Livestock Budget Increase Poll (Contest Members Only)
 

Gonna open a poll to see if you guys would like an increase in the LIVESTOCK budget. Seems like a few would like an increase, and I know a few people joined the contest because they liked the idea of the low budget, so, I'm putting it to a vote.

This additional (amount to be determined) will be for Livestock ONLY.

Voting is for Contest Members Only.


1. No. Leave the budget as is.
2. $50 Increase
3. $100 Increase
4. $150 Increase.

Poll closes Oct 31, 2008.

I'm going to vote yes, I think we've all notice most of the livestock prices have spiked dramatically in the past month alone (due to cdn$ weakness).

Should I be voting?

Would the contest then be open to people who like the new budget but originaly did not join because of the old limit? Would those not in favor of of a budget change (if it was to be voted in) be allowed to leave the contest due to the change in rules, with a refund of entry dues?

I really have to think about this, as I am sure some people, including myself, sat down and thought about the original budget and what they could achieve before signing up for the competition. If I had thought in the beginning that I couldn't do a tank for $300, I would not have entered.

I would have thought that those who alloted a major portion of their budget for equipment would have realized that it left very little for livestock. Changing the rules seems to me to be rewarded people for bad budgeting.

Quote: "I've done the best I can to alter this contest for fit into our forum here on Canreef, but the fact is that not everyone will be happy with the contest rules as they've been established. If you don't think that you can participate under the established guidelines, then your time and $$ is probably best spent on a tank that you truly will enjoy and keep in the long run."

If this change in budget happens, when will the next change be voted on and when do we stop the changes?

If you're participating then for sure, otherwise I guess not.

I figure the more budget the better, you don't need to spend a lot to have a nice tank and you don't have to use the full budget but it's better to have too much than too little.

Rules change, this is true for every part of life. This is a good idea but never done before therefore I think everyone is learning as we go. I think increasing the budget will prevent people from cheating and producing fake receipts, plus it will produce a better variety of livestock and a little more freedom in the competition. If you budgeted for $300 nothing has changed, you don't have to use the full budget.


Not sure if this quote helps or hurts your argument.

Spend the money or dont. If the budget is indeed raised to $450......o well I guess thats just more options on filling the tank with coral or whatever else you need. Even with the budget possibly going up I may not spend it all as other may not aswell, but its always nice to have a bit of a cushion.

I'm kinda with Rocketlilly...if my budget had been bigger I might have gone for a MH on my tank...but couldn't with the budget so bought a brand new fixture that I might not have otherwise bought. I thought the challenge was to have a budgeted amt. and work with that...yep, it will be tough....but doable? Absolutely! Could I work with more money, yes.....do I want to have that and waste the way I've tried to go already....not so sure. I'm gonna be thinkin on it too.

We're all in the same boat, I may have done things different to but having the extra money for livestock still works to your advantage.

I voted for $100 more, but I'm fine with any decision.

Nope.

This is the one and only change I am putting up for vote. Like I said in my original post, some people think its a good idea, and I know others entered the contest based on the original budget.

If members are going to drop out of the contest because of this change, then I will shut this poll down, and we'll stay where we are at. There also won't be any changes made to others entering the contest. It was a headache to keep track of everyones payments the first time, I'm not doing it again. :lol:

This increase is only for Livestock. It's not meant for extra equipment and such.

Again, This increase is for Livestock Only. It shouldn't affect how we have built our tanks up to this point.

Just playing devil's advocate here (and because I understand Chaloupa's point), but the original budget didn't differentiate between money spent on hardware and money spent on livestock, did it? It only stated that you had $300. So if I chose to spend $200 on a light, I'd have $100 left for fish & corals....but if someone else spent $50 on a light, they'd have $250 left. Correct? So how do you say it's only for livestock when the $300 wasn't initially divided into hardware/livestock, and so on?

Quote "Again, This increase is for Livestock Only. It shouldn't affect how we have built our tanks up to this point."

So if we went with expensive equipment to start, we now would have extra to spend on stock, but if we went thrifty on our equipement to start to allow ourselves with extra funds for livestock and our tank is now full, we cannot upgrade or add better equipment?

This latest point is mostly my fault I made the suggestion originally for the extra money to be for livestock only. However that's basically impossible since only one budget exists and it includes both equipment and livestock. So unless JDigital has something else in mind the only way to do this increase would be to increase the one and only budget which is for both equipment and livestock, but the idea was to allow for more livestock not equipment.

I also agree that if people really feel that strongly about the initial budget that they'll quit the contest we should forget about the increase. Honestly the idea was to benefit all equally and although I might argue with you all to the death if in the end you still feel no increase should take place then I guess the only fair result will be to keep things as originally decided. But remember despite some of the previous arguments this is for fun and try and think of the other people in the contest rather than just yourselves.

and how to do you make it so that it's only spent on livestock..others have yet to get their water flowing.....how can you be sure that it was spent on livestock and not equipment...I say if the budget is to be increased....it is just increased...not "livestock" only...I don't think that will work out very well....in the beginning we were just given x amount of dollars...make it work or don't compete....not this much to equip this much to livestock and then upping our livestock budget.

I don't think anyone here can be blamed for thinking only of themselves. I think we're all thinking of the fairness and the original context/guidelines of the rules.

Yes, you do have a VERY valid point, and to be honest I never really thought about that. I was thinking the extra livestock would benefit all.

Maybe everyone should just vote. When the closing date comes then we do whatever the majority wants?

Sounds simple enough to me.

Sounds good to me Ryan.

I voted......ah well, at least with that extra $100.00 if it happens....it could be fun....but I might try to stay close to the original...just to see if I can!:biggrin:

5 more votes I believe :mrgreen:

6... Chowder and Tom R's votes don't count.. lol We got 12 people.

Just noticed that. My bad

Course, now it appears people are getting greedy... adding 50% of initial budget - thats ridiculous.

It's one thing to adjust for inflation, it's another thing to add 50% to the budget mid stream. To me it would seem that adding 20% would be fair/equitable, just increasing for the sake of those who can't stick within the budget; that doesn't work.

I know some of you won't agree with me on this, but since this is a Canreef contest, it would be interesting to hear some feedback from Canreef members who will ultimately be the judges in this contest.

Anyone can post there opinions, the "contenders only" was referring to pole so it doesn't get too cluttered. So Canreef members post opinions but please don't vote.

However don't over think this, only two people have voted to keep the budget as is and as far as I know those two people aren't in the contest. So far everyone has voted for some kind of increase.

Heh, I've been watching this with interest. As a non-contest member, I just wanted to say that I was really interested to see what people could do with a 5 or 10 gallon tank and $300. IMO anyone can do anything with scads of money, only the creative can, well, "get creative" with a small amount.

Just my two cents.

Carry on :razz:

Oh and I edited the poll to reflect only contest members :biggrin:

Well the way I see it the challenge is relating more to what can be done with a stock 10 gallon tank the budget just keeps everyone on the same playing field. I understand the interest in seeing what can be done with $300 but to be honest as it stands the set pricing isn't even close to being accurate anyway. For example $20 for large LPS or 15" SPS, that's not even close. Plus livestock prices vary so much and some get better deals than others. With my tank I haven't spend a dime on livestock but I'm still counting so called "fair market value" which again to be perfectly honest isn't even close. I figure we might as well let contenders have a little more freedom and stock their tanks how they choice, the budget will still exist but at least we'll see a little more variation.

To be honest I think the contest would have been better to just have a budget on equipment and not livestock, maybe next time :biggrin:

I agree on
Quote "For example $20 for large LPS or 15" SPS, that's not even close"

This is why I don't think the large budget increase is necessary.

On this I'll choose to disagree; I think the whole system is a better competition, it allows some of us to go higher tech and make it up on the livestock or go cheap on the hardware and spend it all on livestock.

However, I don't think we should be talking 100$+ increases. I'm adjusting my budget on livestock due to increased costs in the past month on livestock; most of the LFS/LPS stock prices have risen in the 20-25% range. As this has happened between planning & contest start, I'd say we should allow for that. 50$ on the 5.5's and 60$ on the 10's to compensate for inflation sounds reasonable to me, to be hitting 100-150$ that's nuts...

Well so far you're the only one who thinks $50 is good, most are saying at least $100 so I don't think it would be fair to go against the majority, if more agree with you then fine but if not you don't have to spend the full extra $100 you can just spend the extra $50.

Also another note, at the end of the contest we can all post our total $ spent. The voters will decide what they prefer.

Wow, you just forced me to vote.

Input much appreciated, and Thanks for the edit! :biggrin:


Like posted earlier, we've (sphelps and I) have already had one big argument take some of the fun out of this contest, if this increase is going to make all of us start arguing, or make contenders want to drop out entirely, we might as well scrap the idea all together.

This poll hasn't exactly received the warmest welcome from everyone. :confused:

Well this is a discussion so let's not get too hasty. So far no one want to keep the budget the same, so...

Except the people who will be voting at the end. haha :lol:

If the budget is changed, will the people at the end think the contest is a big joke and not vote? Will it hurt the integretity of the contest?

yeap that's why I said "so far" :lol:

I don't really see how that's possible, besides no one will even remember this.

Even if the budget goes up....we can still strive to stick to the initial budget and be proud that we did. No one has to spend the extra money. After thinking about it overnight....I wish I had voted for $50.00 if anything...yeah getting towards the end I might wish for the $150.00 to compete against some of the tanks as they stand now :biggrin:...they're some amazing ideas when we have to get creative. That's a good amount of cash when dealing with a small tank......and it doesn't take us very far away from the initial budget. HOWEVER, the tanks can be done and done well with the first amount we were given..just check out some of the other build offs on different sites...it's a challenge, and that's the idea. It's easy if you have a large budget to make anything gorgeous...but when you're limited you spend wisely and have to plan

Oh I think some will :wink: