Swine Flu/H1N1 Vaccination - Yes or No?

[Binare]

Originally Posted by midgetwaiter

That's not really fair, when the clinic setup for the Flames was done the gov was still in free for all mode, I don't think they realized what was going to happen. The Flames have been pretty up front about this whole thing, they felt having all the players go to a public clinic would have been a circus so they approached AHS. That's a pretty understandable thing IMO. It doesn't make sense to send somebody out to vaccinate 30 guys so they took care of as many people as they could while they were there. The Flames are no more at fault for shortages than anyone else who has already received the vaccination.

The failure here was the way AHS setup the vaccination program from the beginning. Alberta is the only province that failed to prioritize high risk groups, this seriously magnified the problems. When they did decide to setup a schedule they misprinted the age of children allowed access in the first run of the newspaper ads.

It pretty much renders the discussion we are having moot for Albertans. It goes from "will you get the shot" to "can you get the shot".

I'm sure atleast one of them read the paper that mornin, I'm sure atleast one of them knew the clinics were bein shutdown due to shortage. I woulda jumped ship for my families sake too, but I'd take the flack like a man.

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by midgetwaiter

That's not really fair, when the clinic setup for the Flames was done the gov was still in free for all mode, I don't think they realized what was going to happen. The Flames have been pretty up front about this whole thing, they felt having all the players go to a public clinic would have been a circus so they approached AHS. That's a pretty understandable thing IMO. It doesn't make sense to send somebody out to vaccinate 30 guys so they took care of as many people as they could while they were there. The Flames are no more at fault for shortages than anyone else who has already received the vaccination.

The failure here was the way AHS setup the vaccination program from the beginning. Alberta is the only province that failed to prioritize high risk groups, this seriously magnified the problems. When they did decide to setup a schedule they misprinted the age of children allowed access in the first run of the newspaper ads.

It pretty much renders the discussion we are having moot for Albertans. It goes from "will you get the shot" to "can you get the shot".

I'm glad you think that rich people deserve better treatment than you. Next time your in the emergency ward in pain and waiting for 12 hours and a hockey player walks right in because he broke a finger in a fight just remember that you're OK with it because he's famous and you're not.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by midgetwaiter

That's not really fair, when the clinic setup for the Flames was done the gov was still in free for all mode...Alberta is the only province that failed to prioritize high risk groups

Really? I didn't know that. I thought everyone was prioritized.

I know that me having asthma puts me on the high risk priority list and I was supposed to be able to get my vaccine this past Monday (in SK), but due to the shortage they changed the priority list to only include children under 5 and women pregnant for 20 weeks or more. It sounds like the plan is to include more high risk people in each consecutive week.

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by Myka

Really? I didn't know that. I thought everyone was prioritized.

I know that me having asthma puts me on the high risk priority list and I was supposed to be able to get my vaccine this past Monday (in SK), but due to the shortage they changed the priority list to only include children under 5 and women pregnant for 20 weeks or more. It sounds like the plan is to include more high risk people in each consecutive week.

Yeah, Alberta dropped the ball and figured that the 50 million shots that Canada ordered would just magically materialize out of thin air all at once. People aren't mad that the Flames and their famillies got the shot, it's the fact that they jumped the queue by not having to wait in 4-6 hour line ups like every other Albertan. Small kids, pregnant women, chronic illness suffers were all out there standing in the cold but healthy young atheletes are better than these people and don't have to? Calgary Stampeders, Eskimos, etc have had to wait in line if they wanted the shot, Oilers said they're waiting until those that need it get the shot first before they do.(I'll admit the last one is all for publicity)

[midgetwaiter]

Originally Posted by intarsiabox

I'm glad you think that rich people deserve better treatment than you. Next time your in the emergency ward in pain and waiting for 12 hours and a hockey player walks right in because he broke a finger in a fight just remember that you're OK with it because he's famous and you're not.

I didn't say it was right. what I was getting at is that AHS made the mistake not the Flames.

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by midgetwaiter

That's a pretty understandable thing IMO. It doesn't make sense to send somebody out to vaccinate 30 guys so they took care of as many people as they could while they were there.

I guess what you wrote and what you meant weren't the same thing, because to me it sounds like you approve of them getting a private doctor to vaccinate 30 players plus their families. I know people in the health care system as well but I didn't ask them to put me and my family ahead of everyone else and from what I've read none of the other sports teams have either.

[midgetwaiter]

Originally Posted by intarsiabox

I guess what you wrote and what you meant weren't the same thing, because to me it sounds like you approve of them getting a private doctor to vaccinate 30 players plus their families.

Yeah I absolutely do. What do you think would have happened if those 30 players went and lined up at some random Calgary clinic? Media circus, autograph line, a huge disruption in an already messed up situation. The Flames front office knew this because they deal with it every day so they phoned AHS to see if they could avoid said circus, it being in everyone's interest to do so.

Now if you're going to send somebody out to do 30 vaccinations it's not going to take a lot more time or energy to do 100. Planning is the same, travel is the same, etc. They may as well get as much done as they can.

Both of these points are perfectly reasonable in a situation where the vaccine was available to everyone and there were no supply issues. Turns out that wasn't the case and going ahead with the clinic for the Flames was a bad idea because of it. The point I'm trying to make is that the Flames are not the guys in charge of deciding if the supply is available, that's Alberta Health Services and that's who screwed up.

[FitoPharmer]

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[Ron99]

Originally Posted by FitoPharmer

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FitoPharmer,

Please give up already. These youtube videos are not credible. What are Dr. Blaylock's credentials? He is one of these "natural remedy" folks and peddles his own vitamin mixture on his website. Run a medline search on him. He has 13 publications in the database. That is not even close to the number you would see from a real full time research scientist would likely have hundreds of publications. Also, he has only published 4 papers in the last 18 years, 3 of which were in the journal of alternative therapies which is hardly a mainstream medical or scientific journal.

Similarly, Dr. Mercola is not a real medical doctor but a doctor of osteopathic medicine. Look it up. I wouldn't let him near me with a ten foot pole. He apparently also has numerous complaints of fraud leveled against him.

http://www.quackwatch.com/11Ind/mercola.html

This is not real science. Not even close. It is two guys peddling snake oil. Listen to them at your own peril.

[Ron99]

Just to add, if you think youtube is a good source of information on any subject then I feel really sad for you. Most of this kind of stuff is complete nonsense and not credible at all. Please cite some publication by credible scientists with actual data and information. If you want to link to stuff like those videos I suggest you research them a little more carefully and find out more about the people making those statements.

If you tried these types of arguments or used evidence like this in a court of law you would lose your case badly.