Newbie looking for feedback

[Reef Pilot]

Planning equipment for your new reef tank is good, but I don't think you have to go overboard. You can have a very good, thriving set up without spending a fortune. Then as you gain experience, you will have a better understanding and feeling for what you really need/want. There are of course some minimum givens, like good lights, and a good skimmer (lots of capacity is good, more is better, and too much is just right).

But just as important (I would argue more) are your reef keeping practices such as QT, dipping corals, checking/maintaining parameters (dKH is very important). I have seen far too many newbies (and some oldies, too) get frustrated and quit the hobby because their fish die or they get one of the far too common coral pests (AEFW is the worst). Or they have persistent algae and/or cyano problems. These issues are all totally preventable with good sound reef keeping practices.

Again, read lots and learn what has worked for others. But be wary of the many internet experts, that like to copy and paste, but have no direct experience themselves on a particular topic. And be a good observer of your own tank, to learn what works and what doesn't. Bear in mind, though, that there is often a very latent effect with cause and effect, esp with SPS corals. So don't be too hasty with anything. Anyway, it will be fun, and best of luck with your new endeavor.

[Sidius]

Thank you everyone for all your comments!!

To explain my ATO plans in more detail, I was planning to use a water reservoir with a Tunze Osmolator ATO to keep the sump topped up. The RO/DI would be plumbed with a solenoid and controlled by the apex to keep the water reservoir topped up (float switches for both low and high marks in the water reservoir). I was going to get a plumber friend who is also an aquarium junkie like myself to plumb the actual RO/DI because I admit that I know nothing about plumbing.

Would that give me the redundancy that you're referring to?

Basically the ATO keeps thet sump topped up and whenever the water levels in the water reservoir drop the Apex would trigger the RO/DI unit to fill the water reservoir back up. If the RO/DI failed it would overfill my water reservoir but it wouldn't fill my tank. The most the ATO could dump into my tank if it failed in the "on" position would be the contents of the water reservoir. I'm thinking a 20gallon tank or something would work well for a ATO water reservoir but would that be too much?

Edit: I should add that I live in a townhouse with ground level main floor so I have no basement and no closet to keep any tubs or garbage cans to store water. My wife isn't thrilled that I'm converting to a reef tank as-is so leaving anything visible to annoy her will just compound that problem lol.

[Sidius]

The plan I was thinking of using for the auto-water change was to use a 29g tank (I already have one in a closet unused) that I would fill with saltwater. Using the Apex and DOS I would set up a daily water change to swap out 1-2 gallons of water at a certain time. At 2 gallons per day it would last me 14 days before I had to replenish the water reservoir. I would then mix up more saltwater and add it back in myself (likely using a pump like you described). That would have to be done manually because like I mentioned in the last post, unfortunately I don't have anywhere to store large tubs or garbage cans for water. I was also planning to setup a float switch to remind me when the water change reservoir was getting low. The cabinets that I'm picking up is my attempt at adding some storage but at best all I can fit is a 30ish" wide storage cabinet on either end of the tank and it has to "look pretty" or my wife will not be happy with me. That means nothing left out in the open, nothing left unfinished looking or out of place, etc.

[Reef Pilot]

I have an even simpler ATO system. I have an RO/DI line going directly to my sump (no reservoir). It runs through a solenoid that comes on every 6 hours for 5 min. The sump level is controlled by a float valve. But as a final failsafe, I also have that double float switch that will not allow the solenoid to come on (and flow water) if that sump level is reached. Have had this set up for a several years, and even my primary float has never failed, let alone the backups.

I should mention though, that my RO/DI system is located upstairs near the kitchen sink (also use RO for household drinking) and has two pressurized (by household line pressure only) holding tanks. And my sump is located downstairs, so always have decent pressure and volume available there.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Sidius,

If your ATO float switch failed in the "open" position, wouldn't it keep pumping water from the 29g and then the float switch in the ATO reservoir would refill, so you'd overflow your display/sump and drop the salinity? Also, if the float switch in the reservoir fails, you have freshwater all over your main floor. Neither scenario would please your wife or you.

I really like Reef Pilot's setup for failsafe, foolproof ATO system, cause having it timed (5 min every 6 hours) will really minimize any excessive RODI water dumpage, either into the display/sump or your floors.

Another note I tell newbies is that reefing is as much an art as it is a science. We've all known or read about people with all the latest gizmos who can't keep corals/fish alive and others who use the most basic system and have thriving tanks. So if anybody tells you its "his/her way only", then runaway.There are a lot of ways to achieve success in reefing, but most of it involves spending the time to learn, to keep track of what your livestock are doing, and to having the patience to not rush and make sudden changes.

If you're into sps, what I've noticed is that low bioload is one common factor in many really nice sps setups. The owners chose a few fish they really like and didn't overload their systems with a lot of other fish. Low bioload keeps it easier to maintain high water quality. High bioload is possible, but means you have to keep on top of things. As others have mentioned, and you already seem to have found out from your research, Achilles & Powder Blues are very much ick magnets and can be real difficult for even experienced reefers to keep alive and ick-free. The Achilles comes from surface areas of the Hawaiian reef where there is extreme wave action and high oxygen levels (according to my friend who snorkeled all over the Islands). I think that is why so many die in captivity. Achilles generally like to be the only tang in the tank. Powder Blues and Achilles will break out with ick at the first inkling of stress, such as you look at them funny (ok a bit of an exaggeration but NOT much). Neither fish are really suitable as "first" fish for newbies.

I also really like your small daily water change idea. It's something I would do in a heart beat if I had the space, but I don't. My wife would kill me if I took up more space in our limited living area for an auto water change system.

Anthony

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by SeaHorse_Fanatic

Sidius,

If your ATO float switch failed in the "open" position, wouldn't it keep pumping water from the 29g and then the float switch in the ATO reservoir would refill, so you'd overflow your display/sump and drop the salinity? Also, if the float switch in the reservoir fails, you have freshwater all over your main floor. Neither scenario would please your wife or you.

I really like Reef Pilot's setup for failsafe, foolproof ATO system, cause having it timed (5 min every 6 hours) will really minimize any excessive RODI water dumpage, either into the display/sump or your floors.
Anthony

With my set up, both the solenoid (in the open position) and the float valve would have to fail before I could have an overflow. While theoretically possible, the mathematical probability of that is very, very minuscule. Especially, since the solenoid is spring loaded to close, and needs power to open. The much more likely failure is for the solenoid failing to open, which of course can't produce a flood.

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

With my set up, both the solenoid (in the open position) and the float valve would have to fail before I could have an overflow. While theoretically possible, the mathematical probability of that is very, very minuscule. Especially, since the solenoid is spring loaded to close, and needs power to open. The much more likely failure is for the solenoid failing to open, which of course can't produce a flood.

And if you wanted to get really silly anal, you could have a double solenoid system, so if one does stay open the other one would still close the line. But then you would double the chance of a closed failure (much more probable).

These are not airliner systems where life (human that is) is at risk, so we have to be reasonable/practical with the cost of our risk mitigation.

[Aquattro]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

With my set up, both the solenoid (in the open position) and the float valve would have to fail before I could have an overflow. While theoretically possible, the mathematical probability of that is very, very minuscule. Especially, since the solenoid is spring loaded to close, and needs power to open. The much more likely failure is for the solenoid failing to open, which of course can't produce a flood.

I have the same setup. Has worked for 6 years without issue, other than solenoid failing closed about year 4, so simply replaced it.

[Sidius]

Ahhh yes I see what you guys are saying now about the ATO. It took me a minute to understand it but that would happen if it failed in the on position. I like that failsafe idea of only running the ATO for 5 minutes at a time at 6 hour intervals. My tank and cabinets are going in about 10-15' from my kitchen sink, and my friend who is an actual plumber is going to plumb the RO/DI, so hopefully I can achieve the correct pressure for something like that. It eliminates the need for a ATO reservoir at all and for that matter, I guess it would eliminate the need for the Tunze Osmolator at all which saves me money

I'm not going to lie, I'm a technology nerd and love what things can be achieved with the Apex so that is part of why I came up with some of these ideas. The auto-water change idea came from a combination of years of dealing with weekly massive water changes in my freshwater systems and reading the various studies that I've found on the web about the benefits of daily smaller changes. I will of course still have to clean detritus out from rocks, sand, etc. so I will need to do some manual/larger water changes from time to time.

In regards to the fish stock list. It's definitely not set in stone and very likely could change. The tangs would also not be the first fish I add to the tank. If I do decide to go that route, I would likely add those down the road after I've gained some experience in the difference between reef and freshwater husbandry and let the other inhabitants get settled. After years of dealing with aggressive and territorial African Cichlids that can stress each other out, I've grown accustom to researching each species endlessly before deciding to add them. I would never rush anything in any aquarium, let alone a reef system.

For those that are curious, I'm planning to use dry rock (with a few pieces of live rock) and taking my time to cook/cure them in rubbermaids first. Once ready, I'll add a CUC and then eventually a pair of clowns. Of course this is all a long ways away. I have a stand to build, a sump to finish and a lot of equipment to purchase before any of that that happens lol

[Sidius]

My next big question is what is everyone's opinion on various skimmer options...

Of course in a perfect world we'd all have endless supplies of money and we could all buy the best that money can buy. In reality there is a limit to what we can afford and I want to make sure I buy the best I can without overspending just for a name.

From all the reading I've done, most people seem to agree that the Vertex Alpha Cone series is right up there with or possibly is the best of the best (subjective I'm sure). Unfortunately it's almost $1100 new (before tax). I've been reading up on the SRO3000INT and it gets great reviews. In fact from what I've read (and from what BRS said when I called them), the SRO series is a great skimmer and should be just as efficient as the Vertex, but the Vertex had better build materials/quality. Knowing that the build quality on the SRO has to be pretty good (just not as good) and it's half the price sitting at around $600 new (before tax), is it worth it?

I read a study on the efficiency of skimmers (I can't recall where but I want to say Reef Builders) and it seems that no matter the skimmer, they are all limited to about 35% efficiency at removing nutrients. Some are just better at processing it faster than others. I am probably over analyzing this to death but all that being said, is it worth spending the extra $500+tax just to achieve slightly better quality build/materials? I guess what I'm really asking is, will I be kicking myself later for not spending that extra money or will the SRO be a great skimmer for my system?