Camera & Lense Recommendation

[TheReefGeek]

Good info thank!

For high-iso grain though, a good digital will be able to go to higher ISO than film without grain though, won't it? I thought this was a big advantage of digital over film.

The other reason I like (or at least I THINK I will like digital, I have no experience with any SLR yet) is the lcd screen for previewing pictures, and the ability to take 1500 pictures on a single card and only develop the pictures I like. Plus the easy photo editing.

I think I would miss some good pictures with film, because I am too cheap to buy that many rolls of film and use them!

[kwirky]

digital doesn't get grain on high iso? yes and no.

With film, there's a thing called reciprocity failure. Where once your exposure is past a second and a half, each additional second of exposure you have to double your exposure time. Think of it as an exponential curve, and remember that increased exposure time means more grain. And you'll notice that second, red curve, density. That's basically how much information is recorded. The longer the exposure, the less information recorded. You'll get a washed out image that requires you to "push" your film, and develop it longer, further decreasing image quality.

here's a chart showing what happens.

(c) Kodak

Digital has no reciprocity effect, so long exposures have the possibility of less grain, but unfortunately, digital's grain pattern is much more noticable, and very anti-aesthetic compared to film's grain pattern. And digital normally can't do exposures longer than 15 seconds, because areas of the CCD will overheat, and you'll get "hot spots" on your photograph. Usually around the corners, and little white spots will show up in the photograph.

But you'll almost never need to go past 15 seconds for longer exposures, so either will look pretty good. Digital will never look as good as film though in the darker regions of your photograph.

A good, and quick stress test you can do with a digital camera in store is to switch the camera to fully manual mode, and set the exposure to "bulb." That's where the exposure is as long as you hold the button for. (If you don't know how to do that, ask the sales associate to show you how. If they won't show you, or if they don't know how and won't ask somone how to do it, walk away and go to another store; they've just failed their customer service test lol.) Then take like a 6 second exposure with the lense cap on, and review the black picture. Zoom in real close with the camera's preview function, and look at the nasty grain, because black is the hardest part of an image for a digital camera to photograph. Look for a camera where you find a good grain pattern, if grain is an important issue for you.

And yeah, you're exactly right about the benefit of being able to shoot thousands of photographs. I went the route of digital before film, because the time involved with developing every single roll of film before you see whether you messed up or not is kinda crappy. And camera's screen is a nice review of whether your focus was good or not, and whether you got the correct exposure. Oh and if you're shooting in RAW format, which I'm sure you eventually will, you'll be lucky if your card holds 150 . A photo looks horrible when JPG compression has to deal with grain.

.oO(I wish they'd hurry up and bring JPEG2000 out...)

[TheReefGeek]

Wow, so much to learn, thanks for the insights.

I am taking a full 3 credit class on digital photography in January, so hopefully this will make more sense after that!

I'm getting a 6 gig card, how big are RAW files about?

[Old Guy]

With my camera each raw file is 13.88 meg. I get 151 pics to a gig.

[reeferaddict]

Originally Posted by TheReefGeek

Wow, so much to learn, thanks for the insights.

I am taking a full 3 credit class on digital photography in January, so hopefully this will make more sense after that!

I'm getting a 6 gig card, how big are RAW files about?

RAW files are "unprocessed" images at the native resolution of the camera, and image size depends on ISO and how each picture is exposed. You can then open a RAW file with the camera's software or Photoshop, (if the RAW format for your camera is supported in Photoshop), and tweak exposure, whit balance, saturation, colour balance settings and more. What used to be an art in the darkroom is now able to be previewed on a screen before "post processing" a RAW file to a final image file such as a TIF or JPEG.

Why do I know this? Because photography is another passion of mine besides reefkeeping. I carefully researched and purchased a Canon 20D system this spring. While all the other company's are offering some innovative "prosumer" products at some fantastic prices, I chose Canon because of their proven technology and commitment to their higher end stuff... I had a Digital Rebel before I bought this system and had to sell it a couple of years ago, so I had a practice run at buying this stuff which made this time around much easier AND more expensive. Avoid kit lenses and consumer grade zoom lenses. While a 28 - 300 zoom might sound like a wonderful all-in-one lens, good luck getting consistently clear, sharp images, especially if you have less than sunlight to shoot in. I paid around $7500 for my system and primarily bought it off eBay. I compared local, and national companies, but in the end saved more than $5000, (that's right five THOUSAND), by doing it over a 3 month period looking for the deals on eBay. After getting my first high end lens I was hooked on the expensive glass and that's all I have.

Just for the availability and variety of accessories I really recommend Canon or Nikon. Their products are relaible, the technology proven, and ask any pro and they'll tell you nothing compares when it comes to their glass. Even the Zeiss glass used in Sony's camera's is a "consumer" grade. Canon by all accounts has the best noise/ISO ratio and I prefer their CMOS as opposed to CCD sensor technology as their pixel density is the best in the business. The Fuji S3 could also be an option, they have probably the best dynamic range of all DSLR's and take Nikon glass... just a little clunky to use IMO.

All I can say is that if you intend to be into photography in any serious way at all, be it pro or amateur, don't look for the bottom buck solution... your results will suffer and you will only end up frustrated... I hope this gives a little insight.

[Ruth]

Reeferaddict which lenses would you recommend? I also have a Canon 20D system. I have a few lenses for it but I think the 2 that I am happiest with (and yes they were definately the most expensive) are my 75-200 and a 100mm macro lense. I am looking for a wide angle lense and after a while go cross eyed trying to read and understand all of the info out there. Care to make a recommendation on a good zoom and wide angle lense for this camera.

[muck]

oh oh ... and a fisheye lense.

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by muck

oh oh ... and a fisheye lense.

Yuck Yuck Yuck - everyone is a comedian

[TheReefGeek]

Reeferaddict, I will do some research on the 20D, looks like a nice camera, very similar to the Nikon D70s I am about to order.

What lenses do you have, and recommend for the 20D? I will have to start with some cheap kit lenses, but eventually want a 100mm macro, a 12-24ish zoom, 18-70ish, and a 70-300ish.

[Ruth]

This is the zoom lens that I have for my Canon - I also have a 70-300 lens but the far superiour pictures come from this lens
http://http://cgi.ebay.com/Canon-EF-...QQcmdZViewItem