Crystal Sea Bio-Assay

[Buccaneer]

Just posing a question here but how many would be interested in trying this salt ? ... I have looked around here in Calgary and cant find it anywhere ( maybe not looking in the right places :smile: )

I have emailed the manufacturer and also Dr Mac ... so far 28.50 US for 150 G box + shipping ( $37 - $50 / box ) from Dr Mac.
http://www.drmaccorals.com/sys-tmpl/door/
If there is interest then maybe a group order as I have asked about that also and just waiting for return email

Cheers

[StirCrazy]

Not much cheeper than IO when you factor in shipping and brokerage.. possable more expensive. that suck as everyone was using it as it is presumed to be good and 1/2 the price of IO.

Steve

[Buccaneer]

The idea was not " necessarily " if it was cheaper ( same as IO would be fine too or even a bit more ) but the apparent closeness to NSW in chemical content was my motivation to try it. Just looking to see if there is any interest out there in trying it out

Cheers

[EmilyB]

Steve (Rasta), have you read the threads on Reef Central (http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=186595) ?

Be sure to read the imbedded threads as well.

[Buccaneer]

Steve (Rasta), have you read the threads on Reef Central (http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=186595) ?

Be sure to read the imbedded threads as well.

I have actually ... there is quite a debate going on but from a hobbyist point of view as far as I can tell ( not sure if some of them have a alterior motive ) ... is there any portion of a thread in particular that you would like to point me to ?

There are also threads on survival rates going up with seahorse fry using this salt so hence the curiosity

Cheers

[Quinn]

if it is cheaper than IO or kent for the same quantity, i might be interested. except IO comes with cheesy fake plants, so we'll see :razz: :rolleyes: anyone got a freshwater or species tank that could use a little decoration?

[EmilyB]

Nope, nothing in particular Rasta. Just wanted to make sure you (and or others reading this)had read all of that. :smile:

I've used Kent for four years now, and it has treated me very well. Mixes clean and clear every time, and goes in at Ca of 420.

I'm still very interested in the results of the RDO (reefs.org) salt tests (if they ever get done :rolleyes: ) but myself, personally would be very cautious about changing salt mixes without some measure of experience from users in the long term.

And the cost of the salt would be the LAST thing I would take into consideration.

JMO.

[Samw]

There are also threads on survival rates going up with seahorse fry using this salt so hence the curiosity

Cheers

Interestingly, all of a sudden, I have swarms of mysid shrimps gliding around my tank now. They're so cool hovering/gliding millimeters above the sand like the land speeders in Star Wars hovering across the desert. Not saying that the new salt is responsible but coincidental at least.

[sumpfinfishe]

I have done three water changes over the last few months with Crystal Sea and I won''t be doing a fourth. Since using this salt I have noticed a thin layer of brown diatoms on the sandbed, corals closing for hours after the change, cloudy water even after mixing for 4 days, both pieces of my pocillapora have turned a light yellow from a rich golden color, and also the CS needs to be chiseled from it's brick-like form that it came in.

Price was not an issue for me, instead I was attracted to the closeness to NSW. At the end of this month I will be switching back to IO, after almost 6 years of using this saltmix I never experienced the problems that I have had over the last few months with CS. I am going to wait for some long term studies before I think about switching over to Crystal Sea.

cheers, Rich :smile:

[StirCrazy]

one thing that stopped me from trying it is the unprofesional mannor in which this test was done, I was rather shocked that all the samples except the two Crystal Sea were actual test results but the the info for the Crystal Sea products was taken from the package, and the salt was not even tested. Plus there were a lot of other varibles that were not tested for or even mentioned. To me this look like something done quickly to meet a deadline.

Steve

[Buccaneer]

The test that Dr Ron did aside for now ( lots of controversy there ... some merited and some not ) ... this salt has been used in laboratory and public aquarium conditions for years ... I am in no way defending it by saying so because I have not tried it but there are as many success stories as there are " bleach " stories too :eek:

There seems to be some anecdotal evidence to suggest that it might not be all that friendly to algae ( in many forms ) but it seems to also be beneficial to fry of all kinds ... very curious indeed :confused:

Cheers

[Quinn]

i've heard of aquariums using IO as well...

if shimek tested all the brands of salt except CS, instead taking the CS specs off of the box, then to me the study is rather useless.

[Buccaneer]

This is from Dr Mac an online retailer in the US ...

Originally posted by Dr. Mac
I had responded to another thread about my experiences, but thought I would also respond here FWIW.

I switched to CS BioAssay Formula more than 2 months ago after using IO since the 1960's. My reason for the switch was that MEI was more open to working with me with direct purchases than IO and MEI is fairly local for me. I have hundreds of corals, clams, inverts, and fish in several systems and have observed no changes positive or negative since changing. I first bought one box locally-saw no problems and then bought it by the pallet load. It does mix cloudy so I run a hang-on H.O.T. Magnum filter with the micron insert and the mix is clear in less than an hour, I aerate the mix overnight before use and at that time dKH is about 10 and calcium about 400 at 1.025, I use RO/DI water and do not heat it prior to or after mixing, I add the salt to the water with strong circulation, I do not see any film or accumulations in the mixing container after mixing-which I always did see with IO, the container always had a scaling on the sides and residue on the bottom with IO and not with CS.

I have been selling the salt and one person has reported bleaching to me. MEI tells me that they had this same person contact them and also one other, but the other person had some other issues unrelated to the salt. It would seem that with this one report to me and several reported here that switching should be done slowly and animals observed carefully despite my personal experiences.

[StirCrazy]

Now I never get any residue when I mix salt.. not once.. I mix it to 1.026 or a little higher. I put it into a bunch of cold RO and then mix it with my paint mixer for 5 min.. totaly desolved. if I use a power head it takes a couple hours. the paint mixer was the best thing I have bought for my tank yet.. go figure :rolleyes:

I do not dispute that it might be better but what I do dispute is a lot of people's reason for changing.. the main one being because Dr. so and so said it was better in a article.. if you look at previous tests that were done it actualy tested out to very different values than it claimes..

As for Dr. Mac's responce that you posted

"My reason for the switch was that MEI was more open to working with me with direct purchases than IO and MEI is fairly local for me. "

to me that says that because MEI would sell directly to him and not though a reseller, and that it was closer, his costs would be a lot cheeper.

Money it is all about money, the cheeper you can get it the more you will make selling it... and of course you are not going to say anything bad about the hand that feeds you, not good business after all.

I look at every statment by a bussiness with a sceptical eye and take it with a grain of salt (pardon the pun :mrgreen: ) not that they are crooked or anything like that but they have to make a living as a business and any business man when it comes down to the wire will look after himself first.

Heck maby we should be buying PI water to mix out salt in.. :eek: :razz: :lol:

Steve

[Buccaneer]

I understand your scepticism with Dr Mac but think about this for a second ... who has more to lose by bleached corals for the sake of a couple bucks ? ... does the manufacturer have some secret deal with Dr Mac to replace bleached corals as long as Dr Mac keeps endorsing the product ? ... if you think about it you know that is not true ( not that it is not possible and would make a good " made for TV script of big business corruption " and all but just not very likely :lol: )

Here is how I see it so far ... there seems to be an aclimation that the corals go through in changing salts and the smaller the change increases your chance for success. Also by following the procedures that those that have used it sucessfully have done would be prudent.


EDIT ... for those that dont know already Dr Mac sells CORALS :eek:
Cheers

[Samw]

i've heard of aquariums using IO as well...

if shimek tested all the brands of salt except CS, instead taking the CS specs off of the box, then to me the study is rather useless.


I didn't like the trace element break down of Dr. Shimek's test either since those weren't gathered consistently (some were from old test results, some were from publications) and I ignore it. However, I don't think the test is completely useless and haven't seen a reason to discredit the results of the urchin tests itself. More uchin larvae died in one type of salterwater over the other. That's a fact. However way you decide to interpret the results is up to you. Some people believe that the causes of urchin larvae deaths might also be detrimental to other marine organisms so they change. Other people think that the causes of urchin larvae death will not be detrimental to other marine organisms so they won't change. To me, it doesn't matter if the reason was metal or not. As long as the experiment was controlled and all else remained equal, one salt had different results than the other. Of course he only tested from 1 bag of each salt I think (correct me if I'm wrong) and that was one of the issues with the experiment.

Now, if Dr. Mac and Son's Corals business decided to switch salts, I don't think its necessarily only because they can get a better salt deal with MEI. I think it is in their best interest to get the better salt. Suppose Crystal Sea was a bad salt and bleached all of their corals. That would ruin their business. By making this entire switch, they have shown a lot of faith in the Crystal Sea product.

[Samw]

Rasta, I just read your last message and noticed we had the same conclusion wrt Dr Mac. :mrgreen: I'm just a slower typer. :mrgreen:

[Buccaneer]

Rasta, I just read your last message and noticed we had the same conclusion wrt Dr Mac. :mrgreen: I'm just a slower typer. :mrgreen:

Not slower ... just more to say LOL :smile:

Here is a scenario that may hurt the pride of some that have had the bleaching :idea:

You ever hear the saying " Tis a poor carpenter that blames his tools " ?

What are the consistencies with those having trouble switching over as opposed to those that show no adverse effects ?

Cheers

[StirCrazy]

I do not believe that the other salt caused bleaching either, but rather the spead at which people do change overs.. yes there could be differences in the salts so doign large changes will only lead to a sudden change and hence stress, I think if you did small water changes like 5% and smaller for a long time you would not notice any ill effects.

I do not say one is better than the other, I am just skeptical of the way in which the testing was done and how so many people jumped on the band wagon in the US based on a unscientific test in a online article.

but when you think of it.. this is par for almost everything in this hobby. one person says something and every one buys it.. thats why I spent 2000.00 or more on lights I didn't need :rolleyes:

now as for report od Mysis and such .. I use IO and I have more bugs than I can shake a stick at.. my mandrin is fat and content and I still see copopods, worms, mysis, and others that I do not know what they are called. this stuff all road in on rock I bought and multiplied. Maby I would have more with Bio Assy maby I woulden't but I have 220 more gallons of IO to mix up befor I even think of switching.. also there is the fact of no one on the Island selling it or I might have bought a small bag and tried a comparason in a small tank.

It just seams funny to me that because one person says this is better than that all of a sudden the brand (IO ) that makse up a good majority of the market share in salt.. is sudenly no good.. when 2 days befor it was the most recomended salt you could find.

Steve

[Samw]

now as for report od Mysis and such .. I use IO and I have more bugs than I can shake a stick at..
Steve

I don't really know what caused the jump in my mysid shrimp population in my tank. I've had my tank for 18 months now and only this past month, I've seen dozens of mysis shrimp. I still have all the amphipods and bristle worms and spaghetti worms like before with IO salt but never before was there an outbreak of mysid shrimp like now. Maybe it was just a matter of time and I was due regardless of the salt but I thought I'd throw this coincidental development out for discussion. I suppose I could switch back to IO and see if all the mysid shrimps disappear, to be sure. :mrgreen:


Steve, by the way, when you say "need" as in spending $2,000 for lights that you don't need, what does that mean? Do you mean that the $2,000 lights did not give the results that you were hoping for as compared to your older lights? I didn't need to upgrade to MH either but my sps colors sucked.

[Samw]

I have done three water changes over the last few months with Crystal Sea and I won''t be doing a fourth.

cheers, Rich :smile:

Rich, I'll buy the rest of your salt at half price and pro-rated if you like. :lol: :lol:

[StirCrazy]

naa, I ment I spent to much money on "new" types of lighting instead of just starting out with MH and actinic.. mind you I had fun doing it, and I learned alot :wink:

Steve

[Buccaneer]

Steve ... nobody is saying IO is no good ... at least not here I dont think ... but as somebody responsible for providing the best environment for the creatures in my care I have to look at what is available and weigh the pros and cons ... now as far as anecdotal evidence goes 64ivy at RC has started using it with no ill effects so far and he has arguably one of the coolest tanks going that I have seen ( a 500G monster of technology ) so looking at this objectively I would have to say that the evidence clearly shows that " healthy " tanks are doing well switching over and those that are having trouble in some cases have been reckless in their transition procedures.

As far as Dr Ron's testing goes ... I have not seen anything to dispute the results he achieved so far ... sure there are " other variables " that could be explored but the bottom line is that urchin larvae are more sensitive to toxins than corals and thus the perfect subject for the test ( which was for metal toxicity )

It is puzzling how some have such adverse effects and others dont and yet still some have mild bleaching but then the corals recover and then achieve even more growth and even richer colours ?

I think it is viable to test slowly ( personal opinion ) ... I have had some feedback from the manufacturer as of this posting and they will give a hefty discount for 50 boxes ( 150G box ) ... in the neighborhood of C$45 - $50/box delivered

Cheers

[Samw]

Don't forget Joe Burger's (JB NY) awesome tank too (RK 09/2002 TOTM). Quoting Joe "I'm going to stay with it for a while"...."I measured the Ph and Ca of Crystal seas, and it was 8.32 and 410. much better than the 8.0 and 360 I was getting from IO. I've noticed a considerable change in color with many of my SPS corals. A few corals that sort of went dormant and were hardly growing at all, have started to get better color and noticeable growth. "

He did experience some problems as well but is sticking with the new salt as he likes what he is seeing.



now as far as anecdotal evidence goes 64ivy at RC has started using it with no ill effects so far and he has arguably one of the coolest tanks going that I have seen ( a 500G monster of technology ) so looking at this objectively I would have to say that the evidence clearly shows that " healthy " tanks are doing well switching over and those that are having trouble in some cases have been reckless in their transition procedures.


Cheers

[Buccaneer]

Here is a interesting reply after using CS for a while ...

Originally posted by Graham
I haven't participated in these threads about the Crystal Sea much over the past month or two. I had a relatively significant event with a Heteractis sp. anemone, two Pavonas, a Pocillopora, and some Monti digitata bleaching.

I'm proud to report that everything is making a nice comeback and nothing was lost. I initially did a 30% change (mistake) about 2 months ago. Well, the other day I did only 5 gallons and nothing has reacted negatively...in fact, when I woke up this morning, the "bleached" anemone was spawning! No kidding...I got some video that I'm going to post soon, but I have to say that my tank is doing much better than it was 2 months ago. As if the anemone shooting eggs isn't proof enough...as someone else reported, the few small patches of Bryopsis that WOULD NOT go away, went away 2 days after the first big water change. Growth is excellent and the many of the corals are more colorful than ever.

Whether or not this is due to using CS Bioassay instead of IO, I don't know. I do know that I won't be switching again any time soon...

[Fishster]

I have been using IO for a long time and have had no problems. But when I am done with my current supply of IO I will be switching to Crystal Sea. The reason is I will never know what I am missing unless I try. It is my belief that a healthy reef is as diverse and full of life as possibe, and if this salt is more condusive to that then I think it is worth a try.

[Quinn]

i guess my feelings in the long run are that most of the salts are fairly close to the composition of NSW, they seem to work fairly well, and if one seems to kill sea urchin larvae and another makes corals grow slower, so be it. i wonder if there were confounding variables that may have caused the death of the urchin larvae. and you can't tell me that in the ocean, a. all the water is of the exact same specifics (becaues we know it's not), and b. urchin larvae aren't invincible :razz: there are plenty of other, bigger problems in the hobby that have a higher chance of killing off or at least slowing growth. in the case of corals, wouldn't lighting have more importance than salt mix? in the case of fish, feeding? people have used IO for years. it obviously works. why switch if it is a. more expensive and/or b. going to cause livestock to go through a stressful adjustment phase?

[StirCrazy]

Teevee, the CS bio assy is cheeper than IO. (about 1/2 the price in the US) so if it works good all the better, thats why we have Rasta and SamW to be guinny pigs :mrgreen:

Steve

[Quinn]

edited out what i had before. stir, sounds like a plan :cool:

[EmilyB]

Originally posted by Graham
As if the anemone shooting eggs isn't proof enough...as someone else reported, the few small patches of Bryopsis that WOULD NOT go away, went away 2 days after the first big water change. Growth is excellent and the many of the corals are more colorful than ever.

Whether or not this is due to using CS Bioassay instead of IO, I don't know. I do know that I won't be switching again any time soon... [/quote]

You should follow up with this guy. I've had anemones spawn several times and it is SEVERE water pollution...man the house smells like a whorehouse... :eek: A massive water change is in order after an anemone spawn.

Also, in reading that post (among others on RC), if you did a water change and algae died...would that not be alarming to you in any way ? It would be to me.

[Buccaneer]

Those that report algae loss are not losing ALL algae just the nuisance algae ... coralline is thriving as well as macro algae

Cheers

[Aquattro]

maybe I should get some of this stuff to rid my tank of wafer algae!!!

[Buccaneer]

:smile:

[EmilyB]

You guys are so funny... :lol:

[Samw]

Some serious hobbiests are starting to switch I think.

This thread is 19 pages long so I'll just snip the quote over. Hope she doesn't mind.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=168736&perpage=25&pagenumber=18

Originally posted by Flame*Angel
I started out by hooking up my auto top off to my bucket of Crystal Seas salt water and gradually added five gallons over a couple days. That was about a week ago. I didn't see any signs of trouble so today I did an actual water change with it. I changed approximately 20 gallons. That was at noon, about 8 hours ago.

As I was writing this I looked over at the tank and saw something cloudy. My big diadema urchin, Spike, just spawned several cloudy spurts. Cool.

Anyway, no signs of problems yet. I'm going to make the switch. I found the salt very well packaged (3 sealed bags in the bucket), of a very fine, dry consistency and no more difficult to mix up than IO. I didn't see any of the cloudiness I've read about. Maybe it could be my mixing technique? I always make my RO/DI water in a Rubbermaid Brute garbage can with a heater, a MaxiJet 1200 powerhead or two and a tube connected to an air pump.

[Aquattro]

I'm also mixing this right now and I DO see the cloudiness. My RO/DI goes into a 20g rubbermaid garbage can with a heater and a powerhead. It has been cloudy for 12 hours now.
An urchin spawning can signal a stressor in the water. It does not mean that suddenly something is better.
I will be adding this to my tank shortly...wish me luck!!

[Samw]

Good luck Brad. Oh yeah, my change water in the bucket stayed cloudy even after mixing overnight. I use carbon in the main tank so the cloudiness goes away quite fast maybe because of that. I don't know how long the cloudiness will stay in your tank because I don't think you run carbon. A lot of people (including Sumpinfishe) reported bleaching of their Pocillipora as you might have read. Mine otoh didn't bleach. But you can keep an eye on yours. I'm out of IO now so its only CS that goes in my tank now.

[Mak]

Hey Sam, I just came across this thread. Regarding your Mysid shrimp population, I really doubt it was the salt mix. I had almost positively no Mysids in my 77g, so I sucked up 9 or 10 of them from my 57g system and added them to the refugium of the 77g. When I took down the fuge before moving (which was about two months after putting in the Mysids), the population has literally BOOMED in there. I think your Mysid boom was just a coincidence. Oh yeah I use IO of course.

Just my 2 Rupi's worth! :robot:

Hey cool!!! we got some new CORNY smiley guys :eating: :B-fly: :BIG:

[Aquattro]

Well, I added 5 gallons of the MEI salt tonight. Nothing has bleached and no urchin babies running around :razz:

[Mak]

Just for curiousity, where are you guys getting this Salt and how much???

[Samw]

Hey Sam, I just came across this thread. Regarding your Mysid shrimp population, I really doubt it was the salt mix. I had almost positively no Mysids in my 77g, so I sucked up 9 or 10 of them from my 57g system and added them to the refugium of the 77g. When I took down the fuge before moving (which was about two months after putting in the Mysids), the population has literally BOOMED in there. I think your Mysid boom was just a coincidence. Oh yeah I use IO of course.



Hi Mak.

But the point you made was that it boomed in your refugium and not in the main tank. This is perfectly reasonable. When they are safe from predators, even with a lower larvae survival rate, the refugium could allow large populations to quickly establish in a short amount of time.

Now, the problem I could have had in my main tank was that the larvae survival rate in IO was just good enough such that only a few of them could survive predation and thus I seldomly saw any in the tank. Once the larvae survival rate increased, more of them existed and predation could not keep up with them which is why I see them swimming everywhere now. I don't have a sump or refugium so larvae survival rate plays a much bigger role. With a refugium, even 1% survival could result in large populations rather quickly I'd imagine.

WRT spawning under stress. I don't doubt that it could happen. But I'm a believer that more often than not, animals require ideal conditions to spawn. But I can see how it may be hard to think that a tank can go to breeding condition after 8 hours of a water change.

[Samw]

Just for curiousity, where are you guys getting this Salt and how much???

Hi Mak. Paul's Aquarium is the only place that I know of that carries it at the moment. It was priced about the same as IO. Hm, Paul's might be close to where you live.

[StirCrazy]

Hi Mak.
WRT spawning under stress. I don't doubt that it could happen. But I'm a believer that more often than not, animals require optimum conditions to spawn. But I can see how it may be hard to think that a tank can go to optimum breeding condition after 8 hours of a water change.

Actualy this has been well documented in dozzens of types of marine organisims. it is a servival mechanisim. Anemone, Urchins, ect.. when stressed may release eggs/split in order to increase the chances of there species survival.

Steve

[Mak]

Well the main tank, in 57g there used to be mass Mysids everywhere :eek: . They however are a little more scare since the addition of my two FLATWORM EATERS (Yea!!! no more whining from me as they have been totally erradicated from my tank), which are my little 6-line and my Neon Dottyback :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :cool: . The Mysids have also spread quite nicely in the 77g main tank as well.

But anywho if this stuff proves itself, I see no reason not to switch.

[Mak]

But I can see how it may be hard to think that a tank can go to breeding condition after 8 hours of a water change.

If this salt actually did bring optimal breeding conditions after 8 hours, I myself just might be sold. Something also tells me that the price of this salt will probably jump up more the IO.

[Samw]

They however are a little more scare since the addition of my two FLATWORM EATERS (Yea!!! no more whining from me as they have been totally erradicated from my tank), which are my little 6-line and my Neon Dottyback


Yeah, that's kind of what I mean. With predation, the larvae survival and hatch rate will play a bigger role in whether or not you will see lots of them in your tank. I have a leopard wrasse and still it can't keep up with the mysids now. Well, who knows. Hard to say unless there is a side by side comparison or a before and after scenario. I really wish I had lots of tanks to experiment with so I can make side by side comparisons of mysid shrimp reproduction and clownfish breeding. If I lived in a place with more room, I would have started these experiments already.

[Samw]

Interesting to me, someone else had a population explosion of mysid shrimps after switching salts.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=168736&perpage=25&pagenumber=20

Interesting poll here. Also, glad to read from JohnL that RC is conducting more salt tests to be published soon. Happy to see that RC is actually going forward with these tests so quickly.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=191129&highlight=poll

How's your tank doing Brad?

[Aquattro]

How's your tank doing Brad?

Sam, I've had 3 of my colonies bleach after the water change. Can't say for sure it was the salt, but to be safe, I'll only use it to cure rock or something. :rolleyes:

[Samw]

Brad, very sorry to hear that. Were those colonies close to the light and did the bleaching occur on the top of the corals that receive most of the light?

[Aquattro]

Brad, very sorry to hear that. Were those colonies close to the light and did the bleaching occur on the top of the corals that receive most of the light?

Sam, one was right under the light, one was on the bottom under the cross brace and the third was up high but right at the side of the tank. Completely different light exposure on them. One acro, one pocillipora and a T. reniformis. No idea why these three out of all the corals. Again, maybe something else changed the same time I did te water change. I'm not chancing it though.....

[sumpfinfishe]

Yeah me too!

That's why I called it quits on the CSBMM. I was just about to drop you a line Brad- to ask if your Pocillipora had been affected. I almost lost both colonies of that coral and also my big green Frogspawn :confused:

I'm going to stick with the brand that's worked for me for 6 years, or until a serious study of salt mixes and comparrisons has been done :smile:

cheers, Rich

[Samw]

dam Rich. That's a serious blow. I have both frogspawn and pocillipora with no problems. Is it because I use carbon? Either of you use carbon? Rich, I can frag you some frogspawn if you are interested.

[Aquattro]

Sam, I have both carbon and a poly filter in the sump. I also have 3 other pocillipora colonies that were NOT bleached. My hammer was also not affected.

[sumpfinfishe]

Sam
Thanks for the frag offer :biggrin:

I didn't loose the green Frogspawn, it was however effected by the water changes using CSMBM. It remained completly closed for up to four hours after doing the changes. The Frogspawn and also the Pocillipora are both slowly rebounding back so I'm keeping my fingers crossed :exclaim:

And yes, I also use Chemi-Pure carbon in my sump as well.

[Samw]

Sam

I didn't loose the green Frogspawn, it was however effected by the water changes using CSMBM. It remained completly closed for up to four hours after doing the changes. The Frogspawn and also the Pocillipora are both slowly rebounding back so I'm keeping my fingers crossed :exclaim:




Good to hear that they're making a comeback. I misread your original post when you said "almost lost". I thought you actually did lose them.