URGENT PLEASE HELP ! Shock everytime I put my hand in the tank

[mtlreeffreak]

I cant figure it out.. Yesterday every time i put my hand in the sump I got shocked I unplugged everything one by one until i figured out it was my old auto top of system..today my wife put her hand in the main tank and she says she felt a shock.. So i tried putting my hand in and I only get choked every so often ..

I have a vertex grounding probe in the display tank. is there any way to Test if something is leaking or if I have higher voltage than average?

please someone help me im worried i will lose all my clams and corals..

thank you.

[mtlreeffreak]

its really odd.. I keep trying to put my hand in the tank but only my wife gets shocked not me..?

[gregzz4]

If you own or have access to a multimeter, set it to Volts AC, put the positive in the water and the negative in an outlet ground. Ideally you want to see nearly 0 volts

Is your wife touching anything around the tank when she gets shocked ? Such as the light fixture ?

[mtlreeffreak]

If you own or have access to a multimeter, set it to Volts AC, put the positive in the water and the negative in an outlet ground. Ideally you want to see nearly 0 volts

Is your wife touching anything around the tank when she gets shocked ? Such as the light fixture ?


dont even know where to get a multimeter.?

She is putting her hand directly in

[gregzz4]

dont even know where to get a multimeter.?
Something like this (http://www.canadiantire.ca/search/search_results.jsp), from any tool or hardware store
Sometimes you can get them on sale for as little as $10
Analog will work fine, but the digital ones are easier to read and most are autoranging which makes them easier to use
Don't forget to buy batteries for it :wink:

If you plan on testing it in an outlet, read the instructions well before you use it for the first time, so you don't cook it or yourself

She is putting her hand directly in
So your wife is not touching anything near the tank, just the water ?
Is she wearing shoes, or barefoot ?

[mtlreeffreak]

Something like this (http://www.canadiantire.ca/search/search_results.jsp), from any tool or hardware store
Sometimes you can get them on sale for as little as $10
Analog will work fine, but the digital ones are easier to read and most are autoranging which makes them easier to use
Don't forget to buy batteries for it :wink:

If you plan on testing it in an outlet, read the instructions well before you use it for the first time, so you don't cook it or yourself


So your wife is not touching anything near the tank, just the water ?
Is she wearing shoes, or barefoot ?


thanks.. hopefully i wont lose anything till tomorrow the stores re closed now:(

shes wearing socks..

[gregzz4]

shes wearing socks..
Do you get shocked if you do exactly the same thing she does ?
I'm not asking you to intentionally hurt yourself, but are you both in socks, both not touching the light, etc etc
Some people are more sensitive to electricity than others, but either way, get a meter

Once you are comfortable using it, test the tank. If you see anything except nearly 0, start unplugging anything touching the water until the voltage drops and there's your voltage leak/damaged hardware

Also, sometimes lights can cause a bit of static charging of the water, so if all else tests 0, unplug the light to rule it out

[mtlreeffreak]

Do you get shocked if you do exactly the same thing she does ?
I'm not asking you to intentionally hurt yourself, but are you both in socks, both not touching the light, etc etc
Some people are more sensitive to electricity than others, but either way, get a meter

Once you are comfortable using it, test the tank. If you see anything except nearly 0, start unplugging anything touching the water until the voltage drops and there's your voltage leak/damaged hardware

Also, sometimes lights can cause a bit of static charging of the water, so if all else tests 0, unplug the light to rule it out

it only happens once in a while its not constant.. were both in socks..
im gonna get a meter tomorrow am

thanks.. hopefully it wont kill anything in the tank

[Reef_Geek]

I've been shocked a few times. Work long enough with aquariums, it's a matter of time before you realize why all the fuss about being careful around water and electricity.

Culprits have been...
1) most commonly, broken heater tubes
2) seals eventually broken on submersible pumps
3) salt creep or a bit of salt water bridging electrical contact points, such as on light bulbs or along your cords to the plug, to the rest of the system

Lessons learned
1) don't forget to unplug your heaters when draining
2) make sure you install a drip loop. if you don't know what this is... look it up
3) keep salt creep away from electrical contact points, ie don't rest your light on the tank and clean up the splashing
4) ideally, ground your system.

In your mystery of selective shocking... I've found that a weak current can be felt more readily where the skin is thinner... such as where I've chewed my finger nail cuticles or through a cut. (yup). Also, electricity will flow through your body, so if you're bare foot vs not, makes difference... as well as touching another contact point as gregzz4 pointed out... something else metal.

[mtlreeffreak]

Something like this (http://www.canadiantire.ca/search/search_results.jsp), from any tool or hardware store
Sometimes you can get them on sale for as little as $10
Analog will work fine, but the digital ones are easier to read and most are autoranging which makes them easier to use
Don't forget to buy batteries for it :wink:

If you plan on testing it in an outlet, read the instructions well before you use it for the first time, so you don't cook it or yourself


So your wife is not touching anything near the tank, just the water ?
Is she wearing shoes, or barefoot ?


can you post the link again.. it just shows a bunch of search results..

[mtlreeffreak]

I've been shocked a few times. Work long enough with aquariums, it's a matter of time before you realize why all the fuss about being careful around water and electricity.

Culprits have been...
1) most commonly, broken heater tubes
2) seals eventually broken on submersible pumps
3) salt creep or a bit of salt water bridging electrical contact points, such as on light bulbs or along your cords to the plug, to the rest of the system

Lessons learned
1) don't forget to unplug your heaters when draining
2) make sure you install a drip loop. if you don't know what this is... look it up
3) keep salt creep away from electrical contact points, ie don't rest your light on the tank and clean up the splashing
4) ideally, ground your system.

In your mystery of selective shocking... I've found that a weak current can be felt more readily where the skin is thinner... such as where I've chewed my finger nail cuticles or through a cut. (yup). Also, electricity will flow through your body, so if you're bare foot vs not, makes difference... as well as touching another contact point as gregzz4 pointed out... something else metal.



hmmm my Sump does have alot of salt build up around the edges now that you mention it..

[gregzz4]

Getting shocked only sometimes could mean the faulty hardware is something that only runs sometimes, such as a heater


Something else I wanted to touch on, but after the multimeter stuff ...

You have a ground probe and are getting shocked.
Does this mean you don't have a GFCI ?

Using a probe without one is much more dangerous than not using a probe at all. You are allowing the water to become fully energized (completed circuit) from a voltage leak but doing nothing to protect yourself

If you are using a GFCI, test it

[mtlreeffreak]

Getting shocked only sometimes could mean the faulty hardware is something that only runs sometimes, such as a heater


Something else I wanted to touch on, but after the multimeter stuff ...

You have a ground probe and are getting shocked.
Does this mean you don't have a GFCI ?

Using a probe without one is much more dangerous than not using a probe at all. You are allowing the water to become fully energized (completed circuit) from a voltage leak but doing nothing to protect yourself

If you are using a GFCI, test it


no GFCI here..

[gregzz4]

can you post the link again.. it just shows a bunch of search results..
Hmm ... it worked the first time :smile:
Just do a websearch at your favourite tool/hardware store for a multimeter - I prefer digital ones for this use

[mtlreeffreak]

Hmm ... it worked the first time :smile:
Just do a websearch at your favourite tool/hardware store for a multimeter - I prefer digital ones for this use


this good?

http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/browse/4/Auto/AutoTools/MultiTesters/PRD~0251080P/Autoranging+Multimeter.jsp?locale=en

[gregzz4]

no GFCI here..
:nono:
Umm, that's a pretty dangerous situation
Let's just say it's a good thing you only got shocked
For the sake of your critters, I'd suggest you unplug the ground probe for now and DON'T TOUCH the water
This will cut down on the amount of current in the tank and give them a break
DO NOT touch the water without the probe in place as you will become the ground

Maybe spend tonight reading up on aquariums with GFCIs and ground probes

1 - Plug the probe back in when you have the meter ready to go
2 - Find the hardware issue and fix it
3 - Install a GFCI, or a bunch of individual ones for each 'wet' hardware piece

[gregzz4]

this good?
Yup, that'll do well. And you can use it all around the house and your vehicle

[gregzz4]

OH, if you have kids, just leave the probe plugged in :biggrin:

[mtlreeffreak]

Yup, that'll do well. And you can use it all around the house and your vehicle


thanks for the help!

[gregzz4]

You're welcome
Now go do some reading :lol:

[mtlreeffreak]

You're welcome
Now go do some reading :lol:


on it :)

[makana]

I have been shocked on two seperate ocasions and both where from induced voltage from the lights. Once when the floor in front of the tank was damp because I had just wiped up some spilt water and once while I was cleaning up spilt water and didn't even have my hand in the tank. The water on the ground and the induced voltage somehow made a circuit out of me and a metal filing cabinet. If you have ballast driven lights then induced voltage is something to consider.

[mtlreeffreak]

I have been shocked on two seperate ocasions and both where from induced voltage from the lights. Once when the floor in front of the tank was damp because I had just wiped up some spilt water and once while I was cleaning up spilt water and didn't even have my hand in the tank. The water on the ground and the induced voltage somehow made a circuit out of me and a metal filing cabinet. If you have ballast driven lights then induced voltage is something to consider.


i have maxpect razr leds

[iceman86]

I've been shocked a few times. Happened to me when I first started the hobby, I didn't know any better and I bought few equipment items from a lfs. He brings his stuff over from Asia and I just compared prices to others lfs and obviously went for the cheaper stuff. Soon enough I learned that in this hobby you REALLY get what you pay for and every single item broke down within a couple months. Almost every time I'd put my hand in the tank I'd get a little shock and couldn't figure out why. Talked to another lfs about this and they instantly knew where I bought my equipment. I replaced everything and haven't had any issues since.

[Aquattro]

Lessons learned
1) don't forget to unplug your heaters when draining
2) make sure you install a drip loop. if you don't know what this is... look it up
3) keep salt creep away from electrical contact points, ie don't rest your light on the tank and clean up the splashing
4) ideally, ground your system.



1) Learned the hard way
2) Lit my house on fire
3)Lit my house on fire
4)Did this before lighting house on fire

Also, electrical cords eventually get brittle and crack in salt water. Learned the hard way. :)
DIY wiring, make sure you know what you're doing - Lit house on fire (yes, I'm also surprised I still have a house -lol)

[iceman86]

1) Learned the hard way
2) Lit my house on fire
3)Lit my house on fire
4)Did this before lighting house on fire

Also, electrical cords eventually get brittle and crack in salt water. Learned the hard way. :)
DIY wiring, make sure you know what you're doing - Lit house on fire (yes, I'm also surprised I still have a house -lol)

What I'm surprised is your still alive and your wife hasn't killed you!! My wife would have killed me if I set the house on fire because of the aquarium lol :mrgreen:

[Aquattro]

What I'm surprised is your still alive and your wife hasn't killed you!! My wife would have killed me if I set the house on fire because of the aquarium lol :mrgreen:

Good point. Last time I came home, smoke billowing from house, wife, daughter and a nurse standing on the road. Thought I was done for sure!

[iceman86]

Good point. Last time I came home, smoke billowing from house, wife, daughter and a nurse standing on the road. Thought I was done for sure!

Lmao (clapping hands)

[gregzz4]

Any updates ?
Are you still alive :razz:

[craigwmiller]

I get shocked by my tank every time I wear crocs (or dawgs) around the house... The shoes provide an insulation allowing static electricity to build up, and since my tank is grounded with a grounding probe, it hits me (audibly, and curse-word-flying) when I forget to take them off before touching the tank (or sump).

[gregzz4]

I get shocked by my tank every time I wear crocs (or dawgs) around the house... The shoes provide an insulation allowing static electricity to build up, and since my tank is grounded with a grounding probe, it hits me (audibly, and curse-word-flying) when I forget to take them off before touching the tank (or sump).
Static electricity shocks aren't uncommon
Are you being shocked from static when you, say, touch your light ?
Or are you saying you are being shocked when you touch the water ?

[craigwmiller]

For me it's anything around the house that's metal when wearing the shoes (which is nearly all the time as we have no carpet, and I work from home :biggrin: )... I walk around the house touching the fridge, stove, TV, etc - shocks everywhere -- especially comical when I touch the TV and it reboots while my wife is watching something :lol:


Around the aquarium, mainly just the water - but since I have a grounding probe it's to be expected. Some of the other plumbing parts that are wet or have damp salt creap, same thing. Don't remember being specifically shocked by my lights (hanging AI Vega's) - but will give it a try tomorrow for giggles :D


long story short, fleece pants + crocs = constant static shocks...


But for the thread starter, this is another possibility why his wife gets shocked and not him (different clothing/footwear choices/etc)

[gregzz4]

But for the thread starter, this is another possibility why his wife gets shocked and not him (different clothing/footwear choices/etc)
This is why I asked them to conduct a test with similar footwear

[Wheelman76]

From what I remember reading a while ago , and I may be completely wrong but here goes.

Stray voltage if too high in the water can affect the fish , but won't give you a shock if you put your hand in the water. Stray voltage usually comes from powerheads and other pumps that use magnets. I have about 25volts right now when I test with a multi meter and if I add a grounding probe it will drop to 0. I'm not using the grounding probe right now because from what I've read like gregzzz wrote earlier , is that using a grounding probe with no gfci is very dangerous. I'm in the process of installing a gfci and then I will start using my grounding probe.

Stray current doesn't bother the fish but this is what will give you a shock. Stray current comes from things like a faulty heater.

To test stray voltage with a multimeter set it to volts.

To test stray current set it to amps or milliamps.

[gregzz4]

From what I remember reading a while ago , and I may be completely wrong but here goes.

Stray voltage if too high in the water can affect the fish , but won't give you a shock if you put your hand in the water. Stray voltage usually comes from powerheads and other pumps that use magnets. I have about 25volts right now when I test with a multi meter and if I add a grounding probe it will drop to 0. I'm not using the grounding probe right now because from what I've read like gregzzz wrote earlier , is that using a grounding probe with no gfci is very dangerous. I'm in the process of installing a gfci and then I will start using my grounding probe.

Stray current doesn't bother the fish but this is what will give you a shock. Stray current comes from things like a faulty heater.

To test stray voltage with a multimeter set it to volts.

To test stray current set it to amps or milliamps.
You're correct, but need to keep some things in mind
It doesn't matter whether we are talking about volts or amps .. either is bad in saltwater
Ungrounded stray voltage, in most cases, will not affect in-tank critters visually. This is why we see nothing wrong and get shocked when we touch the water, creating a ground loop, and hurting ourselves and them. Only when the circuit is completed do we see problems with our critters, and by then we are able to easily be shocked
There are many different ways electricity can be in our tanks, and many outcomes
Have a read through this, taken from Bean Animals Bar and Grille http://www.beananimal.com/articles/electricity-for-the-reefer.aspx

This shows pretty much every instance that can occur, and I should have linked it for the OP to start with

GROUND PROBES

A grounding probe is a piece of metal (silver or titanium, to be reef safe) that connects the system's water to the home's electrical grounding conductor. Grounding probes are somewhat controversial in the hobby. The probe adds a degree of protection against electrical shock but at the same time may allow current to flow through the aquarium and its inhabitants. The following examples will help to illustrate the concepts presented here. When a person comes in contact with the water AND the ground

Example #1: A powerhead in the tank develops a hole in the insulation of the HOT wire. The powerhead is not plugged into a GFCI and there is no grounding probe. Because there is no path for current to flow, the powerhead operates normally. Nothing in the aquarium is exposed to current flow. When a person comes in contact with the water AND the ground, then current will start to flow through that person. Because there is no GFCI to sense the imbalance, the person will receive a serious electrical shock and possibly be electrocuted! It should be very clear that a GFCI is a MUST HAVE piece of safety equipment!

Example #2: A powerhead in the tank develops a hole in the insulation of the HOT wire. The powerhead is not plugged into a GFCI and there is a ground probe. Because there is a path for current to flow, the inhabitants of the tank are exposed to electric current. Furthermore, when a person comes in contact with the water AND the ground, then current will start to flow through that person. Because there is no GFCI to sense the imbalance, the person will receive a serious electrical shock and possibly be electrocuted! It should be very clear that a grounding probe used WITHOUT a GFCI is very dangerous proposition.

Example #3: A powerhead in the tank develops a hole in the insulation of the HOT wire. The powerhead is plugged into a GFCI but there is no grounding probe. Because there is no path for the current to take, no current flows and the pump operates normally. Nothing in the aquarium is exposed to current flow. When a person comes in contact with the water AND the ground, then current will start flow through that person. The GFCI will sense the leak and trip, preventing serious electric shock.

Example #4: A powerhead in the tank develops a hole in the insulation of the HOT wire. The powerhead is plugged into a GFCI and there IS a grounding probe. As soon as the HOT wire is exposed, current will begin to flow through the tank water to the grounding probe. The GFCI will register this leak and trip.

There are plenty of other scenarios to look at. What happens when both the HOT and NEUTRAL (or ground) of a piece of equipment are both exposed underwater? With or without a GFCI, current will flow locally from the HOT to the NEUTRAL (or ground). The GFCI (if in place) will NOT trip because there is no current imbalance. The tanks inhabitants will not likely be aware of the current flow either. Placing a hand in the tank could provide a nasty shock! A grounding probe in conjunction with a GFCI would prevent this by causing the current to flow to the probe, and thus tripping the GFCI. The same holds true if two different pieces of equipment develop small leaks, one HOT and the other Neutral. The probe and GFCI combination would allow current to flow to the probe, subsequently causing the GFCI to trip.
Using a ground probe without GFCI protection on all of the submerged (or exposed) equipment creates a dangerous situation for the tank's inhabitants and humans exposed to that tank. A ground probe must always be used with GFCI protection!

[chevyjaxon]

been there, done that zapped myself a few times. voltage needs a ground to travel, the fish will be fine and not feel a thing until you ground the tank with your hand. keep in mind the fish are not grounded until you supply it with your body. never used a probe, 5 years and no fires yet :wink:

[mtlreeffreak]

ok so bottom LINE im not using a GFI but i am using a grounding probe.. should i take out the probe?

[Reef_Geek]

ok so bottom LINE im not using a GFI but i am using a grounding probe.. should i take out the probe?

you should get a gfi and keep the grounding probe

but until you get the gfi, you should disconnect the grounding probe. (but you'll be at risk of building a charge on your tank, discharged when your body or something else bridges it and something grounded)

Doing the above prevents electricity from continuously flowing to whatever your grounding probe is attached to. (and lighting your house on fire, or charging up something else in the house as a fun surprise)

[gregzz4]

ok so bottom LINE im not using a GFI but i am using a grounding probe.. should i take out the probe?
Reef_Geek is right
Until you get a GFCI, remove the probe and don't put it back in otherwise

Have you done any multimeter testing yet - with and without the probe in place ?