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View Full Version : Open Tops/Rimless Tanks with fish


Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 07:03 AM
For those running open top, what kind of fish are you housing? I know I won't have water in my 50 for a long time, but I like to have things at least partially figured out. This tank is going to be entirely SPS (seriously Doug!) and was thinking a shoal of 5 or 6 Green or Blue Chromis would be just the right touch...

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Myka
02-23-2009, 02:45 PM
My tank is open top...as are all my tanks, always. I've had a few carpet surfers; a Yasha Goby, and a couple of small freshwater fish/shrimp.

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 03:11 PM
oh man.
I'm also all open top.
you can see my fish in my sig, but I have also had a yellow tang in there in the past without it surfing.

I used to have three zebra dart gobies but now only 1...
I have only ever had one CONFIRMED carpet surfer (a pink/blue spot prawn gobie) as I have a couple cats and a dog who watch over the tanks for me during the day and night when no one else is around so if one jumped, it might wind up lunch or buried in the kitty litter before I found it.

I have lost in the past a gramma, a few jawheads (though none to jumping, they all died before they had the chance) a couple clown gobies and a carpenters flasher wrasse...

Virtually all of my fish are known surfers but I think as long as there isn't a major aggressor in the tank, once a fish is established, there is very little reason for it to jump.

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 06:12 PM
herm. Thanks. Now more too think about. I know I only want a couple fish, with the main focus of the tank being the corals. But it definately gives me something more to think about.

Delphinus
02-23-2009, 07:08 PM
Is building a wooden skirt (like an open top canopy, so to speak) an option at all?

I could see a chromis jumping is the only thing. I've been using an eggcrate cover over my 115g but it wasn't enough to stop a canary wrasse from surfing. :( I've been meaning to look into bird/garden netting locally, seen some tanks on RC with that and it's not offensively obtrusive.

I used glass covers over my golden dwarf moray tank, I thought it was pretty well sealed up but he still found a way out. :cry: If I ever try an eel again it will be with a wooden top, may still go with an open top if it's tall enough, but at least with walls that they can't slither through.

Anyhow guess what I'm saying is there's always a risk. Sometimes it's not a problem and it's fine, sometimes no matter what you do it isn't enough. :neutral:

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 07:15 PM
I hear you, Tony.

The only thing is, I want this tank to be as clean as possible. That's another eason I'll be going with a barracuda pump. I might just be able to get enough flow going through the tank that I won't need extra powerheads. Bare Bottom tank, lots of flow...might need to upgrade my skimmer though now that I think about it...herm...

justinl
02-23-2009, 07:30 PM
i used to have a rimless 60g, but after i had my first carpet surfer (a red coris), i vowed never again. now i used a DIY open topped canopy. I don't advise anyone for the rimless thing anymore though i can still see the appeal. Just pick fish that are known NON jumpers. could you maybe have a rimless but not fill the tank full? like by leaving six inches or so of clearance? it would essentially be like having a small clear permanent canopy; keep in mind that that would effectively make your tank volume smaller than its standard rating.

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 07:31 PM
I swear to you, every fish I have ever bought was a "jumper" and as long as nobody in your tank mess with them too much, they have no reason to jump...

I had a chromis for about 6 months without it jumping but he was bugging my grammas too much so I ousted him....


You definitely take a bigger risk with an open top, but as with a lot of things I am finding in reefing, reports of the ill effects seem to be greatly exaggerated.
at least from my own personal experience.

and I tell everyone this, but one of the most rewarding things I have ever done in reefing is getting my 3 grammas to form a harem in my 72 gallon.
So rewarding to watch and in a tank without too much else you might even get to breed them.
Mine lay eggs, but never seen a fry....

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 07:35 PM
Whatigot...
What about your chalk bass? I like the looks of them.

Justinl: I don't really want to lower the tank volume for a number of reasons. The overflow wouldn't work for one LOL. Two, by the time this tank is grown in I can see the tank having a higher coral to water ratio than most. We'll see though.

Thanks for the suggestion anyways!

JDigital
02-23-2009, 07:43 PM
My 75 is open top... for now... What I got in my tank is all in my sig. No carpet surfers yet.

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 07:52 PM
Whatigot...
What about your chalk bass? I like the looks of them.

Justinl: I don't really want to lower the tank volume for a number of reasons. The overflow wouldn't work for one LOL. Two, by the time this tank is grown in I can see the tank having a higher coral to water ratio than most. We'll see though.

Thanks for the suggestion anyways!

Bought 5 chalkies about 7 months ago, still have every one...
super cool, super peaceful fish, they form a hierarchy where the biggest fish gets the highest up hiding/sleeping spot in the tank right down to the smallest darn near under the substrate....
and they school from time to time, but its sporadic.....lots of shoaling though.

Them and my grammas are so cool to watch and I have not lost any of these basslets to the hardwood yet, and it's been a good while.

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 08:02 PM
So do you think 5 would be pusing it in a 50 gallon? Total system volume will be damn near 150 gallons...

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 08:08 PM
in all honestu, I wish I had bought 10 for my 72.

They fight a bit for the top spot or at least for the spot higher up than they are but other than that, these guys have never shown aggression to any of my other fish nor one another.

I bet 5 in a smaller display system would look sweet and I doubt you would have any aggression issues other than the norm.


Can you see the chalk bass?
just one of my fave chalkie pics....
crappy pic, sweet fish...lol
http://i298.photobucket.com/albums/mm277/ohkenny42oh/aquapics016.jpg

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 08:10 PM
well, I think I'm sold LOL

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 08:12 PM
just watch out...lol
I paid 22.45 each for mine and then saw them at an abby reef shop for 14.99....

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 08:14 PM
Red Coral is pretty decent priced, so I'll probably see if I can order them in through them. Thanks again

GreenSpottedPuffer
02-23-2009, 08:39 PM
My tank is open topped when I am home (quite often as I work from home right beside the tank) and has a screen cover (window screen) when I am not and all night. I just put the screen on before i go out or to bed...its habit already. I had a puffer jump after owning him for 3 years a while back and vowed never to do open topped again. I did it again obviously :( But I am trying to lessen the chance of anyone jumping.

It just takes one quick, little fight for it to happen and I am willing to bet if you have the tank set up for years, it will. Everytime. Just a matter of time. It took three years with that last tank.

So some days if I am out all day, the screen will stay on the tank and light will be blocked a bit but oh well...kind of like a cloudy day on the reef. Its window screen to keep bugs out so NO fish can fit through. Would even work for eels.

The nice thing was that you just buy the frame in length and cut them to fit the tank. Its super easy to make a quick custom cover. Takes maybe about 15 mins. max.

Good luck!

BTW, I had chalk bass in the past and they all jumped at some point either up into my canopy or would jump and hit the lights :( Didn't do it often but over a few years, they all seemed to jump. Only 2 of the 6 died but still...if I didn't have a canopy, all of them would have.

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 09:06 PM
I would bet you had much more aggressive tankmates than I ever did.

Thats the key IMO, careful selection of inhabitants to make sure that there is as little chance of aggression as possible.

Sure, you're never gonna be 100% jump free, but thats no what this thread is about.

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 09:33 PM
so technically, according to what you're saying, if I keep with one species and provide lots of nooks/crannies/mini territories they should be less likely to jump.

GreenSpottedPuffer
02-23-2009, 09:41 PM
Its simple. Fish jump for various reasons and if you have an open top, you have to accept the fact that you will loose a fish or two over the years. There was a thread about this on RC a long time ago that got really long and probably 90% of people with open tops had lost fish unless the tank was only set up a few months. There was everything from triggers to tangs to chromis jumping.

Delphinus
02-23-2009, 09:54 PM
+1

Seems to me it's a just a risk you have to accept if you want open-top. If you don't want to accept the risk, then you have to find a solution to make them fall back in the water "when" they do jump...

Rbacchiega
02-23-2009, 10:06 PM
good points both of you.

The only sure way, it seems, to avoid fish jumping is to go with no fish at all. Herm. Food for thought indeed

Whatigot
02-23-2009, 10:12 PM
Its simple. Fish jump for various reasons and if you have an open top, you have to accept the fact that you will loose a fish or two over the years. There was a thread about this on RC a long time ago that got really long and probably 90% of people with open tops had lost fish unless the tank was only set up a few months. There was everything from triggers to tangs to chromis jumping.

yeah.
Nobody refutes the fact that you're gonna have some jumpers if you go open top, its a gimme on this thread...lol
no question GSP, if you're tank is an open top, you will eventually lose a fish to it.
HOWEVER, I think this thread offers some great insight for those who understand the risk and just like or need open top for whatever reason.
and in my EXPERIENCE, in the 3 years I have been running open top reef s dedicated to PEACEFUL fish only, that your risk of jumpers is mitigated quite substantially by
A) Picking inhabitants carefully to ensure they will all get along, if you have even ONE single aggressive fish, your jump likelyhood increases significantly for every other one, this is why I gave my chromis, yellow tail damsel and yellow tang the boot in my 72 open top; aggression.
B) Have other places to go, if a fish has some known hiding spots like lots of live rock, they will have somewhere else to swim if a panic moment does occur
C) have your tank somewhere low traffic in your home

You'll never have a jump free tank, but you're certainly increasing the potential for one, even if your statistic leaves 10% of tanks jump free ;-)

FlamesFan
02-23-2009, 10:22 PM
yeh my 90 is rimless and I to have had deaths inthe past. Thankfully only chromies ;)

GreenSpottedPuffer
02-23-2009, 10:29 PM
yeah.
Nobody refutes the fact that you're gonna have some jumpers if you go open top, its a gimme on this thread...lol
no question GSP, if you're tank is an open top, you will eventually lose a fish to it.
HOWEVER, I think this thread offers some great insight for those who understand the risk and just like or need open top for whatever reason.
and in my EXPERIENCE, in the 3 years I have been running open top reef s dedicated to PEACEFUL fish only, that your risk of jumpers is mitigated quite substantially by
A) Picking inhabitants carefully to ensure they will all get along, if you have even ONE single aggressive fish, your jump likelyhood increases significantly for every other one, this is why I gave my chromis, yellow tail damsel and yellow tang the boot in my 72 open top; aggression.
B) Have other places to go, if a fish has some known hiding spots like lots of live rock, they will have somewhere else to swim if a panic moment does occur
C) have your tank somewhere low traffic in your home

You'll never have a jump free tank, but you're certainly increasing the potential for one, even if your statistic leaves 10% of tanks jump free ;-)

Right and I agree 100% with what your saying. I just think especially for people new the hobby that they need to make sure they understand there is a risk. I am willing to bet if you keep an open top tank for say 5 years, even with just small peaceful fish, you are going to get some jumpers. If not, then thats awesome...but I think rare.

My scissor gobies would dive straight into the rocks when scared and never go near the surface, so I think your point about them having a safe spot in the tank like a cave is a good point. They should dart to that spot instead of out of the tank...hopefully.

landshark
02-24-2009, 05:49 AM
I run open tops. I've had Gobies,Blennies,Mandarinfish, Yellow Tang, Royal Gramma,Wrasses,and Perc Clowns. I've only had one jumper when a friend put her finger in the tank, one of the Percs bailed. Bounced off her, and landed on the stand. Scooped it up and put em' right back in.