Glass Cardinal - Problems?

[GoFish]

Tank is 46 gallons. 1 of them was bought about 8 months ago and then the other 2 were picked up about 4 months ago. The 2 more recent additions stay very close to each other and the third seems like a 3rd wheel. Damage from fins could be from fighting i guess, though I've never seen any aggressive behavior by any of them. I was mainly concerned about a disease that I should be worried about. The Glass Cardinals at j+l show the same random fin damage as mine, maybe just how they are

Just watched a YouTube video of a Banggai make holding eggs in its mouth, it looks just like that!

If there wasn't a Scribbled Rabbitfish in the the tank then babies would probably survive for a little more than 10 seconds, but he's a pig and eats everything including poop...

[albert_dao]

They're also prone to picking up parasites during the capture and transportation from Asia to us. Cheapo fish are handled as such, which does a lot to explain why "hardy" fish like these and canary wrasses tend to do so poorly.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by Vancity

Tank is 46 gallons. 1 of them was bought about 8 months ago and then the other 2 were picked up about 4 months ago. The 2 more recent additions stay very close to each other and the third seems like a 3rd wheel. Damage from fins could be from fighting i guess, though I've never seen any aggressive behavior by any of them. I was mainly concerned about a disease that I should be worried about. The Glass Cardinals at j+l show the same random fin damage as mine, maybe just how they are

Just watched a YouTube video of a Banggai make holding eggs in its mouth, it looks just like that!

Could you take a pic? Maybe there is a pair and they are breeding. There is often a small amount of fin damage with a breeding pair. It doesn't sound like a disease to me.

If there wasn't a Scribbled Rabbitfish in the the tank then babies would probably survive for a little more than 10 seconds, but he's a pig and eats everything including poop...

The Scribbled Rabbitfish is a poor choice for a 46-gallon aquarium. This fish gets to be 9-11" and most Rabbitfish grow fairly quickly. This fish needs to be in a tank 4x the size of yours. How big is it now?

[naesco]

Once you have damage the opportunity for fungal and bacterial attacks sharply increases.
treat your fish in a qt.

At the same time return the rabbit fish to the LFS or sell it online, I agree that it is far to big for a very small tank like yours.

May I suggest that you research your fish BEFORE YOU BUY. Cardinals need a peaceful aquarium. Rabbit fish wrasse and tangs are active and are not suitable unless you have a very large tank.

[albert_dao]

Originally Posted by Myka

The Scribbled Rabbitfish is a poor choice for a 46-gallon aquarium. This fish gets to be 9-11" and most Rabbitfish grow fairly quickly.

Except when they don't...

I've had a pair of doliatus for three years. They're still 4".

Paul has had a blonde naso in a 280 for the better part of a year now. He's still 7". He was living in a 120 for two and a half years prior to that.

MOST fish grow to the size of their tank. Tangs and rabbitfish are inclusive rather than exclusive to this rule. There are exceptions to like Elasmobranchs, remoras and other pelagic species.

The rabbitfish would most assuredly want a larger tank, but the idea that it will grow to its full adult size (and quickly at that) doesn't have a lot of overlap with reality. When's the last time you saw a 9" powder blue tang? Or a 10" foxface? I've seen plenty of 3-5 year old fish that are still sitting at a very manageable 4-6". If it it hasn't gotten to its adult size in that time frame, it probably isn't going to... Ever.

Anyway, back on topic - cardinals are delicate and easily beaten up. But I doubt that, unless you have seen it with your own eyes, that its due to the efforts of the ginormous and infamously vicious rabbitfish.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by albert_dao

Except when they don't...

I've had a pair of doliatus for three years. They're still 4".

Paul has had a blonde naso in a 280 for the better part of a year now. He's still 7". He was living in a 120 for two and a half years prior to that.

MOST fish grow to the size of their tank. Tangs and rabbitfish are inclusive rather than exclusive to this rule. There are exceptions to like Elasmobranchs, remoras and other pelagic species.

The rabbitfish would most assuredly want a larger tank, but the idea that it will grow to its full adult size (and quickly at that) doesn't have a lot of overlap with reality. When's the last time you saw a 9" powder blue tang? Or a 10" foxface? I've seen plenty of 3-5 year old fish that are still sitting at a very manageable 4-6". If it it hasn't gotten to its adult size in that time frame, it probably isn't going to... Ever.

Anyway, back on topic - cardinals are delicate and easily beaten up. But I doubt that, unless you have seen it with your own eyes, that its due to the efforts of the ginormous and infamously vicious rabbitfish.

You are dead wrong.
Yes a tang will not grow to its adult size in a 45 gallon tank. The reasons are two (at least)

1.You stunt the fish which means that you cause it stress which is multiplied if there are other fish in the the tank. It is our responsibility as hobbyists to provide optimum conditions for the fish that we choose to remove from the ocean. We can provide a suitable sized tank.
2. You cannot reasonably feed a tang in a 45 gallon tank as you would pollute it with ammonia far too quickly. What some keepers of SPC and other fragile coral do is cut back on the food which reduces the ammonia and provides minimum food for the fish. That is the second reason they do not grow.

I might add that I am really disappointed. We have a new reefer here who unknowingly is making the typical mistakes. Instead of confirming Myka's adivice which you know is right, you post this nonsense which makes new reefers think that it is ok to put tangs and rabbitfish in 45 gallon tanks.
You know Myka is right so let the OP know you agree with her.

[albert_dao]

.... Man, you are like some sorta Captain Planet of the aquarium or something.

Edit: I'm a little tied up here, but expect a nice long retort in a few hours.

[Rice Reef]

Originally Posted by naesco

You are dead wrong.
Yes a tang will not grow to its adult size in a 45 gallon tank. The reasons are two (at least)

I might add that I am really disappointed. We have a new reefer here who unknowingly is making the typical mistakes. Instead of confirming Myka's adivice which you know is right, you post this nonsense which makes new reefers think that it is ok to put tangs and rabbitfish in 45 gallon tanks.
You know Myka is right so let the OP know you agree with her.

I would like to apologize to the OP for having to read his comments. Most people on Can Reef do not throw their authoritarian attitudes around here and are infact, very friendly and helpful.

This is a hobby and we are all here to inform and learn but when someone throws their opinion out in such a bullish manner I do not tolerate it regardless who is right and who is wrong. Something like this could have been discussed privately and if you are going to make it public at least be considerate of others.

Reading this makes me sick and it really takes the fun and interest out of the hobby. You are probably right but to call someone out like that in a public is just down right mean.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by Rice Reef

I would like to apologize to the OP for having to read his comments. Most people on Can Reef do not throw their authoritarian attitudes around here and are infact, very friendly and helpful.

This is a hobby and we are all here to inform and learn but when someone throws their opinion out in such a bullish manner I do not tolerate it regardless who is right and who is wrong. Something like this could have been discussed privately and if you are going to make it public at least be considerate of others.

Reading this makes me sick and it really takes the fun and interest out of the hobby. You are probably right but to call someone out like that in a public is just down right mean.

Please read my post in reply to the OP, and, you are right in hindsight I should have sent a PM to Albert asking him to 'clarify' his post rather than posting.

[albert_dao]

Originally Posted by naesco

You are dead wrong.
Yes a tang will not grow to its adult size in a 45 gallon tank. The reasons are two (at least)

1.You stunt the fish which means that you cause it stress which is multiplied if there are other fish in the the tank. It is our responsibility as hobbyists to provide optimum conditions for the fish that we choose to remove from the ocean. We can provide a suitable sized tank.
2. You cannot reasonably feed a tang in a 45 gallon tank as you would pollute it with ammonia far too quickly. What some keepers of SPC and other fragile coral do is cut back on the food which reduces the ammonia and provides minimum food for the fish. That is the second reason they do not grow.

I might add that I am really disappointed. We have a new reefer here who unknowingly is making the typical mistakes. Instead of confirming Myka's adivice which you know is right, you post this nonsense which makes new reefers think that it is ok to put tangs and rabbitfish in 45 gallon tanks.
You know Myka is right so let the OP know you agree with her.

I'm just going to call you out on this crap right now -- This is some sort of liberal arts project for you or something. I mean, it must be. No one can take such a profusely impractical stance on such hypocritical context and believe in it without some degree of trolling.