Electrical woes...breaker box what??

[reefermadness]

watts are simply amps x volts. Usually you only want %80 continuous load on the circuit. So...20 x 120 = 2400 x .8 = 1920. So yes around 1900 watts is safe for a 20amp circuit.

If you are fine with the way the electrial works at the moment and just want the protection of a gfi at minimal cost you could just install the GFI recpticle where your fish tank is all plugged in.

[banditpowdercoat]

I would not run 20A(1900W) on that circuit though, without verifying that there is 12ga wire. 20A plugs are different than other plugs, one blade is sideways, and verticle. Alot of times, in older houses people will change a 15A breaker for a 20 because they were tripping the 15A. Theres a reason it was 15A for starters, because thats what the wire was rated for. If it's 14ga wire, and you run a 20A breaker, you can overload it and run the risk of an electrical fire...

But also, what was sead about adding the extra circuits is also true. As long as the main is not tripping. Even if all the slots are full, they make "piggyback" breakers that are 2 in the space of 1 so you can add more protected circuits.


If you upgrade the panel to 100A, the wire from the pole to the meter, and meter to panel will need to be upgraded as well.

[Myka]

Ah thanks guys, there is light as the end of the dark tunnel! Har har.

The wall outlets that is on this 20 amp breaker look like normal wall outlets. There are several 20 amp breakers on our panel. Good to know these are not "real" 20 amp breakers. I would be getting close to the 80% load on that breaker then.

I see what you mean about the piggyback breakers too, there is one of those on the panel holding two 15 amp breakers.

I do actually have a GFCI receptacle sitting on my fish shelf, but I am worried about it being too sensitive and tripping. I work out of province and the tank sitter only comes Monday, Wednesday, and Saturday so having it trip when no one is around would be bad. I would feel much better if I had two GFCI receptacles with half the equipment on one, and half on the other just in case.

I am going to plan to do some electrical upgrading on my next time off near the end of May.

[raceit]

Remember, the job of the breaker is to protect the circuit wires from overload, not to protect the devices plugged into the circuit.
GFCI plugs are cheaper than GFCI breakers.
Here in northern BC, some Insurance companies will no longer cover houses with main services smaller than 100 amps, thus forcing older homes to get a service upgrade.

Burke,
Electrical Contractor

[banditpowdercoat]

If your plugs are regular ones, then there should NOT be 20A breakers in there. A 20A breaker will continously draw 16A without tripping on overload. 80%. and 20A on overcurrent situations which is higher than what 14G is rated for 15A. 1A doesn't sound like much, but over time, it heats the wire, and breaks down the insulation. Either way, It's not good, not Code either.

[Myka]

Dan, I think pretty much every panel I have ever looked at has had some 20 amp breakers on it. Our panel has 15, 20, and 30 amp breakers.

Originally Posted by raceit

Here in northern BC, some Insurance companies will no longer cover houses with main services smaller than 100 amps, thus forcing older homes to get a service upgrade.

Burke,
Electrical Contractor

Really? Wow, that's interesting. What type of costs are associated with upgrading to 100 amp service?

[DiverDude]

IMO, the only time you should see a 20A breaker is when you have 12GA or heavier wire on the circuit. Most homes are wired with 14GA which is fine for 15A.

There is no doubt that a 100A entry is a basic minimum these days and the value of your home will improve if you get the upgrade. And yes, they change the wire from the pole to your house to handle the extra current. The whole process involves a fair bit of labour and materials -hence the cost.

In a pinch though what I would do (and this is not necessarily ok by code but...) is to run a second circuit (wire and GFCI outlet) to near your tank and add an extra breaker to your panel.

[mike31154]

You should be able to look inside your panel and tell whether your 20A circuit breakers have a larger gauge wire than the 15s. Unless the wiring is very old, the specs are generally stamped on the insulation. As mentioned, 20A circuits need to be wired with 12 gauge wire to comply with code and keep you safe. If it's 12 gauge at the breaker, then it's probably safe to assume that wire run is all 12 gauge. Should be able to tell the wire gauge at the receptacle as well, by pulling it out. Just make sure the breaker is off before you yank out any receptacle on that circuit.

I'd recommend two 15 amp circuits for your tank (GFCI protected) vice one 20 amp circuit. That will give you 30 total and some redundancy for GFCI nuisance trips. Next time you're in a reno store, look for the book "Electrical Code Simplified". Should be around $12 to $15 and is well worth the money. Lots of great info and pretty understandable for most folks.

Hi was just talking to a electrical inspector and as stated above 80% is right but a 70amp breaker may peek at 2000 watts with out tripping that would be a instantaneous Peck and a return to the 80% load. PB is also right about the wire gage. as far as just swapping out the panel that would all depend on the gage of the feed line into the house. if the line to the house is older it will most likely have to be replaced, have an electrician look at it.
Shell buzzy was on the radio last week and they are changing thing here in BC in the future. where as if a home owner dose any electrical work it has to be inspected or your insurance becomes void. I don't know how accurate what he was saying was as he was kind of being very general about it all. I am thinking it has more to do with the individual circuit that the person installs including electrical outlets. This because there has been instances where a home owner ran the neutral through the breaker and then the hot side became the neutral and houses have burnt down because of it. I've heard about this a couple of times. I have seem it once while a house I was thinking of buying was being inspected. that was a deal breaker right there and then as you have no idea what else was done incorrectly in the house or where it was gizmoed to gather.
I'd just rather a person get the profesinals to look into it.

As far as having a panel upgraded to 100AMP as i said my mom has to get it done but she also has to move her mast she told me they wanted some thing like 3000 to 3800. You get it all back in resale value as a upgraded panel is some thing a new owner does not want to pay for in most instances. On my moms line BC Hydro had already changed the line to the house so it is ready to move over to a new panel and mast, the new mast will be closer to the pole than the old panel. so I don't know if the charge includes that cable or not I am asumming that it does not.

Bill

[quote=banditpowdercoat;515390]I would not run 20A(1900W) on that circuit though, without verifying that there is 12ga wire. 20A plugs are different than other plugs, one blade is sideways, and verticle.QUOTE]

Hi BPC,
I didn't know that about 20AMP plugs I know that on equipment that we install in telcos the plug has a l shaped blade and you have top twist the plug in to make contact these can be 120 or 220 receptacles and they are orange I believe which indicate a isolated circuit. I do not install them a electrician does, then we go in a turn up the equipment and do our testing.


Bill