2 Radion G2 vs 3 Vega

[NuraNori]

I know this is the age old debate on this forum, AI or Radion. I am setting up a 5' x 30W x 26"H tank and am looking for a little advise from people that are using these lights and from people who have seen the Vega in action. I am wondering whether to go with 2 Radion G2's or 3 Vega's for my tank. I am not looking to go full sps or anything.

My questions are on spread of 2 Radions over this length and the pop of Vegas on LPS coral.

Let me know your thoughts.

[reefwars]

2 radions may not be very good for that type of tank the spread isnt great enough

vega suck,period.....ai anything sucks not much of a debate their compared to ecotech.


honestly i would go either 2 ghl or 2 x pros or possibly sunbrights,new ati coming out soon as well.

[Aquattro]

....ai anything sucks not much of a debate their compared to ecotech.


.

lol, give your head a shake! The SOL and the Radion are pretty much on par. Slight differences in spread vs. penetration, but in action, provide similar results. Is a $400 SOL comparable to a $1200 Mitras? No, of course not, but saying anything AI is crap is just wrong.

[Reef Pilot]

Be careful when comparing the Radions. The Gen 2s are quite a bit stronger (20 -40%) than Gen 1s. I have both, and really noticed a difference.

I have never owned the AI's or other LEDs, so can't say much about them. But have read that the spread for Radions is better (than the AIs) when closer to the water. I have mine 8 inches above, and they seem to work very well at that level.

I have mine in canopies, and I like the Radion cooling. They have fans that exit the air at the top sides, so are good for mounting in a canopy without restricting air movement. My canopies exit air at the top rear, and run quite cool (esp compared to my old T5s).

[Aquattro]

Be careful when comparing the Radions. The Gen 2s are quite a bit stronger (20 -40%) than Gen 1s. I have both, and really noticed a difference.

.

Fair enough, I haven't seen them yet. But my SOL tank looks just like any Radion G1 tank I've seen as far as light and overall look and coral coloration is concerned.

[reefwars]

lol, give your head a shake! The SOL and the Radion are pretty much on par.

how so?? considering were talking g2 not g1


Slight differences in spread vs. penetration


there def is,slight being being night and day, remember were talking g2 so par is much better

but in action, provide similar results.


so do alot of leds doesnt mean they are even comparable

Is a $400 SOL comparable to a $1200 Mitras? No, of course not,

obviously, which is why i said to go that route, if you can afford it, same with the radion pros.


but saying anything AI is crap is just wrong . no actually i really believe the aqua illumination is crap and i wouldnt be surprised if they didnt do much more of anything with their lights in the future, have you used the vega yet?? sorry if i offfended you buy yah its crap in fact ill repeat it....anything ai IMO is crap, is it worth $400....maybe , on its best day, 2 years ago

:P

remember you can get 2 g2 for the price of three Ai sols , they arnt even in the same category , the g2 isnt in the same category as the pros or mitras as well either so aot has to do with your budget , spec wise there are great differences in them all

[Aquattro]

Forget you, I'm not even gonna try to respond to inline multi quote stuff before at least 3 more coffees :)

[subman]

Sols and radions are not on par not even close.... Same goes for vegas

To the OP go radions over Vegas. I think 2 will do just fine, if you go to sps dominant you may need to add one later

[gobytron]

Forget you, I'm not even gonna try to respond to inline multi quote stuff before at least 3 more coffees :)

Lol...

[reefwars]

Forget you, I'm not even gonna try to respond to inline multi quote stuff before at least 3 more coffees :)


ok ill admit im pre coffee as well.


its like this will the ai sol work....absolutely , it does the job.


my biggest beef with them is not being able to keep up with the standards that ecotech , ghl and soon to be ati are setting.

lets say they decide to revamp the vega i may have another opinion but right now the vega was an epic failure and needs some revisions, how many stores can you go to and buy a vega off the shelf??


dont get me wrong the radions has their ups and downs as well , we will see what the pros do but i can guarantee the pros are an improvement by far on the g1

the vega was not that much of an improvement on the sol , maybe they will come out with a better light next year but if they dont they run the risk of losing their standings with a comparable market led.


overall on a 5 ft x 30" tank 2 radions g2 arnt gonna be enough , 3 sols will

if its price then 3 sols are a given but if theres a better budget then either 2 pros( released this week) or 2 ghls are a much better option....more expensive by far but def a better buy longterm.


then theres the diy route....

[NuraNori]

Are you saying not enough light to spread the tank or just not enough light to have corals on tge edges!! I have seen the gen 1s in action and there was lots of light spread, we are looking at lps and fish basically for this tank

[reefwars]

Are you saying not enough light to spread the tank or just not enough light to have corals on tge edges!! I have seen the gen 1s in action and there was lots of light spread, we are looking at lps and fish basically for this tank

to grow corals plenty of light even sps at the bottom of your tank the g2 have upgraded tir lenses so penetration is not an issue on a 26" h tank.

spread wise the g2 have not improved much from g1 its still roughly the same

you will probably see some shadoing on the edges both front to back and side to side on your tank dimensions but youll grow corals just fine in almost all of that tank.

the sols are going to improve your spread left to right (provided you have 3 ) but wont stretch to 30" in width.

[NuraNori]

Even if mounted parallel with the tank rather than perpendicular? I would think that should give the best spread, just thinking out loud. I won't need the push for sps so even mounting them 8-10" above the water shouldn't be an issue.

[subman]

I had two g1s over a 72x30x24 and there was a small amount of shadowing but not bad and I grew lps and zoas no problem.

[NuraNori]

Thanks subman, that is reasureing, how high above the water did you have them mounted. Are you still running them or have since changed to something else, and if you changed what did you go with and why??

[subman]

I had them at about 10" above the water line. My lighting is a long story lol. I'm running mitras now and love them. I I have had radions, Vegas and still have a sol over my frags. Check my build thread in my signature for pics of them running side by side

[Reef Pilot]

2 radions may not be very good for that type of tank the spread isnt great enough

vega suck,period.....ai anything sucks not much of a debate their compared to ecotech.


honestly i would go either 2 ghl or 2 x pros or possibly sunbrights,new ati coming out soon as well.
Am not implying anything here, but would be curious which brands provide better margins for retailers?

I find it a little interesting how Ecotech tries to control the selling price of their products. Is it to incent their retailers with higher margins?

Again, not implying anything here, right or wrong, just curious.

[viperfish]

I have been using SOL's for quite some time a just recently bought the Vega because I have had such good results with the SOL. When I tried to purchase my Vega colour in black right before Christmas I found one available in all of Canada because no one can keep them on the shelves so despite Reefwars negative comments, they are a very popular item. Having used the Vega for over a month now I have to say its well built, performs excellent, and it can support demanding SPS (even at the bottom). If a light does the job and does it well like AI and Ecotech does, what else are people looking for? Is someone's tank going to be twice a colourful, or corals grow twice as fast because they paid twice as much? I don't think so. If you are just looking for bragging rights or to belong to an elite group go ahead but don't justify it by saying all the others are crap. Besides, it's electronics, spend all you want and it's going to be worthless in a short time. A lot of people spent big money on the early "high end" LED's and they don't even rank anymore.

[reefwars]

Am not implying anything here, but would be curious which brands provide better margins for retailers?

I find it a little interesting how Ecotech tries to control the selling price of their products. Is it to incent their retailers with higher margins?

Again, not implying anything here, right or wrong, just curious.

well i know for a fact theres not alot of profit margin with ecotech , why they regulate their pricing my guess would be to make things fair and keep retailers ordering them and not have to worry about competing with other retailers who may be larger.

ecotech is not the only one who regulates their pricing alot of other pop brands we buy for our tanks have set pricing as far as advertisng goes any ways.

[reefwars]

I have been using SOL's for quite some time a just recently bought the Vega because I have had such good results with the SOL. When I tried to purchase my Vega colour in black right before Christmas I found one available in all of Canada because no one can keep them on the shelves so despite Reefwars negative comments, they are a very popular item. Having used the Vega for over a month now I have to say its well built, performs excellent, and it can support demanding SPS (even at the bottom). If a light does the job and does it well like AI and Ecotech does, what else are people looking for? Is someone's tank going to be twice a colourful, or corals grow twice as fast because they paid twice as much? I don't think so. If you are just looking for bragging rights or to belong to an elite group go ahead but don't justify it by saying all the others are crap. Besides, it's electronics, spend all you want and it's going to be worthless in a short time. A lot of people spent big money on the early "high end" LED's and they don't even rank anymore.


ok im again pre coffee so ill play.... happily

you only found one available in canada not because they sell out so fast but because they arnt availble , heres a serious challange for you name five retailers who have the vegas in stock on their shelves and stock them reguarily??

you wont , not because retailers cant sell them ....they simply arnt available in large numbers and readily.

i bet in the coming years AI fades away period.....

im happy your happy with your light i didnt say you wouldnt be , ive used the sols,vegas,razors,mazzerra,g1,g2 and ghl and find Ai not even at par with any of the others ( although im not a big fan of the mazzerra)


i wonder what the resale value is on a vega?? i bet its also not comparable with radion or ghl which still hold their value long after.

how about other ai products??


if your only experience is with ai then you have no user merit to your comment , just your own user experience with that one light ....


pre coffee so im off the hook.....now ill go have my coffee


cheers

[chef]

How about a vertex illumina 260

[reefwars]

How about a vertex illumina 260


also a great light and have always loved the illumina series:)

[Zoaelite]

:popcorn:


















We are Kien, your Popcorns will belong to us.

[Zoaelite]

On topic I agree with Denny, although I'm bias as use several Rad Gen 1s.

Looking forward to upgrading to the Radion Pro when its released.

[reefwars]

Looking forward to upgrading to the Radion Pro when its released.

im really excited for the radion pros , i know we have some coming to the store soon and anyone wants to come over and check it out are more than welcome too i know ill be putting one over a tank the minute they come in:)

[viperfish]

Vertex has always had top notch products. I don't think you can go wrong buying Vertex. They seem to fall short in the marketing department. Their website has always been terrible from a promotional and support standpoint.

[NIVLEM09]

I've just purchased an AI Vega and will arrive on Tuesday.i wanted the Radion g2 but wife changed her mind the last minute:cry:

[reefwars]

Vertex has always had top notch products. I don't think you can go wrong buying Vertex. They seem to fall short in the marketing department. Their website has always been terrible from a promotional and support standpoint.



yeah they def do seems like they dont advertise or push their products as much as they can , theyve been around a long time too though and have such a large variety of products , im def pro vertex products.

[Skimmerking]

so what about the Nova that some refers are going with ? It has the knobs for dimming is that the reason why they are cheaper? they look pretty good. However Im not converted over to LED still on the T-5 whine. the par numbers are pretty good to. these Nova's look pretty good arent they and they are half of what others are
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l88/Lolaandthecrowd/Fish%20Tank%20-%20SW/novalayout.png
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l88/Lolaandthecrowd/Fish%20Tank%20-%20SW/TankStuffLight019.jpg

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l88/Lolaandthecrowd/Fish%20Tank%20-%20SW/TankStuffLight021.jpg

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l88/Lolaandthecrowd/Fish%20Tank%20-%20SW/TankStuffLight022.jpg

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l88/Lolaandthecrowd/Fish%20Tank%20-%20SW/TankStuffLight023.jpg

so whats is making these so much cheap?

Reef brites have access withte Iphone and Ipad they look pretty good or are they

ok here is another question then if I have a cube 36x36 x21 what would be a better LED light to hang.

[cuz]

also a great light and have always loved the illumina series:)

what fixtures have you run on your personal tank??

[reefwars]

what fixtures have you run on your personal tank??


on my bonsai just the radions , weve had the illumina260 ,skyy light(?),marineland and sols on the other tank at my house. also some stunner strips for a while

i was a bit nervous on doing the switch to leds with my bonsais corals as theyve been under mh for so long and some of them are almost impossible to find so i finally decided on going ecotech for the bonsai , i added some vortechs and 2 x radions slowly over a couple months switiching out the outdated equiment.


did take home a vega for a week same with a razor when they came out but only had them up long enough to see how they looked.

at the store we are running kessils,mazzerras,razors,radions.

on the store display we will have 2 ghl's about to be set up on that tank and we have some radion pros coming for the store displays as well.

[Bblinks]

Lets see some pictures of your tanks. Interested on what you consider better or worse reefwars.

[reefwars]

Lets see some pictures of your tanks. Interested on what you consider better or worse reefwars.





how so?

[Bblinks]

Just want to see why you think radions are so much better. love to see a picture of your tank just for reference thats all.

[subman]

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b87/subman001/20121009_094805.jpg

Here is a side by side the vegas are on the left g1 radions w/o tir lenses on the right.
the vegas are at %100 (no controller at the time) and the radions are at aprox %75 (still ramping up at the time)

I will add I ran the tank like this for a couple months and there was no noticable growth difference but the vegas ran at %100 all day while the Radions ran a custom profile.


****I'd also like to add my tank is much nicer and fuller now lol****

[denny_CC]

Just want to see why you think radions are so much better. love to see a picture of your tank just for reference thats all.


here is my tank journal it started off with sunpod 250w halide which is similiar to what it was in the 90g.

youll have to browse through the journal to see what the differences are , personally compared to halides with this tank the radions arnt quite as good as my halide was , spread wise the tank is darker , things at the bottom are just as happy as they were with the halides but the stuff on top of the tank is growing much faster since the switch.

i started at 30% and 10-12" above water level( i dont reccommend 8" )

im now comfortably at 60% peak during the day.

the switch over was a little hard on my thin fleshed corals like chalices, favias and some of my sps .

heres the link to my journal:

http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=88961&highlight=bonsai



unfoprtunately i only have a camera phone for pictures so the quality isnt dslr, with all the money i spoend on corals you would think id have a good camera by now lol :)



heres a fts taken by sphelps and his dslr plus some close ups if it helps any:)

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars201210031_zps5dfdb1d9.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_11_zps5a28cfb9.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_261_zps3a224549.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_211_zps4c8176aa.jpg
http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_91_zps439420e4.jpg

and some top downs taken with my phone:

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3807.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3806.jpg


http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3805.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3804.jpg
http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3803.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3801.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3800.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3794.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3793.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3781.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/25g%20bonzai%20tree%20tank/IMG3783.jpg

[denny_CC]

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b87/subman001/20121009_094805.jpg

Here is a side by side the vegas are on the left g1 radions w/o tir lenses on the right.
the vegas are at %100 (no controller at the time) and the radions are at aprox %75 (still ramping up at the time)

I will add I ran the tank like this for a couple months and there was no noticable growth difference but the vegas ran at %100 all day while the Radions ran a custom profile.


****I'd also like to add my tank is much nicer and fuller now lol****

radions are noticeably brighter

radion g1 has better spread than ai sol

they do not need a controller------ edit*** (to run multiple lights)

bluetooth to wirelss eco tech products

touch sensor buttons( should be lcd but what ever ...)

slim profile

clean hanging kit

2 led pucks


thats just to name a few of the bonouses of g1 radions over sols, there are alot more especially if we start talking g2 over the g1 and pros over the g2

well see if ai comes out with anything new and whether or not they go par with ghl or ecotech but right now its not there in the vega.

[cuz]

radions are noticeably brighter

radion g1 has better spread than ai sol

they do not need a controller------ edit*** (to run multiple lights)

bluetooth to wirelss eco tech products

touch sensor buttons( should be lcd but what ever ...)

slim profile

clean hanging kit

2 led pucks


thats just to name a few of the bonouses of g1 radions over sols, there are alot more especially if we start talking g2 over the g1 and pros over the g2

well see if ai comes out with anything new and whether or not they go par with ghl or ecotech but right now its not there in the vega.



most of the differences stated are bells and whistles.
No offence Denny but it is hard to compare apples to apples over a lps/ zoanthid tank. I'm happy with my SOL's but have only compared them myself to 6 250w MH used previously.
The radions are nice to look at in the box on the shelf but not worth the extra $$'s IMO. I seen them over a very healthy sps tank and the parts of the colony directly under the fixture were night and day different looking as to the part that was slightly off center.
just my two cents based only off what I've seen myself.

[Bblinks]

Hey Denny and Subman, Thanks for the pictures!

Subman, your comparison pictures does show a brighter and more intense light from the radions but that being said we don't know what or how the corals would react under the 2 different lighting. Are you going to keep the tank lit like this for a bit and see how corals react to it? I am more interested in sps growth and coloration then anything as I am more of a sps guy and some lps. I would love to see how 2 exact same coral(sps) would turn out under the 2 different led lights. If you are willing, I can supply some frags...

Denny, you guys have most of the leds in stock and on display. Take in account of price, quailty, and functionailty, which one of the 5 would you go with on your own tank, AI Vega, Radion G2, Mitras, reefbrite, vertex 360? And why?

Thanks in advance for your reponse.

[Bblinks]

Btw, I am currently using AI sols, I can tell you I get great growth out of my sps. They are also so intense I usually bleach any lps that I don;t acclaim to it properly. I also get great colors from my sps but it does not reflect certain colors from those sols since they are heavy in the blue spectrum. I would move corals between my ai tank and my t5 frag tank. Some colors just pop under the T5's which I just don;t see it in the maintank, not that they are present but just not reflected properly. IMO
Thinking about switching to either ai vegas or maybe profilux , but I have my reason for not wanting to go the profilux route.

[subman]

Hey Denny and Subman, Thanks for the pictures!

Subman, your comparison pictures does show a brighter and more intense light from the radions but that being said we don't know what or how the corals would react under the 2 different lighting. Are you going to keep the tank lit like this for a bit and see how corals react to it? I am more interested in sps growth and coloration then anything as I am more of a sps guy and some lps. I would love to see how 2 exact same coral(sps) would turn out under the 2 different led lights. If you are willing, I can supply some frags...

Denny, you guys have most of the leds in stock and on display. Take in account of price, quailty, and functionailty, which one of the 5 would you go with on your own tank, AI Vega, Radion G2, Mitras, reefbrite, vertex 360? And why?

Thanks in advance for your reponse.

I have since sold my Vegas and Radions. Over the couple months I had them running I didn't notice any growth difference but not really a scientific experiment as they were running different profiles and I didn't have the same coral under each

[reefwars]

most of the differences stated are bells and whistles.
No offence Denny but it is hard to compare apples to apples over a lps/ zoanthid tank..


its fact i have a lot of zoos that probably wouldnt do well in a sps sysyem but fact is they need the same light requirements in order to get the best out of them,sps need light so do zoanthids , in fact most zoas and palys grow faster and brighter with more intense lighting same as sps, and colors are also dependant on water quality and lighting same as sps.

whether or not they grow sps has been proven thread over thread over thread on rc and other forumns so i doubt i need to prove that.

unfortunately im not sps dominated so i can only speak from a mixed reef point of view

plus im not saying the sols dont work i never did im saying they arnt comparable to the radions which is also fact if you compare 1 radion to 1 ai sol, and if were comparing then we look at all aspects including the bells and whistles.

my 2 cents will most likely vary from someone elses 2 cents.

[viperfish]

radions are noticeably brighter

radion g1 has better spread than ai sol

they do not need a controller------ edit*** (to run multiple lights)

bluetooth to wirelss eco tech products

touch sensor buttons( should be lcd but what ever ...)

slim profile

clean hanging kit

2 led pucks


thats just to name a few of the bonouses of g1 radions over sols, there are alot more especially if we start talking g2 over the g1 and pros over the g2

well see if ai comes out with anything new and whether or not they go par with ghl or ecotech but right now its not there in the vega.

Vega has better penetration
Vega offers more control
Vega has wireless control
Slim Profile
Cleaner hanging kit
4 LED pucks (I don't know what this has to do with anything?)
Pucks can be upgraded easily (No need to buy a new fixture)

The pics mean nothing, brighter just means more lumens, not PAR.

[subman]

This thread has become a defend the lights you own thread kinda off the point of the OP

[Bblinks]

its fact i have a lot of zoos that probably wouldnt do well in a sps sysyem but fact is they need the same light requirements in order to get the best out of them,sps need light so do zoanthids , in fact most zoas and palys grow faster and brighter with more intense lighting same as sps, and colors are also dependant on water quality and lighting same as sps.

whether or not they grow sps has been proven thread over thread over thread on rc and other forumns so i doubt i need to prove that.

unfortunately im not sps dominated so i can only speak from a mixed reef point of view

plus im not saying the sols dont work i never did im saying they arnt comparable to the radions which is also fact if you compare 1 radion to 1 ai sol, and if were comparing then we look at all aspects including the bells and whistles.

my 2 cents will most likely vary from someone elses 2 cents.

Reef wars, what you running for lights right now? Can you post a picture of your tank if you don't mind. I would love to see it. I know it's not a Sps system but mine isn't all Sps either. I got a good collection of zoas and acans along with a lot of other corals.
IMO my ai sols are very comparable to a radion, not only they are on par with the abilty to grow any kind of coral it also have the controls that radion offers. well it dont have touch control but what eves. i can live without those. I have also dealt with ai's customer service. Let me tell you it was a pleasure. No hassle no bs, you have a problem they will solve it. I have heard countless issues with radions and horror stories about getting issues resolved. I know I would be ****ed paying double the money for the radion unit and get left out in the cold when any problem arises.
Anyways thats is my 2 cents.

[Cal_stir]

What is this coral?


http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_211_zps4c8176aa.jpg

[apexifd]

What is this coral?


http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad85/reefwars/ReefWars20121003_211_zps4c8176aa.jpg

Tube anemone

[intarsiabox]

This thread has become a defend the lights you own thread kinda off the point of the OP

I think every single compare x to y LED thread has ended up this way. There are just too many things based on personal preference that a consensus will never be reached on this topic. But it always turns into a lively discussion for everyone's reading pleasure!

[subman]

Lol very true........ And just so we are clear MY lights are best. Whatever they are when you read this :rofl2:

[Aquattro]

Lol very true........ And just so we are clear MY lights are best. Whatever they are when you read this :rofl2:

Agreed, your lights are best. Not sure why you sold them!?! :)

[subman]

Agreed, your lights are best. Not sure why you sold them!?! :)

I still have the ones you have so like I said....

[Cal_stir]

Thanks

Its awesome!

[AquaticFinatic]

Just stump up the extra dosh Nora and go vertex :mrgreen: I know you want to lol. Join the best club out there :wink: