to my demands I will build my own.

Steve

[shrimpchips]

I'll chime in since I use the Fauna Marin salts and the whole balling system.

I thought about using DIY salts, but the purity issues had me stay away from them. In a small system, if I do encounter any impurities, they can quickly build up an become very detrimental. Also, I too like the fact that they are pure, easy to use and I have some ease of mind knowing they're from a quality company and brand.

As for DIY, I strongly considered it, but the first thing that got me was the impurities that might be present in DIY salts. Also, you have to make a lot larger batch of balling salts with DIY since they are a lot less pure than the brand-name salts. Space is a premium to me, and I don't want to have to make a batch every few weeks.

For me the decision also came down to the fact that I had already spent hundreds, if not thousands on corals - I wasn't about to save $50 and possibly put things in harms way. For me, I just don't trust something made for the sidewalk and driveway for my SPS reef tank, which I've already invested heavily in.

As for the price of these chemicals, pure chemicals are expensive, and driveway quality melting salts aren't exactly pure. In the end I think it comes down to how comfortable you are with the unknowns associated with icemelting salts, and how much extra you're willing to shell out for the brand-name salts.

[fkshiu]

Originally Posted by shrimpchips

For me, I just don't trust something made for the sidewalk and driveway for my SPS reef tank, which I've already invested heavily in.

There's always the happy middle ground from those such as BRS and littlesilvermax - high quality stuff at lower prices - sort of like the "No Name Brand" products from the supermarket. I had complete confidence using those bulk chemicals in my tank that I have invested heavily in as well.

I found AquaDigital's posting to be insulting in the extreme, IMHO. According to him, I might as well have been pouring radioactive fallout into my tank when I was using two-part.

[lastlight]

Plus I heard DOW puts antiReef crystals into its new mix.