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12-19-2013, 05:52 PM
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Member
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 3,272
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TM balling webinar synopsis
Many thanks to those that joined our webinar.
One of the highly important topics that came up was the question of imbalances and as the slide show was clear to show, once explained it makes so much sense. I will try my best to put some of that info here.
If anyone highlights an inaccuracy to what I have written please let me know and I will happily address that in the thread openly.
Hearing about the relationship between the ions of Calcium chloride and sodium Bi-carbonate was fascinating especially how the coral polyp takes in the calcium ion from the calcium chloride element and the carbonate ion from the sodium element and what is left behind is your imbalance.
Left behind is sodium from the Bi-carbonate and chloride from the calcium, these two together of course make sodium chloride, and here lies the imbalance in 3 part, all of a sudden you have extra sodium chloride with no other elements attached to it floating around in your tank, and by doing a water change you are only removing the percentage of that water change of the imbalance.
So if you are dosing 2 or 3 part light systems and rely on water changes alone to address the imbalance you are only removing for example on a 10% water change, 10% of that imbalance.
Now - by adding into the mix Part C the remaining sodium chloride has something to balance it which includes the 70 trace elements
Now of course there is an argument that this system too raises your sodium chloride level, and yes you are right, BUT and here is the defining factor, it is doing it in a balanced format in the same way you would be doing by adding more sea salt to your system, because it is balanced there is no ionic risks, and even the most minimal water change would cater for any salinity rise, however due to being in balance and such a very low level this is not an issue, where as an unbalanced system with just sodium chloride floating about is.
What is an issue however are 3 part or light systems that allow for free amounts of sodium chloride in your system with nothing to balance it allowing for a complete imbalance that can not be addressed wholly by water changes as you only remove the % of water change and as such only remove that % of imbalance.
There is only one way to keep a system in balance when dosing calcium and sodium Bi-carbonate and that is to add in proportion NACL free salt. (Part C)
To make the point clearer, the very first original Sea Salt mix from Tropic marin that still to this day forms the basis of all their salts is a 100% mixture of A B and C of the Tropic Marin Balling system together!
So there is no argument chemistry in itself proves it, if you dose a system with nothing to balance the excess NACL you create an imbalance, and this is where part C comes in which is made up of everythign you find in a sea salt mix including all trace elements without adding additional NACL, hence the term for part C as NACL-FREE sea salt. But lets be clear Part C is not just magnesium as in every other other 3 part system, it is the whole bells and whistles found in sea salt as stated before WITHOUT any NACL component.
This is why Tropic marin balling from the inventor Hans-werner balling is so popular to those that care about doing this 100% right.
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01-11-2014, 09:05 PM
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Yeah!  there has been a huge uptake in this which is great, looking forward to helping everyone if they need it.
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01-13-2014, 03:11 AM
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So after running this for a few days,my levels are slowly dropping started slow and bumping it up every day to ensure my levels don't spike. My question is now for a reef calculator what option does a person choose that has similar characteristics as these salts.
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01-13-2014, 03:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueTang<3
So after running this for a few days,my levels are slowly dropping started slow and bumping it up every day to ensure my levels don't spike. My question is now for a reef calculator what option does a person choose that has similar characteristics as these salts.
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I don't think there's any. You would have to play with it to find the right amount. It would be easy since you will most likely be dosing the same volume of all three solutions (that's why there's very specific instructions of the amounts of each powder to be mixed to 1gallon water: generally, about 2dkh of alk drop will drop the Ca by 1.5ppm in every tank and the solutions are concentrated in such a way that equal amount of each three parts will follow that ratio).
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01-13-2014, 11:54 AM
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TM explained to me the importance is getting your levels balanced i.e where alk ca and Mg should be, balance alk and ca first. If your alk is too high it will buffer both your ca and mg.
once balanced then within a tolerance everything else will be equal to a degree.
ranges
alk -7 to 8
Ca - 400 - 430
MG - 1280 - 1350
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01-17-2014, 10:47 PM
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I'm considering switching to this from the BRS recipe. I also plan to start using the Pro-Reef salts (Was using H2Ocean)
What I'm looking for is a conversion. I know how much I need to dose daily based on the concentrations prescribed by BRS. I imagine the Tropic Marin system is more/less concentrated. My system is already balanced and stable, it would be helpful to know so I could dial it in faster with less headache.
Also, are the Pro Coral A Elements and Pro Coral K Elements still recommended? What do these bring to the table that the system doesn't already?
Loving the products you bring to Canada. Super pumped Bayside brought this in. Keep it up!
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01-17-2014, 11:00 PM
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Thanks for the positive thoughts on what we are bringing in
the A and K are the trace elements that are not found in salt mixes or can not be added due to precipitation. They add the final element to the system.
In regards to conversion calculation to be honest there is not one as TM or us have no clue of what type or quality the salts they use are although based on the price I am going to guess at not above food grade.
If you have balance right now and that should be as follows
Ca around 420-430
ALK - 7-8
Mg - 1280 - 1350 (closer to 1350 is better in my oppinion)
If you are within those ranges then initially dose to the same level you are now for 48 hours and then test, from there you will know if you are needing to adjust an element up or down.
If you are not within the ranges above then manually adjust over a week to those levels. Remember the connection between ca and alk the higher the alk the harder it is to raise ca without raising your MG.
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01-17-2014, 11:37 PM
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Well after the two weeks seems tank has settled at 250 ml a day of all parts.
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01-18-2014, 12:36 PM
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Good result! Let us know how things roll along?
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01-18-2014, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueTang<3
Well after the two weeks seems tank has settled at 250 ml a day of all parts.
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What does that equal in dollars and cents?
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01-18-2014, 01:34 PM
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over 10L of make up of A and B and about 41L of part C
kit costs $59.00 for A,B,C
Can be purchase separate.
Remember also Blue Tangs tank is total water volume 540 gallon!
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