Alright whose 12 footer is that?

[lastlight]

I was paying Mitch a visit at Bow Valley and got a tank tour of some behemoth 800 gallon tank. Anyone on here building this?

Bottom was 2 x 3/4". I'd hate to move that thing!

[Delphinus]

I'm always amazed at some of the tanks that get built, that we never (ever) hear of the owners. I think there's a pretty goodly portion of people of fish tanks who just basically have money, and want something "ooh ahh" in their house or business, and pay someone to stock it and care for it .. and generally don't give a rats behind about the actual knowledge that goes into the building and maintenance of such a thing.

[albert_dao]

I'm always amazed at some of the tanks that get built, that we never (ever) hear of the owners. I think there's a pretty goodly portion of people of fish tanks who just basically have money, and want something "ooh ahh" in their house or business, and pay someone to stock it and care for it .. and generally don't give a rats behind about the actual knowledge that goes into the building and maintenance of such a thing.

Is it just me, or is there some sort of remarkably strained angst hidden in this post :P

I'm having one of those days too Tony.

[Sebae again]

Yeah. Is there something wrong with my new nano tank?

[VFX]

The angst isn't very well hidden and the tone remarkably narrow minded for such an experienced & well respected forum member.

I know plenty of people with amazing marine setups that never venture into forums. Does that mean they don't give a rats about their tanks?

I also find nothing wrong with paying for the build & maintenance of a system. I mean, who cares? so long as everything is healthy & well looked after...

.

[fkshiu]

I think Tony does have a point in the sense that I have had experience with certain people who could give a rat's ass about the things in the tank as long as it looked impressive. In fact, while channel surfing a few months ago I came across an interview with some music star/professional athlete-type who was giving a camera crew a little tour of his mansion. When he was asked about his monster SW fish display he said something along the lines of "I gotta keep paying $^%&*&^% big $$$ for new fish cuz they keep dying, but it sure looks cool! Haw! Haw!" He obviously didn't have a clue of what fish he had or why they might have been dying.

I am in no way suggesting that whoever ordered this particular tank is one of those people.

[Delphinus]

You read far too much into my comments. No angst except for what you mistakenly place into my comments. All I mean is there are a great number of big tanks out there that you'll never hear about. Does the owner of a business who puts a tank in the lobby care about what's in it? Not usually. The effect is for impact, and it serves its purpose. There's nothing wrong with it. Same for the wealthy segment - they may want the take for the visual appeal and nothing more. If they take it further, good for them, but if they don't, they don't. All I'm saying is there are more tanks out there that fit into that category than what you may realize. If that's what makes the owners happy then so be it.

Now.. since you tried to spank me, I'm going to spank you back. Please don't ever call me narrow minded again unless you are prepared to tell that to my face. You don't know me, you don't even come close to thinking you know me, so you are not in a position to make such a vicious judgment on my character. You talk about being narrow minded, perhaps you need to do some introspective analysis yourself there my friend. Have a nice day.

[michika]

Well I for one would love that tank, it sounds beautiful. But, you are right, I definitely wouldn't want to be lifting that sucker.

[VFX]

You read far too much into my comments. No angst except for what you mistakenly place into my comments. All I mean is there are a great number of big tanks out there that you'll never hear about. Does the owner of a business who puts a tank in the lobby care about what's in it? Not usually. The effect is for impact, and it serves its purpose. There's nothing wrong with it. Same for the wealthy segment - they may want the take for the visual appeal and nothing more. If they take it further, good for them, but if they don't, they don't. All I'm saying is there are more tanks out there that fit into that category than what you may realize. If that's what makes the owners happy then so be it.

Now.. since you tried to spank me, I'm going to spank you back. Please don't ever call me narrow minded again unless you are prepared to tell that to my face. You don't know me, you don't even come close to thinking you know me, so you are not in a position to make such a vicious judgment on my character. You talk about being narrow minded, perhaps you need to do some introspective analysis yourself there my friend. Have a nice day.

I stated that your comment had a narrow minded tone.

I did not call you narrow minded.

You however, are most definitely name calling here.

Again for such an experienced & respected forum member, I am VERY surprised by your immature response to reef related discussion.

If you are so thin skinned that you accuse me of spanking you (I would never knowingly spank a stranger! :wink:) & then threaten me in a public forum, then please grow up, & also please follow moderators own advice & leave that kind of comment in private messages & allow normal discussion to carry on.

Are people not allowed to disagree with staff here anymore?

.

[StirCrazy]

can't we all just get along, Don't make me spank the lot of you :mrgreen:

Steve

[Veng68]

can't we all just get along, Don't make me spank the lot of you :mrgreen:

Steve

[Lines up for spanking] ;)

Cheers,
Vic

[christyf5]

can't we all just get along, Don't make me spank the lot of you :mrgreen:

Steve


Exactly. Chill people.

I'll leave this open for now but behave.

[Delphinus]

You can disagree all you like, without making it personal. You don't know me so you're not in a position to make the kind of personally directed comment that you did. I can't add anything further that doesn't further dilute the purpose of the original poster so I am stepping off this thread. If you feel you are being treated unfairly please feel free to state your case to any other staff member. Good luck and have a nice day.

[JDigital]

I'm not sure what the OP meant by 2x3/4" or what (is that how wide it is??)... but if anyone is interested in a VERY DIY 12 foot tank, THIS (http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=154877) guy is doing an amazing job with his.

BTW... shouldn't this be in the Calgary section?

[Delphinus]

Hmmm.. probably. I'll move it. Thanks for noticing.. :)

[Veng68]

I'm not sure what the OP meant by 2x3/4" or what (is that how wide it is??)... but if anyone is interested in a VERY DIY 12 foot tank, THIS (http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=154877) guy is doing an amazing job with his.

BTW... shouldn't this be in the Calgary section?

That means that they laminated two 3/4 inch pieces together for the bottom piece.

Cheers,
Aquaman

[Aquattro]

Are people not allowed to disagree with staff here anymore?

.

Anymore?? I don't think it's ever been allowed :)

(ok, ok, I'll stay out of it)

[JDigital]

That means that they laminated two 3/4 inch pieces together for the bottom piece.

Cheers,
Aquaman

Ahhh ok... Damn, that's thick! :lol:

[Skimmerking]

this is the best fun I have had since Afghanistan watching to camels wELL you know

[ElGuappo]

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Lance]

this is the best fun I have had since Afghanistan watching to camels wELL you know



Camel porn. Cooooooool!

[VFX]

You can disagree all you like, without making it personal. You don't know me so you're not in a position to make the kind of personally directed comment that you did.

Wow are you still bitter about that? :mrgreen:

I'm sorry Tony... you can spank me anytime...

.

[AJ_77]

Wow are you still bitter about that? :mrgreen:

I'm sorry Tony... you can spank me anytime...Please let it go already.
-------------------

That is about a 12' by 4' by 27"H tank (at least in my little world that's the shape it would take).

Nice.
.

[Delphinus]

It would be amazing. Heck, I wonder if it's even meant for SW. (Arrowana or rays for example I bet would love such a tank). It's a size I can only dream of, however, the cost of the salt alone for water changes make me dizzy. :lol: If I had the means, it also means I'd have the means (I wonder how many more times I can say "means" in a single sentence) to go somewhere nice and see things where they are instead.

I still think it's a totally legit thing for a business though, someone who could write off the costs and so on as an expense... hey why not. (I just wish MY company would do it, so that I wouldn't have to go broke trying to maintain my own tanks. :) ).

[brizzo]

Camel porn. Cooooooool!

Every time I am spending time on Canreef my girlfriend accuses me of looking at fish porn :twised:

[rocketlily]

Camels!!! Oh the images in my head. How funny!

[ElGuappo]

How many HUMPS???????:mrgreen:

[Marlin65]

can't we all just get along, don't make me spank the lot of you :mrgreen:

Steve


lol

[Ephraim]

A lot of reefers do not feel the need to shamelessly self promote thier tank on online forums. Because they do not participate on a forum does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Also, if they pay someone to look after the tank does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Fact is, most people that have 800 gallon tanks in Calgary, don't have the time to look after them themselves, that's how they could afford them in the first place.

The vast majority of aquarists choose only to impress themselves and do not feel the need to show off on the internet.

[fishytime]

A lot of reefers do not feel the need to shamelessly self promote thier tank on online forums. Because they do not participate on a forum does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Also, if they pay someone to look after the tank does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Fact is, most people that have 800 gallon tanks in Calgary, don't have the time to look after them themselves, that's how they could afford them in the first place.

The vast majority of aquarists choose only to impress themselves and do not feel the need to show off on the internet.

I agree. Most customers we get in the store are like..."whats a canreef". And sadly most of those people have nothing but LFS advice to go on(which isnt always in the best interest of the tank or livestock). Arent we lucky to have access to the wealth of information both here and on other online sources.

[StirCrazy]

Hmmm.. probably. I'll move it. Thanks for noticing.. :)

why would a thread on my tank be in Calgary? Does bow Vally only make tanks for you if you live in Calgary. like really who would want to live in Calgary anyways when you could live in Edmonton, the city of Champions:wink:

Steve

[Ephraim]

I agree. Most customers we get in the store are like..."whats a canreef". And sadly most of those people have nothing but LFS advice to go on(which isnt always in the best interest of the tank or livestock). Arent we lucky to have access to the wealth of information both here and on other online sources.


i would not say that we are lucky to have this "wealth of information" for someone that is new to this, the incorrect information on most aquarium forums is more prevalent that it is in the worst of LFS. A good fish shopkeep can give you more useful information than the best web forum, because it is A) filtered and B) they have to answer for the incorrect info.

[mark]

The vast majority of aquarists choose only to impress themselves and do not feel the need to show off on the internet.

I'm not here to impress or show off.

[lastlight]

Mitch told me the tank was headed for Edmonton which is why I posted there looking for the owner...

Additionally...this is the first post I've ever made that's actually generated any interest I think and it's not even my tank!

[ReefJunkie]

i would not say that we are lucky to have this "wealth of information" for someone that is new to this, the incorrect information on most aquarium forums is more prevalent that it is in the worst of LFS. A good fish shopkeep can give you more useful information than the best web forum, because it is A) filtered and B) they have to answer for the incorrect info.

I disagree, I have learned more from this website than from any fish store I have been to... I guess if you have a 'good' fish store nearby that you can go to with questions great (but for me starting out that would have been a lot of trips to the store). I have rarely been misinformed on this or any other reefing forum and if there is some misinformation being given usually the more experienced people chime in right away and correct this. All canreefers together I'm sure have way more experience than any "good shopkeep" and they dont want to sell you anything

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Damn, that's thick! :lol:

So tempted, but going to leave it alone...

[midgetwaiter]

I disagree, I have learned more from this website than from any fish store I have been to... I guess if you have a 'good' fish store nearby that you can go to with questions great (but for me starting out that would have been a lot of trips to the store). I have rarely been misinformed on this or any other reefing forum and if there is some misinformation being given usually the more experienced people chime in right away and correct this. All canreefers together I'm sure have way more experience than any "good shopkeep" and they dont want to sell you anything

I dunno about that, I've seen some truly awful advice offered here lately. Whatever question you've got it's probably best to try and get info from as many sources as you can and make up your own mind.

[howdy20012002]

Is it just me or what?
WOW
How did this conversation jump over 5 lanes and into 2 or 3 different directions.
Too funny.
someone bringing up an interest point turned into a wrestling match with about 4 or 5 people in the ring.
I don't come here for the advice anymore, I just come to see the fireworks.
lol

I think everyone needs a vacation to some far off distant land so we can all swim around in God's aquarium and relax.


Neal

[Der_Iron_Chef]

I'm headed to Costa Rica in March. Ahhhh....God's aquarium or WHAT?!


Is it just me or what?
WOW
How did this conversation jump over 5 lanes and into 2 or 3 different directions.
Too funny.
someone bringing up an interest point turned into a wrestling match with about 4 or 5 people in the ring.
I don't come here for the advice anymore, I just come to see the fireworks.
lol

I think everyone needs a vacation to some far off distant land so we can all swim around in God's aquarium and relax.


Neal

[Delphinus]

Spirited debate is not unhealthy. If the thread jumps over 5 lanes then so be it, as long as nobody has a problem with how people conduct themselves then it's cool. I had a problem with the way VFX expressed himself or herself, which I think would likely have been different had they not been posting from an anonymous vantage point (to me this person is anonymous), and so I replied in kind. Things were said, I said what I thought of his post, he said what he thought of my post, and hopefully both of us have moved on from that particular incident. It really doesn't matter to me beyond this context. In another thread I might be so inclined to congratulate him or her on a nice photo or something, or sympathize about a car engine being wrecked because someone didn't tighten a lug nut or something. It really doesn't matter to me, I always react within the specific context of the time.

A lot of reefers do not feel the need to shamelessly self promote thier tank on online forums. Because they do not participate on a forum does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Also, if they pay someone to look after the tank does not mean they don't fully understand thier system and how a reef works. Fact is, most people that have 800 gallon tanks in Calgary, don't have the time to look after them themselves, that's how they could afford them in the first place.

The vast majority of aquarists choose only to impress themselves and do not feel the need to show off on the internet.

And I would argue that not everyone who comes to an internet forum is here to shamelessly self-promote or show off. Perhaps it is true for some. Perhaps it is not true for others.

It was NOT my intent to imply that the owner of the tank is in any category. Although I realize NOW that in my haste to post, I could have worded things better, but my point was intended to be that there are more tanks out there that are large, and spectacular, and intensely private. It is not my intent to judge, only to state an observation. Everytime I visit Mitch, I see many spectacular tanks being built. And Mitch is but ONE builder - so to extrapolate what I see there onto other builders - the result is that there are lots of big, big tanks out there, and only a privileged few get to know anything about them. The only real "shame" here is that there is likely a wealth of information learned because of these tanks that doesn't get shared in some form.

For the record I apologize for the implication that all big tank owners are those who do not care for the tanks themselves. I also apologize for the implication that this big tank in question falls into that category. I know nothing about the tank or the person and the comments weren't intended to be an assumption about this person. But also for the record, some people ARE in that category. I'm simply stating observation, not passing judgment. If life lets you be in that position then hey, good for you man, you're living the dream. It's not wrong, it's not right, it's just phenomenon.

i would not say that we are lucky to have this "wealth of information" for someone that is new to this, the incorrect information on most aquarium forums is more prevalent that it is in the worst of LFS. A good fish shopkeep can give you more useful information than the best web forum, because it is A) filtered and B) they have to answer for the incorrect info.

One key difference that you're missing is that forums do allow for a form of peer review. Granted, it's not guaranteed - you yourself have implied as has another posted in this thread that you have seen wrong information posted and not intervened yourself to post a differing point of view. So, the model is indeed far from perfect. On the flip side, and you said yourself by prefacing "good" before "fish shopkeep", again, the potential is there for it to be a good model, but is hardly guaranteed. Personally, I have had good advice and bad advice from forums, I have had good advice and bad advice from shopkeeps - although some of the WORST advice I was ever given, did come from shopkeeps who were motivated by increasing sales. Heck, I've been outright lied to by people in the industry. .. I think of the case of the "benign dictatorship" model being an effective method to run a country - the downside is that there don't tend to be many (or any) "benign" dictators in the world. Without checks and balances, things get out of hand. So to bring this back to context, what is a person to do to gather information. The best choice, I think, is to inform yourself from as many sources as possible, and in the case that disparate viewpoints are encountered, question and challenge the assumptions.

Not really sure how this veered into "LFS versus internet" territory but there are my thoughts on that. No LFS is perfect, no internet forum is perfect. I can only speak from my own perspective - I don't lie when giving advice. I have no motivation to increase sales so I wouldn't tell someone "Yes go ahead and buy that blue ribbon eel - everything will be great!!" for example. But I don't run a shop nor work in one, so ordinarily nobody would ask me anyhow. But I AM on here, and if I see something that I can offer some advice on, I'll do my best. Anyhow, that's my reason I'm here. :)

cheers

[Aquattro]

I'm headed to Costa Rica in March. Ahhhh....God's aquarium or WHAT?!

Pacific side? Pretty murky water when I was there....

[VFX]

Spirited debate is not unhealthy. If the thread jumps over 5 lanes then so be it, as long as nobody has a problem with how people conduct themselves then it's cool. I had a problem with the way VFX expressed himself or herself, which I think would likely have been different had they not been posting from an anonymous vantage point (to me this person is anonymous), and so I replied in kind. Things were said, I said what I thought of his post, he said what he thought of my post, and hopefully both of us have moved on from that particular incident. It really doesn't matter to me beyond this context. In another thread I might be so inclined to congratulate him or her on a nice photo or something, or sympathize about a car engine being wrecked because someone didn't tighten a lug nut or something. It really doesn't matter to me, I always react within the specific context of the time.



And I would argue that not everyone who comes to an internet forum is here to shamelessly self-promote or show off. Perhaps it is true for some. Perhaps it is not true for others.

It was NOT my intent to imply that the owner of the tank is in any category. Although I realize NOW that in my haste to post, I could have worded things better, but my point was intended to be that there are more tanks out there that are large, and spectacular, and intensely private. It is not my intent to judge, only to state an observation. Everytime I visit Mitch, I see many spectacular tanks being built. And Mitch is but ONE builder - so to extrapolate what I see there onto other builders - the result is that there are lots of big, big tanks out there, and only a privileged few get to know anything about them. The only real "shame" here is that there is likely a wealth of information learned because of these tanks that doesn't get shared in some form.

For the record I apologize for the implication that all big tank owners are those who do not care for the tanks themselves. I also apologize for the implication that this big tank in question falls into that category. I know nothing about the tank or the person and the comments weren't intended to be an assumption about this person. But also for the record, some people ARE in that category. I'm simply stating observation, not passing judgment. If life lets you be in that position then hey, good for you man, you're living the dream. It's not wrong, it's not right, it's just phenomenon.



One key difference that you're missing is that forums do allow for a form of peer review. Granted, it's not guaranteed - you yourself have implied as has another posted in this thread that you have seen wrong information posted and not intervened yourself to post a differing point of view. So, the model is indeed far from perfect. On the flip side, and you said yourself by prefacing "good" before "fish shopkeep", again, the potential is there for it to be a good model, but is hardly guaranteed. Personally, I have had good advice and bad advice from forums, I have had good advice and bad advice from shopkeeps - although some of the WORST advice I was ever given, did come from shopkeeps who were motivated by increasing sales. Heck, I've been outright lied to by people in the industry. .. I think of the case of the "benign dictatorship" model being an effective method to run a country - the downside is that there don't tend to be many (or any) "benign" dictators in the world. Without checks and balances, things get out of hand. So to bring this back to context, what is a person to do to gather information. The best choice, I think, is to inform yourself from as many sources as possible, and in the case that disparate viewpoints are encountered, question and challenge the assumptions.

Not really sure how this veered into "LFS versus internet" territory but there are my thoughts on that. No LFS is perfect, no internet forum is perfect. I can only speak from my own perspective - I don't lie when giving advice. I have no motivation to increase sales so I wouldn't tell someone "Yes go ahead and buy that blue ribbon eel - everything will be great!!" for example. But I don't run a shop nor work in one, so ordinarily nobody would ask me anyhow. But I AM on here, and if I see something that I can offer some advice on, I'll do my best. Anyhow, that's my reason I'm here. :)

cheers

Tony, this is the type of considered response that you're known & respected for, hence my initial surprise at your posts.

Glad it's behind us & we both moved on...

.

[lastlight]

I was gonna yell 'bike racks' but gas is expensive. Glad we ironed it all out the easy way.

[Parker]

Alright, now that's solved.. lets get back on topic, tell me about this camel spanking? :lol:

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Pacific side? Pretty murky water when I was there....

Liberia...so yeah. We'll see. I'm sure I'll just be happy to NOT be in Calgary for a week.

[BC564]

Becareful over there......I know there is a travel advisory. and no....not the snow kind we get here....

[JDigital]

I'm not here to impress or show off.

Nor am I... I just like to share my build with other hobbyists, and learn as much as I can.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

i would not say that we are lucky to have this "wealth of information" for someone that is new to this, the incorrect information on most aquarium forums is more prevalent that it is in the worst of LFS. A good fish shopkeep can give you more useful information than the best web forum, because it is A) filtered and B) they have to answer for the incorrect info.

Huh. How do you figure that advice from most aquarium forums is incorrect more so than the WORST LFS? Wow. "Hey, Canreef community....guess what? You're more ill-informed and useless than the worst employee the worst LFS has to offer."

Awesome. Thanks for that.

And how do you figure that advice from a single LFS source is better? Filtered? What does that mean? Is that code for "only one"? Because the first time I purchased something at a LFS without knowing better was a Regal Tang for a 3-foot 50G aquarium. LFS owner said it was fine. The second (and last) time I did this was with a Goniopora. LFS owner said it would thrive.

Blah blah blah. Whatever. *grumbles and steps down off soapbox*

[Skimmerking]

Man this thread went out the door.

[StirCrazy]

Tony, posts that long mean one thing.. you need another hobby :mrgreen: many I haven't writen that much in one go in a long time:lol:

Steve

[Aquattro]

Becareful over there......I know there is a travel advisory. and no....not the snow kind we get here....

Wrong Liberia :)

[Aquattro]

many I haven't writen that much in one go in a long time:lol:

Steve

Thank gawd!!

[Aquattro]

Huh. How do you figure that advice from most aquarium forums is incorrect more so than the WORST LFS? Wow. "Hey, Canreef community....guess what? You're more ill-informed and useless than the worst employee the worst LFS has to offer."

Awesome. Thanks for that.

And how do you figure that advice from a single LFS source is better? Filtered? What does that mean? Is that code for "only one"? Because the first time I purchased something at a LFS without knowing better was a Regal Tang for a 3-foot 50G aquarium. LFS owner said it was fine. The second (and last) time I did this was with a Goniopora. LFS owner said it would thrive.

Blah blah blah. Whatever. *grumbles and steps down off soapbox*


I'm with you on this one Drew. I would trust the advice of 20 respondants in a thread over a LFS any day.

[Matt]

Huh. How do you figure that advice from most aquarium forums is incorrect more so than the WORST LFS? Wow. "Hey, Canreef community....guess what? You're more ill-informed and useless than the worst employee the worst LFS has to offer."

Awesome. Thanks for that.

And how do you figure that advice from a single LFS source is better? Filtered? What does that mean? Is that code for "only one"? Because the first time I purchased something at a LFS without knowing better was a Regal Tang for a 3-foot 50G aquarium. LFS owner said it was fine. The second (and last) time I did this was with a Goniopora. LFS owner said it would thrive.

Blah blah blah. Whatever. *grumbles and steps down off soapbox*
Yeah... I could write a book on all the bad advice I've gotten from LFS over the years, and add another volume for what I've heard offered to friends. Oh yeah, my family used to own and operate a LFS (fresh) and I now know what kind of bullshit we were slinging in our innocence and ignorance. We weren't trying to deceive, but our sources (aka suppliers) weren't always reliable. And sometimes, what you needed was (surprise!) what I had to move.

A friend was sold 10 fish and about 20 corals for a 1-week-old 46 bowfront, including a gonipora, which "would do just fine in that setup" and a blue sponge which was "super easy to care for".

The best LFS and LFS staff are fantastic. They're not the norm, in my opinion. On the other hand, even the worst advice on a forum gets debated and often debunked.

[AJ_77]

Man this thread went out the door.Yeah, BUT - we got Steve posting, you're back, and even Darren is posting a for-sale thread elsewhere. Some planets have aligned or somethin'...

All we need now is Troy to show up, and we got ourselves a party!
:mrgreen:

[brizzo]

Did someone say camel party? ;)

[Underwater]

waiting for the details on spanking...ummm. Hold on. If a camel is in a desert - watching fish porn...wait...no...If I'm watching a camel - while watching fish porn.....no....it's gotta be your camel while at a party... can fish be spanked?

Never mind-I derailed

[blood_hound]

LOL this thread is getting out-off-hand its allover the place now....

Did this thread started about a 12 footer tank?