LFS advice on algea

[saltyair]

Learning in this hobby is non stop.

So a little back ground, I have a 180 gal mixed reef with a 65 gal refug/sump
250gal rated skimmer a large carbon/gfo reactor. This set up is now 4yr old.

I have not had any major algae outbreaks since year 1. But over the last 3 months I have had persistent patches of GHA that I manually clean during WC. (I do a weekly WC of 15gal with RO water)

3 months ago I made a desision that i still say was worth it. Others might disagree. I had a very sick YT I have had for over 5yrs (previously in a 75) The YT came down with a blood bacteria and was wasting away. I desperately tried to catch her no chance. So I dosed my tank with melflex for 3 days @ 3/4 first dose and 2 1/2 dose. After the three days the YT survived and started eating again after not eating for 10 days (she was fat) Total success saving the YT. I did lose a milli frag and had to trim a blue acro due to stn.

#1 mistake I also had trimmed my cheteo way to much, over 50%
#2 my old carbon reactor cracked and was not being used for 3 days - than 5 days due to meds.

I also had to stop carbon dosing due to meds. I had started carbon dosing 3 month prior.

- I have tested parm's weekly since using the meds

Before carbon dosing my NO3 was in the 20-30 range
PO4 was always around .25/ .5
cal - 400
Alk - 9
PH 8.1

After carbon dosing for a month and adding GFO
NO3 - 0
PO4 -0
Alk - 8
PH 8.1
Cal - 400

So I went to the LFS - has given me good advise 80% of the time. I asked why I have GHA in my DT - it has been growing since the meds. (3 months ago) I was assuming they were going to tell me to shut down the lights/ slowdown on feeding/ increase flow, maybe the bacteria hasn't caught back up to the bio load ect.

This is what they told me to do. Add more nutrients, the GHA is growing because your tank is @ 0 or close to 0 nutrients

They proceeded to tell me about fresh water planted tanks and that the combat algae is by increasing NO3 - a little research I did find that.

" There’s considerable anecdotal evidence that nitrates and phosphates do not cause algae in a heavily planted aquarium. In highly illuminated tanks with CO2 injection the dosing of these nutrients is considered essential to help prevent algae. If nutrient deficiencies occur, plants will leech ammonia/ammonium that can trigger algae outbreaks."

Also found a lot of issues with people carbon dosing and getting cyano outbreaks.

This suggestion goes against everything I thought we were to do to keep GHA from our tanks.

I do not have a overgrowth of GHA - I have a few persistent spots.

Was this advise crazy? should I shut down my GFO/Carbon, should I stop carbon dosing?

Any thoughts are welcome.

[michika]

Yes, that advice is crazy.

GHA could also be misIDed as bryopsis as well. I haven't dealt with either lately so unfortunately so I'd recommend getting an ID to confirm that you have GHA to start and then either address the additional nutrients in your system (probably phosphates).

[saltyair]

100 % sure it's GHA

So your saying that the GHA is absorbing the PO4 - that is why i'm showing 0 po4?

So after 3 years of no algae outbreaks - I start carbon dosing and upgrade to a gfo/carbon reactor - I now have GHA?

I agree that the lfs advise sounds crazy. So what would be your solution to rid the GHA? response is very much appreciated

Originally Posted by michika

Yes, that advice is crazy.

GHA could also be misIDed as bryopsis as well. I haven't dealt with either lately so unfortunately so I'd recommend getting an ID to confirm that you have GHA to start and then either address the additional nutrients in your system (probably phosphates).

[Spyd]

The problem is you are comparing plants to corals... I have not heard of corals extracting ammonia in a clean system unless they are dying off.

Why not test for ammonia and see if you have anything there. It is possible your medicating killed off a lot of your bacteria and will just take time to re-colonize.

I run a ULNS and have not seen any signs of GHA. Cyano is definitely an issue with carbon dosing. Stirring up your sandbed will help that. Also, blowing off your rocks once a week is good housekeeping to prevent any food, etc from decaying and producing the PO4 needed for the GHA. I use MB7 along with my bio-pellets to keep cyano in check. Does it work? I think so... But, when add more pellets to the system to replaced the ones used up, I find I have to be very careful. Too many pellets and I will see signs of cyano. Carbon dosing can be tricky to not over dose it.

[Dearth]

Hair algae is one of those funny algaes that can completely over run your tank then suddenly disappear almost overnight

It is also an algae that self supports itself so it tends to be very difficult to get rid of

You could see if you could borrow a Sea Hare it would make short work of the algae

Tangs will eat it but also from what I understand can be very picky about what they eat

Scrub scrub scrub your rock very labour intensive and can take several weeks of daily scrubbing to make a dent

Fresh water dip your rock but comes at a price of kill off and increased everything

Just some options

[Reef Pilot]

I believe GHA is related more to P04 than N03. I recently (summer) combined 2 tanks into one sump. One of the tanks had high P04 (over 1.0) and now my other "clean" tank has started to show some GHA. I run both biopellets (for several years) and GFO, but my while my N03 stayed at zero, my P04 is still around 0.10 (although dropping now) with the combined tanks.

I have beat GHA before by running GFO, and it took a while at zero P04 before it finally let go. So it seems that it does not take a lot of P04 to get GHA happening.

Good news with my tank, is that GHA is now starting to subside again, which seems to be coinciding with my P04 dropping. I just need to keep doing my weekly toothbrush routine on the rocks, to be sure detritus doesn't get trapped and feed the GHA.

The ironic thing, though, is that my other previously high P04 tank has no GHA problem, despite having less internal flow and live rock that was saturated with P04 (presumably). So I can't say that I totally understand what causes or mostly fuels GHA. It could also be because of the foxface and kole tang I have in there. However, I do have a yellow tang in the tank where I do the problem, and he does spend all day picking at algae (lots of green poop, too,...LOL).

[saltyair]

Totally agree that GHA does feed off it's self by trapping waste - I will start blowing off rock effected (just one big one and one small one) It's not over taking the tank just looks bad in spots.

some great observations and thoughts.

Reading from aquarium corals - by Borneman
Average coral reefs tested NO3 - .25ppm
Average PO4 - .13ppm

Page 396
Algae growth in relation to nutrients and grazing
Low nutrients = coral growth (high grazing) filamentous algae growth
High nutrients = coralline algae / macroalgae

[Madreefer]

There is alot of mixed reviews on Melafix. Alot of postings saying that it killed things from corals to snails. Others swear by it. I'm thinking it killed something in your rocks which are still leaching out the PO4 which is being consumed by your hair algae. A freind and myself watched his tank crash before our eyes for some strange reason one day. He had a massive hair algae outbreak that lasted for 2 years. He tried everything possible to help beat it, which Dearth mentioned. Nothing at all worked and it would just get worse. Only thing that seemed to work is putting the rocks in a seperate container and letting sit for months while changing the water in the container weekly. That tank has since been shut down but another member on here has the rocks and it looks as though the hair algae is now gone. Good luck, sorry to say but it's goin to be a battle. And it will never disappear overnight as mentioned.

[saltyair]

Oh I did get a GHA outbreak in the first year the 180 was set up. It took 6 weeks before it was all gone. This is the first time it has shown again (after the melflex) I agree it has something to do with the medication. I have noticed over the last few days that it is starting to turn white and die.
still carbon dosing and using gfo/carbon.

The LFS did make me think - it's not super crazy once I read aquarium corals by:Borneman

Originally Posted by Madreefer

There is alot of mixed reviews on Melafix. Alot of postings saying that it killed things from corals to snails. Others swear by it. I'm thinking it killed something in your rocks which are still leaching out the PO4 which is being consumed by your hair algae. A freind and myself watched his tank crash before our eyes for some strange reason one day. He had a massive hair algae outbreak that lasted for 2 years. He tried everything possible to help beat it, which Dearth mentioned. Nothing at all worked and it would just get worse. Only thing that seemed to work is putting the rocks in a seperate container and letting sit for months while changing the water in the container weekly. That tank has since been shut down but another member on here has the rocks and it looks as though the hair algae is now gone. Good luck, sorry to say but it's goin to be a battle. And it will never disappear overnight as mentioned.