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View Full Version : start from scratch and add fish coral and all in a day.


acepumping
01-10-2013, 04:58 AM
Hey. Just wonderin about starting my 150 gal with dry rock and adding all corals and fish in at one tike on day like 2 or 3.. I am gonn be using that stabalize stuff. Just windering if anybody else has tried this kindof startup here. If so I would like some feedback thanks a million
Dave

sphelps
01-10-2013, 05:02 AM
Well as long as you're using "stabalize stuff", better add a double dose just encase.

acepumping
01-10-2013, 05:04 AM
Haha I dont have the name of it. But have you or you heard of anybody thats tried it and it works good?? What kind of issues have you people had?
Stuff like that

Thanks again
Dave

naesco
01-10-2013, 05:05 AM
Hey. Just wonderin about starting my 150 gal with dry rock and adding all corals and fish in at one tike on day like 2 or 3.. I am gonn be using that stabalize stuff. Just windering if anybody else has tried this kindof startup here. If so I would like some feedback thanks a million
Dave

You need to post this on a freshwater board.

acepumping
01-10-2013, 05:06 AM
Its salt though lol

marie
01-10-2013, 05:11 AM
I'm sure many have tried it and maybe a few were successful but I would think that it would take the fun out of "building" a reef

naesco
01-10-2013, 06:24 AM
Its salt though lol

You are not the first to use fish to cycle a tank. Ages ago that was how salt water tanks were cycled.

Conscientious reefers use dead shrimp or something like that instead.

It is not a good thing to put fish through the stress of any ammonia cycle.

Please have the patience to cycle your tank.

Add your first fish one month after the cycle. Throw in a few live rock to get your rock seeded and observe the neat stuff that happens in the month is takes for the cycle.

Go slowly

gregzz4
01-10-2013, 06:53 AM
Hey. Just wonderin about starting my 150 gal with dry rock and adding all corals and fish in at one tike on day like 2 or 3.. I am gonn be using that stabalize stuff. Just windering if anybody else has tried this kindof startup here. If so I would like some feedback thanks a million
Dave
Besides what's already been stated ...

It's not very often that I pipe up on these threads when people are going to kill critters, but :twised:

Why would you want to rush it, and subject your critters to a possible lethal environment, or just flat out kill critters ?

Besides the fact that you are going to use 'that stabalize stuff' ...
How is that going to help you when you haven't mentioned what you will do otherwise to keep the fish healthy ??????

Ace, back away from the tank ....
Maybe you will have success, but most likely you will kill every critter you put in there - and that's a total waste of life :surprise:

lpsreefer
01-10-2013, 06:56 AM
I cycled my tank in a week. Using dr. Tim's (One and Only Live Nitrifying Bacteria) I put a few damsels in the sump and I haven't had a problem since on that tank. Beside me doing something stupid. Dropping the power bar into the sump.

albert_dao
01-10-2013, 07:10 AM
Using dr. Tim's (One and Only Live Nitrifying Bacteria)

LOL @ the name of this product...

gregzz4
01-10-2013, 07:28 AM
I cycled my tank in a week. Using dr. Tim's (One and Only Live Nitrifying Bacteria) I put a few damsels in the sump and I haven't had a problem since on that tank. Beside me doing something stupid. Dropping the power bar into the sump.
This does not equate to the OP wanting to put all their critters in their tank all at once :surprise:

all corals and fish in at one tike on day like 2 or 3.. I am gonn be using that stabalize stuff

The nitrogen cycle needs to be visited here, and the OP should re-consider their plans, or re-read about the cycle and have second thoughts

I don't want to come across as some kind of 'naesco' kinda guy( and I kinda respect naesco's thoughts most times), but there are limits to my keeping my lips 'zipped'

It's nice to see you asking questions about populating your tank, so take some good advice from members here

Don't rush it, and don't use 'snake oil' additives to 'help you along'

My opinion, albeit limited, is you will fail if you start a tank from scratch and add all that you said you will .... :surprise:

spit.fire
01-10-2013, 08:31 AM
I have found that the key to success with a reef tank is Patience...

Now that my tank is over a year old I finally feel that is cycled enough to add fancy coral and the expensive fish I want

Aquattro
01-10-2013, 12:12 PM
With dry rock, it's just not gonna happen. I did this with my tank, but all rock was real live rock that had cured separately for 2 weeks with about 30% of it coming from my previous tank.
Without a full compliment of bacteria, you're going to kill things.

howdy20012002
01-10-2013, 02:38 PM
even if there is added bacteria for the fish byproduct, it takes months typically for a system to properly "level out" and mature.
I personally think you would be throwing out a lot of dead coral and a lot of money down the drain.
you can speed up the initial process perhaps by adding the "stabilty stuff"..maybe throw in a fish or two to start (durable ones)..but I would not go beyond that step for a while.

reefwars
01-10-2013, 03:00 PM
LOL @ the name of this product...

thats awesome :P

chevyjaxon
01-10-2013, 05:40 PM
You have to be kidding right? trying to get a rise out of the forum? 1st of all as stated this is not freshwater your dealing with, the Live rock is chalked full of bacteria that will filter your saltwater. there is more life on that rock than you could ever imagine. Dry dead base rock will not cut it period. you could add base rock to a system with live rock already in place. the live rock will then seed the base rock with bacteria but this can take some time. Stability is by no means a life starter, stability is a product made by Seachem with the intention of easing stress on marine inhabitants. Spend your money first off on Lots of live rock 100-150 lbs is a good start. a sand bed will host anerobic bacteria and once added should not be mixed around. Amonia will spike in your tank no matter what you do during the initial cycle of the tank. this is caused by the initial die off of micro organisms found on your live rock and dont worry it will all grow back. if you belive you can just dump a bunch of life into that glass box and youll get it right, try an experiment, open a bottle of old dutch ammonia and let it sit on your counter, see how long before your face eyes and skin start to burn from the ammonia released into the atmosphere. then think of how your critters are gonna feel when your outside catching your breath from the chemicals. Marine aquaria is a game of patience end of story. you need to read up a bit on what your getting into, any more questions ask around the board we will be glad to help, not flaming you or anything but you need to do this one step at a time. :wink:

Aquattro
01-10-2013, 05:50 PM
trying to get a rise out of the forum?

Looks like it worked :razz:

chevyjaxon
01-10-2013, 05:54 PM
Looks like it worked :razz:

Oops :redface:

acepumping
01-10-2013, 06:01 PM
Yea. Wasnt trying to get a rise. But I guess some people think they are aquaria gods. Oh tips, thanks for the info on how to start a tank. Been there, done that!!! It was a simple honest question. I wanted to try a new thing, it was brought up to me by someone. I saw it done on the show tanked too and likr I said I wanna try something new. Have a nice day guys

reefermadness
01-10-2013, 06:09 PM
DO IT ! DO IT! DO IT!



NOT.

chevyjaxon
01-10-2013, 06:18 PM
cant belive everything you see on TV man, just trying to save you some time money and aggrivation. we arent "gods" but the average marine system costs in the thousands a good skimmer which is the most important thing youll buy 500-1000.00, so we tend to take this hobby pretty seriously. the more people involved in this hobby the more knowledge we can share with eachother. there is still so much not known about marine aquaria, thats what makes it so fascinating and rewarding. the more solid and high quality foundation you build today the less youll have to spend tommorow fixing mistakes. good luck with your new tank! keep us all posted as you build. there is alot of very imformative people on canreef that can help you make your tank a sucess!:wink:

lockrookie
01-10-2013, 08:01 PM
You asked the question

acepumping
01-10-2013, 08:19 PM
Its all good. Just wanted opinions not smart _-_ remarks lol.. so yes I did ask a question rookie.. I am going to do it the old school proper way but was thinking about a change up. Thats all.. thnx for you opinion rokkie lmfao

Aquattro
01-10-2013, 08:23 PM
Its all good. Just wanted opinions not smart _-_ remarks lol.. so yes I did ask a question rookie.. I am going to do it the old school proper way but was thinking about a change up. Thats all.. thnx for you opinion rokkie lmfao

I'm sure the next time you ask a question you'll get better answers :)

albert_dao
01-10-2013, 08:47 PM
To be fair, I do it all the time <___<

gobytron
01-10-2013, 09:10 PM
Its all good. Just wanted opinions not smart _-_ remarks lol.. so yes I did ask a question rookie.. I am going to do it the old school proper way but was thinking about a change up. Thats all.. thnx for you opinion rokkie lmfao

Welcome to canreef.

As a noob, this is what you can expect.
best keep your questions to yourself and do a little reading instead.

albert_dao
01-10-2013, 09:39 PM
Oooooookay, listen, here's how you do it:

*Disclaimer 1, I do this all the time. But I know what to monitor and have a ton of water premixed in case anything goes south. Proceed at your own risk and don't be a scrub and keep on adding livestock if you are experiencing negative water quality.

Disclaimer 2, if you are a noob, stop reading now and just keep doing what everyone else is telling you to.

1. Set up tank. Make sure you have good equipment and lots of flow (the flow part is important). If you have any real liverock, it would be to your benefit to use it. If you don't, well, you don't.

2. You'll need a substrate for the bacteria. I use a 1:5 mix of Zeovit and Hydroton. Place this into a suitable container (media reactor, canister filter, whatever), you'll need at least 1 liter of this media per 100 gallons of water.

3. Seed the tank with a product like Zeobak or MB7 (I use Zeobak, your mileage may vary with other products) at triple the recommended dosage.

4. Add enough household ammonia (or pee, yes, pee, haw haw haw) until you get an ammonia reading of 0.25-0.50, NO MORE. If you overdose, you will retard and delay this process.

5. Add a DOC source. I use vinegar mixed with vodka and acetic acid (1:1:1 ratio by volume) at the rate of 1mL/gallon. This should cause a bacterial bloom which will cloud the water nearly opaque. Keep your skimmer running and empty the cup as necessary.

6. Continue adding bacteria (normal rate) and DOC (1mL/50 gallons) daily until the bacterial bloom subsides. This can take anywhere from three days to 15 days. Test your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels daily, twice a day if you're bored.

7. Enjoy your cycled tank. Continue adding bacteria until you run out. Dose DOC source as needed (test your NO3 and PO4 levels to determine the dosing rate).

This method works for me 100% of the time and I can put my money where my mouth is (read: conspic angel and gem tang +++).

Edit #1: I r bad english.

Edit #2: I know this isn't a one-day recipe, but I doubt there is one, short of being plumbed directly into a GIANT water source which can naturally buffer all of the bad stuff (e.g. the ocean).

Edit #3: Clarified the term 'bacterial bloom'.

subman
01-10-2013, 09:43 PM
I may have been guilty of peeing in my tank to get things going lol

albert_dao
01-10-2013, 09:45 PM
I may have been guilty of peeing in my tank to get things going lol

Your wife was probably really impressed :P

subman
01-10-2013, 09:48 PM
Yeah it's definitely on the list of things she shook her head at and walked away lol

naesco
01-10-2013, 10:34 PM
Rather the **** to cycle the tank than damsals.

And subman don't make a habit of it.

albert_dao
01-10-2013, 10:41 PM
And subman don't make a habit of it.



Dude... Uncool. Seriously. One never doesn't simply tell a man he can't pee into his tank. Wars have been started over less.

Subman, on behalf of the rest of the internet, allow me to apologize for this guy's callous and unthinking hate mongering.

Proteus
01-10-2013, 10:48 PM
I may have been guilty of peeing in my tank to get things going lol

Haha. If I tried I'm sure company would walk in. Ill stick to peeing in the shower ;)

toytech
01-11-2013, 12:07 AM
a 2 or 3 day cycle can be done using products like dr tims and you could add fish but i find when using dry rock i always get quite an algea bloom.With a bunch of fish it will be hard to control nutrients at first and that bloom is going to be hard to knock down and corals arn`t going to be happy .Its not the way i would start a tank because it would take me longer to get it turned around then it would to set it up right.

acepumping
01-26-2013, 06:18 AM
FINALLY!! Some legit answers instead of been bashed. Albert, thanks for your opinion. I have met and know that your a smart guy this way.. I am still going tondo it the old way.. just going tonseed my tank with a few rocks and get some dry rock and let it cycle. But im going to let it go for a good month.. the old way is the proper way but new technology allows us to jump to our steps faster.. its not like the old products that were hit and miss

Once again thanks to the real ones that gave me legits answers

Xadieu
01-26-2013, 09:03 AM
You can try using Prodibio START UP for the initial stage of your tank. I've never tried it but I heard good reviews on it.

fishoholic
01-26-2013, 03:28 PM
I may have been guilty of peeing in my tank to get things going lol

Note to self: never put my hands into Jason's tank.

Haha. If I tried I'm sure company would walk in. Ill stick to peeing in the shower ;)

:yuck: Yuck!

I have done fast tank set ups before, but they would be more similar to a tank transfer then a new tank set up. Because I have over 1000g of saltwater in my house (I have 5 tanks) and Doug (my boyfriend has 1) I have extra live rock to choose from (mostly in Doug's sump). I used some of his rock (fully cured rock that has been in his newest tank for a year now, that he's had for several years now) to quickly (or instantly) cycle the newly set up tank.

Basically I set up the new tank with new sand and newly made saltwater. Then I take the rock from mine or Doug's tanks and move the fully cured live rock over (completely submerged in saltwater to avoid die off during the move) and add the rock to the new tank. Then I've added (figured it couldn't hurt) either prodibio start up http://www.prodibio.com/start-quickly-cycle-tank-aquarium-water-bacteria-biological-filtration to help with the cycle or Seachem Stability http://www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/Stability.html Usually I wait 2-3 days test everything and usually everything is good to go.

Now even I (who admittedly, is impatient as hell) still wait a full week before adding anything and then only add a few things here and there per week after. Still a lot faster then usual, but I've only been able to get away with it because of starting with fully cured established live rock.