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This is completely unacceptable! I can't believe it's legal.

http://reeftools.com/news/key-chains...tles-terrible/

presumed cruelty
 

not too sure about cruelty side of entombing live animal inside keychains. look at all those oysters, clams and other live edibles placed live on ice in supermarkets waiting for human consumption. think their potential lifespan is no more than 4 to 5 days.l

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"waiting for human consumption" is the differentiator; unless your contention is that people should not eat animals

Number of acts of genocide in Darfur: 300,000
Ornamental gold fish in bags are the least of our worries as a species :neutral:.

That is messed up , who would even think of somthing so stupid .

If you're not sure I can help clear it up for you:

Fish in keychains for decoration - Total nonsense, the idiots that created this are sick for exploiting these poor creatures in such a way.

Seafood in a market - Food

Your comparison makes no sense.

It takes a lot to shut me up (just ask my wife !) but this.....

I'm speachless.

$hit like this really leaves me wondering what the future holds for our species.

:cry:

+1

Sick, revolting!

Sicker are the Chinese customers who buy them.

remember, what is acceptable in china's culture may not be acceptable in another. most lfs in canada have no problem selling a goldfish in a goldfish bowl.

if this was a betta keychain would that be ok?
small plastic cup or keychain?

This is not acceptable in anyone's culture, period!

well, emotions aside, not acceptable in our culture but obviously it is in china.

Only one word "STUPID"

Personally, I'm not overly optimistic.....

So how come we don't have a problem with betta's in tiny little cups? Or goldfish fed as feederfish? Or kept in tiny fishbowls where the water is never changed? Or goldfish or bettas used a centre pieces in weddings.. afterwhich half are taken home to die, while the other half are flushed? Or the goldfish put in blenders or swallowed whole by 12 year old kids?

I'm not saying it's right... but advocating for the rights of maybe a few thousand goldfish sold in China is very low on my priority list compared to human injustices such as genocides, abuse of women, children, and the elderly, and religious persecution (which is quite a problem in China, BTW).

I appreciate the link to the article.... thats what Canreef is for, but lets not start lobbying for laws against crualty to goldfish, or we may end up with laws that restrict our hobby! Imagine going to jail for because you "neglected" your tank for too long and a fish died...

Just my two cents... :)

I agree that there are lots of things as a human race that we shouldn't be doing.

I am not trying to start an argument by any means; but bettas are natually found in puddle's so small tanks arn't much different then there natural environment. As for gold fish, they are supposed to be housed in 30G or larger aquariums. A key chain is just not large enough and is enprisionment.

As for the neglect that some people have will allowing kids/pets to eat fish, or not properly taking care of an aquarium... I think those people arn't much better than someone who buys this keychain, its just cruel and unfair to something that stick up for itself.

ahhhh a Puddle ? last checked I haven't seen a betta live in a puddle of water... so I question your choice of words there, also i doubt a Betta in their natural enviroment lives in small dixie cup of water.

If I recall correctly they are from Asia and mainly live in rice paddies. They live in warm, shallow waters eating mosquito larva. Often time the water they live in is muddy and stagnant so they have adapted to be mouth breathers.

A dixie cup is far from there natural environment. Small tanks (5 gallons minimum) should be enough to make them happy. Or at least as happy as any other fish that we put into our little glass boxes.

I do appologize and am regretting posting on this touchy subject at all. But at the end of the day in my opinion putting goldfish and turtles in key chains is just WRONG. As well as somehow they figured out that they would last up to a month without feeding and water changes...

I'm not trying to make light of the link it is wrong but it sounds like something you think of when your totally **** faced and stoned and your thinking outloud " keys are so boring we should make like goldfish keychains! "

+1 :lol:

because this is a tread about fish and not a tread about dardur.

Without stepping on anyone's toes
I don't think it makes it any more acceptable for the Chinese people to allow horrible things like this to happen just because we allow equally stupid things like betas in a cup to happen here. :redface:

I think this is disgusting, and people who are caught selling such things should be kept in a closet for a week with some nutrient rich air to see how it feels.

this is stupid for many reasons.

and you cant even clean the algae once it starts growing a few days later

It's not any different to me then bettas in a plastic cups we look at in everystore in Canada, or puppies in a glass boxes in petland.
And yes China has a bigger problem them a goldfish in a key chain, just search Chinese live animals market or dogs for meat/fur trade.
How about a bonsai kitty? Fully operated business in New York City with website and phone#.And apparently there is a thing like appropriate Bonsai Kitticulture permits from the U.S. government from reading there website.http://www.ding.net/bonsaikitten/bkmethod.html

The rest of your post seemed legit but you're being facetious here, right?

I disagree with the puppies in the pet store, while I think pet stores who support puppy mills should lose their license, the display in the store is only a stopover and they can at least have a good quality of life once they go to their new home.
There are people out there who would disagree with us putting fish in tanks but I think the quality of these creatures existence is where the line needs to be drawn. There may come a time when the fate of entire species will depend on captivity, in fact there have been already. Practices like these "keychain fish" can kill off a species if it became a fad. It's not that long ago that you could go to craft stores and buy dried Seahorses, look where the Seahorse population is at right now.

Agree. We may not like it, but attacking a culture is sick itself.

Look at some of the tanks on here... lol. They may as well be keychains as well.

Would make a great anytime snack, just boil for 2 min. And have instant poached fish or turtle soup. Mmmmmmmmm turtle soup. Makes a great appetizer to go with a Panda Bear steak.

+1

I'm simply pointing out as a race we have quite a few downfalls prior to putting living animals in key chains for entertainment, sure it's horrendous but the slaughter of 300,000 individuals so we can have moderately priced gas is in it's own league.

Ohh and :welcome: to the board!

I agree with you on that aspect Levi... but I don't think people are concerned about Darfur (no offence meant) as there are more pressing things... like Libya.

Yes, it sucks this practice goes on. There are really, really poor practices here in Canada as well.

While I understand the sentiment that there are more serious things than ziplock goldfish and turtles on keyrings in this world, I have difficulty dismissing this as something I shouldn't feel revolted about.

I also appreciate the idea that we shouldn't be attacking chinese culture, BUT... Chinese and (more broadly) Asian culture seems to have an enormous number of these traditions that are horribly destructive to the environment. Does anyone here remember the big fuss in Ontario in the 90's over poaching of black bears for their livers? Shark fin soup? Overfishing of Tuna and Japanese whaling ships? The list is seemingly endless, and this keychain thing is just one more item on said list. Where is the line between tolerating it because "it's their culture and they think it's acceptable" and acknowledging that these practices are incredibly barbaric and destructive and need to stop.

not sure, but i dont see it as attacking another culture. we tend not to find it acceptable and thats ok. its also ok to speak out. as for shark fins and overfishing tuna. well, thats worldwide. including northamerica and euope.

aisans are not the only people that have distructive traditions. for example the whales. our first nations peps here on the west coast hunt whales for ceremonial purposes yearly. (although they use the carcus it is controversial)

our fishermen also shoot seals regularly while fishing.
what about seal hunts?
the list goes on. my point not just asians. pick any culture and you will find traditions or not, that are distructive.

No disagreement... every culture has it's dirty practices. However, North American and European cultures tend to have more of a social conscience with these things. You won't find many people in Calgary or New York (outside of the Asian communities) who would be really enthusiastic about having Shark fin soup, or Bear liver pills, or Rhino Horn powder, etc. Yet in Asia, the market for these things is enormous. I read a relatively recent national geographic article that discussed the illegal trade in endangered species parts, and the percentage of poaching due to the demand for traditional asian medicines was astonishing. Culturally, they seem to have a much lower respect or awareness about the impact they have on the planet than we do.

Native "ancestral" rights are a bit of a farce, but that's a whole other can of worms that I think we should steer clear of in this thread :twised:

Anyways, my beef is when we see something like this and call it for what it is, Barbaric, people get all upset and say it's their culture and we shouldn't criticize because we're not perfect ourselves.

you know that website is a joke right

http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/2001/02/41733

sounds like an hoax? this is nearly an impossible thing. The fish would die in a few hours or days...who would be dumb enough to buy this?

Hmmm.. does not look real.

that was my first impression as well, but was unable to find anything about a hoax. Hard to believe.

did you guys hear abou these house hippos?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBfi8OEz0rA

Thanks for posting this, made me feel a lot better.

Yes exactly my point, how is what we do different? we are keepeing fish in small glass container with half dirty water, fish didnt have a say or a chance.
It has been taken out of its invironment and kept in prison for life.
Hipocrasy is North american way of life. what we do is ok because we think is ok. but not what they do is not ok lets bomb them and that is our way of helping others.