Saltwater ****es me off

[canadianbudz604]

Lesson learned. I bought an API tap water filter thinking that it would be good enough for my 30g mixed reef. Man was I wrong. After using it for 3 weeks to make my saltwater and top ups my tank has hair algae growing, bubble algae is coming from everywhere, sps doesn't look so hot, palys are like half open, zoas lost color. I'm ready to just give up. I've had the tank running for 7ish months now and have had great success buying water from culligan. Why I changed it up I don't know. For the people that have success using tapwater and ur tank is clean, I hate you:lol:. My bulbs are all newer (3-4months) kz bulbs. Now I've been doing 10% water changes every 4 days, what can I do to help my tank recover? More water changes? I'm running some carbon, any help is appreciated. I want my tank back to normal

[mrhasan]

Lesson learned. I bought an API tap water filter thinking that it would be good enough for my 30g mixed reef. Man was I wrong. After using it for 3 weeks to make my saltwater and top ups my tank has hair algae growing, bubble algae is coming from everywhere, sps doesn't look so hot, palys are like half open, zoas lost color. I'm ready to just give up. I've had the tank running for 7ish months now and have had great success buying water from culligan. Why I changed it up I don't know. For the people that have success using tapwater and ur tank is clean, I hate you:lol:. My bulbs are all newer (3-4months) kz bulbs. Now I've been doing 10% water changes every 4 days, what can I do to help my tank recover? More water changes? I'm running some carbon, any help is appreciated. I want my tank back to normal

Hair algae = clear sign of phosphate. GFO should help. Maybe the water source got temporarily bad or something?

[HaZRaTTy]

I would like to say that you don't even know me, how could you hate me! Ha I have always used tap water and apart from the three eyed fish and a little slime algae in the spring I have never had an algae problem!

Correct me if I am wrong I'm going to go look at this tap filter? Is it similar to a brita filter? Curious if you measured your TDS after your filter.

[canadianbudz604]

Yeah the phosphates are up. Now I added chemi pure elite a week ago to help and it made it much much worse. I know a lot of people love chemi pure but I will never ever use it again. It made my tank cloudy and much worse. Ppm coming out of the API was 3ppm

[scherzo]

I used to use the API tap filter. It is basically a DI filter. It should bring it down to 0 TDS. With our water on the lower mainland it should last about 200 gallons or so. At least that is what I found. My TDs out of my tap was about 5-10.

Did you check your TDS?

[mrhasan]

Yeah the phosphates are up. Now I added chemi pure elite a week ago to help and it made it much much worse. I know a lot of people love chemi pure but I will never ever use it again. It made my tank cloudy and much worse. Ppm coming out of the API was 3ppm

I am not sure but you might be blaming the wrong sources :razz: I can't comment on the tap water issue but chemi pure works. It won't lower high amount of phosphate but it won't make anything worse. Something is wrong with something inside the tank. Just my 0.05c!

[canadianbudz604]

I would like to say that you don't even know me, how could you hate me! Ha I have always used tap water and apart from the three eyed fish and a little slime algae in the spring I have never had an algae problem!

Correct me if I am wrong I'm going to go look at this tap filter? Is it similar to a brita filter? Curious if you measured your TDS after your filter.

The API tapwater filter should have worked here especially where tds is like 10ppm without a filter. It's a deionizer. I need some serious help here.

[scherzo]

If your TDS is 3 then you're running it too fast. Just slow it down until you get 0.

3 shows a depleted DI filter.

Are you on well water?

[canadianbudz604]

I am not sure but you might be blaming the wrong sources :razz: I can't comment on the tap water issue but chemi pure works. It won't lower high amount of phosphate but it won't make anything worse. Something is wrong with something inside the tank. Just my 0.05c!

Defiantly not blaming chemi pure but I am defiantly not a fan. It even says helps remove phosphates.l, and it didn't do a damn thing but make my water cloudy.

[canadianbudz604]

If your TDS is 3 then you're running it too fast. Just slow it down until you get 0.

3 shows a depleted DI filter.

Are you on well water?

I had the API filter running at a slow slow drip like taking 4 or 5 hours to fill up a 5g jug slow. Plus it was brand new. No well water city water

[mrhasan]

Defiantly not blaming chemi pure but I am defiantly not a fan. It even says helps remove phosphates.l, and it didn't do a damn thing but make my water cloudy.

"Helps" remove phosphate to some extend (if any, it just helps keeping the phosphate low in a already low-phosphate tank). And since you have algae growing, the amount of gfo in chemi pure will do nothing; it might have died as soon as it went into the tank :P I am 100% sure the cloudy water was not caused by carbon; it simply not what carbon does.

[canadianbudz604]

I know it's not supposed to, but even google it man I'm not the only one. When I had my 10g nano I decided to use chemi pure elite and It did the same thing. I decided to give it a second chance and i regret it.

[canadianbudz604]

I have ro/di water 0ppm. Should I change 50% or what can I do?

[canadianbudz604]

Anyone?

[Dearth]

I would probably do a 50% or more water change to help lower the lvl and then run some kind of media to help reduce it further till it gets to a manageable lvl.

[mrhasan]

I have ro/di water 0ppm. Should I change 50% or what can I do?

That would be a wise idea. Make sure that other than the nutrients, the parameters of the changing water is not very off compared to the tank water.

[JmeJReefer]

Tap water. Bad. RO water good. Rinse the chemipure well before using it. These things r designed to help, not cause more problems. There is something else plaguing ur tank. Dead/dying livestock?

[canadianbudz604]

I've checked the tank up and down and can't see any dead livestock. I can't find the nassasrius snails though, maybe they died in the sand? But again I wouldn't understand how because everything was perfect. I'm going to change 50% of the water and see what happens, if it doesn't help the tank is getting shut right down.

[hillegom]

I live in Surrey, near Bear Creek Park.
The TDS today is at 9ppm. I have never seen it above 15.
So I agree with the former poster that mentioned something might be dead.
Whats your feeding schedule?

[JmeJReefer]

Tap water. Bad. RO water good. Rinse the chemipure well before using it. These things r designed to help, not cause more problems. There is something else plaguing ur tank. Dead/dying livestock?

On a side note, Do you have an adequate flow source? Does your tank have dead zones? do you run a sump? anything dead in there? Canister filters are nitrate factories IMO so maybe look into that? Swap out filter socks or filter mediums? too much liverock? Not enough? Skimmer? working properly or don't have one period? Look into UV sterilization?

Just some thoughts into your "fixable" problem.....:biggrin:

[canadianbudz604]

I live not far from bear creek as well. Feeding schedule is once every 2 days (1/4 cube of mysis, and nls pellets) I don't over feed. Only as much as the fish and crew eats. No sump, a small Biocube skimmer , running only a small bag of fluval carbon in an aquaclear 70. For flow I've got the aquaclear, 425?gph koralia, and a koralia nano. My tank was doing very well before the API filter. Crazy amounts of growth. Only thing I've changed up was the water source. If I change 50% of the water will it shock anything? I always match my water up before using it. I don't want to go digging in the sand to find the nassatius snails, but I will if I have to. On a side note my hammer coral and soft corals look great

[mrhasan]

I live not far from bear creek as well. Feeding schedule is once every 2 days (1/4 cube of mysis, and nls pellets) I don't over feed. Only as much as the fish and crew eats. No sump, a small Biocube skimmer , running only a small bag of fluval carbon in an aquaclear 70. For flow I've got the aquaclear, 425?gph koralia, and a koralia nano. My tank was doing very well before the API filter. Crazy amounts of growth. Only thing I've changed up was the water source. If I change 50% of the water will it shock anything? I always match my water up before using it. I don't want to go digging in the sand to find the nassatius snails, but I will if I have to. On a side note my hammer coral and soft corals look great

Phosphate! 50% won't shock anything as long as the parameters are close (if not spot on). I have seen an european reefer changing 95% water during maintenance for years ;) All you need to do now is bring down the phosphate and check whether it rises. If such happens, you got something leaching in the tank. Instead of worrying about anything, just do a water change: it is always the cure for almost anything :)

[canadianbudz604]

Got 15g of water on the go hopefully this will help

[mrhasan]

Got 15g of water on the go hopefully this will help

Sorry for asking this question but what's the size of your tank? I didn't keep track :redface:

[canadianbudz604]

It's a 29g standard. Only reason why this is making me so mad is because the tank was doing soooo well.

[mrhasan]

It's a 29g standard. Only reason why this is making me so mad is because the tank was doing soooo well.

I can totally understand. **** happens :( Two pumps burnt in two consecutive weekends in my tank. Its just part of the hobby and hence not a lot of people survive this hobby. Do another 15 gallon and maybe take a sample of water to LFS for a quick phosphate test.

[Dearth]

Aye its the curse and blessing of a smaller system when things go wrong they go wrong fast whereas in a larger system you often have time to correct a problem in a small system the death of just one fish can affect your system within hrs. Having a much larger skimmer pro-rated will give you time in a smaller system to correct the problem with less of an immediate impact I have found.

[mrhasan]

Aye its the curse and blessing of a smaller system when things go wrong they go wrong fast whereas in a larger system you often have time to correct a problem in a small system the death of just one fish can affect your system within hrs. Having a much larger skimmer pro-rated will give you time in a smaller system to correct the problem with less of an immediate impact I have found.

When things want to go wrong, system size doesn't matter. :(

[naesco]

Aye its the curse and blessing of a smaller system when things go wrong they go wrong fast whereas in a larger system you often have time to correct a problem in a small system the death of just one fish can affect your system within hrs. Having a much larger skimmer pro-rated will give you time in a smaller system to correct the problem with less of an immediate impact I have found.

+1

[Digger19]

I have run over the years 3 size tanks. A 12, a 75, and my current 28. After many frustrating years I think I finally have things figured out. I have run the 28 now for 3 years and have never had a problem. (Knock on wood)

My routine involves a 30-40% water change(RODI) every 8-12 days. I add nothing else, I have never used a test kit of any sorts on this tank. Only livestock loss was one fish.

My other secret. I have always run a phosban reactor in the tank from day one. My idea is to prevent phosphates etc from overwhelming the water column and live rock rather than reacting to it after it becomes a problem.

Ridding a tank of hair algae once it takes hold is a frustrating task. Water changes by them self dont take all of the phosphate and other nutrient out of the tank as much of it still dwells in the sand and live rock. Until that is removed the hair algae will persist.

In the past i have dealt with the problem using a 3 fold approach.
1) Try to deal with the excess nutrient issue. Phosban reactors with GFO or any other phosphate sponge will do. Have also used a liquid tank additive Phosphat-E by brightwell aquatics with good success.

2) Frequent water changes with RODI water while pulling as much of the hair algae off in between

3) Removing the liverock 1 piece at a time and scrubbing teh hair lagae off with a stiff brush it while submersed in fresh salt water with a rinse in clean saltwater after the scrubbing. While it is not always possible to scrub all the rock I do as much as I can

If you have sand in the tank, I might also suggest going bare bottom as this is also a nutrient trap.

In any case, this wont cure itself overnight and without some effort. Once you do though I still recommend running a phosphate sponge as a prevention measure.

[canadianbudz604]

Once I get home from work I will do the huge water change. At my lfs they have green phosphate sponges that come in a big pad. Will these work or do I have to buy something like rowaphos? Like I said before I had huge success with this tank, so I gotta just fix this problem and go back to the exact way I was doing things before. Now with barebottom do I need a huge skimmer? Or do I need a skimmer at all? I'm liking the look of the tiles that ppl are using

[mrhasan]

Once I get home from work I will do the huge water change. At my lfs they have green phosphate sponges that come in a big pad. Will these work or do I have to buy something like rowaphos? Like I said before I had huge success with this tank, so I gotta just fix this problem and go back to the exact way I was doing things before. Now with barebottom do I need a huge skimmer? Or do I need a skimmer at all? I'm liking the look of the tiles that ppl are using

Don't disrupt the system that is working for you. Disturbing the sand bed now means releasing all sort of bad stuffs into the tank unless you are willing to take out everything and practically restart the system. Sponges will not do anything. If you can, start a phosban reactor with gfo. But don't shock the system with full dose of gfo. If you can't accommodate gfo and reactor, try using phosguard, works good. And like the previous poster said, keep up the water change. And I personally don't like the borrowing game but you can try to borrow a sea hare or something to mow down the hair algae. Will take couple of days for your tank size for a sea hare to whip out the hair algae. Alongside, just keep up with the methods for reducing phosphates.

[Proteus]

Once I get home from work I will do the huge water change. At my lfs they have green phosphate sponges that come in a big pad. Will these work or do I have to buy something like rowaphos? Like I said before I had huge success with this tank, so I gotta just fix this problem and go back to the exact way I was doing things before. Now with barebottom do I need a huge skimmer? Or do I need a skimmer at all? I'm liking the look of the tiles that ppl are using

I still would use a skimmer but the bonus of BB is a turkey Baster will clean the bottom

[Digger19]

Siphoning out the sanded without stirring it up is easily accomplished. Siphon over the surface gently and it can be removed with spewing a whole lot of bad nasty stuff into the water column.Most of it should go up the pipe with the sand. I have done it twice before and have not had an issue. This shouldnt be your first step but might be something you want to consider.

I do large water changes for two reasons. First to replenish goodies used in the reef that are consumed during the biosphere's cycle. I use a good quality salt although there will be some debate as to what that constitutes. Secondly, because I have no protein skimmer, I need a method of reducing other bad stuff from the water that skimming may remove and that the phosban reactor doesnt. I dont worry about phosphates because I run Rhowphos in my tank full time. At some point in this process you are going to measure very low levels of phosphates in the tank but the hair algae will keep on trucking. This is because the hair algae is consuming it as fast as it can be produced leaving little measurable in the water. The real key is getting rid of as much of the hair algae as possible and keeping it under control until the phosphates are completely removed from the tank. That is why I remove the live rock(the stuff covered in hair algae) and scrub it vigorously as practical.
It will take weeks for the algae to attempt a comeback and it will but by then you will have removed much of the remainder of the phosphate from the tank.

Repeat until you have won the battle. A Sea hare will eat a lot of it but once its gone you will need to find a new home for it. They are hardy eaters and once the algae is gone they will starve.

Any phosphate removal solution will work. Some better than others, some more expensive than others in the short term but not necessarily over the long haul.

[canadianbudz604]

Ill buy a small reactor when I get paid. In the meantime ill change a bunch of the water and go from there. I've always stirred my sand bed at water change time so no problems there. Anyone who seen my little tank before this all happened knows it was pretty nice. Also have some fairly expensive corals in there so I'm defiantly not wanting to start over. The way the rock is in my tank it's going to be very hard pulling it out and cleaning it. Maybe a sea hare is my only option for the algae.

[canadianbudz604]

K I've got the water changed, new carbon going, scraped a bit of hair algae off and sucked it up immediately. Put my turbo snail right on the patch of hair algae and he seems to be eating it. Things are somewhat looking up.

[greyreef]

Tagging along to see if canadian bud will get control of his algae...
Looks like your winning, keep up the battle!!
Debating myself between api filter and importing culligan from down the street...
Might want to start with that culligan

[canadianbudz604]

I know or have spoken with people that swear by the API filter and even testing the water today it's 0ppm. U know thinking back a few weeks ago the sewers were being fixed around my place, almost wondering if it completely screwed up that batch of water I made around then. I don't actually test the water everytime I make it so this could be a factor. Also I found one of the nassarius snails but not the other so Maybe it died and kicked off some mini cycle or something because I also see a tiny bit of red slime forming. Defiantly true that when something goes Wrong in a nano everything turns to **** in a hurry. Funny though how the softies have never looked better same with the hammer coral and the japonica cyphestra. This wouldn't make me so mad but my 40+ head colony of red magicians and 25+ heads of nuclear greens are my favourite and I'm gonna be ****ed if they disappear over this

[canadianbudz604]

Palys are still half open turbo snail is eating the hair algae and my forest fire red Digi is bleaching out. Softies and lps have never looked better. Changed a ton of water the other day, should I change more in small increments?

[Dearth]

I would just do normal weekly water changes now of 20% you should start to see change happening over the coming weeks.

[canadianbudz604]

So my tank is defiantly starting to look a bit better. Water is a hell of a lot clearer, and the hair algae has slowed down growth. I've gone back to weekly water changes, and when I do the water changes I just scrape of as much algae as I can. I've also added rowaphos in a media bag in my hob filter and it kicks ass. Now, is there a way to fluidize it by making a reactor out of say a Tupperware container or something? I've seen the Gatorade DIY reactor but I don't want an ugly bottle in my tank. could u not use any container as long as the media bubbles in it and doesn't release into the tank? I'm on a very very tight budget right now so any help is appreciated.

[JmeJReefer]

Straight up outta tha ghetto.
1. Hop in car. Drive to dollarama. Buy a water jug thingy. Something tall n skinny with a removable lid. Drive home. (Don't build it in store, they hate that:()
2. In the lid. Make a hole jus large enuff for a little pump nozzle to fit in.
3. Take some filter sponge, cut to size filter pad, something that will allow water to pass thru but not media, and make large enuff so it snug on the inside diameter of ur water jug thingy.
4. Cut some small slots on a corner OPPOSITE the pump end.
5. Stuff in filter sponge to slot end.
6. Stuff in rowaphos.
7. Stuff another filter sponge in. Near pump end.
8. Screw on lid, stuff pump nozzle into nozzle hole (refer to #2)
9. Now depending on how much of seal u r going for at the nozzle of pump into the lid, and how ghetto u wanna go is up to u... I could suggest a small trip to lowes for $.50 rubber grommet. Put that onto the lid hole and the pump-to-lid snug ratio increases ten fold! R u could slab on some epoxy if that's ur flavour too.
10. Mounting. Dunno. Figure it out.

That or wait till a fellow reefer sells ya a real reactor for cheap....

This is the pinnacle of ghetto rigging a reactor. If there r more terrible ways of doing this, plz feel free to try those too!

[gobytron]

I used to use the API tap filter. It is basically a DI filter. It should bring it down to 0 TDS. With our water on the lower mainland it should last about 200 gallons or so. At least that is what I found. My TDs out of my tap was about 5-10.

Did you check your TDS?

+1
Been using an API tap filter for close to 10 years now.
Live in Coquitlam though and TDS straight from the tap is usually under 8.

They are a bit of pain, first to admit it.
but for me, have been very cost effective and work great.

I have an extra TLF media reactor and some high capacity GFO I'd trade if you're interested.

[Rodney]

I had the exact same thing happen in my tank at roughly around the 7 month mark. It's not a quick fix but I changed my lighting schedule down from 10hrs daylight to 8 got a phosphate scrubber, dosed with ph4,no3 x. These steps pretty much stopped the growth and it started to die off, got myself a sea hare from the LFS and he's presently cleaning up the rest. But it is definitely a phosphate issue , I don't know where I got it and I sure as hell can't tell you where yours Is coming from I use tap water myself my guess is just a build up over time

[canadianbudz604]

Tank is finally getting back to normal (thanks to lots of maintenenance and rowaphos) sps is showing its red color again, and polyps are opening back up.

[mrhasan]

Tank is finally getting back to normal (thanks to lots of maintenenance and rowaphos) sps is showing its red color again, and polyps are opening back up.

There you go :D You just panicked too much ;)

[canadianbudz604]

http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/ee433/canadianbudz604/image_zps64800ecb.jpg (http://s1227.photobucket.com/user/canadianbudz604/media/image_zps64800ecb.jpg.html)

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Do you defrost the mysis and rinse them before you add to your tank?

If not, the melted "water" is full of phosphates. My friend tested it one day and it had very high phosphates.

Since then, I ALWAYS rinse and not just throw in a frozen cube or chunk.

Anthony