Sad news: baby elephant has died.

[Cap'n]

Originally Posted by Buk_A_neer

Because we can " decide " to invent things we became special ... when we could rationalize and expand our minds past a primate we became " special "

Oh No ... I have upset another " tree-hugger "

Hey man, you did call me a tree-hugger, I never did.

And I didn't retract anything, even the part of my post that you quoted states "I think not" in reference to the possibilty of calling you such a term.

[Cap'n]

Originally Posted by Fish

And I never suggested that the name is insignifigant. Only that the names cleverly represent a falicy of logic - the strawman falicy I think.

Ah, a more eloquent way to say the same thing I was attempting.
Thank you.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by CptCleverer

Ah, a more eloquent way to say the same thing I was attempting.
Thank you.

No but I think... uh... oh... ur welcome.

- Chad

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by CptCleverer

Hey man, you did call me a tree-hugger, I never did.

And I didn't retract anything, even the part of my post that you quoted states "I think not" in reference to the possibilty of calling you such a term.

LOL ...

this was you saying this as well right ? or was your friend referring to somebody else ?

Originally Posted by CptCleverer

and he loves to call his backpack wearing, anti-TV, bicycle commuting friend of his a tree-hugger, so I can take a good natured ribbing, I'm not that sensitive.

you dont deny being a tree-hugger though as it is a term you are familiar with right ?

[G1GY]

I'm a tree hugging redneck that has a fixation on glass boxes full of rocks and water!

[StirCrazy]

Bahhh trees just get in the way of good space for parking cars

Steve

[Aquattro]

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

Bahhh trees just get in the way of good space for parking cars

Steve

Careful Steve, or God will evolve you back into a monkey, and then you'll miss the trees.

Now, I'm thinkin', as us mods must every now and then, that this thread is heading in a precarious direction. Let's try to keep it on the long noses, or it may get aborted.

Thanks

[Beverly]

Originally Posted by Fish

Despite the amount of destruction and killing and clear-cutting we seem to do as a species, I can not think of a single other animal that cares personally about the well being of another species (that is not motivated by personal preservation).

Our concern with the welfare of other species is definitely self-motivated. Beginning centuries ago, we have destroyed other species' habitat at an ever excelerating pace. In the last few decades it has become increasingly clear that if we do not have more of a balance between the ever-expanding, so-called civilized human world and the natural world, humans will eventually share the planet with only a few other pest species.

Originally Posted by Fish

I mean really, our concern for an elephant in the zoo or even all the elephants in Africa is not motivated by any sort of benefit to ourselves because, as a species, we do not rely on the elephant for anything.

Actually, we subconsciously rely on the knowledge that elephants still exist on our planet to relieve ourselves of the guilt we would feel if elephants, along with other well known species, were inadvertantly killed by our aggressive human expansionism.

Humans are the only animals on the planet that keep other animals in zoos. There are two elephants at the Edmonton Valley Zoo. Every time I've seen them, they and the other animals looked so sad in their relatively small enclosures, that I had to stop going to the zoo. Can you imagine yourself as an animal in a zoo? I mean, honestly see yourself caged in surroundings not of your choosing, being fed food not of your choosing, and being without others of your own kind, such as friends and family?

Originally Posted by Fish

Infact, if anything, it could be seen by many as a competitor for space and a thief of farm produce.

Actually, elephants lived in the places where farms now exist, so who is the competitor here?

This is a pretty harsh thought, but sometimes I think a good plague that would wipe out 90% of the human population might do the planet and all who live here plenty of good.

[muck]

Originally Posted by Beverly

Actually, we subconsciously rely on the knowledge that elephants still exist on our planet to relieve ourselves of the guilt we would feel if elephants, along with other well known species, were inadvertantly killed by our aggressive human expansionism.

Humans are the only animals on the planet that keep other animals in zoos. There are two elephants at the Edmonton Valley Zoo. Every time I've seen them, they and the other animals looked so sad in their relatively small enclosures, that I had to stop going to the zoo. Can you imagine yourself as an animal in a zoo? I mean, honestly see yourself caged in surroundings not of your choosing, being fed food not of your choosing, and being without others of your own kind, such as friends and family?

Bev,
If this is how you feel how is keeping fish in a glass box any different?
I don't think they choose to live there either...

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Beverly

Humans are the only animals on the planet that keep other animals in zoos. There are two elephants at the Edmonton Valley Zoo. Every time I've seen them, they and the other animals looked so sad in their relatively small enclosures, that I had to stop going to the zoo. Can you imagine yourself as an animal in a zoo? I mean, honestly see yourself caged in surroundings not of your choosing, being fed food not of your choosing, and being without others of your own kind, such as friends and family?

I think if you ran this past the men and women who care for these animals in the zoos they would have slightly different opinions. Unfortunately, zoos have become vital for the survival of some species whos natural habitat has been swallowed up. I'm not saying this is good, or it's the best possible outcome - I'm saying this is reality. I think you would also find that these people are motivated by a true love for these other animals and not by a desire to appease their own unconcious guilt. JMO.

- Chad