Help with skimmer

[geweagle]

hello everyone,

I am very new at this so any help would be appreciated. I have a 2-month old system. Bought this skimmer second hand. I was told it is very good. I do not know its name or have any instructions. When I started using it everything was great. The cup filled in about 1 week and was dark and smelly. I understand that is good. Now all of a sudden it is filling in 1/2 a day. The liquid is lighter and watery. Not know what changed. I am working to get PO4 down. it is at 1 ppm now. as I try things I find the outlet flow control knobs (2) on the front. I have them at max flow. If I slow them down the cup fills up with water. I tried decreasing air flow, seems like lots maybe too much bubbles. That also made the cup fill up in 1/2 hr. So I do not know what happened or waht to do. Any ideas would be great

[Proteus]

First I would take pump apart and clean it.
I have found that certin medias such as filter floss affect skimmers. If you use try without.
Are you adding any additives to tank that may affect skimmer

IMO there's not alot of good hob skimmers. Deltec and reef octopus would be my preference.

Some more info about setup and water params may help

[geweagle]

Thanks for the ideas. I have not even open the pump. I did not put anything in, but I will check. i do not even know what brand this is. Do you reconize it? Then I could get more direct info on it. As to other parameters in the tank, not got much. Have not added anything to the tank when the problem started. I did top up the water some. Thought that might be it. Raise the water level about 1 " added 5 gal. After the problem started I thought thta might have been it so i lower the water back to before, but it did not help much. maybe a little. After the problem as a treatment for the PO4 I have started a little hangon biofilter with Xport-PO4 to try to drop the phosphate. seems to be working. Down to 0.75ppm, a 0.25 drop in the last day. Also thought maybe the high PO4 was making more foam in the skimmer.

I have thought of a sump system but the tank is not drilled. and I would have to setup a sump etc. A lot of work at this point. Wife is already concerned how much I have spent :)

[mrhasan]

That's a seaclone 100 I am guessing. Don't know whether you can adjust the air mix or not with this skimmer; that could have solved the problem of light colored skimate.

Further analysis:
From the shape of the lead, I think its a generic type skimmer found in ebay:
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/PROTEIN-SKIMMER-AQUARIUM-FILTER-W-300GPH-POWERHEAD-PUMP-/290592911193?pt=Fish_Filters&hash=item43a8afef59&_uhb=1

(Seaclone doesn't have the circular disk on the top of the cup).

[Proteus]

. Wife is already concerned how much I have spent

It only gets worse

[geweagle]

I am beginning to think this is some generic no-name or DIY type. I cannot see anything to identify it. if it was a brand name should have a name plate or logo. It is similar to the seaclone, but not. There does not appear to be any air control. If I pinch of the air intack the water level rises and fills the cup. there are two outlets both have flow control. That is the only control I see. If i decrease them then the cup fills too. It suck! I think I will have to replace it and got shammed when told "its a great skimmer". I am new at this so had no idea.

I do think for now I will have to stick to a HOB because have no sump etc. But open to any suggestions. Wife agrees it is not good :biggrin:. Thats my ticket to spend some money.

[mike31154]

Looks like DIY skimmer to me also. Nothing wrong with that, other than it may take some tweaking to get it dialed in. Certainly worth experimenting a bit before spending a bunch more $$$s on something new. I have an HOB DIY wooden air diffuser driven skimmer that came with my tank & it's been doing the job for 6 years. Old tech, but works fine. I had to do a couple of mods to improve the performance & add features though.

Does the pump provide both flow thru the skimmer & produce bubbles, i.e. needle wheel or something similar? Looks like the pump is in a collection box in the display? Is the flow from the pump adjustable?

One thing you can do right off the top is drill a hole into the collection cup & add a drain that you can direct to a larger container like a bucket. This will eliminate the need to empty the cup every day & minimize the damage if it overflows when you happen to be out.

I don't see a valve on the return line from skimmer back to tank. Plumbing one in there will give you increased control of water level inside the skimmer, if that can't be accomplished by adjusting the pump's flow. Either way, it's one more way to control flow/water level & not that difficult to add. This is one of the mods I did on my own skimmer. A slip union on the same line is also a useful mod. It allows you to adjust the height of the return plumbing, which in turn adds control to the water level inside the skimmer by adding or taking away a bit of head pressure.

Here's a photo, might help with some ideas. Note the collection cup drain tube, slip union & ball valve on the return line. Ignore the air pump, air tubing & air stone stuff (unless you fancy converting yours to something similar):
https://tsl4pa.blu.livefilestore.com/y2pDMkf17oyLi_oJNLHaIVR9v6zKct3mJz0V1x2B0UtLiX_C1D G0r4BpKqIBWUk98iFpIBYSdQCVgjuMusjnNwMVFFitRl-sv6EDi9T42GcAMI/P1010815d.jpg?psid=1

My skimmer is fed from a small powerhead in a box in the display. All it does is provide flow. An air pump makes the bubbles thru wooden air diffusers. It's very quiet & uses little power.
https://tsl4pa.blu.livefilestore.com/y2p7rKdeNs2XggaUfcGYZLyrE7RwIHZ40MiyZ6zgc8yYnXOcif kXLmPbAyvz64a4Dlbtms4avuWN5sg1Y4fI_9u9TtdTytrh3VhV 4WZTBIX9ks/P1030317a.JPG?psid=1

[geweagle]

Mike,

Thanks great ideas. I will put the over flow into a bucket. That will cover the immediate issue. Yes this unit has venturi air inductor on the pump so air enters there. The pump is inside the tank while the unit is HOB. I have attached a diagram with labels. There seems to be no inlet control. But there are two outlet controls, I have marked. However, if I cut the flow back it builds back pressure into the skimmer and overflows the cup, as you suggested. Your suggestion of a control on the inlet would help a lot I think. It should dcrease the inlet flow.

All thanks for you help. It appears this is DIY unit since no one and all the searches I did cannot come up with the unit. It really has lots of air but a little too much if I cannot reduce the pressure in the unit. Everytime I cut back because it is on the outlet it just builds pressure and overflows the cup.

Sure would like to know what happen a week ago. Before that it was great. I will take the pump out and check it. Maybe something in there is causing too much air pressure?
11542

[mike31154]

So there are two 'knobs' for flow control but you're still unable to dial it in reliably to prevent overflows? How exactly do these flow controls function(Edit: never mind, I see that there are two outlet lines each with a control, so this would be the same as the ball valve on my skimmer. Perhaps modifying the output lines to make them larger or having a single large line may help control)? Yes, very curious how it would work so well initially then suddenly get finicky. Clearly something changed for this to happen. A change in water level of the tank and/or any container that your skimmer pump may be drawing water from will often have a significant effect on the level in the skimmer itself. So a constant level in the tank is what you need to aim for. Auto top off for evaporation to keep things level. It's a bit difficult to tell how your pump is situated & where it draws the water from in your photo. Looks like there is quite an air gap between the tank rim & the water level at the corner of the tank where I assume the pump is. Some additional shots would be helpful to understand the set up. Definitely have a look at the pump itself. My little powerhead actually has a lever on the intake which allows for regulating output flow, but your pump may not be similarly equipped. Because mine is a small pump, I can leave the lever at the full open position & it won't overflow my skimmer. I'm able to regulate the water column in the skimmer with the ball valve on the return line. If I haven't cleaned out the skimmer box or the powerhead for a while, I need to start closing the ball valve to keep the water level at the sweet spot in the skimmer. The powerhead intake gets clogged with debris/algae & the output drops. I don't need to tweak the valve very often though & usually give the pump a good cleaning every water change which I generally perform every 21 days or so.

[geweagle]

Hi all,

Well I found the unit. Its asian, no surprise from Hong Kong. Here is an ebay new version . Here is the web link The unit I have is an older model but this is the general layout. With the suggestions Mike made it might be an OK unit. as you can see this one does have the drain in the skimmer




http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjAwWDYwMA==/z/ly0AAMXQrNtRzmW7/$(KGrHqJHJFcFG+mRbh!BBRzmW7PC)g~~60_3.JPG

[Myka]

Check that the airline is clear. There will often get to be calcification where the air meets the water in the venturi (the bell shaped thingy on the end of the pump). You should be able to remove the venturi and soak it in vinegar overnight. You can also pull the airline off and inspect that the opening is clear. A partially blocked airline will produce the effect you describe in your first post.

On another note, a person's opinion of the ability of a skimmer is directly relative to the other skimmers that person has used. If the person who sold you the skimmer never tried anything better then it is quite possible that he indeed thinks the skimmer "is very good". As with everything in this hobby, buyer beware - research potential purchases before purchasing. :)

[mike31154]

Hi all,

Well I found the unit. Its asian, no surprise from Hong Kong. Here is an ebay new version . Here is the web link The unit I have is an older model but this is the general layout. With the suggestions Mike made it might be an OK unit. as you can see this one does have the drain in the skimmer


Aha, good picture worth many words. Forgot to mention in my last post to check both outlet lines & adjustments for possible obstructions that may impede outflow & raise water level inside skimmer. Also, if yours has the foam jobs on the end of the outlets, remove them. No need & they will eventually clog & impede flow with similar results... overflow. Unless you clean them every couple of days...

[JmeJReefer]

It only gets worse

Bwahahaha! Truer words couldn't have been spoken!

[geweagle]

Thank you all for your help,

Especially Mike and Myka. Your were on the money. The root cause was just what Myka said. When I took the unit out for a complete cleaning and upgrades, I checked the venturi. Just as Myka said the air intake in the venturi was blocked with salt/calcium. Clean that and now its is running great. In addition as Mike suggested I have now installed a valve on the inlet so I can control the inlet flow. Control of only the oultet can over pressure the skimemr leading to overflowing. Also I drilled and tapped the cup and installed a drain so if it does fill it will drain into a bucket and not over the floor. Thats a real plus for the wife :biggrin:.

So I hope this tread serves others in the future. This was a great learning. And I got to say I have a lot better understanding of what makes a HOB skimmer work. Still may in time go to a sump as I can see the advantages.

Once my tank settles down I will snap some picture to add to the tread as DIY upgrades for older HOB skimmers.

[mike31154]

Cool, that Myka gets to the root cause of many things. I think you should add to her 'reputation'. You can do this by clicking the little scale icon next to the post #11.

[Myka]

The root cause was just what Myka said. When I took the unit out for a complete cleaning and upgrades, I checked the venturi. Just as Myka said the air intake in the venturi was blocked with salt/calcium. Clean that and now its is running great.

Awesome! Glad I could help. :thumb:

Cool, that Myka gets to the root cause of many things. I think you should add to her 'reputation'. You can do this by clicking the little scale icon next to the post #11.

Hey no worries about that, but thanks. :)