lastlight's 225 [Archive] - Page 2 - Canreef Aquatics Bulletin Board

lastlight

10-21-2009, 09:46 PM

Here I was thinking you guys knew me well enough to know I don't appreciate humour in a build thread :razz:

Hmmm...goodies includes:

- refractometer
- 100ft 1/4" tubing
- few parts,filters and a tds meter to get Snappy's old ro/di performing again

I wanted to get a big bucket of carbon, gfo and the dual reactor (this is all from BRS btw) but I want to get things running with the money my wife greenlighted so not right now!

After that I just need heaters, 2 buckets of salt and a few test kits! Waiting for this order is quite literally going to KILL ME =)

Parker

10-21-2009, 10:01 PM

Now? All of a sudden now you want to get this thing going? :puppydog:

lastlight

10-21-2009, 10:08 PM

How long Are you in Vegas?

Scared yet?

JDigital

10-21-2009, 11:48 PM

:lol:

Parker

10-22-2009, 12:47 AM

How long Are you in Vegas?

Scared yet?

Well I can't go now!

lastlight

10-22-2009, 07:07 AM

Here's a couple pics of what I've been breaking my back on...literally. I have bad knees as well. You guys with fishrooms are onto something!

The pics show the two American DJ power centers I installed and all the gear in place. Ranco, Osmolator, Tunze powerheads and my light timers. The little shelf up top holds the transformers for the powerheads. The white bundled extension cord next to the Ranco is for a chiller if I ever need one (fingers crossed).

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wires1.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wires2.jpg

The return pump and skimmer pump are not tie-wrapped like everything else so I can remove them easily. Hypothetically though, if anything Tunze ever dies on me I'm in for a nightmare of a time removing it lol. All the slack for the powerheads currently hangs behind the tank. I have more than enough length to move them and place them in a bucket of vinegar on the floor without disconnection.

Next up is aquascaping and getting my ro/di up and going once my BRS order arrives in a couple weeks!

Blowfish

10-22-2009, 07:11 AM

man thats a dream setup!!!!!! btw where do you get those slider rails for your doors, im sick of velcroing my doors on and off, how much clearance do you need for those rails?

Delphinus

10-22-2009, 07:14 AM

Looks good. What model are those timers?

lastlight

10-22-2009, 07:22 AM

Thanks guys.

The sliders are just the longest ones I could find at HD. They are 1/2" thick which didn't matter much to me since my doors have the lip on the top so you see no gaps.

The timers are Intermatic. Says they are safe for outdoor use which seemed like a plus to me. $20 each at HD. HB800 series. What appealed to me was that they had a 24" cord on them which meant they could each reach to my power strip.

Parker

10-22-2009, 02:20 PM

I think it looks good the way it is. No need to put water or salt in it, it will just get dirty and ruin the look.

lastlight

10-22-2009, 03:41 PM

I'm so impatient (even after a year and a half or whatever it's been!). I almost dumped the sand into the display to check it out but backed out last second. Told my wife I didn't wanna get in there and lay rocks out in the sand lol.

Voided a few warranties I'm sure doing all this. My light, power strips and osmolator pump all needed their power cables spliced and extended. One other extension I need to do is the osmolator return. I need it to feed into my display overflow because the reservoir is pretty high in the other room. Did a test last night and it siphons into my sump after the pump is shut off.

One other thing I haven't done yet is sort out my overflow. I need something to keep fish from going over. Right now I'm thinking of one of these:

- leave the weir as is (quiet). Just put a strainer on my pipe ends and fish out the odd fish etc that goes in.
- rig something using fishing line stretched tight across the overflow opening. Would not alter flow since it's so thin (quiet) but I'd need to be creative to mount it.

Parker

10-22-2009, 04:20 PM

One other thing I haven't done yet is sort out my overflow. I need something to keep fish from going over. Right now I'm thinking of one of these:

- leave the weir as is (quiet). Just put a strainer on my pipe ends and fish out the odd fish etc that goes in.
- rig something using fishing line stretched tight across the overflow opening. Would not alter flow since it's so thin (quiet) but I'd need to be creative to mount it.

I used eggcrate on mine, but I'm thinking it might be better if the fish entered the overflow instead of possibly getting stuck on top of it and cooking under the lighting or flopping the the wrong way and ending up behind the tank.

TheMikey

10-22-2009, 04:23 PM

- rig something using fishing line stretched tight across the overflow opening. Would not alter flow since it's so thin (quiet) but I'd need to be creative to mount it.

Is it possible for you to get in there with a small drill bit? If possible you could just drill matching holes on either side of the acrylic and tie on your fishing line. It would be easy to snug up horizontally... not sure about if you want to go vertical or not.

Additionally, forgive me if I'm picturing your overflow problem in the wrong idea. Perhaps if you were to post a pic of what you're trying to solve it might give the great minds on the board some visual cues :)

Delphinus

10-22-2009, 04:33 PM

I use gutter guard over the eggcrate on my overflows to keep small fish out of the overflows. Bigger fish it's not a worry. I find my FW tank some fish at first are small enough to still fit through, but it's better than nothing.

Problem with adding stuff water flows through (eggcrate, gutter guard or anything for that matter) is that it becomes a place algae can grow where grazers can't get at it. In my 110g cube I have to pour boiling water over the overflow eggcrate once every 2-3 months or so just to keep them clear.

Parker has a good point, something I sort of learned the hard way with my first eel - sometimes it's better to let them get into the overflow instead of somewhere else. I had had my eel tank locked down so that there was no way he could get into the overflow - so instead he ended up getting out of the tank some other way. Had he just gone into the overflow or sump, it would have been .. possibly less fatal for him. :neutral:

So there could be something to the idea of just putting strainers on the pipes and "just deal with it" when a fish inevitably finds his way in there. FWIW, that is my plan for my 280g - just eggcrate for the overflow, and strainers for the standpipes, and a net nearby. :lol:

lastlight

10-22-2009, 04:37 PM

Here's the only decent shot of the overflow cutout. It's all glass so no drilling.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/tank3.jpg

I'm really liking that idea. My water goes over so smoothly and quietly that I'd hate to disturb that. I think I'll screen the pipes somehow good call guys.

Anyone know if a bulkhead strainer could fit over 1.5" or do I need to prime and glue it?

Delphinus

10-22-2009, 04:44 PM

You can get strainers for 1.5" for sure. The ones I have (got them from BRS, great supply of that sort of thing there) are threaded. Slip would be nicer just so it's easier to get off to clean once in a while. (Don't glue the strainer on.) With threaded sometimes it gets kind of hard to turn to get off.

lastlight

10-22-2009, 05:40 PM

Strange I couldn't find them to purchase on their site. I had looked when I originally got my plumbing from them. My pipes are sch 80 so I hope they'll still slip inside. If not I'll have to rig something but it's way easier than fishing line hehe.

Delphinus

10-22-2009, 05:58 PM

Hmmm yeah now I can't find them either. Maybe I didn't get them there after all. J&L has them for sure: http://www.jlaquatics.com/phpstore/store_pages/product-info.php?product_ID=pl-bhst15

Surely Red Coral has them as well, since they're usually pretty good with obscure plumbing bits like that.

lastlight

10-22-2009, 06:05 PM

Surely Red Coral has them as well

Yeah but chances are I'd run into Doug and he always gets so braggy about his tank. If I get desperate perhaps I'll try that thanks Tony.

mseepman

10-23-2009, 12:02 AM

JDigital

10-23-2009, 12:41 AM

You could think about adding one of these to your overflow.

http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/am-ofcomb/Aqua+Medic+Overflow+Comb.html

Not sure of the details on them but at such a cheap price, you might be able to DIY something with one that will work for you.

IMO, those are worse than eggcrate... I used it on my 10G Nano tank, and was constantly picking algae out of the teeth because they are soo tight it can't flow through, plus they make a bit of noise as the water doesn't flow smoothly and cut back the overflow flow quite a bit.

lastlight

10-23-2009, 01:15 AM

+1 to all that.

I looked into these previously and considering using a few side-by-side but yeah they restrict a lot of flow and make things really noisy.

Another idea I have tossed around is some sort of strip of wood or plastic with maybe 50 pins stuck into it to form teeth. Then dip the whole thing in some epoxy or something. Very strong yet thin teeth to not impede flow and you lift the strip off for cleaning...

GreenSpottedPuffer

10-30-2009, 09:57 PM

:blah:

lastlight

10-30-2009, 10:03 PM

Oh that's it.

ARM WRESTLE NOW AT THE BIKE RACKS!

After me move the racks to the side it's ass-kickin' time.

GreenSpottedPuffer

10-30-2009, 10:16 PM

Oh that's it.

ARM WRESTLE NOW AT THE BIKE RACKS!

After me move the racks to the side it's ass-kickin' time.

Me: :boxing:

You: :faint:

fishytime

10-30-2009, 11:02 PM

I would offer you a solution, but Im to busy bragging about my tank:mrgreen::lol:

Delphinus

10-30-2009, 11:39 PM

Doug your keyboard is broken! It missed an apostrophe and an o there. :lol:

lastlight

10-30-2009, 11:47 PM

I would offer you a solution, but Im to busy bragging about my tank:mrgreen::lol:

Dammit Doug Tony and I are coming down there and tattooing the differences betwen 'to' and 'too' onto your forehead! Wait tho...then you couldn't read it? Maybe we'll just wrestle?

And you finally found that comment? Hahah. Jokes BYE!

BigHammer

10-31-2009, 12:02 AM

beautiful build, love the precision and attention to detail..

just read from start to finish!

lastlight

10-31-2009, 01:30 AM

So my rock arrived today. It's KILLING me having to finish some work work before I can get down to business with these filthy yet SEXY pieces of rock.

Big shelf piece:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock1.jpg

Pop can is on my base rock for my tower. Beside it is my other shelf piece which I think WAS even bigger than the other but two 6" pieces were broken off in my box. Does anyone think it is worth trying to superglue the pieces back onto the rim of the parent piece?

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock2.jpg

Bucket of various boulders:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock3.jpg

Measurements. Both shelf pieces are in this box so my kid doesn't jump on them (I hope!)

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock4.jpg

Measurent of my base rock which the shelves will mount to:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock5.jpg

I wasn't the only one that BRS made happy today!

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rock6.jpg

Dez

10-31-2009, 01:49 AM

You are a lucky man to be able to have all that stuff on the nice kitchen counter and stove... I would get a lickin'!

Now let's get on with putting it together and more pics...

I think I started after you three....and ummm...*cough cough*..

Nuff said :)

Lance

10-31-2009, 01:57 AM

Nice pieces. I love that shelf rock from BRS. A warning though: I believe there may be considerable amounts of phosphates tied up in that rock. When I used it I had an unbelievable outbreak of hair algae.

lastlight

10-31-2009, 02:53 AM

Guys I found a DEAD FISH jammed into the top of one of the shelves haha. Yeah there's gonna be some phosphates! I'm not lighting the tank for at least a month. Just let it run and do weekly water changes.

lastlight

10-31-2009, 03:00 AM

beautiful build, love the precision and attention to detail..

just read from start to finish!

Thanks Hammer. So you also read a hell of a lot of SILLINESS along the way. Thanks for toughing it out we're almost there =)

fishytime

10-31-2009, 03:02 AM

Doug your keyboard is broken! It missed an apostrophe and an o there. :lol:

Dammit Doug Tony and I are coming down there and tattooing the differences betwen 'to' and 'too' onto your forehead! Wait tho...then you couldn't read it? Maybe we'll just wrestle?

And you finally found that comment? Hahah. Jokes BYE!

Cut me some slack....Im still heavily medicated.....Ive never put the apostrophes in:mrgreen: Looks like some massive pieces there....should be fun to work with.

lastlight

10-31-2009, 03:04 AM

The rock's DIRTY stuff. My plan is to assemble the structures in the empty tank. Should I fill/drain the tank with cheap tapwater a few times after I'm done to get rid of a BIT of the crap/phosphates in the rock and then do ro/di? I know tapwater has phosphates etc but wouldn't this at least work like diffusion? Rock must have way more an some would leech out...

fishytime

10-31-2009, 03:31 AM

You could pressure wash it?

lastlight

10-31-2009, 03:35 AM

Is the crap on the outside (which washing would help knock off) my biggest concern or is it what's inside the rocks? I was thinking of at least scrubbing each rock in the sink before I used it...

Delphinus

10-31-2009, 03:38 AM

If it were me ... I'd just give the stuff a hosing and deal with it. Especially since the plan is to run a little while still without livestock .. just let it diffuse and cycle out.

Those pieces are massive!! Should be great to see the final 'scape.

Dez, you really need to get that cough checked out! LOL!

lastlight

10-31-2009, 03:47 AM

Tony layoff Dez. He's about buying coral and has no time for this crap LOL!

Yeah I'm giving each rock the ole rub'n'tizzug in the sink and putting the puzzle together. I am takin' it slow and will try and keep the lights OFF but I imagine I'll be sitting in front of the tank even with my dead rock in it.

Lance

10-31-2009, 04:06 AM

Hurry up and get the DAMN rock in the tank! I can't wait to see those big shelves. Any idea yet how the 'scaping is going to be? A couple of big towers?

lastlight

10-31-2009, 04:19 AM

The left will be a really big tower I think with most of my shelf pieces. Maybe all of them. Then open sand maybe. Then on the right will be the two pieces I've had laying in there for some time. Tho I may build them up a bit. But much more open on the right side...

Of course when I start getting dirty who knows what I'll decide. I change my mind every 10 minutes.

Lance

10-31-2009, 04:37 AM

Ha Ha I know what you mean. The end result of my scape wasn't anything like the way I had it pictured in my head. I liked the way it turned out though. (after 3 hours of.........move this rock here, no here. Yes, no, maybe.)

lastlight

10-31-2009, 04:42 AM

Is your rock on egg-crate Lance?

Dez

10-31-2009, 05:52 AM

You know what Brett.... I had all these hopes and dreams of using rods and stuff to put my rock together. I also thought about building a pvc frame....

But in the end I got too anxious and didn't want the hassle of trying to hide the pvc or glue rock together - plus I was dealing with live rock, not dry rock...

Soooo, what I'm suggesting is to .... um, just put the rock in there and get some life in it....

No, actually I really appreciate your patience and attention to detail in this build. There better be stuff in there at Christmas cause I'm always in Calgary every year at Christmas...wink wink, nudge nudge..

lastlight

10-31-2009, 06:03 AM

I'm desperately trying to wrap up some work here with a Sunday deadline. The rock is in my office behind me. Like 4 feet away and I can smell it's sweet and gut-wrenching stench. It's in my nature to start washing rock NOW but I can't until I finish.

So why am I on canreef? Hey now...I'll ask the questions here!

If I wrap up tonight on work...I'll have the rocks in the tank by Monday. Nightowls get'er DONE (when their wives sleep and can't stop'em!)

Delphinus

10-31-2009, 07:14 AM

I was NOT laying on Dez ! Geez, you make it sound so dirty. *LOL!* I promise I will lay off Dez and everyone for that matter. Oh no wait, crud, that sounds even worse. :neutral: No pink slips!

Ok, hmmm, I think I might actually be sillied out for the moment. Strangely enough I have a Sunday deadline too (dog gone TOTM's, people want them out at the start of the month). And it's DST weekend on the first of the month. It's .. pretty much a perfect storm this weekend. Good luck with your work, good luck with your rock.

lastlight

10-31-2009, 07:18 AM

Always good to have a fellow night-owl around. Plus you're dirty. That last bit of nonsense was LMAO. Might be my fatigue setting in. Wife had her gallbladder out last week so I've been doing EVERYTHING at home and then my own work after everyone goes to bed. Yet I'll find the energy to aquascape.

DIET PEPSI for life =)

kien

10-31-2009, 07:38 AM

This thread is getting intense on so many levels.. :-)

lastlight

10-31-2009, 07:50 AM

Lol. You just wanna arm wrestle man. Shouldn't you be in bed?

kien

10-31-2009, 07:54 AM

Trust me you don't want to arm wrestle me, just ask tony!

I am in bed :-)

lastlight

10-31-2009, 07:59 AM

LMFAO. Ok you're very right. Why the hell does Tony know you're in bed?

kien

10-31-2009, 08:12 AM

That's not for you to know :-)

lastlight

10-31-2009, 08:16 AM

It's a known fact that Reef Central contains roughly 5% of the silliness we're accustomed to here. Canreef just feels like home.

Skimmerking

10-31-2009, 01:26 PM

Brett what did that rock cost you, looks pretty good.

Lance

10-31-2009, 05:02 PM

Is your rock on egg-crate Lance?

Nope.

lastlight

11-01-2009, 08:22 AM

My back is ON FIRE.

Built everything in about 8 hours. The tower on the left is held together with 1/2" pvc and the middle one is a lot of zip-ties. You'll notice I tossed reef epoxy over zip-ties since I hate how they look. Also the lower shelf on the right tower is actually 2 pieces that broke off the top shelf piece in the left tower during shipping. I zipped it back together...almost as good as new! Tomorrow I get the ro/di up and running.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape1.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape2.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape3.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape4.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape5.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape6.jpg

Dez

11-01-2009, 01:45 PM

Those pictures were well worth the wait for me..... Can't wait till your corals grow man. It's going to look stunning? I can't remember, are you going mixed reef? Or Sps?

Snappy

11-01-2009, 02:01 PM

Nice job.:biggrin:

JDigital

11-01-2009, 02:12 PM

Wow.. that rockwork looks awesome!!! :mrgreen:

Nice job!

Lance

11-01-2009, 02:25 PM

Ooooooooh! That looks great! Good job. Those big, heavy pieces aren't easy to work with are they?

fishytime

11-01-2009, 02:51 PM

Looking good there Brett.....are you still gonna pick up a few pieces of LR to seed the tank?

Tony better be ready to receive the full brunt of our harassment when you finally fill this sexy thing up.:biggrin:

Delphinus

11-01-2009, 03:58 PM

When *I* fill Brett's tank? That makes no sense at all Doug, your keyboard is really in need of replacement. Now it's shifting objective focus mid-sentence and not just randomly dropping characters!

fishytime

11-01-2009, 04:11 PM

When *I* fill Brett's tank? That makes no sense at all Doug, your keyboard is really in need of replacement. Now it's shifting objective focus mid-sentence and not just randomly dropping characters!

Makes sense in my mind when I read it:lol:

kien

11-01-2009, 06:34 PM

Very nice! This reveal was definitely not disappointing. Although, this is just the beginning. You still have that empty canvas to paint :-D

lastlight

11-02-2009, 07:32 AM

Thanks guys.

Bit of a setback tonight but not too bad. I got Greg's old ro/di unit up and running but realized the di gasket was cracked and no good and the di cartridge that he also gave me was not re-fillable. I'd hav ordered one if i'd known.

My tds meter says the ro membrane is putting out 0-1 tds so i am going ahead and filling the tank without the di working for now. I quickly tested the incoming calgary water with the same inline probe and it was 280 so I think it's working...

I can't remember, are you going mixed reef? Or Sps?

Yes I plan to have all the less light hungry stuff under the shelves.

Ooooooooh! That looks great! Good job. Those big, heavy pieces aren't easy to work with are they?

As I was leaning over into the tank and lowering some of these I had flashbacks to when I dropped a rock in my much smaller cichlid tank back in the day and blew the bottom out on it. 3rd floor of an appt too!

are you still gonna pick up a few pieces of LR to seed the tank?

Definitely will be needing a few seed pieces. I'll see you soon! Should I let the tank run with saltwater for a while before tossing the seed rock in or can I do that asap? After my tank is nice and pod-infested etc I will sell the rock since I have no plans to add to my current layout.

Delphinus

11-02-2009, 04:28 PM

You can always keep the extra rock in the sump.

Also, I think you can add the extra rock pretty much anytime.

lastlight

11-02-2009, 04:32 PM

Thanks Tony.

I have one large and one small piece in my 10 gallon fuge and the rest of the space is for chaeto. I really have no room in the sump for any rock unless I pile it above my heaters which are laying in my small return compartment.

Actually they might solve my microbubble problem without me adding a sponge guard like I was going to try. Only issue is that is a small space and my topoff area is small as it is. Tossing rock in it will mean a day's evaporation will really knock it down (if my ATO ever failed).

Good news about the live rock! I'll grab a few pieces as soon as my salt has circulated a day.

Delphinus

11-02-2009, 04:37 PM

Oh - yeah - nix the sponge idea (IMO...)

lastlight

11-02-2009, 04:48 PM

I'll feel better too about ordering all that rock. I kicked myself when I had the aquascape done and had *really* only used the shelf pieces and maybe 3 or 4 more small boulders lol.

dsaundry

11-02-2009, 05:03 PM

Had some time to kill at work today and found your build thread...very impressive. I am currently planning a teardown and rebuild on an in-wall with a fish room behind it. I have a question for you, knowing what you have done to date, is there anything you would change in your build procedure? I am just in the drawing stages for my fish room and always looking for what people that have gone through builds would do different if anything.

lastlight

11-02-2009, 05:48 PM

Can't let my wife see this:

- starphire on three sides
- black tinted glass for back pane (avoid overfow area being different color)
- wider external overflow
- 8 feet long rather than 6
- lower stand 6 inches and make tank 30" tall
- Tile up the bottom 6" of glass though so the floor of the tank dissapears
- have sumps etc built for me to increase safety
- find way to eliminate center post in stand

dsaundry

11-03-2009, 03:00 AM

Can't let my wife see this:

I wonder what my wife will say when I start cutting the hole in the wall for the tank, probably not much, but I will be ducking a lot and sleeping with my eyes open....:lol:

lastlight

11-03-2009, 05:03 AM

Ok hopefully everyone's browser will support the network cam I installed. You should see my webcam right in the thread below this text.

If you watch long enough you can see the ro/di level go up it's the AWESOME! You guys watch and tell me what you think.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/cam.jpg

Delphinus

11-03-2009, 05:07 AM

banditpowdercoat

11-03-2009, 05:18 AM

Nope, your Ro's busted LOL

lastlight

11-03-2009, 05:39 AM

Oh the excitement!

Going with a sandbed eh? I gotta say I don't blame you. I understand the betterness of no sandbed but man I can't get wrap my head around the look, it just looks better with sand. At least when it's all nice and clean anyhow.. :p

Yeah my first tank was BB and I hate the look. I'll do whatever it takes to keep sand. Going to get an eheim sludge extractor for vacuuming.

Nope, your Ro's busted LOL

Dude be patient. You gotta stare at the phot...at the live cam shot for long enough to see any change =)

Veng68

11-03-2009, 05:41 AM

Yeah my first tank was BB and I hate the look. I'll do whatever it takes to keep sand. Going to get an eheim sludge extractor for vacuuming.

Dude be patient. You gotta stare at the phot...at the live cam shot for long enough to see any change =)

Any idea were to get one of those sludge extractors?

Cheers,
Vic

lastlight

11-03-2009, 05:49 AM

No idea actually. I was going to look more seriously when I have things running. Trying not to abuse my wife's kindness too much...prioritizing my purchases lol.

Ok...quick search show big als sells them. If any vendors reading this can get them in please drop a note here.

Ok #2...I read the description there and it says not designed for use with sand. what gives?

Delphinus

11-03-2009, 06:37 AM

Ahhhh hahahahahahaha!! Stellar.

Actually those things remind me a little of a gravel vaccuum I used to clean my brother's 10g fish tank ... in 1977. (I was a lucky kid brother, getting to clean the poop out of that poor goldfish's home. I think he lived around 10 years and ate one of our cats until we finally gave him away to a vet's office where he promptly ate the receptionist. They haven't spoken to us since. The goldfish not my brother. I might be embellishing a little. About my brother that is, not the goldfish. That thing was a monster!) So anyhow, the idea isn't new but you don't see these things a lot so it kinda makes me wonder if they're not really the shizzle OR or the nizzle.

The nicest tank I ever saw with sand was something out of Holland and the guy was all Mr. Moneybags (well, in Dutch though, so it was probably more like Der Hoogen Guilderbaggen {with a heavy phlegmy accentuation on the Hoog, the Guild {pronounced HEELD}} .. ah crap, my tangential meter if off the chart - apparently I'm off topic. What I was trying to say was, the guy budgeted to replace his sand every 6 or 12 months or something like that.

I found since adding a tigertail, and a bunch of conchs though I've always had a more or less clean sandbed without replacement. But I've had to cleverly direct flow away from the bottom because it stirs up too much. One of the reasons I might stick with BB with my next tank is because of this, but, we'll see. Once I have rock in there I might have a change of heart.

lastlight

11-03-2009, 06:46 AM

Tony I'm Dutch so watch your step sir.

Poking around on RC it seems they can suck quite a bit of crap out of sand as well but the finer particles will get sucked in and the finer detritus will not be removed. I think one of those gobies will do the work for me along with some regular poking of the sand with a baster or something.

Delphinus

11-03-2009, 06:49 AM

I'm Dutch too, so there. You haven't lived until you've heard HOT FOR DOMMUH, ROT KEEND, NOO DING ALL KAPOT.

kien

11-03-2009, 06:12 PM

. Once I have rock in there I might have a change of heart.

That's what happend to me. I was all, "clean BB tank, here i come!", until I actually saw all that bare bottom. The rocks looked weird without the sand. Someone on canreef said it best.. the ocean isn't BB.. hehe. But this is all just personal preference, like boxers or briefs. There's not right or wrong answer ( I don't think ).

I think one of those gobies will do the work for me along with some regular poking of the sand with a baster or something.

They do the work alright.. just don't get the type of goby that takes in gobs of sand, then hauls it into the water column and spits a trail of it out from one end of the tank to the other :twised:

Anyway, with careful powerhead direction you can avoid hitting the sandbed and blasting it. This is another reason why I like the tunze 6105 vs an MP40. The MP40 has such a wide wave that it would surely hit my sand bottom, especially since my tank is only 20" tall. I think the mp40 has an 18" diameter flow or something like that. With being able to direct the flow I can blast a narrowish stream down each side of my 6' tank, have it hit the other end of the tank and flow back through the centre of the tank without touching the sandbed. It actually works out quite well for me. 6800+gph and no sandstorms.

JDigital

11-03-2009, 06:33 PM

Anyway, with careful powerhead direction you can avoid hitting the sandbed and blasting it. This is another reason why I like the tunze 6105 vs an MP40. The MP40 has such a wide wave that it would surely hit my sand bottom, especially since my tank is only 20" tall. I think the mp40 has an 18" diameter flow or something like that. With being able to direct the flow I can blast a narrowish stream down each side of my 6' tank, have it hit the other end of the tank and flow back through the centre of the tank without touching the sandbed. It actually works out quite well for me. 6800+gph and no sandstorms.

That's the first time I have heard that arguement regarding tunze vs mp40... I've got a mp20 running 100% on Reef crest, 6" above my sand bed (in a 24x24x12 tank), and it doesn't stir up a single grain of sand...

kien

11-03-2009, 06:58 PM

That's the first time I have heard that arguement regarding tunze vs mp40... I've got a mp20 running 100% on Reef crest, 6" above my sand bed (in a 24x24x12 tank), and it doesn't stir up a single grain of sand...

I was just speculating as I have never owned an MP40. Just saw pics one of that was put too close to the sandbed once. The Mp40 is more powerful than the 20 isn't it? I wonder how close you could put that puppy to the sandbed. It would be really nice to have both and try them both out. I don't know too many people who have/had both though.. They are so expensive, you typically either have one or the other and you love them because they are so damn expensive! :-)

JDigital

11-03-2009, 07:07 PM

I was just speculating as I have never owned an MP40. Just saw pics one of that was put too close to the sandbed once. The Mp40 is more powerful than the 20 isn't it? I wonder how close you could put that puppy to the sandbed. It would be really nice to have both and try them both out. I don't know too many people who have/had both though.. They are so expensive, you typically either have one or the other and you love them because they are so damn expensive! :-)

Obviously a mp40 would be too much in a tank the size of my cube, but at only 6" off the sand with the mp20 (2000gph), I think its a good indication of what an mp40 would be like even 10-12 inches high... If it was an issue, you'd probably see alot more people complaining, rather than praising! :lol:

Delphinus

11-03-2009, 07:17 PM

Well, luckily both Tunzes and Vortechs are cheap like borscht so it's easy to just buy both and try each, and just keep the one you like better, and just toss the other one in the recycling can! :lol:

(... Well, that's the way it would be if *I* were king of the universe..)

lastlight

11-03-2009, 09:38 PM

Yeah I don't see the 6100s up in the rear corners as being a problem with the sand at all since everyone has those right there. It's the 6101 I have near the bottom rear that I might need to re-position.

Tank's half full. My flow test won't be for a bit yet! This wait is WORSE than the previous 1.5 yrs

lastlight

11-05-2009, 06:40 AM

Water is maybe a few mm from spilling into my overflow box. Damn this is brutal haha. Have all 3 Tunze on and yeah the sand certainly gets blasted bad in a few spots. Have to wait and see if that bacterial coating on the grains thing helps me any.

Snappy

11-05-2009, 07:12 AM

I was just speculating as I have never owned an MP40. Just saw pics one of that was put too close to the sandbed once. The Mp40 is more powerful than the 20 isn't it? I wonder how close you could put that puppy to the sandbed. It would be really nice to have both and try them both out. I don't know too many people who have/had both though.. They are so expensive, you typically either have one or the other and you love them because they are so damn expensive! :-)
I have both Vortech MP40w's & Tunze's in my reef.
Have all 3 Tunze on and yeah the sand certainly gets blasted bad in a few spots. Have to wait and see if that bacterial coating on the grains thing helps me any.
I place rubble in the high flow areas where the sand gets blown away, works well and in my opinion looks quite natural.

JDigital

11-05-2009, 07:12 AM

fishytime

11-05-2009, 01:28 PM

Im also running both (mp40 and two tunze 6055s)...the combo has turned the tank into a 50/50 split of bare bottom up front and sand at the back....I like both powerheads for what each has to offer....vortech for wide flow pattern and shear power....tunzes for their point-ability

goby1

11-05-2009, 01:59 PM

Very interesting and entertaining read. Congratulations on your tank Brett, it looks really great.

lastlight

11-06-2009, 08:11 AM

The dust settles. Lastlight for the win! Be a while till the salt settles though!

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/salt1.jpg

I bought this over a year ago. It's a relief to say that so far this thing appears to foam like a BEAST.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/salt2.jpg

fishytime

11-06-2009, 01:06 PM

mmmmmm BK:lol:

Delphinus

11-06-2009, 02:21 PM

Haha, that's a long time to wait to try out a skimmer. That must have been a nice itch to scratch.

Lance

11-06-2009, 05:29 PM

[QUOTE=lastlight;461464]

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/salt1.jpg

And on the 2nd Day (or was it the 1st or 3rd day?) God said: "Let there be water."

Whoo Hooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :Banane10:

Lance

11-06-2009, 05:31 PM

Nice skimmer.
You have nothing to skim though so you better pee in the tank and get that bad boy working.

lastlight

11-06-2009, 05:37 PM

Actually I was skimming wet last night and it has already pulled out a full cup with lots of solids and a light tea color! The rock definitely has a boatload of crap in it and it's now my mission to clean it up! I still am AMAZED at how much foam this skimmer pulls. It's so luxurious I wanna lather myself up for a shave haha.

I'm treating the wife to dinner up north today. Red coral happens to be close by as well. Might have to pickup my live rock lol.

karazy

11-07-2009, 12:36 AM

I'm treating the wife to dinner up north today. Red coral happens to be close by as well. Might have to pickup my live rock lol.

that'll be a great way to end a date night. the smell of liverock :lol:

Delphinus

11-07-2009, 12:38 AM

It's so luxurious I wanna lather myself up for a shave haha.

Ask Lance to borrow his compressor..

muck

11-07-2009, 02:08 AM

ask lance to borrow his compressor..

bwahahahaha

lastlight

11-07-2009, 02:18 AM

Lmao. Man that made me snort!

Lance

11-07-2009, 04:34 AM

:redface:

lastlight

11-07-2009, 06:00 AM

Picked up a very small amount of live rock and some chaeto. I'm going to let patience do the rest I guess. Skimmer continues to pull some fairly funky water out of the system.

I'm trying my best to not run the lights but already I'm sitting in front of the tank dreaming lol...

banditpowdercoat

11-07-2009, 06:51 AM

LOL Lights out sux

Carmen

11-07-2009, 02:12 PM

Looking awesome Brett! Nice to see the salt water in there! This will be one incredible SW tank! Very excited to see what you do with it! Very nice!:mrgreen:

JDigital

11-08-2009, 07:01 AM

How much does the waiting time suck? :lol:

How long you leaving the lights off for?

lastlight

11-08-2009, 12:50 PM

Haha. I meant my thread about whether I should feed the pods in my fuge at this point but thanks for the input lol...

But to answer your questions it a) sucks hard and b) lights off for a month I'm guessing but we'll see what the test kits tell me. Ammonia is STILL under 0.25 so maybe this rock wasn't that grungy?

Parker

11-08-2009, 07:46 PM

Looks good Brett!!

lastlight

11-09-2009, 03:59 PM

I asked the kids yesterday who wanted to clean the skimmer cup. My bad.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/fight.jpg

JDigital

11-09-2009, 08:10 PM

Teddy bear looks like your best bet... :razz:

Leah

11-10-2009, 01:02 AM

Adorable kids, I would be wanting to clean it now rather than later :biggrin:
Unless you have it all stocked and are going to suprise us with photo's!

lastlight

11-11-2009, 05:11 AM

I'm bored waiting for my bacteria to get it on. Here's some quick and dirty pics:

Fuge with some rock and live rubble. My pods are growing in numbers. You can see my heaters and a bunch of rock tossed in the return area of the sump. Keeps the display nearly bubble free.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored1.jpg

Skimmer right after I cleaned it. Already has a bit of stinky water in the cup. I'm excited to see what this thing can do with a bioload. Far left is my 20 gallon reservoir I empty to do water changes. Filter sock on my herbie is already pretty dirty.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored2.jpg

I'm a nerd. So what!

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored3.jpg

FTS showing the 2 pieces of seed rock in the display. One on each shelf/tower.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored4.jpg

Glow off the rocks makes the water appear cloudy but it's quite clear right now.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored5.jpg

Left side of my water-change cabinet.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored6.jpg

Hard to get a decent shot in the top ro/di reservoir. I extended a 90 out from my emergency overflow bulkhead and then glued my float valve to it. Osmolator pump in there too. It's neat working in my office (same room) and hearing that little pump kick on knowing it's taking care of my system.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/bored7.jpg

Delphinus

11-11-2009, 11:59 AM

Nice photos! You have an amazing eye for aethestic details. I know you were all trying to sound manly before and not know a thing about the pheasant balls but I no longer believe you. Those things are totally yours aren't they, not your wife's! If nerddom doesn't work out for you you could consider a career in interior design, reef style. No seriously, the way you make an empty tank photograph so nice is quite frankly .. kind of disgusting, and I'm thinking I should just hire you to take every picture I want to post of my own stuff from now on.. I bet I can't afford you though now that you're all famous and stuff.

Leah

11-11-2009, 12:42 PM

I really like how you have hung your light that is very classy. Where did you get the idea? You must have a ton of patience.....this will be an amazing tank.

Myka

11-11-2009, 01:42 PM

Holy crap, that's quite the system you have going there now. I wish I had wiring skillz like that!!

I totally LOL'd when I read Tony's reply. Too funny.

cprowler

11-11-2009, 02:13 PM

Outstanding setup! You do very nice work.

Looking forward to watching you stock it.

banditpowdercoat

11-11-2009, 02:46 PM

Lance

11-11-2009, 04:45 PM

Everything's so new, and clean, and shiny, and organized, and well-planned, and artistic. I'm thinking you should drain the water out and leave it as is: corals and fish would just ruin it. :mrgreen:

lastlight

11-11-2009, 10:47 PM

Tony you're makin' me blush dangit! I'm no photographer I just mostly point and shoot lol. Thanks for the comments guys.

A question for you guys:

How long does it take for me to see an ammonia spike? Since I've had the thing running I measure around 0.25 and it's held steady. Although the smell in the house has risen a lot today. So much so that I turned the house ventilation on for a few hours. Maybe tonight It will have risen. I was starting to think my rock was pretty clean but now the stink and my skimmate has darkened...

What sort of peak can I expect? The kit maxes at ">2".

Myka

11-12-2009, 01:54 AM

Be sure to do water changes to keep ammonia down to prevent the ammonia from killing the life on and in the rock. I think my tanks all seem to peak ammonia at about day 10 or so...? Been awhile since I cycled a tank with uncured rock though.

lastlight

11-12-2009, 02:36 AM

Just tested again (Salifert) and it's simply a milky white colour. Which means it's still less than 0.25 as the actual scale moves from colourless to shades of yellow. I see no yellow at all so far.

Planning a waterchange on my one week anniversary. Skimmate is getting nastier looking daily.

Thanks.

EDIT: Guess miracles *don't* happen. I'm topping my freshwater reservoir up right now and indeed without the DI I'm getting a reading of 4. Which actually makes me happy because zero seemed unreasonable to me before and I questioned the meter. Also when I fired up the unit It read about 170 and dropped to 4 in about 30 seconds. So TDS creep is also real I'll have to run that water elsewhere for 30 seconds in the future with a diverter valve.

lastlight

11-12-2009, 04:14 PM

The plot thickens:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/breakin.jpg

shrimpchips

11-12-2009, 07:21 PM

Mmmmm soup!!

I think water and rock ruined your build. Looked so much nicer empty :p

Thanks for documenting everything so well, this build definitely serves as an inspiration :)

lobsterboy

11-12-2009, 08:45 PM

hey Brett

your tank and set up is all so professional, very very well done. :thumb:

i hope my new system will be like this.

cant wait to see some live stock in there.

Myka

11-13-2009, 01:15 AM

Also when I fired up the unit It read about 170 and dropped to 4 in about 30 seconds.

That's pretty typical. I always let a few hundred mL go through the system before catching the water.

lastlight

11-13-2009, 01:23 AM

Thanks guys.

Yeah I'll do that next time for sure. After setting up my first water-change today I think I may need to rework how my system works a bit for ease of use etc but for now it'll do.

And last night after I let the unit run even longer it DID drop finally to zero again.

lastlight

11-15-2009, 07:37 AM

So already I can't keep my hands out of the tank. I'm cursed like everyone else of course. The longer I look at my aquascape the more concerned I was.

1. not enough interesting places for small fish to swim or hide. Not enough rock on display.
2. Lots of nice shelves to place corals on but not enough smaller piles for coral, not enough caves and not enough cracks to swim through.
3. No depth as both towers viewed from the side basically lined up.
4. Kien's underwater video raised the aquascape bar way too high for comfort.

Here is the old FTS:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape1.jpg

Two slightly different angles of the new FTS. Notice I rotated the entire middle tower so that from the front you see just how interesting it is. Originally I had the neat profile facing the end of the tank.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped1.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped5.jpg

Old FTS viewed more from above:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/aquascape6.jpg

This shows perfectly why I am happy I made the change. It's more dynamic, interesting and the swim-through cave on the right end is pretty cool.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped2.jpg

Few more random looks:

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped3.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped4.jpg

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/rescaped6.jpg

lastlight

11-15-2009, 07:44 AM

Besides changing my rockwork I also did my first water change. It was easy. Flipped a switch and turned a couple valves. Hardest part was waiting for the small Eheim to top the 24 gallons back into the stand from my office. I didn't mix my new water with a heater. The awesome part about the way I have the water change tank circulating pretty slowly in the system is that the Ranco detected no temperature change at all as the slightly cooler water worked it's way in.

Ammonia still reads less than 0.25. Water prior to messing with my rock was very clear. Skimmate keeps getting darker. I drain about 2 inches from my cup each day. My ball of chaeto is about 6 times it's initial size. Pods are really growing in numbers and a film of algae is forming in the fuge.

As for flow...well my sand in both the front and back will not stay put. For now I have dialed the power of each 6100 to minimum and replaced the 24V jumper in the 6101 with the 15V. All pumps are running much slower and my 7095 is only ramping from 30-40%. It's still got good circulation for now and I will adjust as time goes on.

I also hack-sawed out the old fuge drain and put a proper T fitting rather than an elbow on the bulkhead. Let's me get a bit more flow through the bulkhead and skim the fuge rather than have the bulkhead fully submerged. Cutting pipe in that stand took me over an hour. 2 cuts and careful placement of garbage bags to keep pvc shred out of the water. The new plumbing is much quieter. No more splashes can be heard with the doors shut. It's all motor whir now (Dart).

TheMikey

11-15-2009, 03:30 PM

Love the new aquascape. I thought the original setup was okay - the shelves were very unique - however the new look blows it away. Well done :)

Delphinus

11-15-2009, 03:44 PM

A considerable improvement on the 'scaping. Good work! I'm a big fan of swim through's, caves and ravines. So while I hated your old look your new look is awesome. Ooops, I mean, your old look was fine. :p

What are you using to test ammonia? I would almost just throw that test kit right out. Don't bother testing ammonia, test nitrite. When you get a zero nitrite reading, your initial cycle is done and your ammonia is zero. I've noticed with a lot of ammonia test kits that I'd get a nominal nonzero reading anytime I tried it, unless it was a FW tank. I don't trust ammonia testkits (even ones that say SW) at all.

lastlight

11-15-2009, 04:13 PM

Thanks guys. I think I have the same issue with aquascaping I do with graphic design. I can work on it till I'm blue in the face and convince myself it's awesome. The real test comes when I wake up and look at it in the morning. I woke up today and dig it hard. Thank god...I'm done mucking about with rocks!

Tony the test kit is Salifert as are all the kits I purchased. If RC had nitrite trust me I would have bought it. I'm going to track down one today and see what that tells me thanks.

Lance

11-15-2009, 04:16 PM

:thumb::thumb: Aaaaaah! Much better Brett.

xtreme

11-15-2009, 04:27 PM

I agree with the other guys, the new 'scape looks awesome.

I have a salifert NO2 test kit that I don't really have a use for anymore, its yours if you want it. Best before date on it is 10/09 though, not sure if a couple weeks past would make much of a difference?

lastlight

11-15-2009, 04:56 PM

Dammit guys. If you didn't dig the old rocks you should have told me! The rocks tricked me into thinking they were done prematurely =)

Thanks xtreme you have pm!

Delphinus

11-15-2009, 05:29 PM

They weren't BAD before, they just had an Ikea Bükjelv sort of look to them. Now they have a "Brêt's Bjæd Æss Rjockwerk" (say it out loud if I'm being too obtuse)

lastlight

11-15-2009, 05:35 PM

Haha thanks man. But dude...just how hard HAVE you been coding?:razz:

TheMikey

11-15-2009, 05:38 PM

I dunno. It's a bit facetious, I think, to come out and tell someone that the aquascape looks bad. I don't think there's much 'scapes out there that are bad, just some people have different tastes :p

Besides, we've all been following this build so long that we wanted to love your aquascape. Kinda like when you finished watching Star Wars: Phantom Menace the first time and trying to convince yourself you loved it for the sheer fact that it was Star Wars. It's hard to admit that it wasn't very good...

I was also expecting you to wave your magic wand and make it look incredible - like everything else you've done in this build. And look! You did!

In summary: new aquascape rocks! now, delete those old pictures and let us never speak of it again >>

lastlight

11-15-2009, 05:46 PM

If my rocks in any way draw parallels to Jar Jar...well there's gonna be fisticuffs haha. I think you're right we best never speak of this again lol.

I think the problem is we try and make our tanks look good before there is coral in them. A real reef is often a pretty boring boulder or two underneath all the splendor isn't it?

Skimmerking

11-15-2009, 05:50 PM

more rock

lastlight

11-15-2009, 06:50 PM

That's what I'll tell my dealer. I'll keep you posted haha.

You just have no idea what to say when you've got no place for a 'MORE PICS' do you? No shortage of those in this thread cowboy.

JDigital

11-15-2009, 06:59 PM

I like both scapes about the same. The first one purely because of the open sand bed/swimming room. The second one because it gives the tank a more filled out look/caves/hiding spots. I think the 2nd one will work best for optimum coral placement though.

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-15-2009, 07:09 PM

I think the problem is we try and make our tanks look good before there is coral in them. A real reef is often a pretty boring boulder or two underneath all the splendor isn't it?

Exactly! Rockwork doesn't matter much long term in my opinion. Its more about the layout (ie. islands, rockwall, ect.) but in time, its all about the CORALSCAPE to get the look you want. I don't think as many people are good with placing corals as doing their rockwork. Getting a good aesthetic balance with coral shapes, sizes, ect. is much harder. Especially when going for the Japanese garden style or less is more look. Tanks jam packed with huge colonies always look impressive for the talent it has taken to grow and keep those corals alive but in my opinion have little to no real visual interest...but I work with design all day long and that's pretty much all I look for now lol.

Did you ever see Leonardo's Formosa Forest rockwork? :smile: That became such a "famous" and beautiful tank but if you look at the initial rockswork, you wouldn't think much of the tank.

But I agree with the rest that the second is a better layout.

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-15-2009, 07:14 PM

That's what I'll tell my dealer. I'll keep you posted haha.

You just have no idea what to say when you've got no place for a 'MORE PICS' do you? No shortage of those in this thread cowboy.

Nicely said chief.

Delphinus

11-15-2009, 08:53 PM

Ani! Ani! Mesa lika new rock! Allsa so sparkly glowy!!! Oooh! Ahhhh!!!

:lol:

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-15-2009, 09:51 PM

:laluot_06:

lastlight

11-16-2009, 01:00 AM

Haha. Tony's been a little TOO close to some bad diapers today.

So I went out and picked up the Elos nitrite. What a JOKE.

For starters it comes with a 5mL syringe. I fill it twice carefully and put it in the 10 mL glass vial. The water was like 3mL over the 10 mL mark on the vial if you trusted those markings. Then I go to put the included stopper into the vial. It's way too big. Doubt it's even the right one so I used my thumb.

Honestly if I pay a premium I want to feel GOOD about it.

Good news is the test actually did something. It appears that my 'trites are at around 0.35 (middle of two pink bands). Now I have something to measure and watch fall to 0. Woohoo.

Was I supposed to like...add a dead shrimp or anything? I sort of thought the dry rock would have plenty of crap in it to feed bacteria. Anyone?

TheMikey

11-16-2009, 01:08 AM

If you're using dry rock alone, I was under the assumption that all the goodies that trigger a cycle are dead and long gone. That you have to season your tank with something. Maybe someone can spare you a little chunk of live rock? Additionally you can also go with the shrimp method. Raw shrimp will deteriorate and kick off the proper bacteria. No idea how long it's going to take though.

Don't do the damsel method though...

Incidently, how long are you going to cycle for? Or, if I can be more specific, how long are you going to wait after your params hit zero to add livestock?

lastlight

11-16-2009, 01:44 AM

Yes I do have a few pounds of live rock from a couple LFS in the tank as well.

Once nitrites hit zero I'll see what nitrates look like. I don't plan to add a huge clean up crew. How long I wait before adding fish remains to be seen. Once nitrites are zero and I've done a few waterchanges it's going to be pretty tough to resist adding SOMETHING.

Delphinus

11-16-2009, 02:09 AM

Elos aren't TOO bad - their main advantage is "ease of use" (although I suppose that's a bit subjective). Don't listen at all to the 10ml mark on the test tube, that's complete fiction. Also (as you sort of figured out for yourself already), DON'T use the cap. I have broken so many test tubes trying to put on the cap, or take it off, that it's not even funny. Those test tubes break if you so much as look at them wrong. :neutral:

if you ask me, cycling is a bit of an art. The problem is that adding something like shrimp (or even household ammonia) and then leaving it, is that it's an addition of the catalyst; but then as it's used up, it isn't replaced, which tends to pull the bacterial numbers back down. In "real life" it tends to be a little more steady state and thus you get the population numbers to be constant.

But in this case I think you're better off to let the grunge from the rock to cycle out before you really push forward because that has to be fairly gross stuff in there if you even found a dead fish it it (:eek:). I'd probably want to let that cycle out and then and a bunch more live rock in the sump and then maybe some hermits or something and see how that goes. The more I think about it, the more I realize I kind of have no idea what to suggest on how to manage the cycle properly when starting a tank from scratch like this.

lastlight

11-16-2009, 02:18 AM

Yeah I pulled that redish piece of tissue off the shelf last night. It wasn't a fish but looked like some sort of clam bits or something. I don't know enough to say. And I thought this rock would have all sorts of stuff dying and falling to the sand but my sandbed is pristine, the water nearly crystal clear and my skimmate after getting darker is slowly getting lighter and producing less. Hell even the stink I thought was the tank...it was a load of laundry my wife forgot in the washing machine. Putting my nose above the tank...the smell is barely noticeable.

Since there is nothing really living in the tank I'm thinking I'm only going to get so much bacterial action in there. Depends what is in all that rock and I'm suspecting the rock isn't that gross after all. When nitrites hit zero...if I add nothing to the tank won't the bacteria populations actually start decreasing with nothing new to eat?

Lance

11-16-2009, 02:39 AM

Maybe try one of those cycling products like "Cycle".

lastlight

11-16-2009, 02:50 AM

If Ammonia and nitrite are zero and nitrates aren't too high what is actually BAD about adding a fish and letting the bacteria adjust accordingly? There will certainly be some bacteria and a single fish would be pretty light biologically speaking?

I thought that Cycle stuff was for freshwater lol.

Delphinus

11-16-2009, 03:18 AM

As long as the fish is of hardier stock, I think that's pretty much what you HAVE to do at some point. Basically it's like revving the engine and it comes back down. Like you say, without something adding more ammonia it will come back down, which is self defeating.

I've used Cycle in SW. There are also some similar products intended for SW, they say it's different bacteria. (FWIW.)

lastlight

11-16-2009, 03:23 AM

Precisely what I'm thinking. This isn't me being impatient at all. I just can't see time working in my favour without a food source for the bacteria once my params are ideal. I think a single fish in the tank for a couple weeks and then see where things are. I don't plan to turn my lights on for the fish either so It's not like I'd have some massive algal bloom in the display without a crew to pulverize it.

kien

11-16-2009, 04:18 AM

I liked the first aquascape because the formations reminded me of giant Cylon Basestars flying through your tank! I like the new aquascape because it looks like a reef. :lol:

This won't be the end of your aquascaping be the way :-) Things will change once you start stocking fish and corals. Probably not a lot, but you will probably face the odd, "Oh man, I need a rock right here" moment (or two). :biggrin:

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-16-2009, 04:25 AM

lastlight

11-16-2009, 04:34 AM

My idea of slow is a fish per month. Is that normal?

This new nitrite kit just became my most prized possession.

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-16-2009, 04:58 AM

My idea of slow is a fish per month. Is that normal?

This new nitrite kit just became my most prized possession.

My idea was more like fish per week :lol:

Actually I think it depends on the size. A bunch of blue eyed cardinals may put about the same load on a tank as a large tang.

As the tank gets more established, you can add more fish at once. For now, I would go one a week depending on size but that is just my experience.

Add the tangs last if possible and at once if more than one. Again just my opinion.

Eventually the Alk test kit with become your prized possession if you get heavy into SPS :D

TheMikey

11-16-2009, 05:31 AM

You sure it was 400g? I want to get to sleep tonight too and I sure as hell can't find it. :lol:

JDigital

11-16-2009, 06:19 AM

Eventually the Alk test kit with become your prized possession if you get heavy into SPS :D

I hate my Alk test kit... I always chase it trying to make the number go UP! :lol:

kien

11-16-2009, 06:22 AM

My Alk and Calc test kits sit next to the baby bottle drying rack in the kitchen :lol: (clean baby bottles - rinse - dry - test aquarium Alk - rinse - dry - repeat)

Lance

11-16-2009, 06:27 AM

If ammonia and nitrite are zero I would recommend you start adding fish slowly. I think you really need to start to add them as soon as possible after getting to that point so that you keep the bacteria colonies going. It has always worked for me anyways...as long as I went slow :wink:

I agree. If nitrites & ammonia are zero, it's time to add a fish or two. Maybe those damsels you wanted. (They are tough little bastards).
I've used Cycle numerous times and it does seem to speed the process up.

lastlight

11-16-2009, 06:30 AM

Just to clarify...my nitrites are at 0.35 ish. But I was looking for advice on what to do when it is zero. It seems that regardless of whether I start with all live rock or all dry with a bit of live...it means the same thing.

Naturally I have to wait far longer for coraline etc but I'm asking about fish and they require bacteria which I would have at that point.

BlueAbyss

11-16-2009, 07:03 AM

When nitrite hits 0, I would definitely add something to keep the nitrogen cycle going.

And I have some Cycle in my fridge, it says for fresh or saltwater on the packaging.

Delphinus

11-16-2009, 03:53 PM

I've used Cycle numerous times and it does seem to speed the process up.

+1. I figure it can't hurt anyhow.

lastlight

11-16-2009, 05:19 PM

Yeah I'm ok just waiting the extra day or two. It gives the skimmer longer to pull more tank fudge out =)

fishytime

11-17-2009, 01:31 AM

Could definitely start with something small....just go slow with the bio-load:wink:

lastlight

11-17-2009, 04:45 PM

Nothing to see here guys. Just pilfering shots of stuff I want off the net.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted1.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted2.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted3.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted4.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted5.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted6.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted7.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted8.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted9.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted10.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted11.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted12.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted13.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted14.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted15.jpg

lastlight

11-17-2009, 06:49 PM

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted16.jpghttp://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/wanted17.jpg

untamed

11-17-2009, 07:44 PM

Well...pictures are more interesting than a "fish list".

JDigital

11-20-2009, 03:43 AM

That's quite the colorful assortment of fish. :mrgreen:

muck

11-20-2009, 03:53 AM

What about...

http://www.marinecenter.com/media/thumbs/8DA8AA87C3A140E189DF46A7999D6B04W.jpghttp://www.marinecenter.com/media/thumbs/268119BED05F446FA823C38CAD6A9E19E.jpg

lastlight

11-20-2009, 03:58 AM

Not a big fan of the shape of those fishes.

I'm going to get lynched but there isn't a single reef-safe wrasse I like. No I'm not running a fever =)

muck

11-20-2009, 04:06 AM

Im not a huge fan of the wrasse either. There are really only a few i might consider getting myself.

muck

11-20-2009, 04:09 AM

I see you have the orchid dottyback listed. A friend of mine got a few of these guys a few years back. They looked so awesome.
http://www.orafarm.com/images/indigodottyback.jpg

lastlight

11-20-2009, 04:28 AM

Wow I really like those as well.

On top of my list...whatever I see at the LFS that I like...I'm also getting haha. Assuming my wife's in a good mood and we're not bust-ass broke.

muck

11-20-2009, 04:37 AM

How close are you to the big day? :mrgreen:

lastlight

11-20-2009, 04:38 AM

I'll let you know in 10 minutes.

...yeah I hate having to decide which pink a tube of water is closer to. Damn color looks like BOTH. Don't think nitrites have moved...0.3 - 0.4.

shrimpchips

11-20-2009, 07:26 AM

How about a wetmorella sp. wrasse (Possum wrasses)?

http://www.liveaquaria.com/images/articles/a-possum-wrasse.jpg
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/oct2004/fish.htm

They're neat looking buggers - I saw one at a local LFS once. In retrospect I should have got it then and there, cause I want one now.

Veng68

11-20-2009, 10:24 AM

I wonder if the Black Cap will fight with the Orchid if you put them together?

Cheers,
Vic

lastlight

11-21-2009, 03:06 AM

I bet they would scrap. I'll try my best to get the black cap first and if nothing pans out I'll go for the easier to get orchid or look into that sweet indigo.

Veng68

11-21-2009, 04:46 AM

I bet they would scrap. I'll try my best to get the black cap first and if nothing pans out I'll go for the easier to get orchid or look into that sweet indigo.

I think the indigo is a cross between the orchid and striped dottyback....... maybe have a problem with the orchid if they are in the same tank.

Cheers,
Vic

lastlight

11-21-2009, 04:57 AM

Yeah I meant I'd like to have 1 of the 3. Priority in this order: black cap, indigo, orchid I think. My orchid was always exploring tight crevasses and I loved watching him get into mischief.

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-22-2009, 07:28 AM

Not a big fan of the shape of those fishes.

I'm going to get lynched but there isn't a single reef-safe wrasse I like. No I'm not running a fever =)

Im not really a fan of any reef safe wrasse either. The closest would be a Mystery Wrasse but they still eat shrimp sometimes. The last wrasse I had was a sixline and I got it because I had some nudi's for it to eat and then couldn't get the rat bastard out.

I had a Canary Wrasse in my big tank but I only got it because it had a deformed jaw.

Oh wait...I do have a favorite wrasse...Aussie Harlequin Tusk, really miss that guy. Mine ate all kinds of inverts though. So ya, I pretty much just like the non reef safe ones like the Pink face or banana.

Oh...lol...I also like the Pink Streaked Wrasse cause they have crazy eyes. Like they always wanna fight eyes or maybe they just look really dumb. I don't remember but I guess there's one reef safe wrasse I like. If they are even reef safe...

:noidea:

lastlight

11-22-2009, 03:32 PM

Leah

11-22-2009, 03:47 PM

My all time favorite fish was a yellow fang blenny I got from J&L.
I was told he was just on the scrawny side so they shipped him he was not scrawny he just had a slight kink in his tail fin. He was quickly named Kinky much to my daughter's horror. he he! :lol: No one else appreciates my humor least of all my daughter so thought you might...maybe more so now that your balls are gone :wink:

lastlight

11-22-2009, 03:52 PM

The moderators are seriously going to run us ballers out of here! In a vain attempt to save my own hide I'm going to pretend I don't appreciate that sort of humour.

Sorry :mrgreen:

Delphinus

11-22-2009, 04:38 PM

That's a very ballsy thing to say about moderators.

Not trying to dissuade either you or Justin from your opinions: if you don't like a particular fish, you don't like them, and that's cool. But at the same time, since fairy wrasses happen to be one of MY favourite groups of fish, I feel a slight obligation to say a word in their defense. To me these are the true "reef safe wrasses" and although nary a reef goes by without a sixline in it at one point, I think comparing the fairy wrasse group to a sixline is about as fair as comparing a .. a .. I don't know. A Chevy to a Ford? A Chevy to a Nissan? Something like that. Sixlines are about as personable as an annoyed and hungry yellow jacket wasp. Fairy wrasses are pretty, with many bright colours, won't bother a thing in your tank. The downside being that they're skittish and jumpers so open top tanks are a complete no-no with them.

Skimmerking

11-22-2009, 04:47 PM

Ok Brett how about stop wasting bandwidth and get the pictures uploaded of the tank...:lol:

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-22-2009, 04:51 PM

Wow that was a serious brain dump thanks for sharing haha.

I won't be swayed. Though after sifting through that I don't think you were trying...or weren't lol. That pink sucker does indeed have some crazy nutty eyes.

So you go out of your way to get disabled fish? Just to save them from an early flush?

No I wasn't trying to sway you at all. Just making a useless point really about how I agreed about not liking many reef safe wrasse.

I only get disabled fish if it makes them look cool. Like that Canary Wrasse had a messed up upper "lip" making it look like he had an underbite. Basically his lower jaw looked massive and protruded way out of his head lol. He looked like a gangster from a Dick Tracey movie :biggrin:

There was a Naso Tang with a flatten head at J&L once that I wanted but I already had a Naso at the time.

lastlight

11-22-2009, 05:55 PM

Tony I drive a Toyota so I still have no idea what you're talking about =) Haha. I think someone's impression of a fish changes if they see one in person. In photos these wrasseholes do nothing for me at all. Maybe If I see a nice one in a reef setting I'd change my mind.

Mike what protocol do I need to follow if there's no changes to photograph? I don't want to see you get all hot and bothered and go out and drop another 3k to make yourself feel better =)

And Justin's penchant for deformity is hilarious. The same fascination might explain why the ladeez like the lastlight.

kien

11-22-2009, 06:34 PM

My favourite wrasse is the banana wrasse, but there us no way I am putting that guy in my reef. Instead I have a fairy, six line and leopard wrasse. They all get along with everyone in my reef.

You strike me as the type that might enjoy a leopard wrasse.. You know, to go with those pheasant balls.

Delphinus

11-22-2009, 07:08 PM

Oh I'm not trying to change your mind. A fish either does it for you or doesn't. I just object to the notion that all wrasses are alike. Personally I'm fond of canary wrasses, radiant wrasses and just about any fairy wrasse (lubbocki, lineatus .. rhomboid .. come on, that's gold!!) And they're not comparable in disposition to a sixline.

Anyhow we have some other business to attend today ... expect PM shortly :p

Leah

11-22-2009, 09:13 PM

Not one comment, must I be the first, you have something in your underwear sir, go check.

lastlight

11-22-2009, 09:16 PM

I just grabbed these quickly.

OOPS!

lastlight

11-22-2009, 09:51 PM

Nitrites have dropped significantly. Very close to zero now.

Leah

11-22-2009, 09:54 PM

Yeah!!!!!!

Dez

11-22-2009, 09:56 PM

I'm more happy about the change in his profile picture/avatar :wink:

lastlight

11-22-2009, 10:07 PM

Haha that's not a GOOD thing Dez. Things like that you wanna keep on the down Low =)

If wars were fought with this stuff there would BE no war.

http://www.fishbrains.net/images/build/gunk.jpg

shrimpchips

11-22-2009, 11:18 PM

Sir, I believe you would benefit from some nutrient export. Or a Brazillian.

Are you going to be getting a skimmate overflow container? Maybe even straight down a drain?

christyf5

11-22-2009, 11:19 PM

Sir, I believe you would benefit from some nutrient export. Or a Brazillian.

:rofl:

lastlight

11-22-2009, 11:44 PM

Lance

11-23-2009, 12:05 AM

HAHA. That was gold!

No I'll never use the drain. I much prefer it to overflow back into the sump than to have an extra (large) container fill then maybe also overflow. I fear the massive topoff that could occur.

I clean the cup every 2 days so the cup's more than big enough.

The overflow containers with the float inside are pretty fool proof.
(PS. If you don't like the Brazillian, I suggest a Beckham).

lastlight

11-23-2009, 12:08 AM

If you don't like the Brazillian, I suggest a Beckham).

You and David must be pretty close nowadays. How cute!

I'll have to see how much this thing produces with a bioload. But I actually prefer cleaning it every 2 days or so. I found my last skimmer did better like this...not sure about this one.

shrimpchips

11-23-2009, 12:42 AM

yeah, them ping-pong anti-overflows are pretty neat. Is it just me or is the outflow tube for the skimmer cup always full?

Anyways get more fish in there soon. Then you can grow your balls back sooner.

shrimpchips

11-23-2009, 12:44 AM

And I apologize in advance for the never dying references to chaeto balls, grabbing and other innuendo that will forever follow you around.

lastlight

11-23-2009, 01:14 AM

Yeah that tube is simply open to the bottom of the cup so the first bit of nasty crap goes in there. Another issue with a skimmer container is I have no room for one. It's already going to be hell getting a BRS dual reactor in there when I can spare some coin for one (and some big buckets of media).

So yeah nitrites almost zero. When they are and when a few invoices get paid I'm gettin' me some fishies!

shrimpchips

11-23-2009, 01:18 AM

Nice. Your stand has nothing on crammedness compared to mine. I literally have a 2 x 2 x 8 inch space (including above other objects) for any future additions in the stand. I was thinking a small container of selcon.

Can't wait to see this beauty filled with some nice big SPS colonies and a ton of tiny fishes.

Snappy

11-23-2009, 01:20 AM

Brett that new avitar is a hoot!:lol:

Skimmerking

11-23-2009, 01:25 AM

ha ha ha ha good one Brett you ass come on spare me but the skimmer pic made up for it .. mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

skimmate

lastlight

11-23-2009, 01:33 AM

You guys make working through an entire weekend and into the wee hours of each morning not bad ya know?

Snappy come on. Your avatar was a classic. :neutral:

Snappy

11-23-2009, 01:53 AM

Snappy come on. Your avatar was a classic. :neutral:
Thanks Brett.
I will be changing it back to the dive pic of my wife & turtle after Christmas.
I just thought I'd go for a more festive look this holiday season.
Perhaps you'd prefer this one.
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h210/Trainer02/christmasdecor-1.gif

Or maybe one a little less tasteful?
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h210/Trainer02/avatar690_2.gif

then again I could have done Homer....
http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h210/Trainer02/homer_santa-1.gif

Sorry I didn't mean to do this to you......http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h210/Trainer02/hijacked.gif

lastlight

11-23-2009, 02:01 AM

I like lacey things Greg...and I'm not referring to anything in my wardrobe. Go with the spicy one lol =)

Whenever I'm about to say/display anything on the perverse side i think WWCD?

What would Christy Do?

After all she's got that naughty word in HER avatar. I post everything I do with that in mind haha.

Lance

11-23-2009, 03:24 AM

So yeah nitrites almost zero. When they are and when a few invoices get paid I'm gettin' me some fishies!

Whoooo Hooooooo!

lastlight

11-25-2009, 06:51 AM

nitrite = zero.
game on.

muck

11-25-2009, 06:56 AM

Only 10 hours till stores open.. :razz:

bulletsworld

11-25-2009, 06:16 PM

Only 10 hours till stores open.. :razz:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

muck

11-25-2009, 06:30 PM

So..... whadya get Brett? :mrgreen:

lastlight

11-25-2009, 06:36 PM

Call me selfish but why the hell did my wife go and get sick/crippled with this pinched nerve? :razz: I'm stuck with the dayhome while she sees her doctor. I'd love to sneak out tonight but I'm Mr. Mom right now!

The plan is to just pickup a few chromis. They're cheap and some of my favorite fish. I was thinking 3? Anyone have an issue/suggestion related to that?

Once they settle in and ace my water with poopFood I'll maybe get a coral or two?

Parker

11-25-2009, 06:40 PM

That's about the worst excuse I've ever heard! :mrgreen:

lastlight

11-25-2009, 06:49 PM

That's about the worst excuse I've ever heard! :mrgreen:

If my wife reads that you will lose your ChaetoBalls.

Delphinus

11-25-2009, 07:20 PM

muck

11-25-2009, 07:23 PM

(Did that sound like a whip? It was supposed to sound like a whip. I meant absolutely nothing by it. Sorry dear! I'm coming! I'm not on the computer, I promise!)

Aren't you at work today? Why you calling your boss "dear" ? :razz:

lastlight

11-25-2009, 07:30 PM

I hadn't thought that far ahead Tony...thanks.

Maybe a strongly worded email?

Honestly she'd likely just kick my ass it's quicker (and easier).

Delphinus

11-25-2009, 07:38 PM

Wait, you mean it's not normal to refer to your boss as dear? I am SO BRINGING THIS UP at my next performance review.

lastlight

11-25-2009, 07:39 PM

Like a bowse!

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-25-2009, 07:45 PM

Ehn, what's she going to do? Chase him? Or just get you to do it (kra-kow !!!!!)

(Did that sound like a whip? It was supposed to sound like a whip. I meant absolutely nothing by it. Sorry dear! I'm coming! I'm not on the computer, I promise!)

I thought it sounded like a bird, probably a crow.

Can't you just take ALL the children to the fish shop? Kind of like a field trip?

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-25-2009, 07:48 PM

Like a bowse!

"I took the kids to the fish store, LIKE A BOWSE!"
"I bought 3 chromis, LIKE A BOWSE!"

but then you may get back home and realize who is really the boss...

lastlight

11-25-2009, 07:50 PM

LMAO!

I was hoping someone would get my BOWSE ref.

Take the kids? Haha taking 6 kids anywhere but up the stairs to watch a movie would be suicide dude!

Parker

11-25-2009, 07:54 PM

I hadn't thought that far ahead Tony...thanks.

Maybe a strongly worded email?

Honestly she'd likely just kick my ass it's quicker (and easier).

So she kicks your ass for the things we say? Good to know..............

GreenSpottedPuffer

11-25-2009, 07:54 PM

LMAO!

I was hoping someone would get my BOWSE ref.

Take the kids? Haha taking 6 kids anywhere but up the stairs to watch a movie would be suicide dude!

Then...

I took the kids upstairs, LIKE A BOWSE
I put on Scarface, LIKE A BOWSE
I left the kids watching, LIKE A BOWSE
I snuck out past my sick wife, LIKE A BOWSE
I went to the fish store, LIKE A BOWSE
I bought 3 chrmois, LIKE A BOWSE

Better?

lastlight

11-25-2009, 08:03 PM

Yes to both of you.

I live a rough life.

Justin you are a gangsta.

Delphinus

11-25-2009, 08:21 PM

I have no idea what you guys are talking about.

bouse also bowse (bouz)v. boused also bowsed, bous·ing also bows·ing, bous·es also bows·es Nautical
v.tr. To pull or hoist with a tackle.

v.intr. To hoist.

I still have no idea what you're saying. I'm going to guess it's some kind of interior designer secret code.