CL on 34gal Cube

[Chad]

Ok, just a quick question to some of the plumbing guru's.

What are the thoughts on using a Poseidon T3 / T4 as a pump on a CL system. I will have a single 250w MH over the tank as well.

I have read a few issues about the PS pumps introducing a lot of heat to the tank. Wondering if the heat will be too much for this small of a water volume.

Anyone have a suggestion of a different pump if not this one? I do need it quiet, and I really want to eliminate power heads. Which is why I am going for this CL idea.

Any help is appreciated!! Thanks :D

Best Regards
Chad

[mr_alberta]

Don't use this pump on a 34G. I use it on my 15G nano and if I didn't have a chiller, the water temp would go into the mid-high 90's. :eek:

You may consider something like a PanWorld 100. I have one of those as well and it seems quiet (though I haven't really used it, just a quick run to make sure it worked).

[Chad]

I am trying to not buy more equipment, I already have the velocity pump.

Anyone else have experience with these pumps. What sort of temp increase do they add normally?

Would a fan over the sump be enough to keep the temp down? I just cannot imagine these pumps adding that much heat :-)

[mark]

Don't use this pump on a 34G. I use it on my 15G nano and if I didn't have a chiller, the water temp would go into the mid-high 90's. :eek:


Wow, that much rise from an external pump.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

on a tank that small with MH lighting and a t3/4 pump, I would think your water temp would hover in the mid to high 90's. those pumps are horrible for heat transfer!!! A mag 7,9,or 12 would be a much better bet, and reasonable in price... There are other inline pumps I would recommend but they are very spendy and you seem concerned about cost. that t3/4 pump with a fan for cooling would still cook all your livestock, unless you had a wind tunnel of fans over the tank and topped up about 3+ gallons of evaporation a day while having the sound of a jet engine in your living room....
my personal opinion, those pumps are not worth their weight in feces....

[Chad]

Well, I didn't want to spend money if I didn't have too. I did not know the velocity put out so much heat.

What would you recommend then for a external pump that is reasonably quiet? I do not want a submersible pump.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

any pump I would highly recommend would cost $3-400 for a low flow pump, Are you aware that mag drive pumps can be used inline as well? and have been by many with great success! they are also disposably cheap!

[UnderWorldAquatics]

the smaller magdrive pumps used inline mounted on a piece of neoprane or other vibration reducing material will be as close to silent as your gona get, short of building a sound dampening box filled with sound insulation to encase the pump body

[mark]

Could look into the Reeflo Snapper (http://www.jlaquatics.com/phpstore/store_pages/details/pumps.php?product_ID=wp-seq00), quiet and would think by design low heat transfer.

Michika was putting one one her 28g

[banditpowdercoat]

FYI, tried a MAG 18 in my 45g. Heated to 88F in 3 days from cold tap water. Way to much heat. I am now running a Pentair Quiet one 3000 for closed loop(pump is in Overflow) and a Mag3.5 in the Sump. just fine.

[mseepman]

I use a Quietone 3000 for my return pump from my sump and it's been really quiet. I have no complaints so far.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

FYI, tried a MAG 18 in my 45g. Heated to 88F in 3 days from cold tap water. Way to much heat. I am now running a Pentair Quiet one 3000 for closed loop(pump is in Overflow) and a Mag3.5 in the Sump. just fine.

a mag 18 is alot larger bodied pump than the 7,9,or 12 that I recommended, and transfers alot more heat, and is very noisy compared to the smaller mag drive series.

[Zylumn]

I am a proud supporter of the Velocity Pump. It does unfortunately generate heat but it is extremely reliable, has great flow adjustment, and far quieter than the person with this opinion.
"my personal opinion, those pumps are not worth their weight in feces...."

Kevin

[banditpowdercoat]

a mag 18 is alot larger bodied pump than the 7,9,or 12 that I recommended, and transfers alot more heat, and is very noisy compared to the smaller mag drive series.


Yes, I know, but was using it as a comparosom.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

I found that they were quiet too, untill you need to scale back the flow, I found that this put considerable load on the motor and bearing, leading to high heat generation, and early failure of the pump. All these things form my opinion, my opinion is that they are a poorly designed pump not worth purchasing. This is an opinion of many people involved in the business end of the aquarium industry.

[Interior_Reef]

A snapper would do fine, very quiet, and works great, even when you have to restrict the flow. These pumps actually use less energy if you throttle them back.

I've had one for 2 years and its been great.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

A snapper would do fine, very quiet, and works great, even when you have to restrict the flow. These pumps actually use less energy if you throttle them back.

I've had one for 2 years and its been great.

Im suprised by this statement, Im no expert on pumps, but I was under the impression that any pump would be under full load, or even excessive load when restricting the output of said pump??? Not being able to efficiently scavange the water would create turbulence at the impeller, forcing the motor to work harder to spin the impeller(motors are wound and loaded to spin at a certain RPM,I believe this is one reason why mag drive pumps dont heat up as much as wound motor pumps do when restricted). At least this was my understanding of basic fluid dynamics and impeller load... Please set me straight if Im under the wrong impression, curiosity strikes!

[Interior_Reef]

http://www.reeflopumps.com/images/flow_charts.xls

straight from the manufactures site.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

http://www.reeflopumps.com/images/flow_charts.xls

straight from the manufactures site.

really annoyed that my computer is being a turd and I cant open the file...lol
any chance you could copy and paste it for me?

[Interior_Reef]

really annoyed that my computer is being a turd and I cant open the file...lol
any chance you could copy and paste it for me?
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y175/d3vil_Z22/Untitled-1.jpg

[UnderWorldAquatics]

thanks!
One file on their site has this quote which confuses me...

"Friction loss increases at an
increasing rate when either flow is increased or pipe is narrowed. The narrower the line the more
the pump has to work (think clogged ateries and your heart)."

this is a copy and pasted quote from their site, this quoted explanation tells me that if I put a ball valve on the output of the pump and restrict the flow(narrow the output pipe), the pump is going to have to work harder.... tell me if Im nutz???

Im very confused because this below, is also a quote from the same page on their site... I find it very contradicting!!!

4. If your pump is producing too much flow, you can reduce the flow by partially closing a
valve on the discharge line. Never restrict the inlet!!! Surprisingly, this will make the motor work
less and use less electricity!! This “valving back” simply causes the pump to operate further back
on its performance curve.

Let me know what you think???

I have used these pumps alot for about 8 years, I think they are great pumps, but I do find these quotes contradicting!

[mark]

It's not unique to the Reeflo pumps which have the motor shaft fixed to the impeller.

I have a Iwaki MD70RLT (mag drive) as a return with a union/valve on the output. Full open 2.24amps, with the valve closed 1.45amps.

As for Reeflo statement, on the surface could be contradicting if trying to link the whole article, but taken separately okay if just trying to simplify the principle of reduced flow and head-loss against pipe size. I'll still be using their product.

[Chad]

Hmm, maybe I should not have sold my Reeflo Dart :-) ... but it is such a large pump, and you need to plumb in a huge bulkhead. Perhaps the Quietone will work. It sucks with the heat increase on the velocity. I really want a silent system.

[UnderWorldAquatics]

It's not unique to the Reeflo pumps which have the motor shaft fixed to the impeller.

I have a Iwaki MD70RLT (mag drive) as a return with a union/valve on the output. Full open 2.24amps, with the valve closed 1.45amps.

As for Reeflo statement, on the surface could be contradicting if trying to link the whole article, but taken separately okay if just trying to simplify the principle of reduced flow and head-loss against pipe size. I'll still be using their product.

I think they are amazing pumps and as I mentioned, have been using them for about 8 years, mostly their larger pumps. Never realized they drew less power when restricted... Good to know!