The Dangers of Tap Water

[Josh23]

Here is a interesting post for those of us who use tap water.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy...-2003Jan21.html

Interesting read.........could be the reason for the death of some of your fish.

[AJ_77]

Josh, could you check that link?

[Josh23]

well I cant get there anymore either. I found the post on reefcentral although now the link on their page is not working. Any way here in a link to the reefcentral post although there are no responses just the link that I had provided above. Keep an eye on it maybe the site is just down for the day.
http://www.reefcentral.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=999db9408edab0fc88252f335edc4d2a&threadid=144511

[Son Of Skyline]

Hmmm...I can't get in either although I assume the point is that chlorine doesn't just precipitate overnight.

Has anybody here ever actually experienced the negative effects of chlorine in tap water? I've been using tapwater all my life in freshwater without dechlorinaters or leaving it overnight, but I've never had a problem. Is it possible that our water systems here in BC aren't as chlorinated as in other parts?

[christyf5]

I believe this is what you are looking for?? :

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A21720-2003Jan21.html

Christy :)

[Son Of Skyline]

I believe this is what you are looking for?? :

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A21720-2003Jan21.html

Christy :)


There must be something wrong with my computer because I get nothing but a blank page after the survey...ah well. Thanks anyways Christy!

[Josh23]

Well the acticle goes on to say that chlorine will not disapate overnight if at all. They did however recomend that water sit for at least 48 hours before adding it to your tank. They also talked about choramine (sorry not sure on the spelling) which is used in Calgary water. The auther went on to say that this can lead to kidney or liver failure in fish (dont quote me on which organ it was) He also mentioned that chloramine can not be removed from the water by letting it sit. In fact boiling it would only lead to 50% removal of the chemical. In short it was recomended that if you are going to use tap water you should be adding a conditioner to remove the chemicals.

[EmilyB]

I wasn't aware that Calgary used chloramine as well, but I have heard rumors. Where did you find that info - they mention chlorine on the site I looked at, but no mention of chloramine ?

Anyway, just wanted to mention, never use a water conditioner that has aloe vera or other such crap in it unless you want to farm green algae, among other things... I use Tetra AquaSafe for conditioning tapwater for the FW tank, but there are similar products out there.

[BC_Grl]

Em, that was a good point. I never thought the water conditioning would give you algae. But we use the Tap Water Purifier for our tank water.

[Josh23]

sorry,
Im not sure if Calgary uses chloramine. We live just outside the city and are on a seperate water system, which has chloramine. Not sure about Calgary

[Josh23]

sorry,
Im not sure if Calgary uses chloramine. We live just outside the city and are on a seperate water system, which has chloramine. Not sure about Calgary

[Jack Rainville]

I've always used RO water. However, I've always had a problem getting CA and Alk to decent levels and have suspected that it's because of the water being a bit too pure. I've been considering switching to tap water but I'm concerned because Edmonton uses chloramine.

Anyhow, today I did a test. I filled two buckets, one with a gallon of tap water and one with a gallon of RO. I did a chlorine test on both using an Azoo test kit. The tap water as expected was at the max end of the chart for chlorine (around 0.1 mg/l) and the RO had absolutely no detectable chlorine. Then I dechlorinated the tap water using a product by Hagen called ChlorXchange. It says clearly on the package that it is a "Chlorine and chloramine remover for fresh and saltwater use". I then tested the tap water again. As expected the chlorine was pretty much undetectable.

Now things get interesting. Supposedly when you dechlorinate tap water that had chloramine in it, you eliminate the chlorine but you liberate the ammonia molecules from the chloramine. So I tested for ammonia using a Fastest kit. The results for the dechlorinated tap water were not good. The ammonia was at the highest end of the scale at 0.8 mg/l. In order to verify that the kit was working right I also tested the RO water. No detectable ammonia.

The question is, is this level of ammonia dangerous when only doing a partial water change? Does the filtration system suck it up fast enough that it's not a problem? Is it possibly a false reading? (supposedly when using Ammo-lok to remove ammonia, people still read ammonia in the tank but it's "inert" and harmless. Perhaps this ChlorXchange product also locks up the ammonia in some way so that it's safe). Needless to say I'm nervous about switching to tap water. Has anyone else in Edmonton or Calgary done this type of test?

For those who are interested in the CA and Alk situation, I also went on to test that...

I let both buckets sit till they reached room temperature and then I added IO salt mix. I matched salinity in both buckets to exactly 1.025. I tested for calcium first using a Salifert kit with the high accuracy method. The tap water mix tested at 420 ppm. That's where I'd like to see it. The RO mix on the other hand, tested at 340 ppm, which explains why I have to keep at the additives to get the levels where I want them (400 to 450).

Then I tested both samples for alkalinity using a Fastest kit and the high accuracy titration method. The tap water tested at about 4.5 meq/l. That's a bit high but allowing for possible inaccuracy of the test kit, and considering that the water change will be replacing some of the "used up" alkalinity in the aquarium, its not a bad level. The RO mix came out at a dismal 2.75 meq/l. Again, this explains why I have to put a lot of additives and keep a steady Kalkwasser drip to get the levels where I like them (3.5 to 4.0).

I'd really like to switch to using tap water so that I would use less additives. Even the Seachem Kalkwasser that I use says to add 1 teaspoon for every gallon of water, but if using filtered water then you need to add 2 teaspoons per gallon. I'm using it up twice as fast as I would if I were on tap water. It galls me to think that each time a do a partial water change, I'm actually REMOVING some of the calcium and alkalinity, and then I have to bring the levels back up using expensive additives.

The chloramine/ammonia situation makes me nervous. I'd be interested to hear from anyone using tap water in Edmonton. Have you ever done this type of test? If you've tested your dechlorinated water for ammonia but couldn't detect any, what type of dechlorinator are you using? Do you have any problems with algea as a result of using unfiltered tapwater?

thx.

Jack

[Bob I]

I wasn't aware that Calgary used chloramine as well, but I have heard rumors. Where did you find that info - they mention chlorine on the site I looked at, but no mention of chloramine ?

I have said I will not even read posts on tap water, as I consider them a load of bull, but instead of speculating on the use of Chloramine would it not be simpler to ask the right people at Waterworks? That is just my two cents worth. :?: :?: :?:

[StirCrazy]

Jack Rainville

the ammonia and chlorine isn;t what most people are worried about.. they can be nutralized with a kit made doe chloramine. the proble is all the "other" minerals and contaminants that you cannot test for and do not want to build up in your tank.

Bob.... :wink:


Steve

[BC_Grl]

Jack, that is a very interesting study you've done. My husband uses RO water for top-offs. And we have to use additives as well.

Bob- you're twisted. You really should encourage people to ask questions so they don't make mistakes and thus turning them off of reefing.

[MitchM]

Every year I phone waterworks here in Calgary, and they fax me over a copy of their water test results. We have 2 treatment plants here, Bearspaw and Glenmore. The tests that they have are for the water leaving the plant(s). What it may pick up on the way, which plant supplies your house and whether you have plastic, copper or galvanized supply pipes in your home you should take into consideration when assesing your tap water.

Mitch :D

[stephane]

IMO it is not good id to use tap water in a reef no mater wath product you add in it and you should remove not add

I prefer take RO water and add wath ever I need. That way Im shure of wath is in the water anyway calcium and carbonate are so easy to add so I dont understand why take the risk to have problem for saving few $
and not add the buffer your self

[Bob I]

Every year I phone waterworks here in Calgary, and they fax me over a copy of their water test results. We have 2 treatment plants here, Bearspaw and Glenmore. The tests that they have are for the water leaving the plant(s). What it may pick up on the way, which plant supplies your house and whether you have plastic, copper or galvanized supply pipes in your home you should take into consideration when assesing your tap water.

Mitch :D

That is a fair point. The way I see it everyone needs to be aware of possible dangers when assessing their water needs. Then use what you feel works for you. Rather than issuing a blanket condemnation, and calling someone an idiot for doing something that works well for him. That is my simple philosophy anyway. :wink: :roll: