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View Full Version : Wanna Try building a LED light


Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 12:18 AM
Ok Im pretty handy and building things so.

What would be best here:
my tank is 60x24x24 150 gal all LPS so what is the lighting requirements for a lps tank since my current lighting is 2x400's 20K XM's

can I get away with 48" light strip?

How many BLue's ?

How many White's ?

Type's of reflector's/optic's?

How do you attach the led's to the metal board?
is it aluminum

Type's of LED's ?

Type's of transformer's ?

Type's of heat sync's?

How many Fan's?

Smaller ones or the larger ones.
what type of wire's should I use what gauge?

BlueTang<3
10-05-2010, 12:24 AM
Check out Reef central they got step by step on building them even the drivers. I was going to put one together but i am a well kind lazy

BlueTang<3
10-05-2010, 12:26 AM
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1587273

Here is one example

Jeff000
10-05-2010, 12:48 AM
I would go 2 blues for every white.
Cree 3W LED's are the most popular.

http://ledsupply.com/creexpg-w139.php They come on an aluminium disk, its about 3/4" diameter.

Don't make a single strip, make an array.

I would buy dimmable drivers, its just so much easier and they are cheap all things considered.

Optics... try some of all and figure out what works best, makes it easier to give a smaller spot more light if you have a demanding coral.

No reflectors, they focus down on there own.

use a heatsink, fans depend on how many LEDs you have and the size/efficiency of your heatsink.

you can use an epoxy or you can screw the LEDs down. I would drill and tap holes and use machine screws to hole them down.

18g is plenty fine for wire.

I am building a small array of just whites and using T5 for the blues, actinic and fiji purple kind of tubes. Waiting on the XPG to come in blue.

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 12:58 AM
wow thanks Jeff

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 01:01 AM
would i want optics that like the 120 degree more of a spread

donlite
10-05-2010, 02:33 AM
Make sure you use heat sink epoxy, tape or white paste. Also make sure the LEDS are sealed of from the water. There are 3 things that are most important #1 is heat management #2 heat management and most important is #3 heat management. My company builds LED units for commercial sites. Make sure the LEDS are current and the heat sink calculations are in tune with your LEDS, Good Luck:smile:

Jeff000
10-05-2010, 03:05 AM
would i want optics that like the 120 degree more of a spread

From what I have read the 70 degree optics give the highest PAR values. And with the 100 or so you will have over your tank I would say 70 degree would be your best bet.

I'll have 84 over my 48"x18" 90 gallon.

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 03:07 AM
what did it cost to build yours jeff

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 03:26 AM
Does this look right for what i need

3023-D-E-1000P Wired BuckPuck, 1000mA Output, DC Powered w/potentiometer 3@$19.99 $79.96

24VDC 6.5AMP Switching AC to DC Power Supply
2@ $29.99 ea $59.98
HEATSINK W/ ADHESIVE TAPE
3@ $4.99 ea $14.97
Royal-Blue 1-Up Cree XP-E Star
30@ $7.18 ea $215.40
CREE XP-G 139 Lumen Star
30@ $8.27 ea $248.10

Subtotal: $618.41

is 30 royal blue too many?
And 30 White should be alot more for a 150 gal

Jeff000
10-05-2010, 03:26 AM
what did it cost to build yours jeff

I got my LED's in a group buy, 36 whites, and 3 dimmable drivers, about 220 in LED and drivers and then about 60 in aluminium to make the heatsink/array

I figure about 600 by the time I get my blues.

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 03:29 AM
oh really 36 whites and 220 leds of blue

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 03:35 AM
you got your stuff from nanotuners

Jeff000
10-05-2010, 03:45 AM
oh really 36 whites and 220 leds of blue

36 whites and 3 drivers for $220.
Don't have the blues yet.


LEDsupply.com

Ron99
10-05-2010, 05:12 PM
Here's what I would suggest:

1. 50:50 mix of cool white and royal blue LEDs is good. Mixing regular blues or other colours in there probably doesn't really make a huge difference. Red emitters look ugly and I have experimented with greens and violet and they look interesting on their own but don't add much when used with the white and royal blue.

2. For a 24" deep tank and seeing as you are replacing 400W MH you will likely want to use 40 degree optics to achieve similar PAR at the bottom of the tank. That means using more LEDs. You asked about a 48" array which will only work if you have little on the ends of your tank? How is your rock etc. set up? Do you have clams and SPS all the way out to the ends?

If you want good PAR coverage over the whole tank you will need to go closer to the ends. Generally you want to space your rows front to back 3 inches apart and you can leave 4" or so from the end of the array to the glass. In each row with 40 degree optics it would be best to space LEDs 1.5" apart but you could go up to 2". 2" might cause a bit of spotlighting in the first couple inches of the tank depending on the height of the fixture.

So if it were me I would try to do 6 rows of LEDs (you might get away with 5 rows if you have more open space in the front or back of the tank). Each row would have 36 LEDs spaced 1.5" apart. That works out to 216 LEDs and along with drivers that will be pricey. But to give similar performance to 400W halides there is no cheap solution.

3. Look at the Meanwell drivers. They are more reliable then buckpucks which tend to burn out if they overheat. They also run right off 110V AC rather then having to have a bunch of 24V DC adapters for the buckpucks. So for 216 LEDs you are probably looking at 18 Meanwell drivers.

HTH to start.

Skimmerking
10-05-2010, 06:15 PM
Holy heck ron thanks alot the 400 w that isnt a problem sinceI use to have 250's over my tank the tank, houses Aussie Acans & LPS and 3 clams squamosa 10", 8" 5".

what is the average price of LEd's the cool white and Royal blue ron , is thee another place that you can get them from other then led supply.

Jeff000
10-06-2010, 01:16 AM
Here's what I would suggest:

1. 50:50 mix of cool white and royal blue LEDs is good. Mixing regular blues or other colours in there probably doesn't really make a huge difference. Red emitters look ugly and I have experimented with greens and violet and they look interesting on their own but don't add much when used with the white and royal blue.

2. For a 24" deep tank and seeing as you are replacing 400W MH you will likely want to use 40 degree optics to achieve similar PAR at the bottom of the tank. That means using more LEDs. You asked about a 48" array which will only work if you have little on the ends of your tank? How is your rock etc. set up? Do you have clams and SPS all the way out to the ends?

If you want good PAR coverage over the whole tank you will need to go closer to the ends. Generally you want to space your rows front to back 3 inches apart and you can leave 4" or so from the end of the array to the glass. In each row with 40 degree optics it would be best to space LEDs 1.5" apart but you could go up to 2". 2" might cause a bit of spotlighting in the first couple inches of the tank depending on the height of the fixture.

So if it were me I would try to do 6 rows of LEDs (you might get away with 5 rows if you have more open space in the front or back of the tank). Each row would have 36 LEDs spaced 1.5" apart. That works out to 216 LEDs and along with drivers that will be pricey. But to give similar performance to 400W halides there is no cheap solution.

3. Look at the Meanwell drivers. They are more reliable then buckpucks which tend to burn out if they overheat. They also run right off 110V AC rather then having to have a bunch of 24V DC adapters for the buckpucks. So for 216 LEDs you are probably looking at 18 Meanwell drivers.

HTH to start.


Couple things.
50/50 split you will get very white light. I much prefer the bluer look like 20000k MH. So 2 blues to every white. Also keep in mind the whites are brighter then the blues to start with.
Get dimmable drivers (only a couple bucks more) so you can have more control.


I have to disagree with your optics recommendation.
see this thread,
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1902716&highlight=led+optics
70 degree optics provided the best results.


I do agree the meanweel drivers are the best buy.

Ron99
10-07-2010, 04:34 PM
Holy heck ron thanks alot the 400 w that isnt a problem sinceI use to have 250's over my tank the tank, houses Aussie Acans & LPS and 3 clams squamosa 10", 8" 5".

what is the average price of LEd's the cool white and Royal blue ron , is thee another place that you can get them from other then led supply.

Ahhh, I looked at things again and I thought you wanted high PAR for SPS. In that case you could use 60 degree optics and fewer LEDs space 2.25 inches apart. That would give you 25 LEDs per row if my math is right? That sounds about right as I used 20 LEDs for 4 feet with this configuration and you are one foot longer.

LEDs run USD $5 to $6 each mounted on stars. You could try nanotuners.com and see if they can give you a good deal on LEDs, drivers, optics etc as a large package deal? Some people really like Cutter Electronics in Australia or also ETG Tech in the US for larger buys.


Couple things.
50/50 split you will get very white light. I much prefer the bluer look like 20000k MH. So 2 blues to every white. Also keep in mind the whites are brighter then the blues to start with.
Get dimmable drivers (only a couple bucks more) so you can have more control.


I have to disagree with your optics recommendation.
see this thread,
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1902716&highlight=led+optics
70 degree optics provided the best results.


I do agree the meanweel drivers are the best buy.

But if you run dimming drivers you can then fine tune the colour temperature to exactly where you want it. 2 blues to 1 white will not give you the option to go more white if you want to.

That reefcentral article is okay but the problem is that he simply changed optics and did not adjust LED spacing. The two have to go hand in hand. If you go narrower optics for greater penetration of light into deeper tanks you need to space the LEDs closer together to get additive PAR. His results are not surprising given the way he did it. The conclusion is that for the spacing of LEDs he used 70 degree optics are best at the particular distance he measure PAR. If he had spaced the LEDs closer together and used tighter optics he would have likely seen higher PAR. This was not a scientific study that can generally be applied to all LED setups, only to those particular strips he used at the depth he measured.

Skimmerking
10-07-2010, 05:04 PM
So Ron you have 20 LEd's for each row of 48" right and how many rows did you do my tank is 24 wide.

Ron99
10-07-2010, 06:21 PM
I have 4 rows for my 18" wide tank. So ideally you would want 6 rows. But since you a doing LPS etc. rather then SPS as I have you may get away with 5 rows. If you want the ability to have higher PAR for SPS in the future then go 6 rows.

Skimmerking
10-07-2010, 06:33 PM
SO for a 60 " tank Ron would you say that
5 rows of 3W LED's with 60 optic's of 25 would do a 60" tank

LIKE THIS

* * * * * * *
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So 125 LEd's would all i need for my tank then
and how many driver's or transformer 4 of them. the dimmable ones

Ron99
10-07-2010, 07:11 PM
Yes, that looks right to me. How many drivers you need depends on what you are using. If you go with the Meanwell ELN-48 then you will need 10 of them, 5 for white and 5 for blue.

Ron99
10-07-2010, 07:13 PM
Actually, you want to stagger the white and blue so like this:

B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B

W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W

B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B

W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W

B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B W B

Skimmerking
10-07-2010, 10:15 PM
Yes, that looks right to me. How many drivers you need depends on what you are using. If you go with the Meanwell ELN-48 then you will need 10 of them, 5 for white and 5 for blue.
ok Ron so 125 LED's would be what i would need so if I say 130 lights 3W each
65 whites
65 royal blues
with 60 degree optics
and 10 meanwell eln-48 dimmable drivers
and for a sheet of metal it should be alum heat shields what did you use ron

Skimmerking
10-07-2010, 10:17 PM
Could i not try using these Ron,


24VDC 150-Watt Power Supply Features:
L 7.80" W 4.38" H 2.00" WT: 1.9lbs
Input Voltage - 100-220VAC, 50-60 Hz
Output Voltage - 24VDC
Output Current - 6.5A




http://ledsupply.com/images/24vdc65a_med.jpg

Ron99
10-07-2010, 11:32 PM
ok Ron so 125 LED's would be what i would need so if I say 130 lights 3W each
65 whites
65 royal blues
with 60 degree optics
and 10 meanwell eln-48 dimmable drivers
and for a sheet of metal it should be alum heat shields what did you use ron

You will want to try to get a proper heatsink rather then aluminum sheet. With close to 400W of LEDs you will want good surface area to dissipate heat and probably to run a few fans as well. The cooler you keep the heatsink and therefore the LEDs the longer they will last. I found some surplus heatsinks on eBay. You could try heatsinkusa.com too. You may need two from them to fit 5 rows of LEDs.


Could i not try using these Ron,


24VDC 150-Watt Power Supply Features:
L 7.80" W 4.38" H 2.00" WT: 1.9lbs
Input Voltage - 100-220VAC, 50-60 Hz
Output Voltage - 24VDC
Output Current - 6.5A




http://ledsupply.com/images/24vdc65a_med.jpg


Not on their own. Those are just power supplies that you would use with something like buckpucks as the constant current driver for the LEDs. You want a good constant current driver as LEDs are current sensitive devices rather then voltage sensitive. To much current and you burn them out.

The advantage of the Meanwells is that they are an all in one device. They are constant current drivers for the LEDs that run directly off 110V AC out of your wall. Each LED will draw around 3.5V so a 24V power supply with a buckpuck will only drive 6 LEDs. That power supply could probably do 6 buckpucks. So you would use one power supply and 6 buckpucks per 36 LEDs. You would need 22 buckpucks and 4 of those power supplies. The 48V Meanwells will do up to 13 LEDs each so overall using 10 of them is slightly simpler and cleaner solution.

mseepman
10-08-2010, 03:23 AM
I just built a small LED fixture last weekend from stuff I got from www.rapidled.com. They were great to deal with but a little expensive. I haven't started it up as I ran out of time and had to go on a business trip before I got to test for shorts.

I will be doing a big LED fixture to cover my 290 when I get it going and I would order from ETG as they will do any order over $50 and have a way better price. Plus you get XP-G's and XP-E's which are more efficient. I will have about 180 LED's over the tank as a plan right now.

PM me if you want info on contact ETG. I can also give you a link to get meanwell's at a reasonable price. You want to use the ELN 60-48D as it's dimmable and can be controlled by an RKE, APEX or Profilux if you get back into a controller.

Try www.heatsinkusa.com if you want to get some heatsinks. Though shipping can be ugly. If you find a canadian source for Heatsinks then please let me know as i haven't found any.