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Duker
04-19-2012, 04:50 AM
Hey all, just wondering what people are using BESIDES regular GFO, or Rowaphos?
I have used both, regular GFO and now onto Rowaphos, but I need something stronger....any suggestions?

freezetyle
04-19-2012, 05:22 AM
Hey all, just wondering what people are using BESIDES regular GFO, or Rowaphos?
I have used both, regular GFO and now onto Rowaphos, but I need something stronger....any suggestions?

TimT gave me some samples of the Foz Down stuff. you could swipe of of those bottles to try. Or asks Aqua_digital to give you a sample.

Just put a filter sock on the end of your drain plumbing and dose it into the overflow portion. It should precipitate into the filter sock. similar (sounds exactly) to lanthanum chloride that they use in pools

reefwars
04-19-2012, 05:31 AM
Hey all, just wondering what people are using BESIDES regular GFO, or Rowaphos?
I have used both, regular GFO and now onto Rowaphos, but I need something stronger....any suggestions?


if you need something stronger than gfo then i would start looking into where all this phosphate is coming from??

whatcaneyedo
04-19-2012, 05:41 AM
Besides regular GFO I do these:
'Oversized' skimmer
10% weekly water changes
Calcium hydroxide
Macro algae
Strain frozen food of its packing water after thawing
Manageable livestock load.

Phosphate and the Reef Aquarium
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/rhf/index.php

Several retailers also sell high capacity GFO.

TimT
04-19-2012, 05:56 AM
Foz Down works great and I have used it here for years.

Since I don't thaw and refreeze my Pacifica Plankton when I make it there is no water to discard. I don't rinse the Pacifica Plankton when I feed it as the juice off of it has lots of minerals, amino acids and fatty acids that the corals love.

reefwars
04-19-2012, 06:02 AM
Foz Down works great and I have used it here for years.

Since I don't thaw and refreeze my Pacifica Plankton when I make it there is no water to discard. I don't rinse the Pacifica Plankton when I feed it as the juice off of it has lots of minerals, amino acids and fatty acids that the corals love.


i love pacifica plankton i think its an incrdible product i also dont rinse it, i do for just about all my other frozen but i find the corals love the juices, i use the juices to entise my nps to come out for feedings:)

whatcaneyedo
04-19-2012, 06:11 AM
Foz Down works great and I have used it here for years.

Since I don't thaw and refreeze my Pacifica Plankton when I make it there is no water to discard. I don't rinse the Pacifica Plankton when I feed it as the juice off of it has lots of minerals, amino acids and fatty acids that the corals love.

I have a package of that in my freezer that I occasionally feed my fish. On the package it says "*Rinse before feeding". So I'm a little confused. If you're against rinsing it why does your packaging say to rinse?

TimT
04-19-2012, 06:43 AM
I have an over sized downdraft skimmer(ETSS 1000) running ozone. My set up can handle a little extra "juice". Other people may not be running a monster skimmer with ozone and have different maintenance regimes than I do. The "Rinse before feeding" recommendation is so they don't potentially overload their tanks. Just trying to be helpful is all :)

monocus
04-19-2012, 06:58 AM
make yourself an algae scrubber-they work great

Duker
04-19-2012, 04:45 PM
Hmm, well I just might try the Poz down.

Ya, I do 20 gallon H2O changes weekly (approx 20%), have the 30 gallon fuge (as my signature line says, 15 gallon mangroves tank, and ya I rinse my food. I din't need help figuring out where it comes from-I know where it comes from --thanks tho. Just wanna know what everyone is using. Or if there are any new products out there I could try.

Thanks Jon, when r u in the store next? I gotta come up there and get the hanna phosphate reagents too. :0)

whatcaneyedo
04-19-2012, 06:47 PM
You've probably got a lot of phosphate bound to your rocks and sand. Three or four years ago when I first tested my tank for it I was at .75. So then I started to do all of those things that I listed earlier including running 2 cups of GFO that I changed once or twice a month. At first I used rowaphos because it was readily available but then I switched to BRS GFO and even a container of HC GFO to keep my costs down. Eventually I drew it all out of my system and now I only need 1 cup that I change every two months to maintain it at an undetectable level. Macro algae no longer grows for me, I have no more bryopsis, and my glass only needs to be cleaned once a week.

TimT
04-19-2012, 07:29 PM
Old tank syndrome where the rocks and sand start releasing their bound up Phosphate has also been cured by using Foz Down.

I recently took over maintenance on a 240 gallon system with large fish that had been heavily fed for over 5 years. The Phosphate read 1.41mg/l on a Lamotte Smart 2 Colorimeter. After 2 weeks the Phosphate is now under control with the routine addition of small amounts of Foz Down via Profilux doser. The cost to do this was about $75 in Foz Down and 4 x 15% water changes. Time to start putting the SPS in. :)

Duker
04-20-2012, 01:32 AM
After 2 weeks the Phosphate is now under control with the routine addition of small amounts of Foz Down via Profilux doser. The cost to do this was about $75 in Foz Down and 4 x 15% water changes. Time to start putting the SPS in. :)

Two weeks, WOW, my concern is dropping it that fast. It might seriously shock my corals to much. But i guess I would just add smaller amounts???? Hmmm gotta do more reading. Do you have info on your website about it?

TimT
04-20-2012, 07:44 AM
Two weeks, WOW, my concern is dropping it that fast. It might seriously shock my corals to much. But i guess I would just add smaller amounts???? Hmmm gotta do more reading. Do you have info on your website about it?

The tank had mainly paly's and shroomz and a gorg with a few LPS, Fox Coral, Pearl Bubble and a Blasto pipe. They all did fine.

From my own system you can drop Phosphate by .25 per 48hrs with out any issues for SPS. Had a bad shipment of Trochus once :-(

Here is the link to the site http://www.oceanfreshaquarium.com/foz-down/
Cheers,
Tim

Duker
04-20-2012, 04:58 PM
Thanks for the link TIM, yeah I will give it a go. And it just so happens I know where I can get my hands on a bottle. Thanks again. I will keep this thread going with my results from using it, then maybe it will help others.
:0)

TimT
04-20-2012, 05:06 PM
Thanks Ronnie. I am sure you will find the product very effective.

Cheers,
Tim

FragIt Dan
04-20-2012, 05:46 PM
I have been playing around with Brightwell Aquatics XPort PO4, which is kind of like a crouton version of GFO, but 'ultra' high capacity and not requiring fluidizing. I am down to using half the recommended dose of the same amount of HC GFO and after a couple of months am still getting Hannah PO4 readings near 0.00-0.03 with daily feedings of Reef Snow, various other (non-rinsed) foods for the fish and periodically coral frenzy and reef roids (very high in PO4) and ATO with RODI.
In terms of food rinsing, Randy HF recently wrote an article that covered sources of PO4 in the aquarium and concluded PO4 sourced from most (or maybe all) frozen foods were the major contributor to PO4 but rinsing did NOT reduce PO4 by any significant amount: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2012/3/chemistry.
I am happy with the XPort PO4 product but don't see why using more GFO wouldn't accomplish the same goal. I have some extra if anyone around Nanaimo would like to give it a try.
Dan

lastlight
04-20-2012, 05:56 PM
So if you dose into your overflow and it goes almost immediately into a filter sock... is the foz down still as effective? And will a 200 micron sock catch the precipitate? I'd imagine that not all of the foz down would react right away and it would get through the sock itself and cause precipitation elsewhere where you can't collect it?

I have an unused doser channel so I'm curious...

paddyob
04-20-2012, 06:39 PM
If you have phosphate issues, it is most likely caused by something YOU are doing.

Most likely overfeeding or lack of maintenance. I know, you are not "over feeding"... nobody ever does. :twised:

Try reducing feeding amounts a little. 25% max at first.

Try more water changes as well.

Adding GFO or anything else is not a solution.

Before dropping money on yet another product to dose your tank with, just try the due diligence. Trust me, you do not need a phos remover in most cases. I did aquarium maintenance for some time, and what I am saying, will work, as I have taken many client tanks from high to low readings.

Once you get it under control manually, you can use GFO or pellets to help maintain.

EVEN if you did just go GFO or something, it is going to take time. Possibly 1-2 months as if you do not change the activity causing the PO4, you are simply fighting it, not controlling.

1) 25% water change - this weekend and again next.
2) reduce feeding up to 25% - watch the fish... if they get skinny, you have gone to far, but generally not going to happen
3) after levels are reduced, use PO4 controlling substance to help keep levels down.

Good luck.

paddyob
04-20-2012, 08:21 PM
Oh yea... Forgot to add, this way is free. If you do not get results, you are not any further behind.

Patrick

TimT
04-20-2012, 09:18 PM
Hi Brett,

Adding the Foz Down the way you suggested is a good way to use it.

As for effectiveness it will immediately bind with any Phosphate it comes in contact with. If you have a lot of Phosphate it might plug the filter sock quickly.

If you have a bucket for ATO water it could be added to that. Then a dilute amount will be added continuously during the day. The water outlet hose for the ATO could be run into the back of the overflow or even directly into the filter sock. I have heard of aquariums using sand filters so a 200 micron filter sock should work well.



So if you dose into your overflow and it goes almost immediately into a filter sock... is the foz down still as effective? And will a 200 micron sock catch the precipitate? I'd imagine that not all of the foz down would react right away and it would get through the sock itself and cause precipitation elsewhere where you can't collect it?

I have an unused doser channel so I'm curious...

Reefie
04-20-2012, 11:25 PM
I'm sold on Foz Down, just have to wait to get some. *Ahem* Tim......

Haha!

TimT
04-21-2012, 12:12 AM
They should be ready end of next week.

kobelka
04-21-2012, 12:46 AM
Is it important to add foz down where you can catch the precipitate? Is it a must do to remove whatever forms?

Ian
04-21-2012, 02:40 AM
I have to chime in here
I have been having a huge algae issue for a long time in my 250 gallon system . I am doing 15% water changes weekly and have reduced feeding and am still fighting this battle. I tried FOZ down to the tune of 2 -8oz bottles in 2.5 months and had no change that I could notice. I actually put in 20ml 3 times in 1 day and measured phosphate before and after each dose and the following morning with no measurable change.

It may work for you but just beware it is no miracle cure....and the battle continues

lastlight
04-21-2012, 03:02 AM
GFO is doing a good job for me I'm just looking at ways to minimize maintenance. One less media to replace every 2 weeks would be nice. As soon as I exhaust the 30 lbs of HC GFO I just bought I'm going to take the stuff for a test drive.

Snaz
04-21-2012, 03:07 AM
Since upgrading my lights algae has become an issue...my refugium can no longer keep up so I have begin today to use Rowaphos. Time will tell.

weyburnt
04-21-2012, 03:25 AM
I put some dried live rock that was given to me into my 50 gal when I started it. When I bought my po4 testkit 3 weeks later I was at 5ppm. I started doing 20 percent wc twice a week and quickly got it down to .9 ppm. Gfo diddnt do much for me. Algea scrubber built from anaquaclear 500 helped alot.foz down brought it down very fast. Tank looked like a snow globe. That was about six weeks ago. Now phosphate leaches from the rocks at about .1ppm every couple of days. Foz down will drop it to zero in an hour. Hair algea is dying and phosphate is leaching less and less.

Philster
04-22-2012, 04:45 AM
GFO is doing a good job for me I'm just looking at ways to minimize maintenance. One less media to replace every 2 weeks would be nice. As soon as I exhaust the 30 lbs of HC GFO I just bought I'm going to take the stuff for a test drive.

Wow, 30lbs is going to last you quite a while :biggrin: I am trying the new HC GFO at the moment. Do you find your skimmate is quite dark now? Some have suggested I may have it tumbling to much but I have it moving very gently. How are you liking it :question:

Duker
04-28-2012, 04:48 AM
If you have phosphate issues, it is most likely caused by something YOU are doing.

Most likely overfeeding or lack of maintenance. I know, you are not "over feeding".

Good luck.

Yeah, as I said. I don't want opinions on my maintenance, just on products out there people are using....but thanks.

Cade
04-28-2012, 05:49 AM
Hey, I just checked my phosphate for the first time today and well.. its up there. (.34 :redface:) What your test reading? and can you keep us informed about your readings after?
My rock its at least 8 years old 6.5 of which were in neglected dirty tanks that probably never had water changes, they didnt have heaters or even power heads! This is what Im blaming my po4 on..:razz:
I have been running bio pellets for about 1 month now and hope its going down..
Thanks for the info and keep us informed.

Cade.

Duker
04-28-2012, 06:11 AM
Wow, 30lbs is going to last you quite a while :biggrin: I am trying the new HC GFO at the moment. Do you find your skimmate is quite dark now? Some have suggested I may have it tumbling to much but I have it moving very gently. How are you liking it :question:

HC GFO...???

Duker
04-28-2012, 06:18 AM
Hey, I just checked my phosphate for the first time today and well.. its up there. (.34 :redface:) What your test reading? and can you keep us informed about your readings after?
My rock its at least 8 years old 6.5 of which were in neglected dirty tanks that probably never had water changes, they didnt have heaters or even power heads! This is what Im blaming my po4 on..:razz:
I have been running bio pellets for about 1 month now and hope its going down..
Thanks for the info and keep us informed.

Cade.

Hey Cade, yeah my P04 started at 0.35ppm, then jumped up to 0.41ppm, then 0.30ppm, NOW 0.19ppm yes still sucks, but coming down. I actually haven't tried the phosphate down, I used some Tailored Aquatics Phosphate Destroyer...love it and no phosphate percipitate people were talking about with the phosphate down (at least not yet). And yes I do water changes, 20% every week, but hell yes i over feed. I can admit it. But slowly getting better with it.

Aquattro
04-28-2012, 06:18 AM
Yeah, as I said. I don't want opinions on my maintenance, just on products out there people are using....but thanks.

No opinions from me, just facts. You feed your fish too much, because you're a sucky mom that thinks they're cute while eating. :razz:

I use Zeo, you should too. (< product advice to stay on track)

Duker
04-28-2012, 06:23 AM
No opinions from me, just facts. You feed your fish too much, because you're a sucky mom that thinks they're cute while eating. :razz:

I use Zeo, you should too. (< product advice to stay on track)

I know right....but my gilled babies love their momma. :0)
And yeah ---zeo shmeo!! LOL

Cade
05-06-2012, 02:01 AM
update?