I have a problem! Please help.

[tony_3a]

Ok so i have a big problem. I kind of just jumped into saltwater and fish in general so needless to say i did not plan nearly enough if at all. I bought the fluval osaka 260(was going to do fresh but at last minute wanted to do salt) So i went back to the lfs(pet lovers abbotsford) and for my 70 gallon tank he was nice enough to sell me the seaclone 150. So that thing is completely useless.

So here i get to the problem. I am not able to put a sump into this tank, it seems nearly impossible. So i am going to need a lot better hang on skimmer for this tank, ive done a fair bit of reading and it seems that one of the best skimmers for the cost is the Aqua c Remora Pro. I think this thursday im going to drive into jl and buy it. If anyone knows anywhere better please let me know. Also i have a couple fish in the tank and i cannot get the stupid seaclone to do anything at all.

Or if u have any ideas on what i can do it would be greatly appreciated because i really screwed up and went way to quick with such little planning.

I would also be interested in buying a good used hang on skimmer if any of you have one.

Ps im stuck with the tank as well, inless anyone would wanna buy it off me for fresh water!(500).

[Madreefer]

Have you done a search in the clasified section on this site? You may be able to find a skimmer here. Well your right about the Seaclone. If you do get the Aqua Remora take note that it is a little loud. Good luck. I would stay away from any LFS that pushes a Seaclone.

[reefwars]

haha seaclones are junk lol i gave mine away ...good riddance lol:)

[naesco]

Quite frankly, I would start again.
Sell the tank to a freshwater guy and wait until you get a great deal on a used complete setup.
In the mean time read everything you can and ask questions here.
wetwebmedia.com is an excellent on-line site.The Conscientious Marine Aquarist by Robert Fenner in one of the best fish books.


BTW, remove the Seaclone and return it to the LFS for a credit. Be polite but firm.

[tony_3a]

I know im not very pleased with the seaclone or getting sold it. Anyways i did look through classified and i could not find any hang on skimmer. Maybe im blind? I dont know i am just quite annoyed.

[tony_3a]

Quite frankly, I would start again.
Sell the tank to a freshwater guy and wait until you get a great deal on a used complete setup.
In the mean time read everything you can and ask questions here.
wetwebmedia.com is an excellent on-line site.
The Conscientious Marine Aquarist by Robert Fenner in one of the best fish books.

I would love to start over but i also have bought 60 pounds of live rock which is about 300+ and it would go to waste.

[tony_3a]

Quite frankly, I would start again.
Sell the tank to a freshwater guy and wait until you get a great deal on a used complete setup.
In the mean time read everything you can and ask questions here.
wetwebmedia.com is an excellent on-line site.The Conscientious Marine Aquarist by Robert Fenner in one of the best fish books.


BTW, remove the Seaclone and return it to the LFS for a credit. Be polite but firm.

He wont let me return it because it is used. Im very upset about this what a waste of $150

[ElGuappo]

Ask around people here are always happy to let you know who is worth dealing with in your city.

IF it were me..... i would start all over like suggested. however if i decided to use that tank i would get an external overflow and sump it. I have been looking for a good hang on skimmer for a 50g for 2 years and have tried 3 or 4 now only to be disapointed. finally bought a complete setup from the used section here, and i will never go sumpless again.

[whatcaneyedo]

If they wont take it back you may need to cut your losses and run (away from the store and never go back).

Get a small stock trough or large plastic tub to store the liverock in with a powerhead, heater and your junk skimmer. Then you can take your time figuring out a way to drill your tank for an overflow and sump or buy a new one.

While you're looking here are some more good book recommendations: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-01/tips/index.php

This was posted earlier today. Remora skimmer for $130. Its probably the smaller version... either way I wouldn't buy another one. Set up a drilled tank with a sump and you will have infinitely more options for skimmers. http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=64752&highlight=remora

[Lego]

why wouldn't you just return it? Or did you use it already?

I used an external over flow for a long time. Worked fine... just do the maintance on it and it will be flawless.

[whatcaneyedo]

The least expensive hang on overflow from J&L is $125 + tax http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/of-cs050/CPR+C-+Siphon+Aquarium+Overflow+-+CS50+Deluxe+%28300GPH%29.html

The last time I went to Speedy Glass and had a hole drilled I believe it cost me $20. :wink: Its less expensive to do things right the first time.

[Ian]

Sorry to hear about your problems. I would take the PITA skimmmer back to the store and very nicely tell them that they sold you a piece of crap and that they where going to give you a refund or you would make a point of telling everyone willing to listen about the crap servise you got......this usually works.
As others have said get an external overflow and a sump and you will be much better off.
Good luck

[RIPTANK]

You don't need to start over. The Osaka 260 is a beautiful tank and can be used for saltwater as many have done. You can put a sump beside your tank and purchase an eshopp overflow box (the PF-800 is the size you need). I would strongly recommend you also buy an aqualifter pump made by Tom (approx. $20) in case of a syphon break. The overflow boxes are very safe so long as you get an aqualifter pump and avoid buying snails. I personally wouldn't waste my money on a hang on skimmer because they just don't seem to skim anywhere near as good as a skimmer in a sump with an overflow. Let's face it... You're not gonna get jack sqaut for your Fluval Osaka 260 on the private market and will have to fork out a bundle more for a drilled tank and stand that won't even look anywhere near as nice as the Osaka. Put the money towards a good quality skimmer instead. If you need any pointers I'll be happy to help you out with some pics of a similar set up. Cheers!

[tony_3a]

Well i was talking to the manager of the store i got the tank from and he said he would let me exchange it, but the only option they have left is the fluval venezia 350 corner unit, i think it looks really cool and has holes pre drilled in it that i could use for the sump? i would just have to adjust the stand a bit so i can get a sump made for it. Only problem with that corner unit it is seems that lighting would be a big problem considering i do want to try my hand at corals and such.

[Mandosh]

Theres a vendor on ebay called ameka aquatics that sells cpr overflows including the aqualifter pumps for about 50 bucks less than jl even with shipping, if your interested. Mine showed up in a couple of days.

http://cgi.ebay.ca/CPR-CS90-DX-Overflow-with-AquaLifter-Pump-Class-A-2nd_W0QQitemZ390170965204QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item5ad80074d4

not sure if this is the right size, but you can figure that part out

[tony_3a]

thanks for the link! I do not have any space to put a sump around the tank, it is in my living room so the wife would not be happy with having just another tank sitting there. I have read something on how someone has put 2 small sumps on either side of the cabinet and linked them. I might give that a go. but i might also get the corner unit thats predrilled and put a sump under that.

Any suggestions with the whole corner tanks? Problems or anything?
The tank i would be getting is a venezia 350. just lighting seems like a problem.

Thanks so much for all the feedback guys I really appreciate it.

[Funky_Fish14]

Sorry to jump in with this but... IMO stay far away from hang on overflows. I know many people use them all the time with success... but the chance of a screw-up with them is about a million times more likely than with a sump... If they fail... your sump will effectively be emptied on to your floor (via your main tank). Its cheaper to get a hole put in and use the right plumbing than it is to use a much more risky hang on overflow. Just my 2 cents.

Cheers,

Chris

[Rogue951]

If designed properly then there's little chance for severe disaster.
my system has enough room incase either the return pump or overflow fails that either tank (sump or display) can handle the excess from the other.
as for the aqualifter failing one day, if you keep both ends of the tube underwater and check on the pump once in a while, even if the pump fails, having both pipes submerged will prevent a break in siphon.


And both box overflow and drilled overflow are used to feed a sump so not quite sure what you mean when you say an overflow box is more likely to screw up than a sump. Yes, a bulkhead is cheaper but sometimes that just isn't an option for people.


Sorry to jump in with this but... IMO stay far away from hang on overflows. I know many people use them all the time with success... but the chance of a screw-up with them is about a million times more likely than with a sump... If they fail... your sump will effectively be emptied on to your floor (via your main tank). Its cheaper to get a hole put in and use the right plumbing than it is to use a much more risky hang on overflow. Just my 2 cents.

Cheers,

Chris

[Leah]

If you decide to go with a hang on. I have a Aqua Pro hang on that I will ship at your expense and asking $150.00. :biggrin:

[gobytron]

Tony...
I run several undrilled tanks with sumps.
If you need a hand figuring out how to sump your osaka, drop me a pm.

[lockrookie]

just my input i run a lifereef hang on back overflow and like it... but next tank must have internal overflow or at least attached off the back. still undecided. but as far as my lifereef goes. havent had it fail yet even with powerouts

[fishytime]

remora is a piece of crap too......really only one hang on skimmer worth buying.....deltec!

[Interior_Reef]

The least expensive hang on overflow from J&L is $125 + tax http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/of-cs050/CPR+C-+Siphon+Aquarium+Overflow+-+CS50+Deluxe+%28300GPH%29.html

The last time I went to Speedy Glass and had a hole drilled I believe it cost me $20. :wink: Its less expensive to do things right the first time.


Actuallyt the Eshopps overflows are lower priced, and dont require an aqualifter to start the syphon after power outages.

the Es300 overflow is 69.99, and the 800 is 84.99 i believe

[BlueWorldAquatic]

You can still drill the tank if you like. Just have to make sure to the glass isn't tempered. You can easily ched by looking at the glass with a pair of polarized sunglasses.

If my memory is correct, Hagen only tempered the bottom sheet on tanks bigger than 90gal, you can easily drill the tank on the side glass.

Ken - BWA

[tony_3a]

drilling the tank is not the problem, the problem is there is no where to put the sump. Although i could try to figure it out. Goby seems to have a idea so we will seem where that goes.

[whatcaneyedo]

Most people prefer to fit a sump directly under their tank in a custom or store bought stand. Others run their plumbing back and forth through a wall and hide their sump in a room behind the tank. You can take that idea a step further and install your tank into a wall with a fish room behind but that's a big commitment. If you have two stories you can put your sump on the lower floor if you buy a powerful enough return pump. I've also seen setups where a sump is hidden under a stairwell beside a tank or creatively hidden in some custom or modified furniture like a cabinet adjacent to the tank. Then there's mine which just sits slightly to the side but basically in front of my tank... I really wouldn't recommend that though.

[Funky_Fish14]

If designed properly then there's little chance for severe disaster.
my system has enough room incase either the return pump or overflow fails that either tank (sump or display) can handle the excess from the other.
as for the aqualifter failing one day, if you keep both ends of the tube underwater and check on the pump once in a while, even if the pump fails, having both pipes submerged will prevent a break in siphon.


And both box overflow and drilled overflow are used to feed a sump so not quite sure what you mean when you say an overflow box is more likely to screw up than a sump. Yes, a bulkhead is cheaper but sometimes that just isn't an option for people.

Haha, im not quite sure what I meant either? Im pretty sure that was supposed to say that a chance of overflow is higher with a hang on overflow than with a drilled tank.

I've heard of many cases of syphon pumps failing. Im just saying that going drilled is a better safety guarantee and unless a tank breaks there is essentially no risk of overflow if set-up right.

[trilinearmipmap]

OK here is another approach that would work, the advice here so far looks sensible to me but here is another option.

From time to time on Canreef I have noticed Deltec hang-on skimmers for sale. This is what I would get if I were in your shoes. From what I have read they are very good, I was planning on changing a FW tank to sumpless SW and spent some time researching and planning. For now I would let the live rock cure with or without the skimmer you have. Give it a few months, there is no rush.

It is true that hang-on skimmers are not as efficient as in-sump skimmers. However IMO that is really only a factor if you want an SPS tank. If you go for a softie and LPS tank the corals will appreciate some nitrates in the water ie. less than perfect skimming. In fact there are corals (mushrooms and others) that I can't grow in my reef tank because the water is too clean.

So I would let the rock brew for a while, sit and wait, someone will sell a Deltec or other good quality hang-on skimmer. Meanwhile spend time reading and researching.

[megs_clark]

Just wondering what route you wound up going with your tank, I have an osaka also and am thinking about doing some modifications on the stand to put a sump in and my skimmer. Would love to hear if you ever finished with your set up.

[daniella3d]

Hey! I have that same tank :)

In deed the cabinet is way too small for a manufactured sump but I am planning to have something like 15 gallons build for me to fit in the left side, then I could put my skimmer in there.

If you can get one, buy a Deltec 300 as it is doing a nice job on my Osaka. there are some used available on regular basis on kijiji and in forums so keep an eye for that. I paid mine 100$ in excellent condition.

I find the Aqua C remora pro difficult to clean up and it does not work as well as the Deltec.

As for the sump, you could have one build for you in acrylic with the precise mesurement so it would fit in your cabinet. I am lucky that someone I knwo will buid it for me for the cost of the material only, and that should be around 75$ I was told.

Just curious, but what lighting did you put on it? I went with a 250 watt mh and 2 actinic. Very nice tank but stupid furniture!



Ok so i have a big problem. I kind of just jumped into saltwater and fish in general so needless to say i did not plan nearly enough if at all. I bought the fluval osaka 260(was going to do fresh but at last minute wanted to do salt) So i went back to the lfs(pet lovers abbotsford) and for my 70 gallon tank he was nice enough to sell me the seaclone 150. So that thing is completely useless.

So here i get to the problem. I am not able to put a sump into this tank, it seems nearly impossible. So i am going to need a lot better hang on skimmer for this tank, ive done a fair bit of reading and it seems that one of the best skimmers for the cost is the Aqua c Remora Pro. I think this thursday im going to drive into jl and buy it. If anyone knows anywhere better please let me know. Also i have a couple fish in the tank and i cannot get the stupid seaclone to do anything at all.

Or if u have any ideas on what i can do it would be greatly appreciated because i really screwed up and went way to quick with such little planning.

I would also be interested in buying a good used hang on skimmer if any of you have one.

Ps im stuck with the tank as well, inless anyone would wanna buy it off me for fresh water!(500).

[daniella3d]

+++1 on that. Don't get rid of that beautiful tank! I love my Osaka 260! It's totaly rimless with starfire glass.

Although I would find difficult and unsighty to put a sump beside the tank, one can be costum build to fit either one side or one sump on each side connected together could work. I am debating with mine to put 2 sumps connected together or to put just one.

BTW, I have many sps and other corals in my tank and have my Deltec 300 hanged on the side of the tank, and it,s doing a great job. I have some micro-algae and my nitrates are always undetectible.




You don't need to start over. The Osaka 260 is a beautiful tank and can be used for saltwater as many have done. You can put a sump beside your tank and purchase an eshopp overflow box (the PF-800 is the size you need). I would strongly recommend you also buy an aqualifter pump made by Tom (approx. $20) in case of a syphon break. The overflow boxes are very safe so long as you get an aqualifter pump and avoid buying snails. I personally wouldn't waste my money on a hang on skimmer because they just don't seem to skim anywhere near as good as a skimmer in a sump with an overflow. Let's face it... You're not gonna get jack sqaut for your Fluval Osaka 260 on the private market and will have to fork out a bundle more for a drilled tank and stand that won't even look anywhere near as nice as the Osaka. Put the money towards a good quality skimmer instead. If you need any pointers I'll be happy to help you out with some pics of a similar set up. Cheers!

[reefwars]

i think its sad that people still use hang on back overflow boxes like cpr , ive had one for years and ill never go back ...sure they can be made to be " failsafe " but they never are really.they need constant tuning to equal out the returen pump from your syphon...the littlest bit of algae and it gets clogged. usually theres is only one drain which is a huge no no and you need to keep the box really clean so as not to clog the drain filter:)

your tank can be drilled easily enough and rock can be stored in a bin like whatcaneyedo said.if you do go the hob overflow box route i can guarantee that you will want to take it out later at some time.most people who push hob overflow boxes are speaking from pride because they were lucky theres didnt mess up ,they have tons of room for error and is a disaster waiting to happen.again i ran one for years and i was fearful to leave town and i was fearfull to go to sleep. aqualifters break all the time and are slow to start a syphon again.if you use a syphin to bring water back to your sump your return pump has to match, a gate valve can be used easily enough but you will have to tweak it all the time.


pls do not do this if you ask around most saltwater hobbyst will tell you they are not worth the headache and money to buy, personally i wouldnt give a hob overflow box to someone...... i wouldnt sleep right:)

[daniella3d]

well that's nice but if you really don't want to dig holes in your aquarium, there is not much other solution.

How about putting a float switch on the tank to avoir "disaster"?

that should be easy enough to implement and if the pump fail, or if the overflow get clogged, then the float switch would cut off the power to the pump. how about that?

There must be something safe enough.

i think its sad that people still use hang on back overflow boxes like cpr , ive had one for years and ill never go back ...sure they can be made to be " failsafe " but they never are really.they need constant tuning to equal out the returen pump from your syphon...the littlest bit of algae and it gets clogged. usually theres is only one drain which is a huge no no and you need to keep the box really clean so as not to clog the drain filter:)

your tank can be drilled easily enough and rock can be stored in a bin like whatcaneyedo said.if you do go the hob overflow box route i can guarantee that you will want to take it out later at some time.most people who push hob overflow boxes are speaking from pride because they were lucky theres didnt mess up ,they have tons of room for error and is a disaster waiting to happen.again i ran one for years and i was fearful to leave town and i was fearfull to go to sleep. aqualifters break all the time and are slow to start a syphon again.if you use a syphin to bring water back to your sump your return pump has to match, a gate valve can be used easily enough but you will have to tweak it all the time.


pls do not do this if you ask around most saltwater hobbyst will tell you they are not worth the headache and money to buy, personally i wouldnt give a hob overflow box to someone...... i wouldnt sleep right:)

[reefwars]

well that's nice but if you really don't want to dig holes in your aquarium, there is not much other solution.

How about putting a float switch on the tank to avoir "disaster"?

that should be easy enough to implement and if the pump fail, or if the overflow get clogged, then the float switch would cut off the power to the pump. how about that?

There must be something safe enough.

im sure with enough things on there you would be safe but seems like alot of trouble, i did have one on my 180g for a longggg time lol and at the time i thought i was gravy i kept it going and in time i figured it out completely .......but


my last tank was a 110g was drilled in each corner for corneroverflows.in each overflow was two drains and one return.now it is physically impossible for water to overflow minus the bulkheads leaking( which is no different from the ring leaking that keeps the drain hose on a overflow box) each overflow has two drains in case one gets clogged.the only water that can enter the sump is the amount the sump had in it to begin with.

i hated not knowing if what i had done was safe enough , turned out i was good but for how much longer??

[megs_clark]

I think my Osaka Is the next size up. Im going to have mine drilled. We drilled the back of my 72 gallon bowfront to accomidate a herbby overflow and the two holes we did went smoothly. I had ordered the Diamon Coated Hole saw bits off ebay and got 3 for under $10 and the one we used took about 10-15 min per hole. Im thinking of taking the shelf out of the stand and part of the middle wall, and reinforcing it somehow to allow for my sump to slide in. Then im thinking of getting a piece of tinted glass and make a swinging door or magnetic one to cover the middle of the stand thats open below the drawer. I have a new vortex in100 that Iv had sitting since last year new and i just assembled it and theirs enough height to get the cup off once its sitting in the sump. My husband was worried about me gutting the inside of the stand, but i figure once were done reinforcing it it will probably be stonger and more stable then if we hadnt and ill have more play room. So thats how im leaning but i love hearing how others are doing it.

[reefwars]

even my hang on back filter on my 33g sprung a leak after running for so long wasnt good lol:):)

[smallfish]

I've have never had a problem with my hang on overflow box, but i've heard they can be disasterious. i'm running a 46g reef with 20g sump lots of lfs and 2 clowns, yellow tang and manderin dragnet.

[smallfish]

my remora hang on skimmer worked well untill i started my sump. i still love mine