I Finally Got Fishys

[Hangfire]

Okay, I finally got a pair of clowns into my tank. The tank is a little over 6 weeks old and everything is going pretty good - a little too much algae, but what the heck. I know I'm probably just being overly concerned but the clowns are not eating. They are swimming well (although they seem to be sticking to one part of the tank), their colour is good, but they aren't eating. I didn't feed them the first night, but the next morning and then tonight. They saw the food (mysis shrim), sort of went after it a little, but didn't eat any of it. Any ideas, or am I just expecting too much too soon. I really want them to do well. Thanks for any help.

[fishytime]

Try a garlic enhancement product... or if that doesnt work, the mysis may be a little big for them, could try brine.

[Hangfire]

Try a garlic enhancement product... or if that doesnt work, the mysis may be a little big for them, could try brine.

Any idea where I can get a garlic enhancement? And is this like a garlic extract -so just a liquid, or something else? I have some brine shimp and krill, so I'll try the brine shrimp. Thanks for the help :biggrin:

[Keri]

If you happen to have fresh garlic you can crush the juice out of that too :)

[naesco]

Any idea where I can get a garlic enhancement? And is this like a garlic extract -so just a liquid, or something else? I have some brine shimp and krill, so I'll try the brine shrimp. Thanks for the help :biggrin:

If you did not quarantine the fish in a QT you should definitely be soaking your food in garlic extract which you can buy at a health food store.

If the fish are new, give them a little food move away and watch them from a distance. They are probably stressed with you present but will get used to you very soon.

[ShrimSkin]

You can get Kent Garlic Extreme at J&L, Ocean Aquatics, probably Big Als, but I would try the first two. And as stated above use a few drops let it soak for a few minutes and back away froom the tank when you place the food in. You may want to try some brine or cyclopeeze. Cyclopeeze is the only food that every fish I have ever owned loved!

Good luck!
ShrimpSkin



Any idea where I can get a garlic enhancement? And is this like a garlic extract -so just a liquid, or something else? I have some brine shimp and krill, so I'll try the brine shrimp. Thanks for the help :biggrin:

[Hangfire]

Thanks for the advice ShrimpSkin. Fed them again this morning, and again they didn't eat. It's obvious that they want to eat, and they are checking the food out, but they appear to be rejecting it. I'll be getting some of that garlic extract today for sure. I hope that helps.

[dsaundry]

Gotta ask...How big are they??...What are you trying to feed them with??
I have mine eating lots but they like Formula 1+2 fish food as well as frozen mysis and brine shrimp...

[Hangfire]

dsaundry - they are a good size. I'd say they are at least two inches long. So far I've tried mysis shrimp, brine shrimp, and krill. The krill seemed to bring the best response, but there was no obvious feeding. I've been staying back from the tank when I feed them - and with the krill I used a turkey baster and waited until one of them was up in the water column before shooting the food into the current. He got excited, but didn't actually eat anything. Of the two, one is quite a bit more active while the other one has found one corner of the tank at the bottom and stays there most of the time. I'm a little worried because I thought I had bought tank raised fish (and I still may have) and so expected them to be familiar with this type of food. I'm hoping this is just new tank stress, and that it will pass quickly.

[naesco]

dsaundry - they are a good size. I'd say they are at least two inches long. So far I've tried mysis shrimp, brine shrimp, and krill. The krill seemed to bring the best response, but there was no obvious feeding. I've been staying back from the tank when I feed them - and with the krill I used a turkey baster and waited until one of them was up in the water column before shooting the food into the current. He got excited, but didn't actually eat anything. Of the two, one is quite a bit more active while the other one has found one corner of the tank at the bottom and stays there most of the time. I'm a little worried because I thought I had bought tank raised fish (and I still may have) and so expected them to be familiar with this type of food. I'm hoping this is just new tank stress, and that it will pass quickly.

Were they eating in the lfs when you bought them?
Never buy any fish unless YOU see it eating.

[Hangfire]

Were they eating in the lfs when you bought them?
Never buy any fish unless YOU see it eating.

Yeah, that's something I'm going to take to heart. I bought some of the garlic and cyclopeeze. I'm hoping that will do the trick.

[WhoPoopWrasse]

All sorts of bells are going off!
What are your water parameters? ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, pH...
Did you quarantine them to make sure they were healthy before putting them into your display tank?
Clowns are usually very good eaters, they could have ich but I'm leaning more towards brooklynella which causes respiratory distress and loss of appetite.

[Hangfire]

All sorts of bells are going off!
What are your water parameters? ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, pH...
Did you quarantine them to make sure they were healthy before putting them into your display tank?
Clowns are usually very good eaters, they could have ich but I'm leaning more towards brooklynella which causes respiratory distress and loss of appetite.

All the parameters were good when the fish went into the tank. I'll check them again tomorrow morning and post the results here. I didn't quarantine them as they are the only fish in the tank at the moment, and I don't have room for a quarantine tank. Am I going to be in for a hard time without one?

Fed them tonight using the garlic and feeding them cyclopeeze. One of them went nuts for the food, and the other one was like "look, stuff is hitting me on the head. . ." I did notice something odd, and now that WhoPoopWrasse mentions sickness I'm worried about it. They appear to sort of do a little dance thing. They arch sideways and jitter quickly. It only lasts a short time, and both are doing it. They also flutter their pectoral fins quickly in little burst from time to time. So, sickness or usual clown behavior? Man, I'm starting to feel like I'm in way over my head and these are my first fish :cry:. Thanks for the help though, and keep it coming, I'm going to need it.

[Hangfire]

Oh crap, now that I go and read about ich I think that might be what it is. I'll post some pictures of the fish and see if anyone can confirm. One of the fish does have a few white spots on it's skin and it was itching it's self on the bottom of the tank. Thanks for pointing that out to me WhoPoopWrasse!

[WhoPoopWrasse]

I don't want to be a party pooper but having a QT is very important since at least 75% of the time the fish you buy WILL have something wrong with them. :cry:

Now that you put possibly sick fish in your new tank, chances are the tank is infected and it will infect any fish you add even if they are healthy.

Some people use the hit and miss method but mostly they are at the LFS every couple of weeks looking for new fish to replace the dead ones.

Your best bet is to get a 10 gallon tank, leave it bare bottom, cycle it and the next fish you get should be QTed for at least 3-4 weeks.:biggrin:

[ShrimSkin]

Well if you have ich and you know for sure, you can take some action. You mentioned one of them ate, that's a good sign. Continue to use the garlic and I would add some Selcon(vitamin additive) to the food. If the fish is eating more than likely it will be just fine. You have to get that other one to eat. If your paramaters are in check you could add a cleaner shrimp and that could help. But to get rid of it 100% you need to treat the fish with Copper which you cannot do in your display if you have liverock. There is a lot of info on ich and how to battle it just search the forums and spned some time reading when you are done you won't feel so over your head.

[Hangfire]

Yeah, there appear to be a few products that can be used in a reef tank that are not too bad for inverts. Would a cleaner shrimp really help with this problem?

[WhoPoopWrasse]

any product that tou can use in your display will either kill your live rock or won't work on the ich. The only thing that works on ich is copper (best if you use Cupramine) or hyposalinity but you can't do either in the display or your rock will die.:cry:
Garlic is good for enticing them to eat but it won't "cure" ich. It will only delay the inevitable.

[ShrimSkin]

My cleaner is always cleaning off my fish, especially my Hippo tang. Will it help? If the shrimp cleans off the fish then yes it will. As stated in above copper is the only cure but you can't use it in the display. In my experience if you use vitamins and the fish is eating it will most likely pull through.

[Hangfire]

So what's the answer then? The display tank is now infected with ich and there's no cure! I can't set up a QT in time to get the fish out and not infect the main tank. I appear to be screwed.

[Monti-Man]

Essentially yes;(

Your main tank is now infected and every fish you get from now on may or may not get infected. But essentially you will always have ick in your tank. Lots of people have managed to get there fish healthy enough to fight it off (including myself)but then in all honesty it is still in the tank and can rear its ugly head when you least expect it and wipe out an entire tank of fish.
So in a perfect world i would get them out and even set up a cheap hospital tank.
All you need is a rubbermaid container,filter and something for flow. Then keep some prime on hand as you have no filter that is seeded. And then do small daily water changes.Keep them in there for 6 weeks in hypo as that is more mellow than copper.
Just do a google search on hypo. Leave your tank empty for the same amout of time and the ick dies off without a host.

In the end you will probably be much happier and then just quarintine all new fish and you will never deal with ick again:)

[ShrimSkin]

Dude you're not screwed you need to relax. You need to do some serious reading, ICH is pretty much in everyones tank, different conditiions lead to a fish getting infected.

If you really want to understand what's going on you need to do some research and you will find everything you need.

Just search this site and google for marine ich. It is a very well documented aquarium disease.

[WhoPoopWrasse]

ICH is pretty much in everyones tank, different conditiions lead to a fish getting infected.

That statement is very inacurate!
You can be completely ich free if you don't introduce it again. By leaving the tank fallow for 8 weeks you will have an ich free tank. Then by QTing all the fish that come in you will be sure nver to have it again.
Ich needs fish to live and reproduce with out them they will just die out.
I've heard some people say that they got an ich outbreak in thier tank cuz the temp went up or down drastically due to equipment failure but that's only because the ich was already there to begin with...

[Hangfire]

. . .you need to relax . . .

Yeah, that's probably true :biggrin:

For those asking about water quality here it is:

Salinity: 1.025
PH: 8.3
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 2-5 (I find this one hard to read - it's not 0, but it's not higher than 5)
Phosphate: ~0.22

I've done some reading on Ich (thanks WhoPoopWrasse) and it appears to be beatable - I just have a crap load of work ahead of me. I'll try and get some pics of the fish today and let you guys and gals see if I really do have Ich or not. The one that rubbed that one time hasn't done so since, and as ShrimSkin pointed out I may have over reacted just a tad :redface:

As always, thanks for the help.

[ShrimSkin]

That statement is very inacurate!
You can be completely ich free if you don't introduce it again. By leaving the tank fallow for 8 weeks you will have an ich free tank. Then by QTing all the fish that come in you will be sure nver to have it again.
Ich needs fish to live and reproduce with out them they will just die out.
I've heard some people say that they got an ich outbreak in thier tank cuz the temp went up or down drastically due to equipment failure but that's only because the ich was already there to begin with...



This is true, I think I said pretty much every tank, so I realize you could have an ICH free tank.

Sorry for the confusion.

[Hangfire]

I'd just like to thank everyone that replied. The fish are eating aggressively now. Everything from the cyclopeeze (thanks for the suggestion ShrimSkin) brine shrimp to mysis shrimp. Also, thanks to fishtime for suggesting the garlic extract. I picked up a bottle at Ocean Aquatics and it's worked wonders. I also believe that they are completely healthy. Both are very active, have good colour, and appear quite happy. They appear to have found a nice little hollow in one of the live rocks and have been cleaning it daily. Thanks again for the help.

[ShrimSkin]

Sweet!