Coral reefs face extinction within 50 years: experts

[Snaz]

Interestingly the article discusses pH issues due to excess CO2 in the atmosphere. I have not heard of this before.

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/07/07/coral-reefs-extinction143.html

[Zoaelite]

I think the term there using now-a-days is Ocean Acidification, its a sad topic but there has been a fair amount of reseach put into play and it looks like the increase in atmospheric CO2 is really causing some problems for small inverts and the develpment of there carbonate shells. One thing is for sure, something has to be done or we could be looking at some pretty white reefs right away here :cry:.
Levi

[albert_dao]

And to think - there's still climate crisis deniers out there...

[whatcaneyedo]

This is why I'm not having kids. I dont want to bring anyone into this pathetic world we're creating.

[albert_dao]

This is why I'm not having kids. I dont want to bring anyone into this pathetic world we're creating.

This type of thinking needs to be exported to certain ...countries, LOL.

[whatcaneyedo]

Sure our population is low but our emissions are not.

Canada in last place among G8 on climate scorecard from World Wildlife Fund

http://www.princegeorgecitizen.com/20090701200081/wire/national-news/canada-in-last-place-among-g8-on-climate-scorecard-from-world-wildlife-fund.html

[Snaz]

We waste so much fresh water. In 10-20 years wars will not be fought over oil but water.

[AndyL]

last place amongst the G8... Really - yet we still emit 10% of the US CO2 emmisions...

http://www.carbonplanet.com/country_emissions

Yeah, but we forget how this work, CO2 acidifies the water, Calcium carbonate disolves, raising pH ... calcium reactor... Reefs have existed during periods where temperatures were much heigher, atmospheric CO2 much heigher...

Lets keep things in perspective...

[albert_dao]

Yeah, but we forget how this work, CO2 acidifies the water, Calcium carbonate disolves, raising pH ... calcium reactor... Reefs have existed during periods where temperatures were much heigher, atmospheric CO2 much heigher...

Lets keep things in perspective...


C'mon Andy, you're being lazy :P

Pre-industrial Revolution, variable world oceanic pH was 8.0 to 8.3.
Today's average variable oceanic pH is 7.9 to 8.2.
That's over the course of 150 years.

Prehistorical parallels took tens of thousands, if not millions of years. Acidic oceans are not unprecedented (late-Jurassic ~7.5), but the rate at which they are becoming so is.

There's your perspective.

[BlueAbyss]

I've given up on climate change... I switched to CFL lights (actually putting me down one rung on the environmental ladder, since they contain toxic mercury and my power is all hydro), I don't drive a car, I buy organic and recycled materials (and recycle those that are worth recycling)... What more can I do?

I need to start breeding endangered species in my living room if I'm to be seen as helping (rather than hindering) these days...

[albert_dao]

What more can I do?

Sounds like you're doing good to me...

[justinl]

Andy, the last time rapid ocean acidification occured, there was a mass marine extinction. i think that's all the perspective anyone needs.

as for the calcium reactor point, you forget that reactors are used outside of systems and pH is still normal in the displays. If the pH is high in the display (the ocean in this case), any calcium carbonate that is formed will dissolve.

[whatcaneyedo]

last place amongst the G8... Really - yet we still emit 10% of the US CO2 emmisions...

http://www.carbonplanet.com/country_emissions

Yeah, but we forget how this work, CO2 acidifies the water, Calcium carbonate disolves, raising pH ... calcium reactor... Reefs have existed during periods where temperatures were much heigher, atmospheric CO2 much heigher...

Lets keep things in perspective...

The figures in the article are per capita and we dont have as large of a population as the USA. Plus it looks like the article I posted is more current than the site you posted.

[plutoniumJoe]

Individual actions will not be enough. Governments and corperations need to make sustainable options the only options available. I applaud stores like Home Depot that now charge for bags.

[AndyL]

The figures in the article are per capita and we dont have as large of a population as the USA.
Here this one is better:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
though I'm willing to bet I will be chided for using wikipedia as a reference.
Still 2.3% of the world CO2 emmisions - if you actually assume these are real numbers - I still find these numbers to be amusing especially when compared to total CO2 emmisions & percentage of errors...

Calcium reactor - it doesn't matter whether its within or external to the display - the chemical reaction is all that matters; you'd probably not be happy if you were to lower your display to a 7.? pH - to raise calcium levels... The chemical reaction still will occur no matter where its located.

Albert - Lets talk over the eons not decades... The oceans pH, and atmospheric CO2 levels have changed radically - yet we don't live in a desolate lifeless world. There are numerous species of current corals that can be found back millions of years - if the changes since then haven't killed these species off...

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Albert - Lets talk over the eons not decades... The oceans pH, and atmospheric CO2 levels have changed radically - yet we don't live in a desolate lifeless world. There are numerous species of current corals that can be found back millions of years - if the changes since then haven't killed these species off...


Your forgetting the time it took for these changes to occur. The changes in atmospheric CO2 levels and ocean PH levels did not fluctuate this fast during the "radical changes" your speaking of. They were much more gradual...tens of thousands of years, not hundreds. The changes didn't kill off the species your speaking of because they didn't happen fast.

Besides, I hope one day when I have kids, they can dive some of the spots around the world I have been lucky enough to visit and still see them in half decent condition. Diving in Australia was the most beautiful experience of my life and yet the local divers who had been in these spots for 30+ years would all tell you the reef was steadily heading downhill.

Im not sure why your trying to defend rapidly declining reefs as ok or normal???

[albert_dao]

Albert - Lets talk over the eons not decades... The oceans pH, and atmospheric CO2 levels have changed radically - yet we don't live in a desolate lifeless world. There are numerous species of current corals that can be found back millions of years - if the changes since then haven't killed these species off...

Bollox - show me evidence contrary to what the overwhelming majority of professional career climate and environmental scientist have compiled based upon empirical data.

Since the manufacturing revolution, humans have been the single largest contributors of CO2 emissions by a long shot, something on the order of 150 times more than all the world's active volcanoes combined. The ocean has a natural process of buffering CO2 by circulating it into deeper waters, but this process takes thousands of years. For all intents and purposes, it is a dysfuctional process. As such, the order of magnitude to which the oceanic pH is changing here is unparalleled and, quite frankly, alarming.

For sure, the fact that species will survive is irrelevant and a sellout opinion. You're right, things will survive, mostly seagrasses and algae lifeforms - the types of organisms that will benefit from an increase in dissolved CO2 and a decrease in spacial competition and predation. Anything that has to lay down a calcium based body structure is going to be severely retarded. Hardly what I'd call a comforting fact, nor an excuse for the world to decline vigilance at the call of duty.

[rstar]

This is why I'm not having kids. I dont want to bring anyone into this pathetic world we're creating.

I think its thinking like this thats driving the world to where it is going. Our jobs as responsible human beings is to create and raise the next generation to be better and smarter than we are, to make better chioces. If we don't do this then what was it all for? Im sorry to say but as soon as humans gained scentience the path the world is on became the inevitable, the reality is its here. and at the end of it all, even if we end up messing this place up beyond repair i think its better to be able to say we did what we could to help it, than just cross our arms and say im not going to even bother helping the next generation because the world is going to hell in a handbasket.

By the way im not a tree hugger or anything like that, and i really mean no offence to your opinion. i mean really i am here and taking part in a very hippocritical hobby and have no intention on leaving. I just really do believe it is our job to usher in the next generation on people making smarter choices that we did.

[whatcaneyedo]

Sorry but I dont have any faith that people are intelligent enough and will work together to solve this crisis. Its going to take an 'act of god' to fix things. Probably a virus that wipes out the majority of the human race bringing it down to a more manageable level. Thats if we dont all kill each other first in nuclear war.

[Snaz]

Probably a virus that wipes out the majority of the human race bringing it down to a more manageable level.

Could be closer than you think. The more people who get H1N1 the bigger the chance the virus flips a couple of nucleotides and mutates into our demise. :yuck:

[BlueAbyss]

Sorry but I dont have any faith that people are intelligent enough and will work together to solve this crisis. Its going to take an 'act of god' to fix things. Probably a virus that wipes out the majority of the human race bringing it down to a more manageable level. Thats if we dont all kill each other first in nuclear war.

Bingo. And...

Could be closer than you think. The more people who get H1N1 the bigger the chance the virus flips a couple of nucleotides and mutates into our demise. :yuck:

Yeah tell me about it... the northern communities are having issues with H1N1 right now. I've been exposed (and it may or may not have made me sick... I haven't been sick enough in the past 3 months to warrant being tested) but it's the fact that so many people are getting exposed that worries me. Or rather, doesn't worry me... :wink:

[justinl]

anyone here seen the movie "Idiocracy"? funny, but the concept behind the story is... foreboding. that said, the more babies we crank out, the less resources for everyone. As a whole, we are already using far more than the world's resources can provide us.