"Last fish" ideas?

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

I am looking for either one more small fish for my tank or maybe a small pair of fishes. 20x20x20, 34G.

Have:

Pearly Jawfish
2 x Purple Firefish
Tailspot Blenny

As of now, everyone gets along extremely well and I have never seen the slightest aggression. I really want to keep it that way.

I had been thinking of a pygmy angel but then that probably means aggression especially since the tank is small.

Any ideas? Needs to be an active fish that will swim in the open a lot. My fish all either perch or just hover now. Oh and either red or yellow is possible but not necessary ;) .

[Dez]

A clownfish? Oscelleris or Perc is what I'm thinking. I find they are a hit with any guest because of Finding Nemo.

[FitoPharmer]

a pygmy angel is a great idea IMO, active, bright. i find they are aggressive but usually calm down within a week or less like most fish and hardly ever pick. and if its your last fish for the tank it really shouldn't be that aggressive since your other fish are lower in the water column and can hide better.

[Delphinus]

Red or yellow, huh. Hmmm.

Yellow assessor maybe? Or how about a candy basslet? I hear nice things about these fish (personality and suitability) and they're pretty (and yellow and yellow/red respectively). There are other fish in this category in other colours (black cap basslet, blue assessors, ... chaulk bass, gramma's .. etc.)

Thinking a Centropyge would eventually get too big. Although if you got a small enough one you could probably get 6-12 months before you had to consider rehoming him.

[Delphinus]

PS. Another obvious choice for red in a tank that size would be a flame hawk. I debated on mentioning it though because you said you'd prefer an open water swimmer and hawks are, well, .. not. :) But you can't beat them for a splash of a red and a hilarious personality.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Thanks for the suggestions. Some good ideas.

I really want a flame hawk but I think it may be better to get something that actually swims around a bit more. Right now the fish I have are beautiful but not the most active. The firefish to swim around but its kind of more slow hovering :)

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Thinking a Centropyge would eventually get too big. Although if you got a small enough one you could probably get 6-12 months before you had to consider rehoming him.

Yeah maybe. I had a flame angel once that never got any bigger than about 2.5"-3" in a few years and I think he would have been fine.

But I don't really want to get a fish that I will have to rehome.

[muck]

Love these guys...

http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/hogfish/candyhogwrasse/

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

"Generally a relatively peaceful community fish, but may bother exceptionally docile, similarly shaped fishes such as Firefish"

This may be a bit of a problem. I have never had the best success with Wrasses being peaceful.

Very nice though.

[muck]

http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/pseudochromisdottybacks/flavivertexpseudochromisredsea/

or

http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/hogfish/candystripehogfish/

are also great looking fish IMO. :wink:

[lastlight]

Yellow assessor maybe?

Wow Tony. I've never seen this little guy before. It's now on MY list (along with your tailspot Justin).

[TheMikey]

I'd second the clownfish. I love mine, very active and colourful. However, if you're looking for colour and something more unique, maybe a flasher wrasse? I've seen them as showfish on nano-reef sometimes.

[gobytron]

Red or yellow, huh. Hmmm.

Yellow assessor maybe? Or how about a candy basslet? I hear nice things about these fish (personality and suitability) and they're pretty (and yellow and yellow/red respectively). There are other fish in this category in other colours (black cap basslet, blue assessors, ... chaulk bass, gramma's .. etc.)

Thinking a Centropyge would eventually get too big. Although if you got a small enough one you could probably get 6-12 months before you had to consider rehoming him.

A yellow assessor is an awesome fish, very colourful (especially if you get the smaller australian variant) and about as friendly as it gets.
Just make sure you have an overhang with some good flow under it because that is where this fish will stay.

I would also put a blue assessor on here, even though it doesn't match your colour schematic but man o man, what an unbelievably eye catching fish...
Would really be a showpiece in the tank described.

Both varieties of assessors (which I believe are considered basslets) are as unaggressive as you could hope for.

I suppose that also, if you're tank is nicely established or you have a 'fuge of one variety or another(or want to spend the money on bottled pods) a red psychedelic mandarin would fit your hopes for colour and passiveness well.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

I'd second the clownfish. I love mine, very active and colourful. However, if you're looking for colour and something more unique, maybe a flasher wrasse? I've seen them as showfish on nano-reef sometimes.

I was looking at flasher wrasse the other day actually. It is an option.

A yellow assessor is an awesome fish, very colourful (especially if you get the smaller australian variant) and about as friendly as it gets.
Just make sure you have an overhang with some good flow under it because that is where this fish will stay.

I would also put a blue assessor on here, even though it doesn't match your colour schematic but man o man, what an unbelievably eye catching fish...
Would really be a showpiece in the tank described.

Both varieties of assessors (which I believe are considered basslets) are as unaggressive as you could hope for.

I suppose that also, if you're tank is nicely established or you have a 'fuge of one variety or another(or want to spend the money on bottled pods) a red psychedelic mandarin would fit your hopes for colour and passiveness well.

Color isn't really THAT big a deal...blue would be fine. I know J&L have the Yellow Assessors right now. Very nice fish!

I don't really have much of a fuge or a Mandarin would be a great fish too. Although I am still really looking for something more active in the water column. It's hard to find anything for a smaller tank like this that is an active swimmer. Obviously if they are active swimmers in this size tank, they have to stay pretty small.

[xtreme]

I really want a flame hawk but I think it may be better to get something that actually swims around a bit more.

My flame hawk moves about quite a bit. He will disappear into the rockwork, then reappear at the other end of the tank. He is always swimming around and he always seems to be watching me. Very cool fish with a great personality.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

My flame hawk moves about quite a bit. He will disappear into the rockwork, then reappear at the other end of the tank. He is always swimming around and he always seems to be watching me. Very cool fish with a great personality.

Does he bother other passive fish at all?

[gobytron]

You wouldn't get a super active fish with the assessor though IMO, they seem to really like a spot with overhead cover and turbulent flow(like right under a tunze or sure flow ph). Mine will venture out pretty regularly but nowhere near as much as my grammas...

Have you thought about them at all if you really want movement and a docile nature above all else?

You could easily get a very small and a med. size gramma loreto and let them do their thing...I only say 2 because 2 of them will be significantly more active in the water column than 1.
JL often gets nice shipments of them in and no joke after a year and a half of them my harem of 4 still crack me up here and there.

With 2 of them sized as stated you'd more than likely wind up with a male/female pair and would encounter 0 aggression unless they're spawning but with you're docile selection of tankmates I don't think you would have any issue even then.

They WILL fight with their reflection though, but fighting for this fish is just a who can open their mouth bigger competition.:mrgreen:

Try that with your reflection sometime...lol

[Delphinus]

Mine never bothered anyone. The ONLY incident I ever noticed with my flame hawk was with my sixline. The sixline was a total jerk to him the first couple of days and the flame had torn fins and whatnot. Somewhere around day 3, the flame hawk said "Enough of this", beat the living SNOT out of the sixline (bruises and everything), from that day on there was peace between the two. So, definitely a fish who can hold his own if need be, but would prefer peace first. Definitely the coolest little fish. Man I really miss mine. :(

[lastlight]

Keep this banter up guys. I'm essentially pretend-populating my tank off this thread lol.

[xtreme]

Does he bother other passive fish at all?

I've never seen him bother any of my other fish. He is one of the smaller fish in the tank though so its a different environment than what your tank would be.

[Delphinus]

Ok, I was going to stop talking but Brett's making me keep going. I'm completely innocent here.

FWIW, J&L also has orchid dottybacks in right now. They fit the bill for a splash of colour (not red or yellow but damn they are a sexy colour), open water swimmers (although like to have caves in rocks for a place to hang their hat), and generally regarded as the least aggressive dottyback. I'm not terribly certain how he would do with your other tankmates. Possibly OK, but ... I don't know for certain.

Mine is in a 115 cube and although the smallest fish, doesn't really fear anyone (but I see no issues of aggression). He did get a little cheesed when I added my eel, I guess as a fellow save dweller he didn't appreciate having to share all the rock holes. So he would swim very angrily around the eel when the eel was out. "Swim! Dart! Swim! Dart! Look at me! I'm small but I'm fast. Swim some more! Dart some more! Hey, come back here! I'm not done swimming towards you. Yeah I'm swimming to YOU buddy!" That's all it ever amounted to, the eel is mostly blind and took no notice, and they seem to accept each other now anyhow.

[lastlight]

Haha! That's EXACTLY how mine was.

Tony do you order livestock from J&L? Is it better to ask an LFS to get a fish or buy one if you see it available at J&L? Also how do you know if fish off their big lists are actually in stock?

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

So Flame hawks seem quite "gentle" :) Still not really what I am looking for but a possibility.

Gramma loreto I had not considered but I might now goo look at them next time J&L has them in. Could be a nice way to add some color to the tank as well as movement.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Ok, I was going to stop talking but Brett's making me keep going. I'm completely innocent here.

FWIW, J&L also has orchid dottybacks in right now. They fit the bill for a splash of colour (not red or yellow but damn they are a sexy colour), open water swimmers (although like to have caves in rocks for a place to hang their hat), and generally regarded as the least aggressive dottyback. I'm not terribly certain how he would do with your other tankmates. Possibly OK, but ... I don't know for certain.

Mine is in a 115 cube and although the smallest fish, doesn't really fear anyone (but I see no issues of aggression). He did get a little cheesed when I added my eel, I guess as a fellow save dweller he didn't appreciate having to share all the rock holes. So he would swim very angrily around the eel when the eel was out. "Swim! Dart! Swim! Dart! Look at me! I'm small but I'm fast. Swim some more! Dart some more! Hey, come back here! I'm not done swimming towards you. Yeah I'm swimming to YOU buddy!" That's all it ever amounted to, the eel is mostly blind and took no notice, and they seem to accept each other now anyhow.

LOL....

Please don't stop! This is exactly what I was hoping for. Otherwise I just end up choosing from the fish I already know or are most common.

Another good idea and at this point, I don't think I will worry about color as long as the fish is brightly colored.

[naesco]

With the size of your tank and your wish to have a mid water fish I would consider a blue chromis. Not the aggressive one but the one with a yellow tail. They are active enough but peaceful, inexpensive and IMO a bright blue fish really looks impressive in a small tank. Just an option.

[gobytron]

I find chromis to be a lot like damsels, eventually always aggressive.

Also, while the orchid dottyback IS supposed to be one of the less aggressive dottybacks, it will certainly get a major hate on for your firesfish and any other conspecifics...

IMO I wouldn't chance any dottyback, wrasse or chromis/damsels in a smaller system I wanted to remain peaceful...

If the tank has a one or more mature sps in it, a couple of clown gobies always add a little colour and a lot of hilarity.

They do nip sps, but it actually seems to give larger pieces some incentive to pick up the pace ...smaller frags will suffer though.

Heres a half decent picture of my assessor...

[Delphinus]

Nice fish, gobytron!

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Yeah thats a nice fish!

Im starting to think I might just go with a few more firefish and leave it at that instead of messing with the peacefulness. They are not all that active but they do swim around and with a few more maybe it would feel more active.

Or otherwise the Flame hawk is also at the top of the list right now :)

[BlueAbyss]

Hmm... I thought the Purple Firefish was one of those 'single or pairs' sort of fish. If you could keep a group of them, that would be awesome... they are beautiful fish (I love mine) and would be gorgeous as a group.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Not sure but my friend has 2 purples and 2 oranges together in a 60G no problem and I have seen large groups in bigger tanks before.

I have no idea though.

Mine are both about 2"-2.5" and get along great. But then again its only 2 of them. In any case I doubt I will end up with more. I have a feeling its either a flame hawk or a flame angel (but I worry about aggression with this one).

Anyone have any experiences to share about their Cherub Angels? My friends is great and very peaceful...is this normal? Would be a great angel since its max size is 3". Not much different from the Flame at 4" I guess.

[gobytron]

I'm 90% sure that as long as they are added simultaneously and aren't too close in size you won't see much aggression beyond establishing a pecking order.

You might be able to get away with reaquascaping your tank and adding a couple new firefish then though...

Or buy try adding some that are much larger than the ones you have in there already as this seems to make established fish less likely to get their hate on for the new guy...

I can only speak from my specific experience with paired/shoals of fish and what I've read about firefish.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

I'm 90% sure that as long as they are added simultaneously and aren't too close in size you won't see much aggression beyond establishing a pecking order.

You might be able to get away with reaquascaping your tank and adding a couple new firefish then though...

Or buy try adding some that are much larger than the ones you have in there already as this seems to make established fish less likely to get their hate on for the new guy...

I can only speak from my specific experience with paired/shoals of fish and what I've read about firefish.

From reading, I am finding that many sites it shouldn't work but then from talking to a few people who I know with experience keeping them, they say its never been a problem for them. I know I remember seeing tanks too with schools of firefish. Might have been very large tanks though.

In any case, I am now on the look out for a Cherub Angel and I think that will be the fish. Not really the brightest fish but I really want an angel and they are about the smallest I have found and also seem to be one of the most reef safe.

[BlueAbyss]

Nice to know about the firefish, I'll consider getting a few more later on then :wink:

One out of three people I have talked to that had Cherubs have said theirs were demons, like killing other fish aggressive. One was just normally aggressive (like my firefish towards my goby, nothing serious), and the other was a sweetheart... so I guess it just depends on the fish and the tank. The super aggressive one was in a 30 gallon and was already established, the others were in larger tanks and added after other fishes. I like them though, they're pretty fish (and the size is perfect).

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Nice to know about the firefish, I'll consider getting a few more later on then :wink:

One out of three people I have talked to that had Cherubs have said theirs were demons, like killing other fish aggressive. One was just normally aggressive (like my firefish towards my goby, nothing serious), and the other was a sweetheart... so I guess it just depends on the fish and the tank. The super aggressive one was in a 30 gallon and was already established, the others were in larger tanks and added after other fishes. I like them though, they're pretty fish (and the size is perfect).

Good to know. I will have to keep that in mind. I have a feeling in my tank it could be a little aggressive because its relatively small and not a lot of LR.

The other option is to just leave the tank as is :biggrin: because Im not kidding, I have yet to see any aggression what so ever other than the jawfish trying to eat fish that come near his cave :D errrrrr...or maybe he is just defending it ;)

[gobytron]

When I was asking about adding 4 grammas to the same tank, people treated me like an idiot.
I got so turned around with misinformation; like being told that grammas are hermaphroditic for example when thats simply not the case...

At least with a smaller tank, if a new addition does go aggressive it's a lot easier to remove the aggressor than in a larger tank full of LR.

IMO though, add a gramma or an assessor and you will still have 0 aggression.

Always seems to be another tough decision around the corner in this hobby.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

When I was asking about adding 4 grammas to the same tank, people treated me like an idiot.
I got so turned around with misinformation; like being told that grammas are hermaphroditic for example when thats simply not the case...

At least with a smaller tank, if a new addition does go aggressive it's a lot easier to remove the aggressor than in a larger tank full of LR.

IMO though, add a gramma or an assessor and you will still have 0 aggression.

Always seems to be another tough decision around the corner in this hobby.

J&L have some Yellow Assessors right now and I am going there tomorrow I think. I will take a look. Tank raised too.

[gobytron]

and on sale for 79.95...
wow...


I just had a thought too...
what about a pyjama cardinal or two?

[lastlight]

Is that considered cheap? I'm all scared to fill my tank now...

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

and on sale for 79.95...
wow...


I just had a thought too...
what about a pyjama cardinal or two?

That was actually an earlier thought as well. I was thinking Bangaii but they can get aggressive I guess. Are Pyjama's better?

I am going to go see the assessors today I think :D

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Is that considered cheap? I'm all scared to fill my tank now...

I think the regular price for that fish is about $110.

[gobytron]

I've actually never encountered an aggressive Bangaii to tell you the truth...

Maybe jut lucky there though...lol

Heres a little blurb from http://saltwater.tropicalfishandaquariums.com/Cardinal/PajamaCardinal.asp
"The Pajama Cardinalfish is not aggressive toward other fish or corals, so they are great choices for a community tank. They will establish a hierarchy among their own kind but do not display aggressive behaviour."

nice pic there too of the coloration that made me think of them.

That to me though describes the Bangaii as I've experienced them pretty well too, so maybe ask someone who's kept them in a community...
Rene would know fo sho if you're going to JL to assess the assessors.

[gobytron]

I think the regular price for that fish is about $110.

Thats about what I got mine for...
A fish that you don't see often and captive bred too.

I got it as a total "return my cashmere sweater xmas present from mom and head to JL" kind of impulse buy...:idea:

Definitely no yellow tail damsel regrets with this fish though.

[BlueAbyss]

I've heard nothing but glowing comments about both the yellow and blue assessors. I find the blue ones a little drab, but the yellow guys are really cool.

[gobytron]

you really have to see a blue in person under reef lighting though...

To each their own, but pictures just cant do the fish justice.

[Leah]

I have one of each and I have to say the blue Assessor is my favorite. The body shape is a little different which is kinda weird. But anyhow the blue one is sometimes harder to see on my blue background, still my favorite though. Nice fish, I am pleased with them. Well mannered, don't eat to much, don't bother other residents, don't try to escape and I am happy to say they have not hosted any wild parties while I was out.

[BlueAbyss]

True enough. While I've seen a yellow in person, I've never seen a blue (only in pictures). I hadn't thought of that :doh:, it's funny that it never crossed my mind when I have a hard enough time getting good pics in my own tank (under 14Ks).

What shade of blue would you describe your assessor as, Leah? I'm sort of curious now 'cause I sort of want a blue fish and would like to avoid any of the blue damsels (which get too big for nano's anyhow).

[gobytron]

royal blue...
lol.
My mom used to own a wedding store.:redface:

[Leah]

BlueAbyss,

It is dark, dark blue like a midnight blue (BlueAbyss) I have just renamed this fish after you!
It is blue/black very stunning in person. When I ordered him I had wanted 2 but they were
not available but they could get yellow so I ordered two but sadly one jumped. Then they got blue in so I kept the yellow in Q.T. a little longer and Q.T the blue and added to the tank together. Yup I know you didn't ask :biggrin:

[lastlight]

Do you have video of either fish Leah?

[Leah]

I can try, if not I will get some pictures it will be later though as I stupidly decided I do not like my aquascaping so have to put it all back. They are in a different tank so it is all good. :smile:

[BlueAbyss]

Yeah that's different than I expected. I love their shape either way, thanks for the info :biggrin: (If I get one I'm naming it Leah :lol: )

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Ended up grabbing a tiny Cherub...just couldn't resist :neutral: They had a full grown one too and its really small...probably about the 3" they are listed at for adults. Mine is about 3/4" max. Maybe even a tiny bit smaller.

We'll see how it goes.

I liked the Yellow Assessors a lot but too shy. Not really what I am looking for. This tiny cherub was so active.

[BlueAbyss]

Awesome, hope it goes well :biggrin:

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Awesome, hope it goes well :biggrin:

So far so good. He is pretty small. He has left everyone alone and they all left him alone. He was kind of swimming between the firefish tonight and they don't seem to mind him.

He is a very active, busy fish, so I am pretty happy so far.