Rapid film algae growth

[Doug]

Bet you never seen anything like I have. Whatever has happened to my tank, just keeps fuelling a growth of film algae on the glass like I have never seen.

I clean it off and can grow a new film on the glass in an hour. Clean the bare bottom and its green in a couple hrs. No green on my rock but it gets covered in a brown film.

All easily removed with a toothbrush or cleaning magnet. I have done 6,0000000000000g of water changes since all the rtn event. My skimmer is skimming like crazy. Change filter socks every two days. Use to be once/week.

RO water is reading 0ppm coming from the DI resin. I only have my pair of clowns and an old pj cardinal nobody wanted, so feeding is not abundant, although they eat well. I even gave my ravenous cleaners to Mike. On my 3rd. bag of Chemi-pure Elite in a couple weeks. Something is crap here and no idea what.

I tell ya. Its getting close.

[Wayne]

Anything die?

[reefwars]

Anything change in your temp or lighting I was having heat problems and mixed with my lights and house temp and was getting same thing , I cut my halides back slightly and got a cooler temp going and it's helped, good luck on your battle:)

[Lance]

Doug, I don't think you've done enough water changes. Try a few more. JK :mrgreen:
Seriously though, if it's not nutrients then try less light for fewer hours. It certainly can't hurt. Any other types of micro algae showing up?

[naesco]

Bet you never seen anything like I have. Whatever has happened to my tank, just keeps fuelling a growth of film algae on the glass like I have never seen.

I clean it off and can grow a new film on the glass in an hour. Clean the bare bottom and its green in a couple hrs. No green on my rock but it gets covered in a brown film.

All easily removed with a toothbrush or cleaning magnet. I have done 6,0000000000000g of water changes since all the rtn event. My skimmer is skimming like crazy. Change filter socks every two days. Use to be once/week.

RO water is reading 0ppm coming from the DI resin. I only have my pair of clowns and an old pj cardinal nobody wanted, so feeding is not abundant, although they eat well. I even gave my ravenous cleaners to Mike. On my 3rd. bag of Chemi-pure Elite in a couple weeks. Something is crap here and no idea what.

I tell ya. Its getting close.

If your RO/DI readings are zero and your water parameters are within range the problem you are likely having is some sort of bacterial aggregation.
Begin at the beginning.
Stop the Chemi-cure, go back to normal water changes, normal filter changes and leave the glass alone.
Things are likely to go to hell for a few days and than settle down.

[Doug]

Anything change in your temp or lighting I was having heat problems and mixed with my lights and house temp and was getting same thing , I cut my halides back slightly and got a cooler temp going and it's helped, good luck on your battle:)

Temps are fine. My halide was ok before, although I do wonder about it at times. I have cut back on lighting already.

Doug, I don't think you've done enough water changes. Try a few more. JK :mrgreen:
Seriously though, if it's not nutrients then try less light for fewer hours. It certainly can't hurt. Any other types of micro algae showing up?

No other algae Lance, just this rapid film growth. I may cut the lights a bit more. Trying to run them enough for the lobo and chalice I have left.

If your RO/DI readings are zero and your water parameters are within range the problem you are likely having is some sort of bacterial aggregation.
Begin at the beginning.
Stop the Chemi-cure, go back to normal water changes, normal filter changes and leave the glass alone.
Things are likely to go to hell for a few days and than settle down.

Sounds like a good theory Wayne. Its Chemi-Pure, which is just a carbon/resin. The Elite version is suppose to have gfo also, which is why I use it in my tank. Use to be a good product but this is the first I have run the elite version. Doubt its causing any problems.

[Doug]

Anything die?

Just a whole bunch of acro,s. The rtn event is what I believe to be the cause of this but should be cleaned out by now. All fish and inverts are fine.

[Seamazter]

My money is on doing nothing at all.
After awhile it will eat all your nutrients and die off, scraping it will just have it die and create more nutrias, let it live till its eating whatever its living on and wait.
Sometimes its best to do nothing at all and let it take care of itself.

[Skimmerking]

its really weird too its like having excessive calcium and you get that chalky film on your glass. but its green from the algae. Doug you forgot to pick up the GFO from me to use....

Are you going to try the BIO pellets that everyone is using.

[Doug]

its really weird too its like having excessive calcium and you get that chalky film on your glass. but its green from the algae. Doug you forgot to pick up the GFO from me to use....

Are you going to try the BIO pellets that everyone is using.

Thinking of ordering them Mike. I found that shorty reactor that fits my bottom shelf.

HOWEVER, as I need a few other things as you know, its like a puzzle trying to find them all at one place. Ones got this and not that and the other this and that. For craps sakes. :lol:

Think I will just order more Phosban and be done with it.

[Wayne]

Another silly question/suggestion how old are the bulbs? Maybe they have shifted spectrum...

[Doug]

Another silly question/suggestion how old are the bulbs? Maybe they have shifted spectrum...

Almost new Phoenix 14k DE 150w

[OceanicCorals-Ian-]

Thinking of ordering them Mike. I found that shorty reactor that fits my bottom shelf.

HOWEVER, as I need a few other things as you know, its like a puzzle trying to find them all at one place. Ones got this and not that and the other this and that. For craps sakes. :lol:

Think I will just order more Phosban and be done with it.

Doug,

I would not suggest using the Shorty Reactor, the shorties do not make good Pellet reactors and they make it difficult to tumble the beads. I would suggest a Phosban/ bead combo with the Phosban 150 or the new 550. We have both kits available.

[Doug]

Thats what I originally looked at Ian, then the Vertex, then on to NextReef. The 150 is 17in. high, is it not? The shelf area its going is only 15in. high which is why I asked about shorter reactors.
Thanks

[Doug]

and...............:D

[MitchM]

Our tanks are always changing to reach a state of equilibrium.

There is obviously something fuelling the algae growth, and I know we have different opinions on this subject...so I hesitate in asking....:wink:
How old are your rocks? ..or..
Can there be any areas of detritus accumulation that have been sitting there for a while?

I'm not on the Biopellet bandwagon yet, but they may turn out to be yet another good form of nutrient export.

I am probably going to be hooking up a second skimmer fed by my 1st skimmer in my ongoing battle for nutrient export.
Just a suggestion anyways.

Mitch

[Doug]

Thanks Mitch. No detritus, as I cleaned the tank out completely after my mishap. Yes, I have some old rock. Some I have had since the early '90,s. But I also have some new stuff that I replaced older rock with.

The tank was fine a couple months ago with this rock.

By the way, the "and" was for Ian. I still need a reactor and if the short version is no good for tumbling, and the one he suggested to high for my situation, then ?? :lol:

I,m thinking now I may just get a Vertex and put it in the sump beside my return pump. No reason that should not work.

[OceanicCorals-Ian-]

Thanks Mitch. No detritus, as I cleaned the tank out completely after my mishap. Yes, I have some old rock. Some I have had since the early '90,s. But I also have some new stuff that I replaced older rock with.

The tank was fine a couple months ago with this rock.

By the way, the "and" was for Ian. I still need a reactor and if the short version is no good for tumbling, and the one he suggested to high for my situation, then ?? :lol:

I,m thinking now I may just get a Vertex and put it in the sump beside my return pump. No reason that should not work.


Doug,

we can most certainly hook you up with our Phosban reactor Bead combo for tight spaces or the Vertex. We also have something else in the works; however, I can only provide a small peak of it at this time as it is top secret.

http://www.oceaniccorals.com/store/images/uploads/Reactors/Salzwasser%20Elite.JPG

http://www.oceaniccorals.com/store/images/uploads/Reactors/Salzwasser%20Elite2.JPG

[Skimmerking]

its a clone of the Zeo reactor

[Doug]

Doug,

we can most certainly hook you up with our Phosban reactor Bead combo for tight spaces or the Vertex.


Agreed. But again, they are 17in. tall. I have 15in. Unless I put the unit in the sump.

[Doug]

So cleaned the front glass when home for lunch, now @ 6pm I can barely see through it. Think I dont have a problem? :lol:

Over 30yrs. keeping aquariums I have never seen anything like it, in anyones aquarium that I know of. Not that fast.

Since I have done numerous water changes and my skimmer is pulling crap non stop, something must be getting introduced in a water change? Cant be just the crap from the rtn event. I must have that removed by now. Whatever the problem is, its likely what caused the rtn and the loss of all my acro,s.

I have seen less algae growth in a shallow pond with no filtration, sitting out in the sun. :lol:

[OceanicCorals-Ian-]

Agreed. But again, they are 17in. tall. I have 15in. Unless I put the unit in the sump.


Hmmm,

I may be able to help you with that space issue but it will be a few weeks until I can say how...

:spy:

[Doug]

Thanks Ian. I borrowed a 150 tonight. Running gfo now. So the reactor is under 14in. What the heck. Specs say 17in. Perhaps they have changed height.

[Skimmerking]

good luck Doug I peed in the reactor to help fire up the PO 4 lol


hope it works for ya..

[Doug]

good luck Doug I peed in the reactor to help fire up the PO 4 lol


hope it works for ya..

Is that why it was a funny colour at first. :lol:

Cant hurt my tank. Nothing can make it worse.

[Doug]

I think this is like reverse aging or something. The longer I,m in the hobby, the worse I get at it.

[edikpok]

Why don't you try a different source of water? Perhaps get some from a different RO unit or purchase some from a store? It might not read 0 TDS but it might help. Perhaps one of your RO system filters constatly introduces some organic waste into your water?

[Doug]

Why don't you try a different source of water? Perhaps get some from a different RO unit or purchase some from a store? It might not read 0 TDS but it might help. Perhaps one of your RO system filters constatly introduces some organic waste into your water?


Thanks. I did use a lot of Co-op ro water for the changes, something I have done many times in the past.

I do wonder if its ro related though. Just before all this downfall happened, I changed all my filters, including my membrane. Thats when I had the restrictor problem with the smaller membrane. I was getting a higher tds from the membrane then but we now know why and it was still 0 from the DI resin.

Its reading 2ppm from the membrane now and 0ppm from the resin.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Haven't read the whole thread, but how old are the bulbs? What type of bulbs? Could be the k has changed & is fueling algae growth more than coral growth.

[MrsBugmaster]

Maybe it is Dinoflagellates. If it is, the more water changes the worse it get. Here is a thread you can read about it.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1619925

[chris88]

the info giving is to complicated. Its simple, you have an excess of nutrients in your water column, its not the bulbs at all. Feed less, skim more, issue solved. Start dosing vinegar or growing chateo to remove the excess nutrients. Skimm wet and reduce your feeding to every second day. It will solve itsefl, something probably died, you overfeed, or your introducing something negative to your tank.

[Doug]

Haven't read the whole thread, but how old are the bulbs? What type of bulbs? Could be the k has changed & is fueling algae growth more than coral growth.

Hi Anthony. Its a fairly new 150w 14k DE.

Maybe it is Dinoflagellates. If it is, the more water changes the worse it get. Here is a thread you can read about it.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1619925

Not dino. Thanks. Its just film algae on the glass, {green} and shows as a brown type on my rock. Both easily wipe off.

the info giving is to complicated. Its simple, you have an excess of nutrients in your water column, its not the bulbs at all. Feed less, skim more, issue solved. Start dosing vinegar or growing chateo to remove the excess nutrients. Skimm wet and reduce your feeding to every second day. It will solve itsefl, something probably died, you overfeed, or your introducing something negative to your tank.

The info is not to complicated. I have been at it for 35 yrs. and reefing for 20. I think everyone is just offering their experience with algae problems, trying to help me find the solution.
Yeppers something did die. A whole whack of acro,s. Not going to light my sump for algae. If I did something like that I would use my ATS thats sitting in the shed. Of course thats not a likely scenario in the small room my little tanks in. For sure a refugium/algae filter is a good idea. Its just not conducive to my current set up. I am skimming wet.

As for feeding, I have been feeding the same way for ages. I do overfeed, no doubt but am a believer in it. Of course filtration needs to keep up. My clowns are 8yrs. old and have been fed the same way everyday. I,m watching it a bit now though.

So I dont think its feeding related but watching the amount that goes in for now. My skimmer gets dumped almost daily. I have never used vodka, {well at least for an aquarium}. I will most likely use pellets if following that route. I have read most of the sps vodka dosing threads on RC.

I started 200ml gfo last night and removed my remaining two corals to a friends. Just had the lights on for a couple hrs. today. Poor clowns are confused or spawning again, not sure which. :lol:

Its definitely not a standard nutrient build up in a tank from to much feeding or insufficient filtration. At least I dont think it is. Something is or was introduced into the tank,
either from the salt mix/ro water
the co-op water
the pollution from dead stinking acros.
something wrong with this batch of carbon/gfo I was using.
last but not least, I dont have a clue....:lol:

Thanks for the ideas people.

[lockrookie]

get a robosnail lol hide the problem set it to clean every day before you get home... j/k i hope it clears up for you i get that pesky dusting on my glass every day as well i thought ozone would help but it just cleared the water not the dusting. i was thinking it may be from the sand. but yesterday i noticed some cyano soooo ill deal with that first

[Doug]

get a robosnail lol hide the problem set it to clean every day before you get home... j/k i hope it clears up for you i get that pesky dusting on my glass every day as well i thought ozone would help but it just cleared the water not the dusting. i was thinking it may be from the sand. but yesterday i noticed some cyano soooo ill deal with that first

Hmmm. A robosnail sounds good. Actually I need more snails but living here in Timbutoo, I cant buy any. Have to order somewhere or drive 2hrs.

I would think ozone would help with that. I have not used it in ages, but know several reefers that run it on their reef tanks.

I think I would try the bio pellets now instead. Of course thats just going by what others have posted here and on RC.

[Doug]

:doh: So the solution was simple.

Not sure if the pollution came from the sps tissue recession or its what caused it. However a couple days of a Phosban reactor and a proper GFO, has all but eliminated the problem.

Go figure.

Putting my SWC sump back in and it will have at least one Phosban 150 reactor for carbon and perhaps another for the beads, depending on what new fangled thing-a-ma-jingy, Ian is inventing.

Or still thinking of the NextReef shorty. I cant see why it wont tumble beads just because its wider?

Oh and by the way Chris. I did turn up the skimmer for an even more wetter skim mate. Over 3/4 cup per day of stinky tea coloured doo-doo. Thanks.. :thumb:

[Skimmerking]

well its about time get your money over here and get the rest of your corals

[Wayne]

AWESOME! Good to see its all cleared up now. I guess you might have put me over the edge for picking one of those Phosban Reactor for my own tank :)

I have heard those bio pellets worked wonders and its good to hear another success story!

[christyf5]

Glad to hear you got it all figured out Doug :biggrin:

[Doug]

Thanks guys. Almost had the 20g running. Just to clarify a point Wayne. No beads in my system yet, although its a sure bet there will be. Its a regular gfo, Phosban type stuff that I,m using still.

[Doug]

Glad to hear you got it all figured out Doug :biggrin:

Thanks Christy. Sure would be nice to know wither what caused the sps loss and if thats what created all the phosphate or visa versa. I guess it remains one of those never solved reef keeping mystery,s. :smile:

[christyf5]

Thanks Christy. Sure would be nice to know wither what caused the sps loss and if thats what created all the phosphate or visa versa. I guess it remains one of those never solved reef keeping mystery,s. :smile:

Yeah, sadly some things in this hobby remain a mystery. I think thats why we get so jazzed when we finally figure a select few things out :razz:

[Lance]

:whoo: Atta go Doug! Glad the problem is fixed. :biggrin:

[Doug]

:whoo: Atta go Doug! Glad the problem is fixed. :biggrin:

Thanks Lance. Need to go raid a friends tank and Mike,s tank now. Kind of lonely in mine. :lol:

[Wayne]

Thanks guys. Almost had the 20g running. Just to clarify a point Wayne. No beads in my system yet, although its a sure bet there will be. Its a regular gfo, Phosban type stuff that I,m using still.

AH oops! My Bad :biggrin:

[Myka]

Sorry I don't have time to read the entire thread, but just reading the first page...do you have somewhere you can get the corals babysat at, and do a 72 hour blackout on the tank? Then do a 50-75% water change? By black period I mean like ZERO light penetration...get a blanket all tucked around it. I suggest this because an algae/bacteria that grows that fast should also die fast (in a blackout). Blackouts don't usually work for stuff like GHA, bubble algae, chaeto, etc which are slower growers (in comparison).

[Doug]

Sorry I don't have time to read the entire thread, but just reading the first page...do you have somewhere you can get the corals babysat at, and do a 72 hour blackout on the tank? Then do a 50-75% water change? By black period I mean like ZERO light penetration...get a blanket all tucked around it. I suggest this because an algae/bacteria that grows that fast should also die fast (in a blackout). Blackouts don't usually work for stuff like GHA, bubble algae, chaeto, etc which are slower growers (in comparison).

Thanks Mindy. I did move my remaining corals and ran little light got a couple days but as soon as back on, the film returned. The last page shows how I finally corrected it with a proper reactor and gfo. Thats the short version. :smile:

[Myka]

Hey Doug, it's solved now? Well I'll be darned.

Usually "little" light won't solve any problems at all since it only weakens algae/bacteria instead of killing it where the point of a 72 hour complete blackout is to kill the algae/bacteria at which point it is often wise to suck up the released phosphate, nitrate, and DOCs with GFO and carbon, obviously preferably in reactors. :D

It's good to hear it was simple for you. Now, if you figure out a simple way to get rid of red and green bubble algae you let me know, ok? Puuuulease???!!! As I continue to battle these lovely algae I have started to really delve into the biology of algae; production, reproduction, photosynthesis, uptake of nutrients, as well as the nutrients that algae leach, and the effect that has on the reef's inhabitants. I know most people would find it quite borrrring, but I find it rather quite interesting (*note old english accent). :D

[Doug]

Seems to be fixed Mindy. Still not sure if the cause of the algae growth and my sps loss is the same or if something else caused the sps loss and the resulting rtn fuelled the algae growth.

I had a fair bit of bubble algae recently. I was getting tired of siphoning it during water changes and my green mythrix never seemed to keep up. One day I was in an lfs in Winnipeg and he had red mythrix. Purchased two.

They ate algae non stop, including most of the bubble algae. Started growing and getting scary looking but never touched a thing besides algae that I could see. After their last molt just getting to large for my tank, so gave them to a couple friends. Mike has one and another large tank the other. Both have lots of bubble algae or other little pickings for them.
Of course also told them no guarantee on what else they may eat. Suppose to be safe but still are crabs. Sure grew fast though but best darn algae eaters I have ever seen.

With my recent problems and now with them removed, I have noticed some bubble algae clumps coming back. IMO, the standard green mythrix does nothing to help or never has for me. I still have one and may add a couple more to see if it helps and if not back to get another red.