PDA

View Full Version : Need help with overflow plumbing


Ryan_Lap
11-06-2011, 01:30 AM
Ive had my tank running for the past 3 years with the setup below. Ive never had it fail and it has generally worked well. Its running a stockman pipe. Its recently come to my attention that my setup may not exactly be "fail safe" and if the primary would become plugged for any reason (eg. snail) it would overflow. Im now worried that the tank may eventually overflow and I cant really have that happen. Any suggestions on how to make this setup with the current plumbing fail safe and silent? The back of the stand is enclosed with only a hole to access the one ball valve and changing the plumbing completely is not an option unless I empty the tank. which Id rather not completely. Any insight appreciated.

http://i43.tinypic.com/6eenh1.png

Raf
11-06-2011, 03:23 AM
not sure i understand your drawing. those are both drain lines?

globaldesigns
11-06-2011, 04:05 AM
I am no expert, but if the stockman pipe (backup or failsafe) can handle the return flow of your return pump on its own, then I wouldn't think there is an issue, unless both plug. Now if either one plumbing, CAN'T handle the return flow on its own, then yes you would potentially have a problem.

But again, as I stated, I am no expert here.

Ryan_Lap
11-06-2011, 08:47 AM
If I completely turn the ball valve in the closed position imitating a clog the stockman can't handle the flow and will over flow.

As for the drawing. The red thing is the ball valve and the circle going into the sump is a bulkhead. The over flow is an external overflow. I ideally would want to use the Herbie method, but with the 2 lines joining into one this doesn't work. Not sure what I can do from here.

Ryan_Lap
11-06-2011, 08:49 AM
not sure i understand your drawing. those are both drain lines?

Yes, both drain lines.

reefwars
11-06-2011, 09:17 AM
what size plumbing are you using now?? you almost have a herbie set up now just needing the gate valve, you could also put a valve on your return and throttle it back so the stockman can keep up.

Ryan_Lap
11-06-2011, 10:32 AM
The plumbing for both is 1 inch. The herbie won't work as it's currently set up because the emergency makes noise because the primary meets up with it. I also do have a ball valve on the return. The stockman method is still too noisy for my liking so I'm trying to eliminate it. I think I may have to change the plumbing somehow so I can use the herbie

Raf
11-06-2011, 03:28 PM
You could drill another hole into the overflow on the side and higher up, then plumb a 90 elbow into that bulkhead in the overflow....that way it would act as an emercency overflow if the main drain would become clogged. You would just run rigid line down to the sump and over the edge...no drilling of sump required...

reefwars
11-06-2011, 03:33 PM
The plumbing for both is 1 inch. The herbie won't work as it's currently set up because the emergency makes noise because the primary meets up with it. I also do have a ball valve on the return. The stockman method is still too noisy for my liking so I'm trying to eliminate it. I think I may have to change the plumbing somehow so I can use the herbie

are your overflows pipes glued in your overflow box?? iff not just remove the primary and the emergency and make it so the primary goes up just past half way and make your emergency about 2 " below your overflow box teeth that ways you can use your gateevalve to keep the water line high and thus no sound of water entering the overflow box.if they are glued then i would condider draing the overflow box and adding new pipes using unions or couplings:):)

reefwars
11-06-2011, 03:33 PM
your return is plumbed over the back oor closed loop??

mark
11-06-2011, 04:20 PM
If I'm clear, you have an external overflow with 2 holes.

You're just about already a classic Herbie; just remove the Stockman, cut off the lower drain line from the Tee, adjust the valve so you don't flow anything into the emergency. Since the emergency is normally dry you don't need anything to silence it.

Calculator at bottom of this link (Beananimal (http://www.beananimal.com/articles/hydraulics-for-the-aquarist.aspx)) should give you idea of max flow on a 1"

Raf
11-07-2011, 04:26 AM
Also, keep in mind that the schedule size of 1" pipe can alter the internal diameter dependent on wall thickness and hence the amount of water it can drain at a maximum....

Ryan_Lap
11-07-2011, 12:30 PM
I drained the tank so I could access the plumbing. Ill be connecting the primary as one hose directly to the sump(bulk head) and Ill have the emergency as a separate line going into the sump. Should work out well. Guess Ill find out tonight.

sphelps
11-07-2011, 04:54 PM
If you want a standpipe as the secondary drain a durso can handle more flow in emergency situations because if water gets too high it will start a strong siphon better than a stockman. A stockman or HGB can also work but you have to make sure you have enough space that the rising water will submerge the siphon hole in the cap before the tank overflows.

Having two separate lines is the way to go though, tying them together can actually make things pretty noisy as the flow through the primary will create a vacuum effect in the tied in secondary and suck air through that pipe or just cause a loud echo effect.