"Mything the Point"

[Quinn]

The three-part series in Reefkeeping magazine is really fantastic.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/eb/index.htm

I think he's hitting the nail on the head in each case, saying something about the nature of this hobby. It would be fun to discuss some of his points debunked at a reefkeeping get-together.

[Bob I]

I want to thank you for pointing this out to us. I have not had a lot of time to absorb all the material, but feel very much vindicated when reading Myth #5 "The "K" rating of aquarium lamps plays an important role in the coloration of corals"
The author reinforces what I have said for a long time , it is total irradiance (Lux), not color that is important.
I just hope that those who believe differently will read this article carefully. :exclaim:

[StirCrazy]

The author reinforces what I have said for a long time , it is total irradiance (Lux), not color that is important.
I just hope that those who believe differently will read this article carefully. :exclaim:

Bob, we have all agreed that it doesent change the color of your corals.. it simplay tanks the look of the tank from but ugly to nice. :mrgreen:
the other situation is where people have been using 6500 PC bulbs and they switch to a radium MH. They think it is the color of the bulb that changes the coral over time so that it is colored even with the lights off, but it is realy the increase in PAR that the MH has over the PC that stimulates the coral to creat color pigments. of course there are other factors that help in this also (feeding, Alk, Ca, ect)


He didn't use the measurment LUX and I don't belive it is a good one to be trying to inject into that statment either. This is because were not talking about lumens/area. I think if you look into that a bit more the value of PAR is what is important, as if you use LUX for a measurment you can measure light that has no effect on photosynthis. PAR is a direct measurment of light that is usable for photosynthis.

so the important factor to the coral is the level of PAR not color, to the human it has to look good to. Some people like the 20K look, some the 10K look, some even the 6500K look so the actual color temp is all personal preference, which by the way what I have always said is "as long as you are supplying enuf PAR for the corals needs then the color is a personal choice."

Steve

[BCOrchidGuy]

Okay so does that mean the old question of, "Why can't I use Halogen shop lights" is a valid question?

Doug

[Quinn]

Regardless of what lights are best, I liked the series because he got to the root of the issue - that this hobby is full of hearsay and speculation, and that to be truly successful one has to look at things scientifically: critically, progressively, openly, empirically, etc.

[Bob I]

Regardless of what lights are best, I liked the series because he got to the root of the issue - that this hobby is full of hearsay and speculation, and that to be truly successful one has to look at things scientifically: critically, progressively, openly, empirically, etc.

For sure, and let's not forget opinion. :biggrin: I fervently hope this Sandbed issue gets adddressed, because it is the one issue that is being batted around with all sorts of unsupported and largely hearsay evidence. Why even the original sandbed idea came from one guy seemingly without any scientific basis. Yet the whole reefing community fell for it. :confused:

[mark]

Mr Bourneman has some excellent points.

It's my frustation with this and other boards, non marine included (okay this is better than others), is how much information on the net is just recycled or regurgitated as fact. Some of my pet peeves, post that you have algea, oh you're not using ro/di water, you have a hitchhiker anemone , must be aiptasia, your stereo sounds much better after you burn in those $300 interconnects.

My rant, thanks, sorry, better now.

[Bob I]

The author reinforces what I have said for a long time , it is total irradiance (Lux), not color that is important.
I just hope that those who believe differently will read this article carefully. :exclaim:

Bob, we have all agreed that it doesent change the color of your corals.. it simplay tanks the look of the tank from but ugly to nice. :mrgreen:
the other situation is where people have been using 6500 PC bulbs and they switch to a radium MH. They think it is the color of the bulb that changes the coral over time so that it is colored even with the lights off, but it is realy the increase in PAR that the MH has over the PC that stimulates the coral to creat color pigments. of course there are other factors that help in this also (feeding, Alk, Ca, ect)


He didn't use the measurment LUX

As far as I know Irradiance, and Lux is the same thing.(at least Tullock seems to feel they are)

so the important factor to the coral is the level of PAR not color, to the human it has to look good to. Some people like the 20K look, some the 10K look, some even the 6500K look so the actual color temp is all personal preference, which by the way what I have always said is "as long as you are supplying enuf PAR for the corals needs then the color is a personal choice."

Steve

[Quinn]

If that's a rant I hate to think what some of the stuff some of the rest of us have written qualifies as... :lol: :confused:

Humans have an obsession with organizing, classifying, essentially understanding things. It's evolutionary, and it's a good thing. Unfortunately Western society has a nasty bug in that fine programming - we encourage spouting off as a way to prove our intelligence (a by-product of the capitalist ethic, in my opinion). When you combine that with the Internet, a medium that allows for the rapid diffusion and reaction to information, you run into problems.

[StirCrazy]

Okay so does that mean the old question of, "Why can't I use Halogen shop lights" is a valid question?

Doug

no.

the problem with them is they preduce way more heat per watt than MH and you are hard pressed to find some over a color temp of 3500 which meens very little PAR. but the bigest factor is the heat they produce.

Steve

[EmilyB]

When you combine that with the Internet, a medium that allows for the rapid diffusion and reaction to information, you run into problems.

Thank you Dr.Quinn.... :mrgreen: :razz:

[Aquattro]

When you combine that with the Internet, a medium that allows for the rapid diffusion and reaction to information, you run into problems.

Thank you Dr.Quinn.... :mrgreen: :razz:

It's those post secondary institutions that teach people to sound like that!!

[EmilyB]

It's those post secondary institutions that teach people to sound like that!!

Those b*stards.. :razz:

[Aquattro]

It's those post secondary institutions that teach people to sound like that!!

Those b*stards.. :razz:

you betcha!!

[IslandReefer]

The three-part series in Reefkeeping magazine is really fantastic.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/eb/index.htm

I think he's hitting the nail on the head in each case, saying something about the nature of this hobby. It would be fun to discuss some of his points debunked at a reefkeeping get-together.
Agreed, but I think you have to look at the point of view, complexity,personal style and organisms kept and experience of the aquarist...then apply it to you. A great example of this is in part 3,(recent issue http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-01/eb/index.htm) to do with skimming...(.ie achieve such a perfect organics balance that you can stop skimming)...way braver than me.
John

[Bob I]

For some reason the link to part three does not work for me. :sad: The poster needs to get rid of the extra bracket at the end of the link. :biggrin:

[Bob I]

The three-part series in Reefkeeping magazine is really fantastic.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/eb/index.htm

I think he's hitting the nail on the head in each case, saying something about the nature of this hobby. It would be fun to discuss some of his points debunked at a reefkeeping get-together.
Agreed, but I think you have to look at the point of view, complexity,personal style and organisms kept and experience of the aquarist...then apply it to you. A great example of this is in part 3,(recent issue http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-01/eb/index.htm to do with skimming...(.ie achieve such a perfect organics balance that you can stop skimming)...way braver than me.
John

You don't have to be brave, just don't buy a skimmer. (I don't own one). Well just a little one in my nano, but it is shut down. :biggrin:

BTW the link above works now as I edited out the extra bracket. :biggrin:

[Bob I]

Everything the author says about patience has been proven in my tank. I fully agree that it takes at least six months before a tank is even semi stable. I have gone through the algae cycles, and everything now thrives. The only algaes I now see are film algae on the glass, and some bubble algae. :biggrin: