Plumbing...suggestions? Added a drawing...

[Myka]

I'm good at putting it together, but my plumbing ideas usually suck!!! :lol:

I'm going to use this style of external overflow:
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f343/3214dannyzubot/tank%20build%20up/IMGP3110.jpg

I have a 3/4" return, running a pump that will deliver about 700 gph. According to a plumbing calculator the minimum overflow should be 1.09". So I think I'm really pushing it to just use a single 1" overflow. So, should I put two 1" or a single 1 1/2"? I don't want anything in the middle of the back of the tank up high (esthetics), but I'm considering putting my return in the middle of the back down low say 3" off the bottom, then have two 1" overflows in each of the upper back corners. If I use two 1" overflows (which I'm leaning towards), should I use a single external overflow for the two across the whole back of the tank, or should each bulkhead have it's own external overflow?

Good idea? Bad? I dunno...? Suggestions?

I don't see many people with check valves on their returns, but I think I will. Is there any reason not to?

Also, can you guys post some pics of how you've incorporated a waterchange valve or some such into your plumbing?

[Parker]

but I'm considering putting my return in the middle of the back down low say 3" off the bottom

The only problem I see is, If the power goes down you’re going to siphon all the way down to the level of your return. A closed loop return down low would be fine, but not a sump return even with a check valve, they have a tendency to fail, it doesn't take much to keep them from closing all the way. This is assuming that your return is through the tank not over the top.

[Myka]

Ah...good call.

[mark]

Rather than a bulkhead to feed the external overflow do a single large notch the width of the box or a series of smaller one (see picture in this thread (http://216.187.96.54/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=36668&highlight=herbie)).

And make a Herbie, drilling the external box for two holes. In your picture the air being pulled into the drain must be making an awful sucking sound.

[Myka]

Rather than a bulkhead to feed the external overflow do a single large notch the width of the box or a series of smaller one (see picture in this thread (http://216.187.96.54/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=36668&highlight=herbie)).

I don't know how to do that to glass, and I don't want to risk breaking the pane. what's wrong with using a bulkhead?

And make a Herbie, drilling the external box for two holes. In your picture the air being pulled into the drain must be making an awful sucking sound.

Yes, now that I think of it, I've seen a couple plumbed kinda like that, and they were very noisey. I've heard lots about Herbies, and I have no clue what they are. I'm going to go researching. :D

[fkshiu]

Yes, now that I think of it, I've seen a couple plumbed kinda like that, and they were very noisey. I've heard lots about Herbies, and I have no clue what they are. I'm going to go researching. :D

Take any overflow box - internal or external, doesn't matter - and drill two holes in the bottom (holes will be in the bottom of the tank for an internal box). Put an ordinary standpipe in one hole. Leave the other hole as is. Put a gate valve under the no standpipe hole and adjust it so the water level in the overflow box is just seeping down the standpipe. Voila . . . dead silent overflow a.k.a. a Herbie.

[Myka]

Ya, I went and found Herbie's original post on Reef Central. Cool idea. I think I'm going to go with that. I think I may just do a u-tube type return as well instead of drilling a return hole, but what are the pros/cons?

I don't know how to make overflow "teeth" in my glass panes though...I imagine the teeth would just break off?

[danny zubot]

Ooh man, where to begin.

First of all, do the notched overflow if you can. I would have, if I would have thought of it at the time. (BTW, for those of you who don't know, that pic if of my tank) When I picked up my tank from Bow valley after they drilled it, I saw a notched overflow on another tank they were working on, and loved it. But, too late for me I guess.

Secondly, if you are thinking of making the external overflow out of acrylic, think again. Acrylic warps under the heat of any lighting really. What you see in the pic is what I had, and it failed. It actually started to peal right off of the tank. I should have made it out of glass. The design is sound, but my execution of the design back fired totally. The adjustable standpipe worked well, but it was noisey. Adding a Herbie to the standpipe would be a great idea. I never thought of that at the time either, probably because the tank is in the basement and I don't really care about the noise.

I have since added a check valve to the return, but only because my sump was about 1 gallon shy of being able to handle the water drain off.

[Myka]

I don't know how to do the "notched" overflow on a glass tank. My tank is rimless, so that's not a worry, but I don't think I could cut/drill those notches without them breaking off...that would REALLY suck.

I'm going to be making glass overflows, but thanks for the heads up. :)

[Myka]

Ok, so here's the best I can do with the software on my puter.

The "PUMP" is a Poseidon PS3 which should give me about 700 gph at the 4'6" head I have. Sump is a standard 25g tank, which barely fits in the stand. The return is 3/4", and there is a check valve just above the pump. The overflow is a 1 1/2" bulkhead to an external box with 1 1/2" Herbie style drains w/ gate valve. They drain into the same chamber the skimmer is in through a CPR 4" sump inlet assembly w/ filter sock. The refugium on the right is fed by a small pump (MaxiJet 1200 maybe?).

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k43/Myka82/Plumbing.jpg

[mseepman]

I know you have even a better handle on this stuff than me Myka, but remember to account for a back siphon if power goes out through your return pump. When I made my sump, I figured out how many gallons of water were represented by each inch in my display and made sure there was that much room (gallons) plus more in my sump/fuge.

[fkshiu]

You would have to re-prime your return pump each time on start up the way you have it placed above the sump (I'm assuming from your drawing).

A simpler way to eliminate having to feed your fuge with a separate pump is simply to split your overflow drain going into the sump after the gate valve OR have the emergency drain go into the fuge. Depending on your flow rate, the emergency drain can take a fair amount of water (as adjusated by the gate valve) before it starts making any noticeable noise.

[Myka]

Mark: Ya, I'm keeping that in my mind, but I'm going to have to get it in front of me before I can actually figure it out. I'm worried that my whole sump will only be able to be 1/2 full. If that's the case, I'll make my own sump from scratch making it extra tall so that it can still hold a decent amount of water. :)

fkshiu: I thought of that about the pump...I have since decided to move it to sit in front of the sump. I will drill the sump, and feed the pump with a bulkhead.

I did think about tee-ing the overflow or return water for the fuge, but I don't want to screw around with a string of ball/gate valves. I think it just may be easier to use a MJ1200 which I have several of anyway.

I think I should probably add a ball/gate valve on the return line before the check valve...? I think a ball valve should do on that side. I can't imagine needing to dial down the pump though, but I won't know until it's up and running.

[mseepman]

Hey Myka,

I don't see a skimmer on your WTB list anymore...did you get one?

[Myka]

Not yet. Haven't found what I'm looking for. Since I'm not in a hurry, I'll stick it out until I find a used one. :)

Updated drawing..."PUMP" is sitting in front of the sump, with a bulkhead connecting it. I added a union below the ball valve on the overflow too.

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k43/Myka82/Plumbing-1.jpg