55 Gal FOWLR - seeking criticism

[turbo]

Okay so hello again. I have to admit I failed pretty badly with plumbing this thing in. First thing was getting past the guy at the LFS (because he also sells the PVC and fittings and stuff - more of the 1" product than Home Depot carries).

He thought it was a terrible idea to have a direct-feed from the overflow to the protein skimmer. He said that it was wrong, not the way "we" do things, my house will flood, oh well hardwood floor isn't so bad, so is the aquarium in the basement? on and on lol. Finally he sold me the stuff I wanted. According to him, I need two pumps minimum (one return and one feeding the skimmer) and the skimmer must reside in the sump.

And as I got about building I had to change up some of the original design on the fly (partly because my vinyl hose is NOT flexible enough) and partly because my cabinet is so narrow that to avoid the structural members I actually had to drill my drain holes in a vertical line rather than beside one another.

So I actually teed the two 1" PVC drains into one 3/4" vinyl hose, because that matches the inlet on the skimmer. So, uh... is this bad or what? Does it defeat the purpose of having two drains... or is it GOOD because we will see high pressure coming from this hose into the protein skimmer???




the other dry-assembled contraption there is the return piping.



and finally...

[turbo]

ok so i ran a wet test and the drain is able to handle the flow from the pump. i pumped freshwater full blast from a 5 gal pail to the external side of the overflow and it just went down the drain and back into the bucket. the water level never changed but holy mackerel it's loud haha!

and this ruined my evening: the inlet on my cheapskate protein skimmer is now broken, and i thought it would be okay if i just jammed a hose onto it and clamped it. this is not okay, though. this leaks. so i am presently unable to use this protein skimmer AT ALL until I can repair this little problem.






I'm left with the following questions:

1. will the proposed drain and vinyl hose be ok? it worked for 45 seconds will it work for 10 years? am i asking for trouble by joining the two drains into one?

2. will my overflow box always be so freakin' lowd???????

3. how the heck can i use this protein skimmer now?? any plumbing experts or material engineers offer some advice for an adhesive or cement? i can't say what type of material this skimmer is made of.

[intarsiabox]

I don't know anything about your particular skimmer so not much help there. I see that you have two drain lines on your overflow that you tee'd off into a single line. This cut yur drain capacity in at least half depending the output size of the tee. I'm not familiar with eshopps overflows either but maybe it needs to be at full capacity for it to be quiet. If you want to continue to use an external skimmer I would have one drain line go to the skimmer intake and the other go directly into the first chamber of your sump (not the return section).

[Mike-fish]

The single pump should be fine. I prefer to have a bit of redundancy in my tanks but my tanks are also much larger so I have the room and with the flow rates I run a single pump becomes far less practical. I'll be sending you a pm shortly. I would defiantly change your plumbing such that both drain lines drop separately to the sump that way should there ever be a problem with one tube being restricted chances are that the other will be enafected and be able to take most of the flow. The vinyl lines should be fine for years to come on my 175g that I've had for about 5?years now has used them from day one I just can't remember if when we got it off a friend we put new lines on to it or not if not there close to 10 years old by now.

[turbo]

Thanks to everyone for the replies so far! I'm going to continue posting here until my sump is operational, so please bear with me!!! Don't worry, I am an avid internetter and am not relying solely on you good people for all of my answers.

One little bit of wisdom I've picked up working in construction is that if something looks stupid: it is stupid. It doesn't take a plumber to know that I did it wrong haahaw D'OH!. My whole life is one mistake after another so why should I complain if my aquarium follows the same pattern? C'est la vie. The worst part about DUMPING money into an aquarium is that half the time it's the wrong decision! AHHthe other bad part about dumping money into an aquarium is that our coins are made of copper.

OK down to business:

So far most of the advice I've received highlights the following issues in my setup:

1. I teed two drains down into one and cut the radius down by 50%. This will increase the output pressure of the drain (fourfold) but drastically reduces the flow rate. Most of the recommendations I've received suggest that I keep the box operating as TWO drains. Run one to the skimmer and one to the sump.

2. It's way more complicated than it needs to be.


I've come up with two solutions of my own and so my NEXT question to post in this thread is as follows: WHICH SOLUTION IS BEST FOR MY SETUP?

Solution 1: Keep one of the drains in my overflow box as an emergency, or ancillary drain, which only kicks in after the first one fails or backs up. This is easily accomplished by cutting one of the PVC standpipes or installing a larger one on one side. The e-drain will go directly to the sump while the main drain will go directly to the skimmer. This way I am only using one drain 99% of the time. I think this will be OK because it is 1" PVC and it should drain at near-capacity if I'm pumping 300gph into the tank.

Solution 2: Remove (and sell) the $125 overflow box that is rated to drain over 1000gph. It vastly exceeds the pump, and the skimmer, and will NEVER operate at capacity on this tank. It will gurgle 24/7 for as long as I insist on using it. It relies on two U-tube siphons. Construct a basic PVC overflow which pipes to the skimmer, and tees to the sump (although I am still skeptical about this it seems like the right thing to do).

Last thing: if door #2 is the winner ... is there a type of valve I can install that will direct all flow to the skimmer until there is an emergency situation, at which time it will re-direct the flow into the sump?

[Aquattro]

Personally, I like the LFS advice. I would run the skimmer in the sump on it's own pump. I would drain the overflow with 2 lines directly into the sump. One day something is going to go down that tube, either fish, snail, or something. I wouldn't want it going into my skimmer But hey, I like pumps, I run 5 in my sump -lol
Not knowing what type of skimmer it is, it might not even work without a pump. is it airstone driven? If not, gravity probably won't have enough pressure to work a venturi well.
Most overflows are noisy, so you need to modify the intake with a durso or stockman type fitting to get it quiet. You may not have room judging by the pics.

[turbo]

Originally Posted by Aquattro

Personally, I like the LFS advice. I would run the skimmer in the sump on it's own pump. I would drain the overflow with 2 lines directly into the sump. One day something is going to go down that tube, either fish, snail, or something. I wouldn't want it going into my skimmer But hey, I like pumps, I run 5 in my sump -lol
Not knowing what type of skimmer it is, it might not even work without a pump. is it airstone driven? If not, gravity probably won't have enough pressure to work a venturi well.
Most overflows are noisy, so you need to modify the intake with a durso or stockman type fitting to get it quiet. You may not have room judging by the pics.

Hi. That is good advice. Sometimes it's one of those things where we (as people) would rather ignore the truth than face it head-on. The skimmer is presently broken at the inlet (as shown in the pics). After discussing the issue with my girlfriend we've decided to keep the overflow box, because we bought it and stuff. She absolutely does not approve of removing the overflow box and trying to sell it, and building a simple PVC overflow in its place.

I really was just planning on having the gravity drain make the skimmer work, but what the heck is the point of using a skimmer if it's not operating properly?

I bet I could talk her out of the Weipro skimmer, and cut our losses. Maybe I can sell it in its broken condition for half price or something.

Maybe it would be best to plumb both drains right to the sump and then invest in a good brand name skimmer and pump. Can you recommend one that would still sit externally (as there isn't much room in the sump). I guess if leaking was an issue I could put the skimmer in a 5 gal pail but the sump is only 10 gal and I want to keep some rock in there. There's room in the cabinet for equipment to sit beside the sump (i.e. external skimmer).

I guess the last thing I need to ask then, is: since the overflow is much too large for the tank, can I use only one of the drains, and keep the second one as backup (in case of a water level increase in the overflow)? I realize two drains operating in parallel will double the flow out of the tank, but I am not sure that's what I want here. One 1" drain should probably do the trick.