switching salt soon

[bignose]

I picked up a box of reefers best and I've heard that it works well with a zeo bacteria based system. I'm sticking with an algea based system so I need to know if RB will be ok?

[Myka]

Imo a salt is a salt is a salt is a salt. I've tried pretty much everything, although I haven't tried Reefer's Best...$100 for salt?? Seriously?? That's why! :lol: All kidding aside, of all the salts I have tried I have noticed a difference in my tank or my corals. I started off my reefing life with Instant Ocean...it was the only one I even knew of. Over the years I have tried a new salt here and there, usually for a year at a time, but I have always tended to go back to Instant Ocean because I see no difference in my tank, so what justifies the extra cost? Every other salt I have ever tried I still need to add chemicals to bump up calcium, or magnesium, or potassium...never alkalinity though, the manufacturers seem to have that one covered! :p

About 8 months ago I felt the urge to try a new salt again. I was lured by Deltec's natural H2Ocean seasalt. I figured well, if anything would perform different it would be natural versus synthetic, no? I was also lured by the reportedly acceptable parameters including the lower alkalinity of 9 dKH compared to 11dKH out of the Instant Ocean bucket. Not to mention the rumor of not having to add chemicals to the fresh batch of saltwater! *gasp* :eek:

So here I am 8 months later still using H2Ocean, still noticing no difference in my reef. Dangit, I fell for the advertising AGAIN! :neutral: I do appreciate the 9 dKH alkalinity of H2Ocean as I can perform larger water changes without throwing the balance out of whack, but I still have to add chemicals to the water change water! I add magnesium and potassium. So what am I paying for? Less alkalinity? :lol: Oh, a sucker I am! :wink:

So, anyway...my point is I don't think it matters which salt you use. It is reported by many Zeovit users that H2Ocean is a perfectly acceptable salt to use with the Zeovit methods, but of course Reefer's Best is always recommended. ;)

You suggest you are using an "algae-based system", but you mention a Zeovit-based bacteria system. Are you just wondering if the RB salt is specially formulated for the Zeo method and therefore wouldn't be acceptable salt for the algae-based system?

RB salt is in fact specially formulated for the Zeovit system. Zeolites (and any other brand of those "rocks") absorb many nutrients and elements including potassium. RB salt is made (among other things) with elevated potassium level to make up for that. As well, RB salt has a lower alkalinity of about 7 dKH to match that suggested of the Zeovit system.

Does this make RB salt incompatible with a typical reef system? No, it is just another salt. It will work perfectly fine, and if all rumors are true (I haven't tested myself), a person using RB salt wouldn't have to add any chemicals to the water change water. Wait a sec, I heard the same thing about H2Ocean! :p

Anyway, use whichever salt you want! What brand were you using before?

[globaldesigns]

I agree with Myka,

I changed to Reefers Best salt about 4 months ago, I haven't seen anything different. Before that I was using Reef Crystals.

I have been having some issues with corals, not sure why, but things dying... Not saying it is the salt, as I was having this issue before changing, thus the reason I am trying Reefers Best. But I can say it hasn't fixed anything for me.

I will say that RB mixes nicer than RC, much cleaner and less residue on the bottom after making the water. So I guess it is a purer salt mixture.

[fencer]

+1 for Ms M
Although I do try and find a salt with higher potassium(coralife)

or I could supplement I/O with gator aid:lol:

[Myka]

+1 for Ms M
Although I do try and find a salt with higher potassium(coralife)

or I could supplement I/O with gator aid:lol:

:lol: I just dose potassium. It's cheap. :D I have yet to find a salt that doesn't need magnesium dosing. I haven't tried RB though.

[randallino]

Myka,
What are using for magnesium dosing?

[reefwars]

I switched to reefers best a Long time ago after being told it is much better by a seasoned reefer. So far I love it , tank seemed more stable after so long and I only dose calcium( nothing as of lately)

prce is a bit high though but I mean a bucket lasts quits a while:):)

[bignose]

I do think the price is a bit high which probably has to due with it shipping from Europe. I have always used IO before this box. I hope it's worth it because if I don't see any benefits I will gladly go back to IO. $50 vs. $100 and doing weekly water changes what was I thinking?!.:lol:

[Myka]

Myka,
What are using for magnesium dosing?

8.5 parts Fauna Marin Magnesium chloride balling salt
1 part Epsom salt

[daniella3d]

I started with IO and had very good result with it but had to dose for calcium/magnesium and alkalinity. Then I switched to Red See coral pro in hope I would not have to dose but I still had to the same amount practicaly.

I was told that I would not have to dose with H2O so I tried it for 6 months and same thing...still had to dose for the same darn things.

I just switched to IO Reef Crystal a month ago and I don't have to dose for alkalinity any longer and just once a week for the rest. I think I will stick with Reef Crystal for now. Also my zoanthids did not really do well when I used H2O, not sure why.

[BlueTang<3]

:lol: I just dose potassium. It's cheap. :D I have yet to find a salt that doesn't need magnesium dosing. I haven't tried RB though.

Reefers best mixes at about 1150(Elos) for mg i bought 10 boxes when i bought them. When i first switched from h20cean to best i has amazing colours. But i have either gotten used to them or they have faded.

[Bblinks]

I have just picked up a box of reefers best salt from jl for 100 bucks. I have always used reef crystal on all my tanks, now that my display is full of sps I figure I should try some thing better...
If there is no reason for the switch I would rather stay with my reef crystal. I have always mixed my salt with ro water and never had a problem with any residue form reef crystal.
My question for those advanced reefer with sps dominated tanks is it worth the extra money to use a "better" salt?
I know Myka's feed back has been salt is salt is salt is salt, but I am really curious if anyone else out there has seen a difference.:wink:

[Myka]

Reefers best mixes at about 1150(Elos) for mg i bought 10 boxes when i bought them. When i first switched from h20cean to best i has amazing colours. But i have either gotten used to them or they have faded.

Thanks for the feedback! Good to know RB needs to be dosed for magnesium just like the others. I still have another year's supply of H2Ocean, so I will stick with that for now. Maybe one day I will try RB. :wink:

[BlueTang<3]

I find your tangent after rolling the pail down the stairs around the house i always found very low alk readings from the few pails of h2 ocean i used. I always keep 90 gallons or so of water around for emergencies and with the h2 ocean i found it leaves some nasty stuff in the tub along with other salts also. With the Rb there is nothing even after 3 weeks. Another reason i changed is the crappy plastic handle on the pails or h2 ocean almost broke me toes a few times. When you read on zeovit.com some people say mg bang on some see it as high as 1800 so it seems weird.

[Myka]

I find your tangent after rolling the pail down the stairs around the house i always found very low alk readings from the few pails of h2 ocean i used. I always keep 90 gallons or so of water around for emergencies and with the h2 ocean i found it leaves some nasty stuff in the tub along with other salts also. With the Rb there is nothing even after 3 weeks. Another reason i changed is the crappy plastic handle on the pails or h2 ocean almost broke me toes a few times. When you read on zeovit.com some people say mg bang on some see it as high as 1800 so it seems weird.

Hmm, my first pail of H2Ocean tests 9 dKH with Elos kit. I find H2Ocean mixes cleaner than IO, with IO leaving flakes or stuff on the bottom of the tub (some are shiny!?!), but they both leave calcium deposits in the mixing tub...to be expected. Don't you get that with RB? Sometimes I think weird readings can be bad test kits, bad batch of salt, or poor testing habits. Never know...

[BlueTang<3]

Yeah i dont find calcium deposits but i got a lot of flow in there and wipe it out a lot. I will check its levels and post the results in a day or so.

[globaldesigns]

I have just picked up a box of reefers best salt from jl for 100 bucks. I have always used reef crystal on all my tanks, now that my display is full of sps I figure I should try some thing better...
If there is no reason for the switch I would rather stay with my reef crystal. I have always mixed my salt with ro water and never had a problem with any residue form reef crystal.
My question for those advanced reefer with sps dominated tanks is it worth the extra money to use a "better" salt?
I know Myka's feed back has been salt is salt is salt is salt, but I am really curious if anyone else out there has seen a difference.:wink:

I am in no way a pro, and I will admit that I am having some SPS issues with death and colorization... I switched to Reefers Best to see if it helps, been running for approx 4 months. Nothing really improving, as of yet. so I can't honestly say the salt change is helping me.

I have 1.5 boxes of RB and 2 more on order with my LFS, if I don't see really any changes after these boxes, I might think about going back to Reef Crystals.

[KevinK]

:lol: I just dose potassium. It's cheap. :D I have yet to find a salt that doesn't need magnesium dosing. I haven't tried RB though.


what do you use for the potassium and how much?

[daniella3d]

Interesting. I never ever had any deposite with IO or Reef Crystal but always have had a brown deposite, sort of shiny, with H2O and I tried 3 buckets with the same result. After writing to DD they said it was due to ferric oxide they add...not exactly pure salt mix huh?


Hmm, my first pail of H2Ocean tests 9 dKH with Elos kit. I find H2Ocean mixes cleaner than IO, with IO leaving flakes or stuff on the bottom of the tub (some are shiny!?!), but they both leave calcium deposits in the mixing tub...to be expected. Don't you get that with RB? Sometimes I think weird readings can be bad test kits, bad batch of salt, or poor testing habits. Never know...

[Myka]

Interesting. I never ever had any deposite with IO or Reef Crystal but always have had a brown deposite, sort of shiny, with H2O and I tried 3 buckets with the same result. After writing to DD they said it was due to ferric oxide they add...not exactly pure salt mix huh?

Hmm, haven't had that. However, ferric oxide is simply GFO minus the G. Ferric oxide is a fancy way to say rust. Not a big deal...however I'm not sure having the GFO mixed in the salt is really a good thing.

[bignose]

thanks everyone lots of good info here. I've also noticed some small flakes at the bottom of my mixing tub.

[daniella3d]

Yes, no big deal, but still not pure sea salt :)

However I am not sure what is the crystalic shiny deposite, as it is not ferric oxide. I use ferric oxyde and it is not shiny.

Hmm, haven't had that. However, ferric oxide is simply GFO minus the G. Ferric oxide is a fancy way to say rust. Not a big deal...however I'm not sure having the GFO mixed in the salt is really a good thing.

[Myka]

always have had a brown deposite, sort of shiny, with H2O and I tried 3 buckets with the same result. After writing to DD they said it was due to ferric oxide they add...

However I am not sure what is the crystalic shiny deposite, as it is not ferric oxide. I use ferric oxyde and it is not shiny.

I find H2Ocean mixes cleaner than IO, with IO leaving flakes or stuff on the bottom of the tub (some are shiny!?!)

I am mistaken, it is my H2Ocean tub that gets the shiny flakes. Sorry, I have a tub of IO and a tub of H2Ocean.

Ya, I think their reasoning behind the shiny flakes being FO is kinda weird. For one, why would they add FO to the salt mix anyway? For two, since when is FO shiny? I'm not overly concerned about it because the salt seems to work just fine, but it doesn't make me go "Huh?". I just don't dump the flakes in the tank.

[gobytron]

IMO, salt is salt.
I have used many of the major brands out there and have never noticed any significant difference.

there are some slightly different elemantal make ups with some brands claiming to tweak this or that but at the end of ever bucket mixed, you still test and adjust accordingly, regardless of what brand you use.

I read an article some time ago, I cannot rememeber where but it was back when H2Ocean first came out and made everyone feel like they needed to spend 90$on a bucket of salt to give their reefs the "best" possible care and it was talking about how so many brands actually are derived from the same places, using the same process.

I've never used a salt that mixed perfectly to match my system parameters...


I now use seachem reef salt...
why?

because it mixes the clearest the fastest...

I used to really like Tropic Marin Pro for this same reason, but you cant get it out here anymore.

[paddyob]

I am mistaken, it is my H2Ocean tub that gets the shiny flakes. Sorry, I have a tub of IO and a tub of H2Ocean.

Ya, I think their reasoning behind the shiny flakes being FO is kinda weird. For one, why would they add FO to the salt mix anyway? For two, since when is FO shiny? I'm not overly concerned about it because the salt seems to work just fine, but it doesn't make me go "Huh?". I just don't dump the flakes in the tank.


I use H2Ocean. I mix it in a mixing bin with an old pump. I put the salt in and let it circulate for a day or so... and leave the pump running the entire time I have a mixture in the bin. I have not experienced any flakes in the bottom.

The directions state do not use H2Ocean for 24 hours. Is it possible you are seeing the flakes before it has had the proper time to dissolve?

That is one thing I don't like about H2O, the wait time as in the past I can use my salt by the time I remove the waste water.

BUT it gave me a reason to set up a proper reservoir ha ha!


I have used IO in the past and have no regrets from leaving it. Went to Sea Chem Reef Salt and then to Bio-Sea when Sea Chem became hard to find for some weird reason. H2Ocean.... got so many good reviews from reefers, I figured why not.

[gobytron]

If anyone can show any actual eveidence that one salt is superior to another through a direct controlled comparison I would be shocked.

Anyone?:question:

[lastlight]

I've considered switching to the new aqua vitro stuff since it has batch test data on the pail directly usually and if not you can look it up. It costs more than the reef crystals I use but I figured I could save myself doing 3 tests on each batch of water. The more I've thought about it tho I'm not so sure. You still have settling in the pail etc and I roll my pails but still...you just don't *know* unless you test. So I'm sticking with my cheapish reef crystals. Just wish it didn't look like someone took a dump in my mix tank after I drain the water out.

I never have to adjust Ca or Alk as both are a bit elevated which is nice. Burn through lots of Mg tho.

[Myka]

The directions state do not use H2Ocean for 24 hours. Is it possible you are seeing the flakes before it has had the proper time to dissolve?

My saltwater mixes for a week before I use it. When I do each weekly water change I fill the bin back up, and get it mixing right away.

[paddyob]

Well then! :microwav:

[amoreira]

I don't worry about the Calcium, Magnesium or Alk of the mix I use in water changes as I use a calcium reactor. There's nothing like aragonite calcium reactor media to suppliment your tank with the right balance of alk, Ca, Mg, Sr and other trace elements. Aragonite has these all in the right ratios (with the exception of alk) that occur naturally. I'm a big fan of calcium reactors to eliminate your dosing headaches.

[Bblinks]

Muzzy's, Synthetic Salt, Test Results
I decided to conduct a series of tests on different brands of salt. First of all I would like to thank STM (http://www.stm-shop.co.uk/acatalog/Marine_Shop.html), for providing the test kits enabling me to conduct these tests.


http://www.ultimatereef.net/uploader/2008Q1/DSCN3425.jpg

The majority of you won't care about how these test results were obtained and by what method, but there will be a few that are! So if you scroll to the bottom of the test results you will find full details of the test kits and batch numbers used, methods of testing plus any other relevant information.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Seachem Reef Salt
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.25
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate P - 0ppm
Potassium - 380ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 545ppm
Magnesium - 1425ppm
Alkalinity - 9.1Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
D-D H20
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.60
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.90
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate P - 0ppm
Potassium - 370ppm
Strontium - 4ppm
Calcium - 415ppm
Magnesium - 1350ppm
Alkalinity - 8.1Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Red Sea Coral Salt
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.50
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.52
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate P - 0ppm
Potassium - 340ppm
Strontium - 22ppm
Calcium - 405ppm
Magnesium - 1170ppm
Alkalinity - 8.6Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Hobby Marin
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.70
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.88
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate P - 0ppm
Potassium - 400ppm
Strontium - could not test as calcium was too low
Calcium - 300ppm
Magnesium - 1080ppm
Alkalinity - 7.2Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Korallen Zucht Reefers Best Salt
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.50
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.52
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - trace
Potassium - 410ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 400ppm
Magnesium - 1170ppm
Alkalinity - 13.8Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tropic Marin
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.28
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - trace
Potassium - 400ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 350ppm
Magnesium - 1200ppm
Alkalinity - 12.8Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tropic Marin Trade Salt
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.34
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - 0ppm
Potassium - 420ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 340ppm
Magnesium - 1140ppm
Alkalinity - 12.5Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tropic Marin Pro Reef Salt
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.20
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - 0ppm
Potassium - 320ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 400ppm
Magnesium - 1050ppm
Alkalinity - 7.7Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Reef Crystals
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.50
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.32
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - 0.03ppm
Potassium - 420ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 480ppm
Magnesium - 1290ppm
Alkalinity - 13.1Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Instant Ocean
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.34
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - 0ppm
Potassium - 375ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 365ppm
Magnesium - 1230ppm
Alkalinity - 12.0Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------
AquaMedic
Temperature - 26c
Salinity - 35ppt
pH (Salifert) - 8.40
pH (Pinpoint) - 8.00
Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm
Phosphate - 0ppm
Potassium - 380ppm
Strontium - 0 - 3ppm
Calcium - 485ppm
Magnesium - 1050ppm
Alkalinity - 9.6Dkh
----------------------------------------------------------------------


http://www.ultimatereef.net/forums/phpads/adimage.php?filename=stm.gif&contenttype=gif
All salt water samples were made up from 500ml of Zero TDS Reverse Osmosis water passed through Di-Resin.
The RO water was tested for nitrates and phosphates before use and read zero on both, although the kits used, are designed for salt water testing.

Approximately 18g to 20g of salt was used per sample to 500ml of water, depending on brand. Mixed to a Salinity of 36ppt at 18celcius.
Samples were mixed until all salts had disolved and the water appeared to be clear. This took between 5 minutes and 30 minutes dependant on brand.
Samples were then decantered into 250ml screw top airtight and food grade plastic bottles, left at room temperature for 24 hours, then floated for 30mins in water of 26 celcius. Salinity was then retested and adjusted if neccessary to 35ppt at 26celcius.

The test kits used were as follows:
Temperature - System 2000 Digital monitor
Salinity - Pre-calibrated ATC Refractometer
pH - Salifert and Pinpoint pH monitor with new and calibrated probe
Ammonia - Salifert
Nitrite - Salifert
Nitrate - Salifert
Phosphate - D-D/Merk High Sensitivity Kit
Potassium - Fauna Marin Kalium Test
Strontium - Salifert
Calcium - Salifert
Magnesium - Salifert
Alkalinity - Salifert
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Test Kit Batch Numbers:
pH - 1207-C
Ammonia - 1007-E
Nitrite - 0807-C
Nitrate - NO3-1 1007-B, NO3-2 1007-B
Strontium - SR-1 01567E, SR-2 02662E, SR-3 02774E, SR-4 402579E, SR-5 02669E
Calcium - CA-1 0507-K, CA-2 0607-C, CA-3 0707-C
Magnesium - MG-1 0308-A, MG-2 0308-B, MG-3 0208-P
Alkalinity - KH 0507-D, KH-IND 0607-E
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The following test kits were pre-tested (twice each) against a Fauna Marin reference solution, this is supposed to be pre-calibrated with the following levels:

Magnesium - 1295ppm
Calcium - 415ppm
Alkalinity - 6.6 Dkh
Salinity - 35ppt

Now here is a problem.
The Salifert Magnesium test read the reference solution at 1200ppm.
The Salifert Calcium test read the reference solution at 400ppm.
The Salifert Alkalinity test read the reference solution at 8.6Dkh

I also tested the Alkalinity test kit against Salifert's own reference solution for this kit, and that read 7.00 Dkh, the reference solution is supposed to be 6.5Dkh.

I also found an issue with the salinity of the FM reference solution. It is supposed to read 35ppt, but I calibrated my refractometer with zero TDS RO water, checked it several times, and the salinity of the reference solution read 34ppt.

You can pretty accurately calibrate a refractometer with tap water that has been run for a while, even if the tap water is say 300TDS, this is in ppm, not ppt, so at 300TDS it should still be assumed as zero on a refractometer.

So what does this all mean?
Due to the apparent error in the salinity of the reference solution and the big margin of difference against all the test kits, im quite convinced that the reference solution is short of some salt! Quite a bold statement, but this would explain the lower than expected salinity, calcium and magnesium, although Im not sure about the alkalinity.

Anyway, I have given a figure for the actual test kit reading, you can choose to take that reading, or adjust as necessary to take into account the reference solution readings or take an average of the 2.
I would definitely recommend you subtract approx. 0.5Dkh from the Alkalinity readings in any case.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Salt Batch Numbers:
Not all salts come with a batch number unfortunately, where one was available they are as follows:

Reef Crystals - 0732601
Red Sea Salt - 1302070037
AquaMedic - 4146
Hobby Marin - 50350
Tropic Marin Standard Salt - 35C66
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Price comparison:
I have taken prices from various websites, using the largest available bucket and calculated an average price per KG excluding delivery charges.
I suggest you shop around when buying your salt, as the prices varied quite a lot from one web site to another. Also look carefully at the shipping costs if buying online, this could add another $20 to the cost!

Reef Crystals - CAD52
KZ Reefers Best Salt - CAD91.95
D-D H20 - CAD74.95
Aqua medic - ?
Seachem Reef Salt - CAD49.95
Hobby Marin Salt - ?
Red Sea - ?
Instant Ocean - CAD39.95

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion:
The results above should not be thought of being 100% accurate.
They were obtained by a hobbyist with hobbyists equipment - just like you have at home.
I have made every effort possible to ensure the results are as accurate as I could achieve with the facilities available to me.
All the salt mixes were tested with exactly the same test kit and in the same manner to keep things as consistent as possible.
You should remember that all hobbyists test kits will have a degree of innaccuracy, add to this the human input - me! the results may have been totally different if sent to a science lab.
Also as only small samples of salt were used, there is no guarantee that the buckets were mixed properly. Its possible some elements settle nearer the surface and some nearer the bottom. The only way of being sure is to mix the whole bucket and take readings from that. Unfortunately I dont have the space or funds to mix up 700 litres of salt x 11 brands!

I am not going to give my opinion on which salt "is the best". I know what appears to be the best for me, but you may have different requirements, maybe a fish only system and not a SPS reef tank. Maybe you like to run a higher magnesium, alkalinity or calcium than me, or even higher nitrates if you keep a tank full of big clams!

So, please do your research and make your own decision on which salt suits your needs best.
Don't forget that batches of salt will vary from one to the next, so if these tested were carried out again in a year from now, they could look quite different.

I FOUND THIS PRETTY INTERESTING, ALSO.
http://www.northcoastpets.com/salt_comparison.htm

FROM WHAT I'VE GATHERED, SALT IS A SALT IS A SALT{MYKA} EVERY BATCH IS DIFFERENT, TEST EVERY BATCH, DOSE ACCORDINDLY, ITS LUCK OF THE DRAW. SAVE YOUR MONEY FOR BETTER EQUIPMENT THEN A "BETTER" SALT.:grab:

[Parker]

I wasn't really going to wade in on this discussion, but. To simply state "A salt is a salt is a salt" is quite ignorant in my eyes.

Can anyone here list the exact requirements to keep every living organism in your tank alive and thriving? Without knowing exactly what's needed and exactly what each manufacturer puts in their salt there's no way to determine which salt is best. Just because you can't measure or see a change in your tank based on what salt you use doesn't mean there aren't benefits or detriments to using one salt over another. Discarding the basics of salinity and temperature most people are only testing eleven parameters, I would bet most people aren't testing all eleven on a regulars basis or at all. I don't believe anyone here is naive enough to believe that if you keep these eleven parameters in check that you have what it takes to keep everything alive. The science behind oceanic creatures in still firmly rooted in the infant stage, there is a vast amount we don't know about the ocean and its inhabitants.

I can eat Kraft Dinner every meal for the rest of my life, yeah I'm surviving, yeah I'm fat. Does that mean I'm healthy and thriving? No. We need a vast variety of items to keep us all happy, healthy and thriving. How many elements are in the multi vitamin supplements most people take on a daily basis? I can assure you it's more than eleven. It would be foolish to think the inhabitants in our tanks are any different.

This isn’t meant to detract from any of the work that people such as Bblinks have completed. The work they have done helps in increasing the knowledge of the group as a whole as it pertains to the parameters we do know how to test and control.


Regards

[ponokareefer]

Wow! Seachem Reef Salt's numbers look awesome!

[gobytron]

I wasn't really going to wade in on this discussion, but. To simply state "A salt is a salt is a salt" is quite ignorant in my eyes.

Can anyone here list the exact requirements to keep every living organism in your tank alive and thriving? Without knowing exactly what's needed and exactly what each manufacturer puts in their salt there's no way to determine which salt is best. Just because you can't measure or see a change in your tank based on what salt you use doesn't mean there aren't benefits or detriments to using one salt over another. Discarding the basics of salinity and temperature most people are only testing eleven parameters, I would bet most people aren't testing all eleven on a regulars basis or at all. I don't believe anyone here is naive enough to believe that if you keep these eleven parameters in check that you have what it takes to keep everything alive. The science behind oceanic creatures in still firmly rooted in the infant stage, there is a vast amount we don't know about the ocean and its inhabitants.

I can eat Kraft Dinner every meal for the rest of my life, yeah I'm surviving, yeah I'm fat. Does that mean I'm healthy and thriving? No. We need a vast variety of items to keep us all happy, healthy and thriving. How many elements are in the multi vitamin supplements most people take on a daily basis? I can assure you it's more than eleven. It would be foolish to think the inhabitants in our tanks are any different.

This isn’t meant to detract from any of the work that people such as Bblinks have completed. The work they have done helps in increasing the knowledge of the group as a whole as it pertains to the parameters we do know how to test and control.


Regards

I think you just reiterated WHY salt is salt is salt rather than detract from this opinion...

the idea being, regardless of which salt you use, you will still be required to test, supplement and test...

[Rogue951]

I went from Instant Ocean to Seachem and haven't really noticed anything...

[steve fedyk]

Thanks bblinks for doing all the test and posting your resalt.
I think testing your tank weekly and dosing daily or weekly is the best way to go. I have been using DD H2O for about a year with my daily water change, witch is about 1% of my volume.
I think I'm going to go with IO because I aready add KH, Ca, and Mg, to my mix.

[Bblinks]

[quote=Parker;566368]I wasn't really going to wade in on this discussion, but. To simply state "A salt is a salt is a salt" is quite ignorant in my eyes.

Can anyone here list the exact requirements to keep every living organism in your tank alive and thriving? Without knowing exactly what's needed and exactly what each manufacturer puts in their salt there's no way to determine which salt is best. Just because you can't measure or see a change in your tank based on what salt you use doesn't mean there aren't benefits or detriments to using one salt over another. Discarding the basics of salinity and temperature most people are only testing eleven parameters, I would bet most people aren't testing all eleven on a regulars basis or at all. I don't believe anyone here is naive enough to believe that if you keep these eleven parameters in check that you have what it takes to keep everything alive. The science behind oceanic creatures in still firmly rooted in the infant stage, there is a vast amount we don't know about the ocean and its inhabitants.

I can eat Kraft Dinner every meal for the rest of my life, yeah I'm surviving, yeah I'm fat. Does that mean I'm healthy and thriving? No. We need a vast variety of items to keep us all happy, healthy and thriving. How many elements are in the multi vitamin supplements most people take on a daily basis? I can assure you it's more than eleven. It would be foolish to think the inhabitants in our tanks are any different.

This isn’t meant to detract from any of the work that people such as Bblinks have completed. The work they have done helps in increasing the knowledge of the group as a whole as it pertains to the parameters we do know how to test and control.

ROB,



JUST CURIOUS WHAT KIND OF SALT DO YOU USE? I REALLY WOULD LIKE TO KNOW YOUR OPINIONS.

THANKS:lol:

[Fishguy52]

i am confused is it ok to use IO?

[Myka]

i am confused is it ok to use IO?

Sure, why not? IO is the most popular synthetic sea salt on the planet.

[Bblinks]

i am confused is it ok to use IO?

For fish only, I use instant ocean, never had a problem. As far as sps tank goes....that I guess is the million dollar question. What it really boils down to is personal preferences, depends on what ur requirements are. Testing every batch of salt is imperative if u r tryin to keep strict parameters.

Rich:mrgreen:

[legendboy]

This might be a stupid question but are there any companys that sell real ocean reef water say by the gallon?

Could there be any benifit to maybe adding this say, once a month?

I wasn't really going to wade in on this discussion, but. To simply state "A salt is a salt is a salt" is quite ignorant in my eyes.

Can anyone here list the exact requirements to keep every living organism in your tank alive and thriving? Without knowing exactly what's needed and exactly what each manufacturer puts in their salt there's no way to determine which salt is best. Just because you can't measure or see a change in your tank based on what salt you use doesn't mean there aren't benefits or detriments to using one salt over another. Discarding the basics of salinity and temperature most people are only testing eleven parameters, I would bet most people aren't testing all eleven on a regulars basis or at all. I don't believe anyone here is naive enough to believe that if you keep these eleven parameters in check that you have what it takes to keep everything alive. The science behind oceanic creatures in still firmly rooted in the infant stage, there is a vast amount we don't know about the ocean and its inhabitants.

I can eat Kraft Dinner every meal for the rest of my life, yeah I'm surviving, yeah I'm fat. Does that mean I'm healthy and thriving? No. We need a vast variety of items to keep us all happy, healthy and thriving. How many elements are in the multi vitamin supplements most people take on a daily basis? I can assure you it's more than eleven. It would be foolish to think the inhabitants in our tanks are any different.

This isn’t meant to detract from any of the work that people such as Bblinks have completed. The work they have done helps in increasing the knowledge of the group as a whole as it pertains to the parameters we do know how to test and control.


Regards

[kien]

I'm thinking about switching to table salt. Does anyone here think that might be a bad idea?

[Ross]

I'm thinking about switching to table salt. Does anyone here think that might be a bad idea?

Just use sea salt and youll be fine.

http://vitanetonline.com/images/products/3022.jpg

[Bblinks]

Maybe we can collect rainwater and use that. That's salty, isn't it... Maybe our sweat. Lol

[Bblinks]

This might be a stupid question but are there any companys that sell real ocean reef water say by the gallon?

Could there be any benifit to maybe adding this say, once a month?

I am sure cribsea had "purified" ocean water in 4 gallon jugs, but don't quote me on it. That might be an interesting aspect. Expensive but worth it.

[Reef-Geek]

Has anyone tried Seachem Reef Salt (http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/sc-rsalt05/Seachem+Reef+Salt++-+50+Gallon+Mix.html)? I am thinking to switch to it because I was told their Ca value is awesome.

I am using H2Ocean (http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/mc-dsalt06/D-D+H2Ocean+Pro+Plus+Salt+Mix+(6.6KG).html)now, and prior that I used IO. Maybe I got a bad batch, I think the H2Ocean salt is cloudier than the IO.

[Rogue951]

I started with IO, now I'm on Seachem, and I honestly can't say I notice a difference. but then I also dose kalk, and magnesium so maybe that's why.
The only difference I notice is that when I get lazy and stop dosing kalk corals stop growing lol...

[phi delt reefer]

IMO...

buy some cheap salt and just dose calc/mag/alk as needed.

calc/mag/alk are SUPER cheap so instead of buying really expensive salt that supposedly has the correct levels just dose and keep your parameters more stable.

Trace elements in all salts are pretty good.

One batch of salt varies from another even though they are from the same company.

[Bblinks]

IMO...

buy some cheap salt and just dose calc/mag/alk as needed.

calc/mag/alk are SUPER cheap so instead of buying really expensive salt that supposedly has the correct levels just dose and keep your parameters more stable.

Trace elements in all salts are pretty good.

One batch of salt varies from another even though they are from the same company.

AGREED:biggrin:

[globaldesigns]

I just wanted to post what I am seeing using Reefers Best.

1.) Firstly as I stated before, it does seem to mix much cleaner with virtually no residue in the mixing pail. Mixes fast and very clear.

2.) I use to dose my magnesium, and such, but for the past couple months, I have ceased the daily dosings of MG, ALK, Str, Ca and so on. Now I only do one water change, but a much bigger one that I use to do. With the bigger water change, using RB salt, I haven't had to dose anything extra for over a month to keep parameters at the recommended levels.

Not saying others salts can't claim the above, maybe they can, but I can say RB salt is doing what I claim.

[Bblinks]

I just wanted to post what I am seeing using Reefers Best.

1.) Firstly as I stated before, it does seem to mix much cleaner with virtually no residue in the mixing pail. Mixes fast and very clear.

2.) I use to dose my magnesium, and such, but for the past couple months, I have ceased the daily dosings of MG, ALK, Str, Ca and so on. Now I only do one water change, but a much bigger one that I use to do. With the bigger water change, using RB salt, I haven't had to dose anything extra for over a month to keep parameters at the recommended levels.

Not saying others salts can't claim the above, maybe they can, but I can say RB salt is doing what I claim.

THANKS FOR THE INFO, I WILL BE STARTING RB ON SUNDAY. HOPEFULLY HAVE SOME TEST RESULTS POSTED FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTH. I HOPE WE CAN ALL BENEFIT FROM THESE FINDINGS.

JUST CURIOUS. WHEN YOU SAY YOU DON'T DOSE ANYMORE, DO YOU MEAN NOTHING AT ALL? IE CALCIUM REACTOR, TWO PART, OR BALLING.

REGARDS

[globaldesigns]

THANKS FOR THE INFO, I WILL BE STARTING RB ON SUNDAY. HOPEFULLY HAVE SOME TEST RESULTS POSTED FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTH. I HOPE WE CAN ALL BENEFIT FROM THESE FINDINGS.

JUST CURIOUS. WHEN YOU SAY YOU DON'T DOSE ANYMORE, DO YOU MEAN NOTHING AT ALL? IE CALCIUM REACTOR, TWO PART, OR BALLING.

REGARDS

Since doubling the water volume of my weekly (once a week) water change (so replacing 16 gallons a week), I haven't dosed a single drop extra of anything related to MG, St, Ca, ALK... Only using my daily Zeovit stuff, but have also stopped the Zeo Potassium. Only feeding my fish, using CoralVitalizer, ZeoStart, AminoAcids, Coral Snow, ZeoFood7. Nothing else being added.

I have been doing my parameter testing twice a week, and parameters have been spot on, with just doing my water changes.

I have been having some issues with coral death and RTN, but slowing seeing improvements. These improvements are the browning of corals, starting to go away. Tissue growth is now apparent on many corals, and the re-inflaction of open brains, candycanes, and other softies.

Since this seems to be working now for a couple months, I am going to continue with this method. Since I am not adding extra stuff, there is much better control of what is going in the water.

We will see over the next 6 months, 12 months, if just doing water changes keeps working.

[randallino]

globaldesigns
Are you still running pellets?

[JOEL]

what do you use for potassium (brand)?

:lol: I just dose potassium. It's cheap. :D I have yet to find a salt that doesn't need magnesium dosing. I haven't tried RB though.

[freezetyle]

I am sure cribsea had "purified" ocean water in 4 gallon jugs, but don't quote me on it. That might be an interesting aspect. Expensive but worth it.

Living in victoria i can pretty much walk out my front door and hit water. I should start bottling it up and carting it back in the car to sell to all of you suckers...I mean, land locked people on my way back to calgary over christmas:mrgreen:

[Bblinks]

Living in victoria i can pretty much walk out my front door and hit water. I should start bottling it up and carting it back in the car to sell to all of you suckers...I mean, land locked people on my way back to calgary over christmas:mrgreen:

Do it, I am burnaby, I can do the same thing. We should start my owe business and make a killing. Lol. :mrgreen:

[Bblinks]

[QUOTE=globaldesigns;568022]Since doubling the water volume of my weekly (once a week) water change (so replacing 16 gallons a week), I haven't dosed a single drop extra of anything related to MG, St, Ca, ALK... Only using my daily Zeovit stuff, but have also stopped the Zeo Potassium. Only feeding my fish, using CoralVitalizer, ZeoStart, AminoAcids, Coral Snow, ZeoFood7. Nothing else being added.

I have been doing my parameter testing twice a week, and parameters have been spot on, with just doing my water changes.

I have been having some issues with coral death and RTN, but slowing seeing improvements. These improvements are the browning of corals, starting to go away. Tissue growth is now apparent on many corals, and the re-inflaction of open brains, candycanes, and other softies


Again thanks for the detailed reply. I have a good mix of sps and lps in my tank, I use np pellets on a nextreef pellet reactor, carbon is also run through a nextreef smr1. Beside the 3 part 25 ml calcium and alkalinity plus 10 ml of mag, I love zeovit products, xtra, sponge power, coral vitality, b k balance, and potassium iodide,with the np pellets I eliminate the use of all zeovit bacteria
and reactor. I really hope that reefers best is gonna make a difference, I would love to cut back on my dosing regime as much as I love the service from bulk reef supply, I really would like to spend my money in Canada. As of now my calcium is at 460, alkalinity is at 8, mag is around 1200, I really hate my test kit for mag, maybe I is just stupid. :redface: I will post my results here on weekly bases and see if it made a difference or not on the amount I need to dose. Hopefully it will be interesting.:idea:


Regards
Happy reefing
Rich

[globaldesigns]

globaldesigns
Are you still running pellets?

Yup, pellets are still there.