when are we going to have a

[StirCrazy]

Originally Posted by Chaloupa

Sorry Steve but I do take offense to this. I have built my tank for the XXX.XX dollars, my stand was all of 41.00 and my tank was 16.00. Questioning the integrity of the people in the contest on their honesty is probably not what you meant...but it's how I took it.

The reason that we don't include those costs is we were following the same build idea as done by Nano-reef.

nope not questioning any integrity here, I haven't seen your tank stand at all, I know when I do a stand here is no way I can do it cheep unless I use stuff I have around the house. ther eis the cost of glue, screws/nails, hardware, wood, and stain/paint, then paint supplies, brush, filler, ect...

I am bad for not accounting for stuff I have laying around.. I built a stand a while ago that I figures I did for 60.00. when I added up everything it was realy about 150.00

Now you guys don't have to account for that stuff in your contest which is good for you as if you had stuff laying around the house you used then bonus.

but I was refuring to the pricing on livestock, it is dirt cheep compared to what I see in stores down here. for example sand and live rick is free, so 10lbs of live rock and sand will be about 100.00 there is 1/3 of the 10g budgit gone if it was not free. acessories less than 15.00 free, so you add a magfloat, thermomitor, tongs ect and you could realistickly be at another 50 to 70 bucks. water, there is 10 bucks if you buy it.
a heater 30 to 50 bucks. I am at 230 now, so a tank we'll use your numbers 16, and wood for the stand 41, so now were at 287.00 still need some sort of pump for water flow..

you see what I am getting at.. I have seen some stands that probably are pushing 100 to 200.00 when all is said and done, they are neat and interesting but heck I could spend 600 bucks easy on a little stand and it would be out of this world and and it would have a huge impact on the finnished product.

[superduperwesman]

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

We'll have a friendly one, no money for entering, just bragging rights. and no silly price lists, what you pay is what it costs

Might as well just get everyone on canreef to post a picture right now and have a vote

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

I think ideally it would be a 1 year long contest, with no water for the first 6 months. this would allow people to take there time and build/buy something that they actually want and really like.

And force those who want to get the tank established quickly to wait?? I don't get why we would make rules on when people can have water?? Factors like that change with the person and effect the result. People who rush getting water in could have way more growth in a year... others who like to take there time and plan might have a better design but a tank that is less filled out.

Originally Posted by sphelps

Also I think entry fees and prizes are a good thing, it will keep contenders interested and more likely to see the contest through to the end. Otherwise you'll have many contenders and very few finalists.

I agree... people already have a hard time posting pictures at the right time when there is prizes and they've paid... if you remove these it'll just get random and too hard to actually track the contest with out it essentially just turning into tank journal threads

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

all I am looking at is that the prices that are listed are not realistic, there is no way some one could get those prices on the island.

I think that was the idea... to have the prices the same for everyone to even the playing field. That way if your in a place with 20 lfs or 1 lfs you all get "the same pricing." They probably could have been a little more realistic but I don't think that was the main goal?? <<< but just because I understand the function of the current price list does not mean I think it's the best way to go about it.

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

why arn't you adding in the costs of the tank

I think it was because everyone would be deducting almost the same amount for the tank, sand, rock etc. I mean we could include all those prices but like you said...the budget couldn't be $395 but it would increase by essentially the same amount for everyone... I mean how much of a difference are you going to pay for rock in a ten gallon?? tank $20, sand $10, rock $80, magnet cleaner $14, thermometer $10 etc. = $134 ok so the Budget is now $529 and everyone is at ____ + $134. Everyone knows the tank cost money but do we really need to include it in the budget when they're all the same?? Plus the the budget should not be the main focus... it's there to kinda help keep things even but it's not the focus so why would it matter if common factors are removed... I guess this is all coming down to how you view the function of the budget??

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

I do agree that there has to be something to prevent rich people (which I am definatly not one of) from going out and just getting a turn key package, so maybe some rules on stuff you have to do yourself, like you have to make your own stand. Cannot start with a reef ready tank, ect..

Sounds like your catering the contest to what you think is best for you?? That's life... some people have more money. You can't discriminate because they do... then your just leaving them at a disadvantage because you don't like what life handed you... but hey if it handed you money and not diy skills tough luck guess you can't play??

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

that is the reason I was thinking of 6 months befor you even have to have water in it to give pour people time to save for what they want to do and to allow time for other people to clean out there garage to a point where they can actualy build there stand hehe

Same deal sounds like your catering the contest to your needs... my garage is clean... but hey I'll wait 6 months to put water in because you need to clean your work space??

Originally Posted by moldrik

Why instead of setting up a limit on budget, set a limit on other things such as:

Ammount of LR/LBS
Ammount of Substrate/LBS
Ammount of Inverts
Ammount of Fish
Ammount of Corals / Category ( SPS, etc.. )

Like others have said, the limit on the price is something that doesn't regulate properly due to a huge variation. If price "needs" to be taken into consideration, then a big enough buffer needs to be established to take into consideration in order for a decent tank to be created in a city where things are expensive.

Why should a contest's motivation/bottleneck be people trying to find the cheapest possible second-hand hardware/livestock VS. being creative with the things that they could possibly achieve when creating a tank in a certain category?

Agreed.... there should be general guidelines on what amounts you can have... prices should have to be posted in detail but there should be no limit on the budget. If people want to vote for a tank because it's the nicest for the money spent fine!

The way I see it there should be rules (picture post requirements etc.), entry fees, there should be prizes, there should be general guidelines on quantities allow to keep the tanks in the same field, but other than that you should just have to post ALL of your prices. If someone has more money so what that's life... we want to restrict what people spend to have the illusion that we can make the nicest tank?? It's a hobby that cost A LOT of money and the more you have the nicer your tank CAN be... but it still takes more than money. Just my $1.52