Most stressful fish I've ever owned - achilles tang

[Chin_Lee]

I acquired this fella on Nov 16th and placed into my tank on Nov 17th.

This is a picture of it on Nov 18th. I was pretty depressed going to sleep that night :twised:
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/Hawaii537.jpg

Nov 19th
I was a little more optimistic this day. I contemplated catching it and putting it through a hyposalinity QT treatment. I was on the fence for the longest time but Tom R convinced me otherwise and convinced me to monitor it for a few more days before intervening.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/Fish004.jpg

Nov 20th
All I can say is wow and it doesn't even look like the same fish.
Its not eating nori or mysis yet but it has been scraping algae off rocks and bare bottom since Nov 18.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/achillesNov20030.jpg

Treatments:
Ozone through beckett skimmer with controller set at 430mv ORP
80W UV sterilizer
With all the talk about garlic, hey why not - I squeezed minced garlic's juice directly into the tank

Although the above treatments probably did help somewhat, the fish was very healthy and plump from the very beginning which I believe is the major contributor to its recovery....... so far.

I'll update more photos tomorrow hopefully it looks even better than today.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Totally amazing recovery. Hope this continues. And again, thanks for my beautiful fish from Hawaii.

Anthony

[cav~firez22]

Beautiful Fish.

Good luck with the treatment..
:)

[guysmiley]

Good job! I also feel that intervening is not always the best approach. Unless you're ready to catch all of the fish in your tank and treat them all then it's waste of time and you risk further stressing out the fish.

Hypo works but you have to leave the tank fishless for up to 6 weeks to get rid of the parasites in the tank (I'm sure you know this already) otherwise the treated fish will simply become re infected.


I hope it stays healthy! I've always liked those fish.
Garrick.

[Doug]

Nothing like a healthy enviroment, to help with illness.

[digital-audiophile]

Nothing like a healthy enviroment, to help with illness.

And Garlic ;)

[untamed]

My Achillies has never truly kicked it completely. Like yours, it went through a bad patch shortly after entering the tank. Now, it has settled into an ongoing minor thing.

Have you seen him flash his colours when he gets upset about something? It is really difficult to get a picture of...but his top/bottom fins will go red/orange and his belly will go white. Nice fish.

[mark]

ouch.

[Chin_Lee]

99% recovery and eating gracillaria. Amazing what this fish went through in five days.....
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/achillesNov21013.jpg

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/achillesNov21010.jpg

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/achillesNov21009.jpg

Thought I would throw in a picture of my mystery wrasse..... this guy is really cool.......
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/chin_lee/MysteryNov21001.jpg

[Jason McK]

What a story. Fabulous looking fish.

J

[Psyire]

Glad to see he pulled through.

A stress free healthy environment with perfect water is the best way to battle any illness, IMHO.

Great job!

[Willito]

Good to hear that it's recovering nicely for you. By the way, where did you aquire it. For the past few months there's been virtually no specimen available anywhere in a decent size (3-4"). You mind share how/where you got it?

[Delphinus]

He literally went to Hawaii to pick it up! :) Well, I suppose he and his family also kind of got a holiday out of it. http://canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=37164

[Chin_Lee]

I should clarify that my wife choose the location...... I only agreed and made the best out of it. :)

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Yeah, but how many nights did you whisper in her ear "Hawaii, Achilles tang, Hawaii, Achilles tang, Hawaii......" while she slept?:wink:

Anthony

[Chaloupa]

Stunning fish Chin!!! WOW, and to have the opportunity to go there to get it! PLUS a vacation.....WOW!

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Yeah....I'm starting to think that there's something to this! Pay for your Hawaii vacation by bringing a few dozen Achilles Tangs back with you? Hmmmm....*taps fingers together*

[Chin_Lee]

Yeah....I'm starting to think that there's something to this! Pay for your Hawaii vacation by bringing a few dozen Achilles Tangs back with you? Hmmmm....*taps fingers together*

Due to their poor shipping status, the store I bought them from packed 4 achilles per box in rather large BIG BAGS. They filled it about 1/3 and filled the rest with pure oxygen. This allowed the fish some swimming room and I believe this was a big factor why they arrived so healthy.

I brought back 11 med/small various types of fishes in two boxes. If you're planning on a few dozen, you're looking at 9-12 boxes :lol:
Oh and try to convince Customs that your 9-12 boxes are for your personal aquarium and not a commercial business :wink:

Another thing is this Known Shipper status in the US. Most airlines will not ship for you if you are not a Known shipper. SOME airlines will make exceptions for pets/live animals if they can open and inspect the box and contents. But in excess of 3-4 boxes, I don't believe they will ship for you because all the contents of the boxes need to be removed and each box inspected. They had no issues with two boxes but I would have seen some eyes rolling if I brought in 9-12 boxes. In all likelihood, they will turn you away because you will be considered a commercial "unknown shipper". Look into this Known Shipper status carefully..........

[Skimmerking]

yup Garlic works wonders man good score when I do my 48x48 cube after afghanistan I'm getting a powdewr brown and a achillies tang for the tnak they are my fav fishies....



nice pic's Chin

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Just kiddin, Chin...lol. I can't imagine the hassle of bringing back a couple dozen tangs....as you've highlighted :D

[Chin_Lee]

Well its been just over a month since I've acquired my achilles tangs. I currently have one in my LPS tank and one in my sump. Although both are eating nori and swimming around normally, they are both very icky.
I have to say for the past month, everyday I wake up in the morning anticipating or wondering if I will find a dead fish and so far so good; these guys are still alive and definitely toughing it out.
But I'm at the point where I am starting to regret acquiring these fishes just because they are so day by day and just not knowing if they will make it another day or two, or three or whatever. The achilles in my LPS tank was so covered with ick at one point it looked like a swimming ghost. Now most of it is gone but still there and its now its getting secondary skin diseases of some sort. At this time, I just don't know if they will live and if they do, for how long. Kinda sucks....

I just thought I should share with everyone my experience with these tangs so far.
Quick background:
I went to Hawaii on November 8 where I liaised with a local pet store to get some achilles tangs. Six were caught by a local diver in Hawaii and brought to the pet store on a Monday. They varied in sizes from 3 to 4.5 inches (1 @ 3", 1 @ 3.5", 2 @ 4" and 2 @ 4.5"). All of them were in prime ick-free condition when I had them packed and shipped on the Friday. The six fishes were individually packed in LARGE bags, 1/3 bag full newly made IO saltwater that had been aerated for 4 days, the remaining 2/3 filled with pure oxygen. They arrived at my place approximately 15 hours after being packed into the bags. Water temp was about 75 degrees which was excellent for 15 hours of shipping.
2 fishes stayed with me: 4.5" and 4"
4 fishes were sold to locals.

Treatments:
1 achilles was given a FW dip and it died the following day.

1 achilles was acclimatized for and placed into a hyposalinity FOWLR tank at 1.10 ppt. This fish acted normal and it ate nori, mysis, and pellets for about 1.5 weeks when it developed a few specks of ick. The ick disappeared and seemed to have been cured when at the 2 week mark, it suddenly just died. The other fishes in this tank began to die at the rate of one every 3 days and after losing about 8 fishes, the salinity was slowly increased over 2 week period (since the hyposalinity condition was obviously not working properly). The fishes were developing patchy spots of some sort of fungus fuzzy stuff on their bodies. The tank has lost a few more fishes since and its still being monitored. The tank was a 120g with 40g sump, 80lbs live rock and rs135 euroreef skimmer for filtration. Aside from the few specs of ick, there was no signs of the fungus on the achilles before it died.

1 achilles was placed into quarantine tank with a 25 w UV sterilizer and skimmer for about 1 week. Some ick developed and some copper was used in the QT tank. This fish acted very well eating mysis and nori like a pig. When the ick was cured after a week in the QT, it was placed into a FOWLR where it continued to do well. At around the three week mark, it just died.

So that leaves only three of the six which are alive at this time. As I stated, both my achilles seems to be a day by day with ick but otherwise eating and swimming around normally. I didn't give them any dips or treatments, and I'm running ozone at 450 mv and 100 watts of UV.

The third achilles at another reefer's place is not very icky and seems to be doing really well. No dips or treatments and that tank is running 80w of UV.

Conclusion:
Well I can't make any conclusions based on 6 fishes but I will point out the following:
- I had complete control of the way they were packed and the time these fishes spent in bags was kept to a minimal (15 hours)
- they were in perfect condition when they arrived at the store and when they arrived in Vancouver
- of the 6, only three are still alive
- the three that died were given special "treatements" - 1) FW dip 2) hyposalinity, and 3) copper.
- of the three that are still alive, two are very icky and one is OK. At this point, only time can well what will happen with them.
- I had an achilles before that died after a FW dip and I spoke to another experienced reefer in Calgary whose achilles also died after a FW dip. It would appear that achilles tangs are hyper-sensitive to freshwater dips.

So if there was any advice I would give to others about these tangs, I would not recommend getting them. They are probably one of the most beautiful tangs out there but owning one is stressful and even when the best shipping conditions were provided, there is still a high mortality rate.

I will update on my tangs as required.

[ron101]

Kudos to you Chin for the very honest assessment.

[fkshiu]

I was the one who did the FW dip and have to agree with Chin's conclusions.

I FW dip virtually all new arrivals and the used the same procedure with the Achilles. So far, only the Achilles has succumed after a FW dip.

After all is said and done, I don't regret the whole experience (not that I had to put much effort into it myself, personally) but would definitely recommend that anyone considering purchasing an Achilles put a lot of thought into the investment and to be prepared to disappointment.

[StirCrazy]

That is so weird Chin, I guess this shows to buy them from a Local LFS after they have been there long enough to be de-stressed. I got mine from a local place (don't know if board rules permit me to say where) and poured it into a net an plopped it into the tank, only thing I did was float the bag to equalize the temps. I had it for 3 years, never saw ich, or anything, and as far as I know some local reefer still has it as I took it back to the store when I shut down my tank.

but I can say when I set up a new tank, I am hoping to go big enough to have a couple of these. they are by far my favorite fish.

Steve

[marie]

I've had my achilles for 1 1/2 yrs now and has never had any signs of ich, the first 8 weeks I had him though I was never sure he was going to make it.
For those that are interested, here is a thread on the marine depot board of the problems I had in the first few weeks

http://forum.marinedepot.com/Topic37757-10-1.aspx

I do have to say it was all worth the troubles of quarantining all my fish, as I said I have never had obvious signs ich in my display tank

[EmilyB]

Marie, what size was your AT ? I ask because although I got mine healthy, it paced and wasn't happy, it may have been too large a capture :question:

[marie]

He was around 3" when I got him.

[Chin_Lee]

Well the achilles in my LPS tank started eating mysis and flake foods today........ over a month after being in the tank. He still looks terrible but its a good sign he's accepting other foods other than nori.

[Skimmer Juice]

Chin di you try cupprimine? It is not nearly as harsh as copper. I used cupprimine on my lnghorn cowfish, wich are believed to be very hard fish to treat. I have also used it on my mappa puffer, you should try this method in a qt tank, it has never let me down. Good luck with the fish, I hate when I have a sick fish, nothing worse.

[Chin_Lee]

He's in my display LPS tank and I've contemplated several times whether or not to intervene which would mean catching him out and into a QT tank. I've decided against intervening each time just because of the stress factor and the fact that he's eating nori very well and not exhibiting any sick behavior.

[untamed]

My Achillies also eats a wide variety of food such as clam, squid, octopus...the basic mixed seafood that you get in the bag from T&T. Likes nori also, but clearly not a 100% vegan.

Oh yes, like Formula 1 and 2 pellets also.