Michika's 28g long nano-esque tank!

[michika]

So I'm upgrading again!

My current tank isn't as SPS friendly as I had hoped, so now I'm upgrading once again. This tank will feature stronger and more random flow, more length, less height, and run with just T5s for lighting. I plan to DIY most items in an effort to keep the cost low. The tank will continue to house my 9 clams, a variety of SPS, and a few select pieces of LPS. This tank will house few fish, 4-5 at the most.

The tank:
Outside dimensions are 33" wide, 18" deep, and 12" tall, which is 30.9g. I will be limiting the water height to just 11", giving me 28g of usable space.

The tank will feature an external overflow with 2x 1.5" bulkheads for drainage. The external overflow will measure 10" wide, 5" deep, and 8" tall.

The water will be returned from the sump/refugium via a Reeflo Snapper pump, via a Calfo manifold. There will be four additional holes drilled into the bottom pane of glass to facilitate futher flow, as well as for easy water changes.

Lighting:
Since I'm on a Wattage budget I've chosen to go with T5 lighting for the display tank. At this time I believe I'll be going with 8 T5 bulbs run on two Workhorse 7 ballasts. While the initial investment for this lighting setup will be higher then just picking up a second MH, and supplimentary PC lighting, I think it will be better in the long run. T5s will put off less heat, as well as the power consumption will be lower. The cost of bulb replacement is comparable to MHs with approximately the same frequency.

Finally a few photos of the tank. I'm so excited to start the project I haven't even cleaned the tank out!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0007-2.jpg

With overflow sketch
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0001-5.jpg

[saltynuts]

wow girl you just left my place and look at you go!
poor kevin!!!!

[Mik_101]

Grate looking tank you got your self cant wait to see it up and running!

[Redrover]

" Dam" this sound like a great adventure...keep us posted, along with some Pic's.:onfire:

[Delphinus]

Neat stuff.

Just curious, how come you want to run the tank at 11"?

What do you use for Ca and Alk, do you run a reactor for those 9 clams or are you dosing manually?

[mr_alberta]

Be careful about drilling so many holes in the bottom of your tank. You're probably only using 1/4" glass right? 4 holes may be much for such a thin piece of glass.

[michika]

Neat stuff.

Just curious, how come you want to run the tank at 11"?

What do you use for Ca and Alk, do you run a reactor for those 9 clams or are you dosing manually?

The total tank height is only 12" and since I would like a bit of a buffer I chose 11" incase of splashes, etc.

I run a kalk, calcium, and phosban reactor to keep all my levels in the right places. I also do weekly water changes and that seems to keep everything happy.

Be careful about drilling so many holes in the bottom of your tank. You're probably only using 1/4" glass right? 4 holes may be much for such a thin piece of glass.

I think your right, I may skip on drilling the bottom pane. Although now I will have to look finding an alternative way to do easy water changes. Suggestions?

[mr_alberta]

Just put in an extra valve in your drain line to your sump from the tank?

[Pan]

So I'm upgrading again!

My current tank isn't as SPS friendly as I had hoped, so now I'm upgrading once again. This tank will feature stronger and more random flow, more length, less height, and run with just T5s for lighting. I plan to DIY most items in an effort to keep the cost low. The tank will continue to house my 9 clams, a variety of SPS, and a few select pieces of LPS. This tank will house few fish, 4-5 at the most.

The tank:
Outside dimensions are 33" wide, 18" deep, and 12" tall, which is 30.9g. I will be limiting the water height to just 11", giving me 28g of usable space.

The tank will feature an external overflow with 2x 1.5" bulkheads for drainage. The external overflow will measure 10" wide, 5" deep, and 8" tall.

The water will be returned from the sump/refugium via a Reeflo Snapper pump, via a Calfo manifold. There will be four additional holes drilled into the bottom pane of glass to facilitate futher flow, as well as for easy water changes.

Lighting:
Since I'm on a Wattage budget I've chosen to go with T5 lighting for the display tank. At this time I believe I'll be going with 8 T5 bulbs run on two Workhorse 7 ballasts. While the initial investment for this lighting setup will be higher then just picking up a second MH, and supplimentary PC lighting, I think it will be better in the long run. T5s will put off less heat, as well as the power consumption will be lower. The cost of bulb replacement is comparable to MHs with approximately the same frequency.

Finally a few photos of the tank. I'm so excited to start the project I haven't even cleaned the tank out!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0007-2.jpg

With overflow sketch
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0001-5.jpg


Love the colors bright green level, bright pink drink can :) did you build it?

Where do you get the t5's?

[michika]

Love the colors bright green level, bright pink drink can :) did you build it?

Where do you get the t5's?

Nope I didn't build the tank, it came from Ed Holland! I haven't yet picked up the T5s, but I have two potential sources in mind for the bulbs. The ballasts are coming from an electrical wholesaler, and possibly the end caps as well.

As for the pink popcan and the neon green level....I have no comment!


Thanks Harvey, I'll figure out how to do that instead!

[michika]

I'm now in the process of searching for a stand. It needs to be 35-38" wide, and I'm hoping for around 35-38" high. The stand probably only needs to be about 2ft deep. Its very frustrating not to have any place to work on this kind of stuff anymore. I'm also going to need a matching canopy, and I'm hoping a set of doors, or something to hide the tank itself.

The plumbing is mostly figured out now, its just a matter of getting the overflow done, and assembling the plumbing parts.

[michika]

Quicky update:

The tank is about 80% ready to go now. I've gotten all my plumbing parts, my pump, and I've decided on my lighting.

I'm going to stay with a single 175w MH for the moment. After a really long hard look at T5s I've decided it isn't really the best option for me. The initial start up cost was more then my existing tank cost me to set up. In short the price drove me away. Maybe in the future I will revisit the idea, but right now I'm happy with keeping my budget small.

The manifold itself is complete. Its all plumbed up, it just needs a trial run which will be happening once I get the stand. I chose to go with the ReeFlo Snapper pump for its low power consumption, the fact that it is pressure rated, and that you can dial it back for futher power savings if need be.

I'm waiting on the following before the big change over:
- Drilling the overflow box and the back pane of the tank.
- The stand & canopy
- Finalizing a sump design, this will be after the stand & canopy arrive.
- Completing the plumbing from tank to sump.

The next step is the arrival of the stand and canopy. From there it is just plumbing it up and confirming my sump design. Everything else is ready for the change over!

I'll try and post photos of everything later this evening.

[michika]

The promised photos:

The tank with the finished manifold.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0134.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0136.jpg

Corner bracing / manifold rest:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0145.jpg

[Pan]

Cool, more pictures, more pictures :biggrin:

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Lookin' good, Catherine! I'm looking forward to seeing that manifold in action. It's an idea that's always interested me.

Where are you getting your stand and canopy from?

[michika]

There will be more photos tonight possibly, if not Friday.

Lookin' good, Catherine! I'm looking forward to seeing that manifold in action. It's an idea that's always interested me.

Where are you getting your stand and canopy from?

The stand and canopy is actually coming from Edmonton Eskimo. I'm super excited about it!

I can't wait to see how the manifold works too. I think there will be a crazy amount of flow, so much so that I'll have to go barebottom, or throttle the pump back considerably. I'll try and make sure to get photos of it in action.

I hope to have the tank running by Ed's Reef Meet on the 14th, but we'll have to see.

[Joe Reefer]

That should work. Are you going to paint it?

[michika]

That should work. Are you going to paint it?

I most likely will, probably a blue if I have time. I'll be painting the back, and the overflow.

[fishytime]

Looks good. Zylumn(Kevin) has a manifold similar to that on one of his tanks.

[michika]

Looks good. Zylumn(Kevin) has a manifold similar to that on one of his tanks.

Thanks! I'll definitely have to go take a look at his system!

[Edmonton Eskimo]

that's not the stand you're talking about painting I hope!

[michika]

Nope, I mean the back of the glass! :D

[saltynuts]

ok ok
it,s been a couple days whats going on.

[michika]

I'm not really sure what is going on actually...we have temporarily come to a standstill...but I'm on my way home now so hopefully I will post a photo layden update tonight.

[Edmonton Eskimo]

sorry guys, I'm the reason for the hold up! I am trying as best I can to finish the stand but am having time issues as well as I need to get some more material and make sure the color matches etc. which can be tedious at best. I'm doing my best and I'm just not willing to sacrifice quality to rush the job. Be patient it will be well worth it.

[michika]

- Drilling the overflow box and the back pane of the tank.
- The stand & canopy
- Finalizing a sump design, this will be after the stand & canopy arrive.
- Completing the plumbing from tank to sump.


So that was my previous to-do list.

The tank is now drilled, I have also fitted all the bulkheads into place. Drilling a tank in your bathtub is truly a pain!

I set up my sump, I think I will need 5-6 baffles to offset the pump I chose. The sump was free, again another awesome gift from Ed! In all my planning I failed to encorporate a refugium in my sump design. I hope that it will work itself out and I'll find a place for my refugium. :redface:

I'm sure the stand and canopy from Edmonton Eskimo will be more then worth the wait. I am more then willing to wait for a great end product. :mrgreen: I'll definitely be sure to post many many photos of it when it comes. :cool:

So next up:
- figure out a rock placement design.
- make a firm decision if I am going to go bare bottom or not, even if its just a trial run.
- make some decisions about livestock, should I add anything or keep it as is?

So far this is what my current tank has:
~60 different types of SPS (I won't be adding anything for quite some time)
~5 LPS, zoas, softies, etc.
10 clams, although unfortunately it seems that my favorite is on its way out. :cry:
- 1 yellow damsel
- 1 male mandarin goby
- 1 sixline wrasse
- 1 green clown goby (missing in action though)
- 1 urchin
- 1 lettuce nudibranch
- 1 1.5" foxface (going to a new home asap)
- various hermits and snails

Any suggestions on deletions/additions to my stocking?

[michika]

Yay!

Stand and tank, with hitchhikers
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0019.jpg

Closer short of the dirty tank with hitchhikers
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0023-1.jpg

Tentative 20g for a sump, with Reeflo Snapper pump.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0027.jpg

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Looks good, Catherine. I really like the shape of it. Long and low, eh? Also, the hitchhikers are pretty awesome :)

[michika]

Thanks! The height is perfect if your standing, or sitting. I also no longer have to worry about wet sleeves :D!

Jason, Edmonton Eskimo, did a fantastic job. The stand looks amazing in person and its like touching silk its so soft!

I am just in the process of getting Kevin, Krazykuch, to put my overflow box on. I hope its going to be ready for a water test by tomorrow, or this weekend.

[digital-audiophile]

That stand is so nice! Did you get a matching canopy made?

[michika]

Thank you.

Yes, there will be a matching canopy, and possibly a side cabinet for storage. We wanted to get the tank on the stand first to best figure out how to situate the canopy.

[IceTurf]

nice hitch-hikers

[Delphinus]

Dig the stand!!

[digital-audiophile]

Just my two cents, have you thought about painting your PVC with Krylon. I did that with mine so the white did not stick out as much in the tank.

[michika]

All the plumbing will actually be hidden by the hood, so it won't be visible once everything is assembled. I may however paint the plumbing in the back of the tank.

What color did you paint yours?

[digital-audiophile]

I painted my return line black becuase I use a black background on the tank. I just find that it blends in a little more.

[IceTurf]

btw nice tank design and all, killer when its done!!

[michika]

Thank you!

[Pan]

Is this tank in a dorm room?

[michika]

Its an apartment that is just about as tiny as a dorm room.

[Pan]

I remember my u of a dorm, then my little apartment close by, I thought they were small until I went to school in Europe...

[michika]

My apartment is bigger then my bedroom in HUB was, but its about twice as small as my place in Newton. I definitely don't miss HUB!

[saltynuts]

well tell kevin to put the ice cream down.
need to see some new pics.
if you need ro water let me know i,ll start getting it ready.

[michika]

I'll see what I can do tonight!

Speaking of photos, where would you like your tank photos?

[saltynuts]

well how goes the battle got any water in it yet.
as for pics send them to edpaulaholland@shaw.ca

[SeaShell]

I'd love to see how those tank pics turned out, Ed! Please post them publically.

:)

[michika]

I'll post them shortly for you!

[rigger11]

so wheres the pics of the new stand andcanopy????

[michika]

I've been pretty bad about photos, so here you go!

FYI its T -11 days until this tank will be up and running.

So far:
- I turfed the idea for T5s, the cost was too prohibitive to consider futher.
- I picked up a luminarc reflector as a upgrade for my existing 175w MH set up.
- I water tested my tank, no leaks!

A few photos to tide you all over:

New skimmer!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0070.jpg

Luminarc reflector
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0065.jpg

[michika]

More photos:

The tank before drilling:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0357.jpg

After drilling:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0364.jpg

Initial plumbing:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0367.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0375.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0377.jpg

[kwirky]

very patient build so far, it will be great when it's ready to add water :)

[michika]

So the move happend, and to be frank about it, it was a disaster.

I lost or am in the process of loosing pretty much everything I really love in my tank. My younger dog ate the body of one of my fish that didn't survive, and my oldest clam is kicking the bucket. The floor in my new condo isn't level, so I am the Shim Queen.

Pretty much everything that can go wrong, has gone wrong in this move. So to everyone who has gotten some frags off me in the last couple of months, you may be getting PMs asking for frags.

I'm off to visit a store to buy new carbon, because of course it got destroyed in the move!

/rant of utter frustration.

[fencer]

Oh Man that hurts....

Sorry too hear that Catherine..but things always get better

W

[SeaShell]

Oh, Catherine, I'm so sorry to hear the move hasn't gone well. I know it's hard, but keep positive......

[Delphinus]

Oh no :( So sorry!! I hope things start to settle out. If there's anything I can do to help please let me know.

[michika]

Thank you everyone for your kind words.

I think I will loose 3 clams, and probably 1/4 - 1/3 of my SPS. There is still some flesh on some colonies/frags and I'm doing my best just to leave them alone to see if they heal or improve. At this point I think fragging larger pieces would cause more harm then good.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Oh no. Catherine, I don't work tomorrow or Tuesday. If you need help, just ask!

[Joe Reefer]

Ah that sux.

[michika]

The die off seems to have stabalized now.

I had to come back to Edmonton to work, so the tank is being watched right now, and hopefully it will start to recover in the next few weeks.

Thank you again for all the offers of help, it is very much so appreciated.

[michika]

I now rename this system the Tank O' Death. Everytime I look into the tank a new SPS frag or colony is dead. When I packed up my little 24g I had 94 different types of sps and about 10 duplicates. I will be surprised if I have 35 left.

I am running carbon, there is very good flow in the system, and the skimmer is doing a good job of cleaning everything out. I am running both actinics and MHs on a reducced photo period, 6 hours a day. The tank also stinks, like die off.

There is no sand in the system anymore, and nothing, including the rock, was out of water for more then possibly 30 seconds in the move. Everything was shipped in water.

All the fish are alive and seem to be doing well. I see less of them though because they have more places to hide. The chromis love the flow and are playing in it constantly.

Any thoughts on why I'm having this wave of SPS death?

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Catherine, have you run the typical tests? What are your levels at?

[Delphinus]

The only thing I can think of is that you're having a mini-cycle (well .. maybe not even all that "mini"). Compounding this is that the die-off from the cycle perpetuates that much more. If that's the case, the fish may likely weather the storm but who knows how bad the corals will do. The key is to get the tank stabilized. I don't know if these things work but everytime I have a tank disruption I dump some Cycle in. Whether it does anything or not I can't say, but if nothing else I get the feeling that I've "done something about it." Maybe some Reef-resh or Probidio or something that infuses and feeds bacterial growth might not hurt. I don't know.

Best of luck. :(

[michika]

Yup and here they are:

SG: 1.025
pH: 8.0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Ammonia: 0.75 <-- I don't know where its coming from, there is nothing dead in the tank.
dKH: 8
Magnesium: 1050ppm
Calcium: 400ppm
Smell: Nasty, like a fish cleaning station.

So my next steps are:
- maybe a water change (I just added 15g of NSW)
- visit a store and look for an ammonia spong.
- toss in my various sponges, nitrate, and phosphate.
- continue to run carbon

I guess my question is where in the city is there a wide varity of dry goods to choose from?

[michika]

It just gets better and better...

My pump is now leaking from the bearings. I have to go find a 2" threaded cap... so where can I go for such a thing? The Rona in Edmonton didn't have caps.

I hope all this bad luck translates into something fantastic, like say a big lotto win, or having everything that is left in my tank live.

[Edmonton Eskimo]

jeez Catherine I'm sorry to hear about this. When the frags I got from you are bigger you can definately have some.

[Psyire]

This is horrible and am sorry to hear about it.

May I suggest finding someone to take the remaining SPS off your hands until you get the tank settled down? Then you'll hopefully avoid further losses.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Where in the city are you, Catherine? With the roads the way they are, you certainly don't want to be running around all over the place. Maybe we can direct you to the nearest best place for dry goods and plumbing.

[michika]

I am in Calgary now. I went to the plumbing place suggested in my Calgary thread and got what I needed. I also sent off an email to Reeflow about my leaking pump, they said they will send out a replacement seal kit, but won't give me an ETA.

Even more SPS have RTNed in the hour I was out. I am fully expecting to loose everything at this point in time. I am putting out a post in the Calgary forum to see if anyone will take my still living SPS and house them for a few weeks until I can get things back to where they should be.

[michika]

Okay, so I have accepted the disaster, and I am moving on. I'll post up today's parameters later this afternoon.

What I did;
- took out about 1/4 of a 5g bucket of skeletons.
- added Prime to the water to combat the ammonia
- added in new nitrate, and phosphate sponges

What I am going to do:
- water changes at 5g a day to avoid shocking the system any more
- keep feeding the fish a variety of foods to try and keep their immune systems strong.
- add more rock to the system. Even though I only have 4 more gallons of total water volume, my tank looks empty with my existing rock.

So after all is said and done I'm now searching out and making a list of what I would like to re-stock my system with in the future. I'm thinking I probably won't be adding anything until at least the new year so I have some time to plot it all out.

I know I would like to aquire more clams, some dersa, crocea, and squamosa. I also know that I would like to replenish my SPS collection, and possibly add a few softies for contrast.

Provided all my fish survive this unexpected disaster, I won't be adding anything. I will most likely add additional clean up crew members though.

On Friday, or Saturday I will try and post some photos of before, during, and after the disaster.

[michika]

Today's parameters:

SG: 1.025
pH: 8.1
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Ammonia: 0.75 Still
Smell: Better, but still a bit funky

I'm going to have a water change done on the tank today, I'm hoping for 5-7g.

[michika]

Photos of the disaster.

Just after I got all the fish, rock, clams, and corals into the tank. This is prior to turning the Snapper pump on, and bringing the sump online.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0417.jpg

The sump before it was filled with cheato, reactors, and filter floss.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0443.jpg

First moments of the overflow in use.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0493.jpg

Noticing something is wrong with the SPS, and the two clams in the right hand corner.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0445.jpg

FTS of the beginning of the disaster.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0491.jpg

The first of 3 pails of dead skeletons.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0510.jpg

Aquascaping and remaining SPS. More RTN.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0517.jpg

The tank today. I have what can only be described as the beginning of a cycle.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0060.jpg

The tank o-death in its full glory.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0059.jpg

I'm doing what I can to just keep things under control at this point in time. It really sucks....

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Oh wow....:s I've been trying to think of why your ammonia spiked like that. Was there maybe lots of sponge on the rocks that died after exposure to air? PUZZLING.

Either way, wow...I'm sorry for all that loss! The bucket of skeletens was tragic.

[michika]

I'm still trying to figure it out. It just kills me to not know. I am so glad I pulled out the buckets separately, becuase if they all came out in one bucket at once, I probably would have cried.

There probably isn't any harm in leaving the remaining skeletons in the tank is there?

[marie]

I'm still trying to figure it out. It just kills me to not know. I am so glad I pulled out the buckets separately, becuase if they all came out in one bucket at once, I probably would have cried.

There probably isn't any harm in leaving the remaining skeletons in the tank is there?

While there is probably no harm in leaving the skeletons, it is a sad reminder of the disaster. If it were me I think I would remove them (or at least hide them) :cry:

[michika]

I'm thinking of tossing all the skeletons into my sump, and using the empty clam shells to create pod piles. I agree with you though, I would prefer them hidden as not to be constantly reminded of the disaster.

[niloc16]

really sorry to hear about that. i too have used salt buckets lately for dead corals. it really really sucks.

[michika]

really sorry to hear about that. i too have used salt buckets lately for dead corals. it really really sucks.

I saw, and I felt so bad for you. I just can't imagine it happening in a very well established tank like yours. At least most of mine were all large frags, or small colonies.

[robzilla]

that sucks :(

[cprowler]

That really sucks Catherine, I recently lost two large colonies that I had for years along with a few other smaller ones. I feel for ya.

[michika]

That really sucks Catherine, I recently lost two large colonies that I had for years along with a few other smaller ones. I feel for ya.

I saw the photos, and they were nice colonies.

[michika]

I think my tank now qualifies for radioactive status. The algae on the bottom of the tank, and on the sides has become neon in color....

I can now say I see some humor in the situation.

[i2ik]

Sorry Catherine for your lost! Did you used some used water? at least 50% of your old water for the new tank?

A water change of 25-30% would help keeping the amoniac low.

Again, sorry for the disaster :(

[michika]

Sorry Catherine for your lost! Did you used some used water? at least 50% of your old water for the new tank?

A water change of 25-30% would help keeping the amoniac low.

Again, sorry for the disaster :(

I used about 75% old water and 25% new water when I set the system back up.

Thank you for your condolences.

[Doug]

Sheez, thats terrible Catherine. Sorry about the loss of your beautiful corals. Its a strange hobby sometimes.

[michika]

Dear tank,

Please stop being such a death trap of disasters.


No love,

Me


This mornings drama:
- another clam dead
- the pump is making funny noises.
- it is retaining the radioactive green color everywhere.
- I can't do anything about the pump or the green color (I removed the clam corpse) until I finish my stupid term paper. URG!

So...if I had to...where in the city would I get a replacement Reeflo Snapper pump on such short notice?

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Oi. No idea here....sorry I'm not much help :( Do you need anyone to keep anything else so nothing more dies?...until you get it all figured out?

I have a Little Giant 3-MDQX-SC inline pump sitting in my closet if you need something in a pinch.

[michika]

I'm thinking I may want someone to take my remaining two clams now. They seem to be unaffected still, but I don't want to chance it any longer. They are big clams, ~6" each. Maybe my fish too?

I just don't know anymore. Thoughts?

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Catherine, I'm not sure I would personally risk it. Obviously if a clam just died, then there's something still going on. What kinds of clams are these?

[michika]

The remaining clams are a gigas, and a dersa. The one that died was a smaller dersa, about 3" in length.

I agree something is still going on. I'm thinking its a cycle like Tony originally suggested, and have been treating it as such. Ideas on what I should do? I've been doing daily 7g water changes, keeping all my media fresh (nitrate, phosphate, ammonia sponges, hypersorb, and carbon). This is so frustrating. What else could I be doing?

Between my paper and this tank drama, it is not a good day!

[kwirky]

it costs $$ but you could convert to zeovit? I had amazing nitrate reduction within 3 days of starting the system. Now 2 weeks later it's undetectable nitrates in the new tank. U need a skimmer though. It costs about $160 to start up on a tank your size if you build your own reactor (which isn't too hard). $80 if you don't dose K+ (potassium).

Not guaranteed it'll help your situation as fast as you need it to though; it's quite the committment to a "new" style of aquarium keeping if it's only to take care of an immediate emergency...

[michika]

Zeo isn't for me. I researched it back when I started planning out this tank, and the financial commitment is too much. My tank used to be self sufficient, paying for everything I needed through frag & equipment sales. Thanks for the suggestion though. I am eagerly watching your build though to see how it all plays out. Lets say I would go the zeo route and suck up the cost, how do you think it would help my current issue? I know you mentioned lower nitrates.I don't have any nitrates now, I just keep the sponge in there in case there really is a cycle going on. Anything else you think it would help with?

I definitely would consider putting out the cash for zeo provided that I know it will work. The downside is that I'm not sure if I want to be on a long term program like. I could always wean my tank off of it right?

[Delphinus]

Zeo (or equivalent) seems to be about "helping along" the bacteria that help stabilize a tank. Now the advertised benefit is a reduction of nitrate and phosphate, and although you may not have a nitrate buildup, it still is bacteria that reduces ammonia into nitrite and nitrite into nitrate, so maybe it's possible that these could be helped along too. (I'm just guessing, I don't really "know").

FWIW I bought into Reef-resh (which is like "Zeo light") for about $150. You don't need a reactor and there are dosing instructions for daily dosing, or a lazier approach for weekly dosing. It might be something to look into. I was pretty impressed with how fast I started seeing results.

[michika]

I always thought, or understood Zeo, and similar products, to be about ensuring the right balance of beneficial bacteria, to keep the tank on that razor edge. I remember the benefits being lowered levels of pretty much everything as well, hence my earlier question.

Does it still sound and look like a cycle to you? Its been a LONG time since I've delt with a cycle first hand, so I'm not really sure about it.

Both Zeo and Reef-resh are available at Golds correct?

[Matt]

First, condolences. This is suckage extreme.

Second, I don't see how this could be a cycle. Immediate deaths at that scale says "toxin" to me. Did you use any new glues, cleaners, solvents,e tc. during the build? Did something get dropped in accidentally during the switchover?

I've never <knock on wood> had to deal with this kind of tragedy, so these are just guesses. I think I'd have broken the tank down and set up a QT tank by now.

[kwirky]

yeah zeovit takes quite a committment and the costs do add up. I've never experienced a cycle so fast as the zeovit cycle happening in my aquarium now though. The initial buy-in and the potassium dosing is the pricey part. Potassium's so expensive :cry:. Zeovit and reef-fresh and the like have a lot of skepticism but at least it's not as strange as vodka dosing :lol:

I think one of the problems is the lack of test kits that have a range of 0.0 to 0.5 ppm nitrate. A few articles in advanced aquarist talked about testing that low. I had wierd algae stuff going on in my previous tank when introducing rock or pulling the rock out of the water and resubmersing it. Nitrates would test 0 on a salifert kit but I had this hunch there was enough in there for some algae types.

[michika]

First, condolences. This is suckage extreme.

Second, I don't see how this could be a cycle. Immediate deaths at that scale says "toxin" to me. Did you use any new glues, cleaners, solvents,e tc. during the build? Did something get dropped in accidentally during the switchover?

I've never <knock on wood> had to deal with this kind of tragedy, so these are just guesses. I think I'd have broken the tank down and set up a QT tank by now.

Nothing new, just the same usual products. 100% silicone, no anti-fungal. No solvents in the tank, other then freshwater for the initial leak tesk in August, and again in November.

Everything went from my 24g to salt buckets, then from closed salt buckets into the new system. If anything got in it must have been after the tank was set up. There was no RTN or signes until 2 days after the initial set up.

The strange thing though is that the only things that have died are SPS, and smaller clams (all under 4"). All my inverts and fish are fine, and that includes snails, and my cowry. Do you know of anything that only attacks SPS or clams? Any ideas on what the toxin may be if its not touching inverts or fish?

[michika]

yeah zeovit takes quite a committment and the costs do add up. I've never experienced a cycle so fast as the zeovit cycle happening in my aquarium now though. The initial buy-in and the potassium dosing is the pricey part. Potassium's so expensive :cry:. Zeovit and reef-fresh and the like have a lot of skepticism but at least it's not as strange as vodka dosing :lol:

I think one of the problems is the lack of test kits that have a range of 0.0 to 0.5 ppm nitrate. A few articles in advanced aquarist talked about testing that low. I had wierd algae stuff going on in my previous tank when introducing rock or pulling the rock out of the water and resubmersing it. Nitrates would test 0 on a salifert kit but I had this hunch there was enough in there for some algae types.

I guess my first plan is to find out what is causing the problems in my tank and go from there. Zeo sounds like its more of a long term "solution". If I understand it correct it would take 2 weeks or longer for me to start seeing results?

I guess my next step is to test my parameters again today, do my normal 5g water change and then what?

[Doug]

Nothing new, just the same usual products. 100% silicone, no anti-fungal. No solvents in the tank, other then freshwater for the initial leak tesk in August, and again in November.

Everything went from my 24g to salt buckets, then from closed salt buckets into the new system. If anything got in it must have been after the tank was set up. There was no RTN or signes until 2 days after the initial set up.

The strange thing though is that the only things that have died are SPS, and smaller clams (all under 4"). All my inverts and fish are fine, and that includes snails, and my cowry. Do you know of anything that only attacks SPS or clams? Any ideas on what the toxin may be if its not touching inverts or fish?

Thats sounds like an alkalinity jump. Not saying thats your problem but a spike in alkalinity would cause those exact symptoms. Was all the new water run through a DI. I had a simialr problem several years ago. Filled 1/2 my 170 with old water & half with new water. Although using an ro unit, my well water was high in alkalinity, unknown to me. That, along with the high alk. Instant Ocean had then, nuked my clams and all my sps.

I blamed it on everything else under the sun but later we figured out what the problem was.

[michika]

Very interesting.

I did use a new salt to mix up some new water for a water change just before this all happened. I used Red Sea Coral Pro, then switched over to Ocean Pro Pure the night before the disaster started.

I use RO/DI to do all my water, and I even brought fresh RO/DI with me back from Edmonton to avoid a shock. I guess I will be testing both my water here, and once I mix up OPP. Thanks for chiming in. If it is this, then the mystery will be solved.

How did you eventually find out this is what it was, and did your tank do the same cycle thing as mine is? Did you just ride it out?

[Delphinus]

Yeah, sorry, I thought I mentioned this but I guess I didn't. I would think even a bacterial system will still take a least a week before producing any results, and you have a more immediate problem on hand.

I actually do still think this is a cycle. Whatever the cause, it's a cycle now, but I think it's even just a cycle that's self-escalating. (2-3 pages back you've got your parameters listed - and ammonia is present..) But the more I think of it, I think it's just that the move was enough to disrupt the processes, and a little cycle turned into a big cycle as things started letting go.

As for SPS and smaller clams in particular, these guys tend to be the most sensitive so, unfortunately, it makes sense to me that they are the first to let go.

I think at this point what you need to do is get whatever's left, that's still of a sensitive nature, out of there for a week or two. If you have any SPS left then those, and your remaining two clams, should probably be moved into an established tank. Softies might be able to weather this storm but I can't say for sure.

I think what your tank needs is basically just enough stability for the processes to re-establish themselves. It could take a few weeks but I'm sure it will settle out. It's just the "what do you do with the livestock" in the meantime.

PM me or call me if you want to use some of my tank space. I cannot guarantee survival but I'd do my best...

[michika]

The only things still "alive" in the tank are the fish, clean-up crew, and the two clams. :(

You have PM.

[christyf5]

Just my two cents, but in a tank that is smaller like that, no doubt when one acro goes it can trigger the others. The living inverts indicate its not heavy metals or the silicone as you've already ticked off on your list.

How was the temperature swing during the move? Did everything get a long acclimation? My experience shows that acros don't like big swings in temp (lost half a tank that way). Also clams don't like acro deaths in a big tank or the other way around as well (I've experienced both of those too).

If I were you I'd get those clams out of there to someone elses tank, preferably a tank with nothing else in it (I hear Tony has an empty tank:biggrin: ). Its better than nothing. Then run carbon in a canister filter/phosban reactor or something and change it out every 3-4 days or so and do lots of water changes.

Hope you get this licked, its bad enough having to move a tank but to have major losses as well, that just sucks :neutral:

[michika]

I'm in the process of making arrangements for the clams. I think it would be the second to last straw if they went, last straw being my fish.

There wasn't a lot of a temperature swing. When I put everything in the display, the old rock, old water, etc. I had a reading of 74-75. I brought the tempterature back up to 78 over the course of I think 4-5ish hours (I went to bed at 2am).

I'll keep going as I am then, water changes, rotating media, etc.

Thank you everyone for your input!

[michika]

I just cleaned my glass for the third time today...its time to reduce the photoperiod in my tank...and start wishing this thing ends quickly.

[Doug]

If you used a DI, then thats removes any high alkalinity, so it should not be the same problem, unless it was a bad salt mix.

I figured it out, much later, like almost a couple years, after having all kinds of problems with my tanks in that particular house. Partly from reading Instant Ocean threads. I also, stupidly thought my ro was removed any alkaline well water, plus it went through a sofener first. However it was not. I have a friend who had a similar problem and it was corrected by adding the di resin.

I dont believe my tank cycled again. It had a lot of rock and I was running my turf scrubber also. All my soft coral, fish & inverts were fine. I removed everything that never looked good. Man, did those large clams stink.

Of course its just my guess thats what my problem was, although we kind of proved it years later.

However, your DI should prevent that. Perhaps when you mix up a fresh batch of saltwater, see what the alk. is.

Other than that it could have just beed the move. Sps seem to get upset so easy and along with smaller clams are fairly sensitive to changes. Some of the sps tanks going down on RC would make you scratch your head. And most for no know reason.

I see some other post while I was typing this one said the same regarding sps & clams. I would not think a temp. change of that amount would start it. Most are colder than that when coming in to a lfs.

[michika]

Clams do stink! That smell is just so nasty and unique, you defnitely know what happened the moment it reaches your nose. Just thinking about it spikes my gag reflex.

[MitchM]

If you don't mind an out-of-the-blue opinion...

I didn't see in this thread how your move progressed, but I think that the only thing that could have prevented the terrible losses would have been the presence of MUCH more cured, mature live rock to help support all the corals and clams in your system.
I don't think that the amount of live rock and some old water alone had the capacity to support all that life.
If your old water was transported from Edmonton, how did the bacteria in it survive? It may have been dead already when you put it in the tank in Calgary.
I think Tony's right - it's cycling now.

Mitch

[michika]

Mitch,

Can you explain further what you mean about more mature rock? The bulk of the existing rock is about 4 years old. There was approximately 45 pounds in the previous tank, and this tank is only 4g larger then my previous system.

The rock was all in water, and it was in a heated car for the whole trip. I don't think the bacteria would have died between Edmonton and Calgary by just the move.

I'm confused about your opinion, can you clarify it more please?

[michika]

The remaining clams are in a new temporary home and I have opted to ride out the remainder of whatever this is.

Tonight there was another water change, to the tune of 10g instead of the usual 7g. The crazy neon green algae is still making frequent appearances. I had to clean my glass 5, yes 5 times, between when my MH came on this morning and when they shut of. Needless to say I have reduced my photoperiod.

[MitchM]

Hi Catherine,

Looking at the size of your system, it looks like it is relatively small for the amount of life that you have in there.
When you think about it, by moving, you basically turn off the lights, heaters and restrict gas exchange for 7 hours, set it up again and hope that it recovers alright.
If your system was running at pretty much full capacity before the move, the support system (live rock, mature water, plus removal of a sand bed) wasn't able to both recover itself and help the corals and clams recover as well.


It would have been interesting to know what the water temperatures and ammonia readings were after the drive.

Something didn't make it - as evidenced by the cycle happening now. I think that more mature live rock - even with new salt water, may have helped the system recover better.

Moving a reef tank has got to be the most difficult task for a reefer to do.

Mitch

[michika]

Its always possible. This is like my 8th tank move and this is the first time I've ever had anything negative happen in the least.

To answer your questions about the temperature and ammonia, it was 76, and 0. The temperature reading was taken about 10 minutes after I got to my new place, and the ammonia, probably 3 hours later (give or take).

Thank you though for clarifying your original post.

[michika]

An update from yesterday:

Lights came on today and all my fish are still alive. My shrimp molted, and my urchin is still pretty fiesty.

Something very cool, yet sad at the same time, is that some of my frags and colonys still have polyps, but no flesh. I now wonder how many frags/colonies I removed that weren't 100% dead. I am also seeing zoas opening up (I didn't even know I had these), which is a good sign. My remaining clams have gone to stay elsewhere until everything is resolved. Thank you Tony for watching over them.

The neon green algae on the glass isn't so neony anymore, and so far I haven't yet had to clean my glass. This is a huge improvement of the multiple cleanings the tank required yesterday.

Parameters:
SG: 1.025
Ammonia: 0.75
Nitrate: 0
Nitrite: 0.10?
pH: 8.1

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0004.jpg

[michika]

The tank today

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0007.jpg

I need to deal with the micro bubbles asap!

Does anyone have, or have you tried, those little feeding rings that keep all the floating foods in one area? I can't turn my pump off to feed (design flaw), and want to try and minimize wasted food.

I also need to add to my skeleton crew, aka my clean up crew. I'm thinking a bunch of snails maybe?

The GHA is returning too...not cool at all.

A few more photos of survivors:

Candycane - it was just a skeleton with a slight overlay of flesh yesterday, and today its all puffed up and much happier looking.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0026-1.jpg

Some zoas I didn't even know that survived. I have 3 types of zoas and I was sure two of them had already gone to the big tank in the sky.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0023-2.jpg

Cactus coral, probably my oldest coral from before the disaster! It was bleached and I was sure it was dead last week. I didn't remove it and today the color is returning, no polyp extension yet.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0024.jpg

I think today I will clean out the remaining skeletons and just clean up the tank a bit more.

[michika]

Things seem to be on the up and up lately, so I'm feeling much better about the future of my tank. With time I'm sure I will have a positive outcome from the disaster.

Good things!
- Canopy is here, and it is beautiful
- Toe kick is here, it just finishes out the system.
- Added more clean up crew members!
- Filter socks on their way to deal with microbubbles
- I have pocket money and it feels SO strange, but in a good way.

Not So Good things
- I don't see any pods in my system anymore
- I should have bought more snails, oh well!
- I have a lighting dilemma (see further down)
- The seal kit I ordred early December for my Snapper Pump has not arrived, I will be buying a new pump this week if its not here by Tuesday.

I have to say the customer service is disapointing when it comes to getting my pump repaired. I am now unsure if I should replace my exisiting pump with one of the same brand. :sad:

Lighting Dilemma!
I got my canopy and it is awesome, but I now I have an unexpected choice to make and would love some input please.

I have two options; 1 MH light on a luminarc reflector supplimented by actinic PCs, or 2MH lights on two batwing reflectors, again supplimented by actinic PCs.

As Drew (Der_Iron_Chef) was nice enough to point out 1MH consumes less energy and creates less heat! On the flip side I wonder if 1MH is going to be enough light overall.

Sorry, no photos right now.

[Delphinus]

Any FTS? I want to see this toe-kick thing.

Pods will come back... hang in there. They always do. And snails, well, you can always get more snails (as if you really needed a reason to keep visiting the LFS's and ordering stuff MO, right? :p )

As for your lighting .. I'm guessing this won't be for a 28g. :lol: I'm not sure what size you were thinking for the tank? That may influence your choice of reflector (or the "1 vs 2" argument). 1 may be less energy+heat than 2, but the flip side is you can probably get away with smaller wattages if you went with 2. Ie., instead of a single 400, you could go 2x250. Or even 2x175 if the tank was not very deep. Technially 2x250 > 400 but only by 100W, that's not that's terrible.

I dunno. There are so many choices when it comes to lighting it gets overwhelming to sift through it all sometimes.

One thought though: I'd probably consider T5's over PC's. The lamp replacement cost alone trumps that one. I've been wanting to switch to T5's for my FW tank for ages (my last PC holdout) because it's a question of $20 lamps versus $40 lamps. :neutral: Seems the cost to get into T5 initially is more but the long-term costs, I think, are less. Anyhow just a thought. Plus I'm not real sure about the PC actinics, a lot of them just seem like blue lights to me. I'm sure there are "real actinics" out there but .. definitely some that aren't.

[michika]

Yeah your right, I probably don't need more excuses to visit more stores!

The lighting actually is for the 28g. I found I have more space then I thought and now I have the choice. I have 175w MH now with two actinics, but I find that the 175w is too far from the water surface to get all the areas I need with just the batwing reflector.

If I could do t5s I would, but I already have the PCs, and I don't really want to put out any $ for T5s at this very moment. I also have a PC size that is just perfect for my system 13", so I want to stick with them for as long as I can get bulbs!

What would you do? Go 2x 175w MH in batwing reflectors, one on each side of the tank, or o 1x 175w MH in a luminarc? With the luminarc the light hits the tank in all the right places, but I worry that it isn't bright enough on the sides.

[Delphinus]

LOL - what you need is two mini Lumenarcs over that tank. :p

I dunno, maybe two batwing reflectors? Seems to me two big lumenarcs would be overkill..

Maybe try the single lumenarc. Unless it looks horrid having the sides dimmer, it could just be a zone for things that like less light (brain corals, maybe some monti's, etc. - that sort of thing).

[michika]

Here is the FTS, and some other photos.

I'll start with the lighting photos because I really want to sort this out before boxing day.

With the single batwing I have lots of shadows from the lockline, and if you put your hand in, its a PITA to see anything below your hand.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0007-1.jpg

Before today's clean up
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_4-1.jpg

After
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0002.jpg

Post Cleaning left side
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0003-1.jpg

Post Cleaning middle
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0004-1.jpg

Post cleaning right side
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0005-1.jpg

View from the left side:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0014-1.jpg

View from the right side:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0013.jpg

The good thing is that the microbubbles will be solved on Thursday, so I hope to have a nice clear tank by Friday.

Some final shots:

The detritus that I found under all the remaining skeletons. I siphoned some out, and I hope to take care of the rest later today or tomorrow.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0015-2.jpg

Shrimp!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0016.jpg

The last bucket of skeletons to be pulled out. A lot of them had GHA on them so everything just came out, and I am deciding how to deal with it.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0017.jpg

[michika]

Caught in the act!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0026-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/PICT0027-1.jpg

[michika]

A week worth of skimmate;

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0001.jpg

The tank is chugging along. Things seemed to have plateaued at this point. No improvements in anything, water parameters included. Its a bit disheartening not to see any changes in what was supposed to be my dream nano system.

I'm still plagued by microbubbles, and while I was hoping to have the problem solved last week, plans changed. I now need to make another trip to the hardware store as I'm going to replumb my skimmer as well as using filter socks in the future.

[Skimmerking]

good to hear Catherine, I will make ya a deal once i'm back from Afghanistan if you are looking for a bigger tank you come down to manitoba and I will give you my 120 gal with tank and stand if you want too.

If ya want too. since I will have my cube going I hope by then .....next summer once I get back but your going to have to give me ahand to load the other tank...

[Pan]

What do you think your snapper pumps head loss is with that manifold you built? I am thinging of doing something similar, though maybe half around tank instead of full. But my overflow is 1300-1600 gph...so i might need to go up to a dart...just trying..quite unsuccesfully to do the numbers in my head.

[michika]

good to hear Catherine, I will make ya a deal once i'm back from Afghanistan if you are looking for a bigger tank you come down to manitoba and I will give you my 120 gal with tank and stand if you want too.

If ya want too. since I will have my cube going I hope by then .....next summer once I get back but your going to have to give me ahand to load the other tank...

:lol: :mrgreen: I would love another larger tank!

What do you think your snapper pumps head loss is with that manifold you built? I am thinging of doing something similar, though maybe half around tank instead of full. But my overflow is 1300-1600 gph...so i might need to go up to a dart...just trying..quite unsuccesfully to do the numbers in my head.

I love it, aside from the leaking problem. The headloss isn't all that bad, but now that the system is up and running and the rocks are in the system, I could have gone to a Dart.

The manifold works well for two reasons; it provides a lot of flow throughout the tank, and not just in a few areas, and its adjustable. The downside so far though is that the lockline is causing some shadowing, but I think that is more of a lighting issue then anything.

If you can, go for the Dart. You can always choke it back with no harm to the pump. Is this for your big system you just bought? Is it in Didsbury? We are coming out through Didsbury on the 26th!

[Pan]

Yep its for the big system. I was going to go with a mag 18 for a return, but then i would need to plug up the bulkheads in the sump. I figure about 4-5 feet vertical and maybe 2 feet horizontal for head loss. I was thinking the snapper, but was afraid it would be cut back to much with a manifold. The sump has a bulkhead very near or the same as the inlet size on the dart/snapper so figured it would be easy, plus i like the energy ratings of the snapper. So many choices....but for 171 vs 234 at jl it mkes it even harder to decide. I've heard good things about both pumps...but i think with the head loss the mag would be underpowered. I have also decided to not really utilize the baffles in my sump and to fill the water over them. I think to much of the sump is wsted withthe heaght of the baffles that are in it now. I have to work boxing day :(
Now i hafta run out and get some epoxy to finish up my stand. Good christmas project :)





EDIT: I cannot spell, I aplogize but i don't feel much like fixing the inumerable errors...

[michika]

I understood what you were saying, so errors or not, it doesn't matter. Sorry about having to work Boxing Day, that does suck. Maybe with that setup look at the Dart. I know the purchase costs between the two are just $5-10 apart. From what it sounds like I would probably go with a Dart on the system you described.

You should start your own tank journal, with photos! Then we can all watch the progress.

[Skimmerking]

I was just looking at your webpage Catherine. Have you thought about the black sand that you had in your tank, caused the bloom of algae

[michika]

I was just looking at your webpage Catherine. Have you thought about the black sand that you had in your tank, caused the bloom of algae

Yeah I looked into it. I can safely rule it out now though. I still have GHA and I have no sand. That sucks though. I do however have a better idea considering I moved and some parameters changed. I'm now thinking that whatever parameters were constant before and after the move may be to blame, e.g. the rock, the fish, etc. as they were the same before and after the move.

I'm glad nobody is coming over here for the holidays....my tank is a bit drab to look at. Maybe I should print out photos of prettier tanks and tape them up over my glass? :mrgreen:

[michika]

More bad news...

- My sixline wrasse died. I'm not sure what happened, it was fine on Wednesday morning, and on Thursday I found the corpse. There wasn't enough left of the fish to even guess what happened.
- The neon green algae has returned and its stronger then ever.
- The cactus coral died, and I had high hopes for its recovery.
- My urchin died.

All water parameters test normal, ammonia, nitrate, nitrite all at 0ppm. I'm trying to convince someone to head out to one of the boxing day sales on my behalf to pick up stuff. Nothing like getting sick on the ONE day you have to shop all the holiday sales.

[michika]

I'm going to pre-face this post with a huge thank you to Snappy. I was over to pick up macro algae yesterday and came home with a few beautiful SPS peices to get me started again. They all look great, polyps out and everything. Thank you very much Greg for your kindness.

I'm finally getting a change to start dosing Aqua Connect's Energy Elements product. I now have a very small collection of SPS and my water parameters have been all in line for some time. Why not start now while I repopulate my system.

So today's parameters (Jan. 6th)
SG 1.025
Nitrate, Nitrite, and Ammonia 0ppm
Mg 1500
dKH 10
Ca 500

I started using Ocean Pro Pure salt in December, and so far without running reactors I'm finding all my levels are a bit high for my liking. I think I will be switching back to Red Sea Pro after I finish with this experiment. However I don't want to skew any results by switching back now.

I'm using all three products 1, 2, and 3. The recomended dosing is 1mL per 100l, which converts to about 1mL per 26g. Per the website this is assuming a heavily populated coral tank. Since my tank currently isn't well populated I'm cutting down my dosage to 1/4 of the recommendation, so 0.5ml per 50g.

The website claims to do the following;
-enhance the intensity of colors
-support a better growth
-enhance vitality
-improve the appearance of the polyps
-not boost algae growth

Photos. I'm going to try and photograph each coral at least once a month, and post FTS one a week. If I can offer more frequent photos, I will.

Today's FTS:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0041.jpg

from today:
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0014-2.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0012-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0018-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0020.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0021-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0027-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0032.jpg

[michika]

Today is the 3rd day of dosing and I think I'm already seeing some minor results. So far I'm just seeing increased polyp extension on all the sps, and my hammer coral is more inflated and elongated then it was before. Granted its very early in this test, but its nice to see results. On the other hand increased polyp extension could also be a sign of the SPS fully settling into my system.

[michika]

I switched out my (dirty) batwing reflector for a luminarc reflector tonight. The change is huge, however the drawback is the crazy shading from the reflector.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0007-2.jpg

I'm not sure if even moving the PC lights further to the sides is going to do anything for the shading. I can't see how to get any PC light to the center of the tank.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0008.jpg

Shot down the right side of the tank
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0010-1.jpg

SPS today after 3 days of dosing. I think all the polyps are out more in all my pieces, even ones I've had in the system for a month, or the surviving zoas and LPS.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0001-1.jpg

I've decided to go to 250w MH, regardless of the reflector. Its too hard to get 175w bulbs reliably, and I'm thinking of moving that setup onto my QT system. I just have to buy a ballast, which I'll do tomorrow.

Next up on my todo list:
- hook up kalk stirrer on the kalk. reactor (I'm sick of hand shaking)
- Swap out 175w ballast, and put in new 250w ballast and new bulb
- Re-plumb my skimmer
- Put in a new sump
- New drain design for the overflow

[Snappy]

Catherine you are very welcome, I hope things continue to turn around for you. I do recommend that the type of birdnest be kept in a low light area and it will get green hues through it and the polyps will turn green as well. It is a bit bleached from the location it was in high in my tank before I cut it down. The acros & digitata you got should colour up in no time under the strong light assuming your nitrates are kept in check. Anyway, let me know how those experimental pieces do and we can get you set up from there. Good luck.:biggrin:

[michika]

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely make sure that the birdsnest is placed low as I want to see those lovely greens again.

[Edmonton Eskimo]

I still haven't seen a full shot of everything! Why are you doing this to me:)

[Edmonton Eskimo]

I wonder if you can drop the actinics down even with the bottom of the reflector. This should eliminate some of the shading.

[michika]

I still haven't seen a full shot of everything! Why are you doing this to me:)

I'm doing 'cause I'm mean and like to tease you :lol:

The lights just came on so here you go. I'll take something nicer in the future after I'm done cleaning up the tank.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_3-2.jpg

[Edmonton Eskimo]

Nice! I'm glad it looks good. Now we just need to remove that growth from your camera lens... Oh wait that's a dog! Your dogs are such camera hogs:)

[michika]

Yeah they are bad, Matia is the worse though.

[Brent F]

I wonder if you can drop the actinics down even with the bottom of the reflector. This should eliminate some of the shading.

Another idea that might work - install them at a 45 degree angle low on the sides of your hood instead of the top. Might be able to get some light to the middle. Would need to play around to figure out what angle gets light to the middle without excessive light bouncing off the water surface.
________
FXR150 (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Suzuki_FXR150)

[michika]

Well I want to put the luminarc on a slider system, and maybe I can put the actinic down at the edge and tilt them like you suggested. I wonder if my actinics will even reach the center of the tank.

[Brent F]

Well I want to put the luminarc on a slider system, and maybe I can put the actinic down at the edge and tilt them like you suggested. I wonder if my actinics will even reach the center of the tank.

could work - Kind of like this?
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj252/Brent_F/lights.jpg
________
Honda RC161 (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Honda_RC161)

[michika]

That is awesome, and exactly what I was thinking. I'll have to make something to allow all the lighting to slide together on a slider. etc.

[michika]

This weeks update:
Parameters for January 13th
SG 1.025
Nitrate, Nitrite, and Ammonia 0ppm
phosphate 0.05mg/L
Mg 1380
dKH 10
Ca 500

I'm still dosing daily. I've also added a few more SPS to my system, and I've started using filter socks again. The other change I've made, is that the skimmer has been replumbed so the output is no longer right above the imput for the pump. Between the filter socks and the replumb I've seen about an 80% reduction in microbubbles. However, the bubbles do return if I put my hands in the tank for any reason.

Photos
Re-plumbing the skimmer. This is it before with its metric plumbing.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0113.jpg

Filing out the inside of a reducer
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0116.jpg

Reducer on the stand pipe.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0123.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0124.jpg

The new plumbing isn't the most graceful looking thing, but it gets the job done for now.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0125.jpg

Filter Socks after 2 days (yuck)
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0117.jpg

I still have a few more things to do to the system to get it to where I want it. I am excited to have a system again that will require little if any weekly maintenance (other then water changes, feeding, and dosing).

FTS and photos of my new aquisitions to follow.

[michika]

Today's FTS, it seems that the GHA is both spreading, and thickening. I am going to manually prune it later today. It seems like I have another GHA battle on my hands.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0019-1.jpg

This is some of SPS I aquired this week. I need to re-mount one of them, and find permanent homes for them in my rockwork. However, I don't like my aquascaping so I'm really iffy about gluing anything down.

New SPS
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0004-2.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0005-2.jpg

Existing corals.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0010-2.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0002-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0013-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0005-3.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0010-3.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0026-2.jpg

[Snappy]

Catherine that first new piece doesn't look too healthy. I recommend a whack of blue legged hermits to chow down the GHA. I could lend you 2 large guys that will eat that stuff.

[michika]

Actually this first new piece is supposed to be A. plana (http://wickedfrags.com/images/sps/Dec4_l_plana.jpg) Its bleached for sure in shipping. I already lost two pieces from my shipment, I'm waiting back on a reply about the losses.

You probably wouldn't know it from the photos but I have 35 blue hermits in the system, and I keep moving them onto the GHA. They have been pretty ineffective so far. Would you suggest more?

[Snappy]

Actually this first new piece is supposed to be A. plana (http://wickedfrags.com/images/sps/Dec4_l_plana.jpg) Its bleached for sure in shipping. I already lost two pieces from my shipment, I'm waiting back on a reply about the losses.

You probably wouldn't know it from the photos but I have 35 blue hermits in the system, and I keep moving them onto the GHA. They have been pretty ineffective so far. Would you suggest more?
Put some of them in your sump for a week or two so they are good and hungry and then place them where you want them to start eating.

[michika]

Okay sure. I'll try that today and see what happens.

[michika]

January 20th Update
Parameters today:
SG 1.023
Nitrate (Pinpoint monitor): Undetectable
Nitrite 0ppm
Ammonia 0ppm
phosphate (Hanna Colormeter) 0.01
Mg (salifert) 1190ppm
dKH 7
Ca (salifert) 420ppm

Things that are happening this week;

I noticed cyano forming last week in tiny patches, I siphoned it out. This week its back and its everywhere. Last time I delt with this was 2004 and I fixed it by correcting my then low dKH levels. This time around I don't really know what to do. I'm researching it again to see what new information has come out on dealing with it.

I am experiencing STN on my biggest colony of SPS. You can see in the photos below the fresh white skeleton showing through. In one photo there is cyano on the colony before I blew it off. I'm unsure if it is related or not to the dosing program I am on as it was fine prior to starting the program.

My surviving clams came back to me. Delphinius was kind enough to hold onto them while my tank settled back to where I wanted it. Its really nice to see them again. Both are open and the mandarin is happy to have his favorite hiding/hunting spot back again. I can't wait until I can add more clams in the future, I really miss my field of clams.

The tang that I was holding for a friend is now mine. I convinced him to trade the tang for a good meal. I am now the proud owner of a tang that EATS!! GHA. I'm planning a 6ft tank right now to move him to in the next month or so. The tang also taught my imperator angel to eat GHA, so I can't complain. :biggrin:

Speaking of the GHA its still proliferating. I manually prune about 1/4 cup every few days. Its not as thick as the GHA I delt with in my previous tank, so that is a bit of a relief. I'm slowly going to start moving out infested rocks so I can cook them. It is going to be a long and slow process, but I think it needs to be done.

I'm thinking that there are two possible sources that are feeding the GHA right now, a) my RO/DI itself, b) my rocks from my original first set up in 2004. The only rocks that do get covered with GHA are all rocks that I got in 2004 when I set up my first tank. I had to go back through all my photos to make this connection.

I did starve a bunch of my hermits in my sump as suggested, now that they've been returned to the tank I hope they start chowing down. My urchin has finally abanadoned the tank walls as his perfered spot. Instead he how hangs out on the rocks, sadly its the underside, rather then the tops with the GHA.:rolleyes:

FTS from Friday the 17th
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0019-2.jpg

FTS from today, the 20th
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0029.jpg

The imperator angel.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0050-1.jpg

Mandarin
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0043-1.jpg

Necrosis on my colony
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0031.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0046.jpg

Other corals in the tank
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0033.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0036.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0037.jpg

The clams, home at last.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0035.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0039.jpg

[sharuq1]

Very encouraging to see you have your clams back. Hope all the corals come back. Lovely angel and of course love the mandy. Is it a male or female? (just curious)

[michika]

Thank you. Its a huge improvement from say just prior to x-mas.

The mandarin is a male. I eventually want to find him a lady friend, but it seems like there are no females to be had.

[Delphinus]

My tank looks empty now :) But I'm happy your clams are back home where they belong! That is one of the nicest derasa's I've ever seen. If you ever decide you're tired of it .... :lol:

Sorry to hear about the one piece receding but your other frags are looking well (better than mine ... I'm tempted to try moving them out of the coral-nippers tank, but I'm a little paranoid about putting SPS in my other tanks!)

Gorgeous mandarin. Seems to me they come in bursts .. you'll see a whole bunch, then not for a while, then a bunch again .. if I see a female at any LFS I go to I'll let you know. :)

[michika]

Thank you!

I was really happy to get my clams back, they just add something to the tank that nothing else can. I guess the same goes for you, if you get tired of any of your clams, I'll happily take them!

[michika]

OMG!! Cyano and GHA are the bane of my tank's existence. The cyano now covers everything. It is smothering out, or trying to, get my surviving zoas, and some of my new SPS.

I added in a seio 2600 to the display to add more flow....something about this just isn't right.

I hate to say it, but I think my tank requires more flow. I think I need to pick up a bigger pump...as if a Snapper isn't big enough....So...who has a dart pump for sale?

Today I don't love reefkeeping as much as I used to.

[michika]

A brief, albeit photoless update for today, superbowl Sunday.

- The cyano got so bad it covered everythng in my tank. I had to blow it off the corals and the sides of the clam twice daily. The powerheads became covered in it. It was just horrific.
- I ended up stopping the use of Energy Elements on Wednesday January 30th and within two days the cyano had dropped back considerably. By today about 95% of the cyano has vanished. I will try again to use the Energy elements in two weeks and see if it again triggers the cyano.
- I'm still battling the GHA, I've swapped out my MH bulb, I'm running a shorter photo period, and I'm doing larger water changes each week, 14g a week rather then 7g. I'm still manually pruning the stuff.
- I am planning to change the tank around. I'm going to re-aquascape this week and see if I can't get things done a little better to combat the GHA. I'm going to cap off two of the returns to see if I can't get stronger flow from the Snapper pump, and more random currents.

[Skimmerking]

try doing a 100% water change are you running Phosban reactor on the tank..

[Snappy]

Catherine maybe try polyp-labs to reduce the nitrates.

[michika]

Thank you for the suggestions! I'll look into polyp labs when I next get a chance.

[michika]

I'm thinking perhaps this tank needs to be torn down and changed at this point. Things still aren't perking up regardless of what I've tried or done, sadly GHA seems the be the least of my worries right now.

Things I need to figure out how to address;
1) RTN its back! My large colony has RTNed, and two frags I picked up in January have died as well. Both frags were fine yesterday evening and gone this morning.

2) Mystery leak? or crazy evaporation. I am going through about 2g per day of water. While my SG remains constant (when I don't over top off), its a lot of water to be topping off. I'm concerned because of the quantity, however I don't see any negative/positive influences because of this.

3) GHA which is a problem in and of itself. I don't want to discuss it as I feel like I've spoken about it ad nausem.

4) Getting things to thrive and not just live. I've seen a color change in one of my frags, but I have seen no growth, not even nubs on anything else. Birdsnest and digitata has always been a quick grower for me, and nothing is growing.

These are today's parameters; they are also prior to today's water change
SG: 1.023 (low, I want 1.025)
pH: 8.1 (before lights on, same as lights on though)
Ca: 370
Mg: 1170
dKH: 5 (low)
Phos: 0.04 (its going up since last week's 0.01).
Nitrate: 1ppm (stayed the same from last week).
Nitrite: 0
Amm: 0
temp: 80.4

On a positive note though the cyano has disappeared, its only one one patch of zoas, and even then it seems to be receeding slowly. I did try to start dosing Energy Elements again, but I saw the return of cyano and immediately stopped dosing. The filter socks I purchased have also solved the microbubble problem, I'm really happy with this turn out, and gladly accept the trade off of cleaning them every other day. I'm looking into polyp labs right now as a potential solution to my tank's sad state. However, since I don't know what the problem is, I hesitate on how to fix anything. I also worry about constant dosing, I liked having a more or less hands free system. Should my upcoming changes not yeild any results by the end of the month I will be trying this. The bottom line is things aren't doing well. While my fish and clams thrive, nothing else (GHA aside) does, and I need to figure out how to fix this asap before the rest of my SPS die.

I think I will make a post in the reef section to solicite opinions on what else I can do. I am at such a loss and I'm very disapointed in how things are progressing. Depending on the responses I get, I will probably purchase polyp labs at the end of the month or early March and try that system. I will also try to do one major overhaul by removing all the rocks that have GHA and see what happens. Since I suspect the phosphates are being released by those old rocks, I'm going to try and remove them, and see if that solves the issue of GHA.

Photos later of before and after the changes as well as some of the RTN possibly.

[cprowler]

Hey Catherine, sorry to hear things still are not going well.

I wish I had a answer for you but I think the reason I have avoided some of these issues is just dumb luck. It sounds like you have been doing all the right things, doing your homework and getting good advice.

I am a fan of filter socks, I started using them again and have noticed a difference in water quality.

I have been using ReeFresh also and think it's beneficial for sure, I don't see all the benefits they claim but would rather use it than not.

I was having some minor issues with nuisance algae and cyano a while back and started using ozone and ReeFresh and things cleared up quite quickly. I have since taken the ozone off but would and may use it in the future if needed.

I'm sure things will start to turn around for you.

[digital-audiophile]

It's just one thing after another eh? :( At what point do you decide to just do a total take down, cook the rocks and start over?

[imisky]

hey michika,

when i used to get alot of cyano issues i would just dose carbon sources ( sugar, vinegar, vodka ) they all work after a day or two i usually see the cyano at close to none. and if continued to dose after that the GHA would start to turn white but that takes more time than the GHA, before taking the tank down i would give this a try maybe it'll be worth a shot

[michika]

Thanks everyone for the comments.

I'm starting to wonder if what I have is not GHA, and not bryopsis. I've tried my best to ID it via algaebase.org, but now I'm questioning my earlier ID.

At least I have some more options now! I've read a bit on vodka dosing, but not enough to feel comfortable doing it myself. I keep hearing dosing instructions along the lines of one for the tank, and two for me :D. Can anyone point me in the direction of a good thread on carbon dosing?

I have two hang ups on dosing products right now, and I'm finding it hard to get over them. 1) Dosing daily, its a bit of a pain, and 2) the monthly cost. Snappy said that he was looking at automating his dosing (I think), has anyone else done this? Anyone want to PM me or tell me what their approximate monthly cost is for using the polyp lab products?

We are experiencing rotating power/heat/phone outages today, I hear a substation in Douglasdale went down this morning. I'm trying to keep my tank temp up with heat packs in ziplock bags, and keeping the flow going with a power supply.

[michika]

It's just one thing after another eh? :( At what point do you decide to just do a total take down, cook the rocks and start over?

Its on the horizon....as in I'm starting my old cube back up in a week or so to try for a 28g tear down and rebuild if I don't have any success at the end of the month or early March. That is assuming I don't go a dosing route.

[Skimmerking]

Catherine I really think its in your rocks some must hav cause it to swing thewrong way, and ended up creating a bloom. why not take the rocks out and cook them or see if you can trade the rocks with a LFS , may be that will work. i fell realy bad for the way that your tank is going thur.. then have the corals in a tub with a light, run a basic system and cook the rocks

[michika]

Would you suggest exchanging all the rocks, or just the ones that have the GHA on them? There are really only 3 rocks that grow the GHA. The others don't get any growth.

Originally I wanted to take the dud rocks and put them into a dark sump, but now I'm mostly decided on cooking them in my storage closet for a couple of months.

[Skimmerking]

well take them out and have a tub connected to the sump and leave the rocks in total darkness.. that is a great idea. may be its your lights causign a bloom. what are you running for lights? Were the lights the same ones from the other tank? did this happen from the swap?

[Delphinus]

Going with Polyplaps is likely not going to have a profound effect on your tank. It is primarily a nitrate reducer. Since your tank is at 1ppm we pretty much can rule out nitrate as a cause of trouble here.

I don't think we can rule out PO4 though. I'm not sure what to think of the 0.04 reading. I get this kind of reading too on my tanks but the lack of a reference solution gives me this whole "how can I verify this number is correct" thing going on. I've been on the fence about ordering a Merck/D-D test kit but as time goes on and my PO4 numbers all over the map, I'm starting to think I'm going to have to bite the bullet and just order it.

It might not be the PO4 though either. Well, in so much that it's not the PO4 in the water column. There may be PO4 trapped in the rocks though and it's slowly leeching out, fueling the GHA.

The lack of coraline on the one rock to the front left there is something that catches my notice everytime I see a photo of your tank. I realize it has some, but ... I dunno, the rock looks white to me. When I set up my 20g back in December, I pulled rock out of my rubbermaid curing tub. It's been sitting there for months and was devoid of any coraline, was more or less pure white. I did get some minor hair algae growth after a few weeks but after about a month it was mostly pinks and purples due to coraline coverage, and where the coraline takes hold, the GHA doesn't. So it's odd to me that this one rock isn't more covered in reds and pinks and so on.

I think, were this my tank, I'd be looking at swapping out most, if not all of the rock. The existing rock should be thrown into a bucket for cooking (just let it sit in some SW with a heater and change out 100% of the water from time to time). And new rock put into the tank. Maybe not all at once though.

Any idea how many lbs of rock are in there now? You might want to consider upping the amount that's in there too while you're at it (couldn't hurt - except for maybe the cost of course!)

Hard to say if those Ca/Alk #'s tell us the reason for slow growth. They are both lower than what you might want to shoot for, but not hugely so. :neutral: Try upping the Ca to around 390-400 and the Alk to around 7-8 dKH and see if you notice a difference.

[adidas]

you could always take out the few bad rocks and let them dry out and die, clean em off and re-seed them later?

is that a possibility anyone? or a stupid idea? lol

[michika]

Thanks Tony!

I'm thinking mostly of doing zeo/polyp labs as a last resort before complete tear down. As well my problems aside I've seen some really nice sps systems using these products, and it does add to the draw.

I'm measuring PO4 with a Hanna Phosmeter, but I agree with you about verifying everything. Its nice to have the meter, but its frustrating not to know if what you're getting for a result is correct.

The tank has what I estimate to be 60 to 65lbs, with 25lbs being in the sump. Thinking back this tank has never produced any coraline algae. That rock that you are referring to is new to the tank from December.

As for the Ca & dkH, I didn't see any better growth (in the sps and coraline) then I was getting measurements of 500ppm and 10dKH. I think I need a more happy medium like what I was getting two weeks ago. The dKH is up to 6 (cusp of 7) now that I topped off for the day. I'm looking at changing how I top off, and how my Ca reactor is working within the system.

I guess my next steps are to get out some of the "bad" rocks and replace them with newer ones. I am also going to tweak my reactors, I think I've turned them down too much trying to fix the 500/10 problem. Does that sound right to you?

[michika]

you could always take out the few bad rocks and let them dry out and die, clean em off and re-seed them later?

is that a possibility anyone? or a stupid idea? lol

Its a possible idea, however I have no where to let them dryout without stinking up my place. Unless you have a super non-stinky way of drying them out!

[adidas]

Its a possible idea, however I have no where to let them dryout without stinking up my place. Unless you have a super non-stinky way of drying them out!

boil em up in some water, that would kill everything lol

..or just put in freshwater, then scrub everything off? then just let em dry.

or maybe i'm way out to lunch

[michika]

Those are some good ideas, maybe I go the freshwater route. Just a thought, but what would happen to the suspected phosphate in the rocks. Would it not just come out at a later time when the rocks are back in a system, or would it leech out of the rocks in the freshwater?

[Delphinus]

Yeah, I have this whole idea that it's offensive to buy the Merck/D-D test kit (it's not cheap) after spending the big money on the meter to begin with, but the lack of consistency in my results is something that really troubles/puzzles me. Have you tried taking 3 tests in a row with yours? When I do this I get three different numbers. I've finally figured out that at least one of my cuvets is suspect - if I zero out the meter, then immediately take a reading - I get an "underrange" error. (Consistently.. I tried it about 20 times.) I would expect it to be zero, or at the very least, "not always" underrange. With the other cuvet I can zero it, and get a zero reading. I wonder if the sensor or the LED emitter might have dust on it too but it would be impossible to clean those I think so I kind of hope that's not the case.

Yikes, 500ppm seems for sure too high, I would have backed off the reactors as well! Might need to be upped just ever-so-slightly now just to find the happy medium..

Wow, 65lbs of rock, that's a lot more than I thought there was in there. :neutral:

[Delphinus]

Speaking of boiling water, have you tried the boiling water trick of GHA removal? I did this in a few spots in my cube tank and it worked like a charm. If only I could do that next to my clams since the clams are now the biggest areas of GHA (their shells). But yeah, hoo yeah, did the boiling water work great in the spots where I did dare to try it :)

[adidas]

Those are some good ideas, maybe I go the freshwater route. Just a thought, but what would happen to the suspected phosphate in the rocks. Would it not just come out at a later time when the rocks are back in a system, or would it leech out of the rocks in the freshwater?

honestly I have no idea, maybe keep in freshwater and test for phosphates? or use a phosphate filter? or go the drastic route and boil the rock, that should get anything out, maybe?

it won't be live rock anymore after these treatments.

maybe take out the suspect rock, and see if tank improves, or do tests to see if phosphates go down/?

[adidas]

if you put out some money for even another 50lbs of rock, and/or get a bigger system for more dilution, I bet it would have a major impact

I added another 100lbs of rock to my system about 7 months ago, and i've done about 3-4 water changes since then, and I've never seen any algae

[michika]

After we had a conversation last time about the meters I did go home and did 3 tests in a row with each culvet. I've gotten consistent results every time. Did you want me to bring my meter to your place and you can see if its the meters?

When I set everything back up I dialed in everything like I still had a stocked tank. It wasn't until January when I realized my error and I was slowly backing it down. I guess I backed it down too quick, or just a bit to far. Maybe by next week it will be back where it should be. When I got 500 the first time, I tested it a second time with another test kit, and at one point I had 580ppm.

I'm just waiting on some water right now, but tonight I'm going to take out a rock, maybe two and start the cooking process. I'm also going to change the aquascape, I need change to keep me thinking that the tank will pull through.

Any thoughts on my lack of coraline growth, both on that rock in the front left of the tank and on the glass?

[michika]

if you put out some money for even another 50lbs of rock, and/or get a bigger system for more dilution, I bet it would have a major impact

I added another 100lbs of rock to my system about 7 months ago, and i've done about 3-4 water changes since then, and I've never seen any algae

I'm not sure where I would put more rock, but its definitely something to consider. Where did you add the 100lbs, your display or elsewhere? In your system, how much rock do you have?

[Delphinus]

If you had some time at some point I would like to take you up on that offer :)

Not sure about the coraline. Maybe it's just being outcompeted? :neutral:

[adidas]

I'm not sure where I would put more rock, but its definitely something to consider. Where did you add the 100lbs, your display or elsewhere? In your system, how much rock do you have?

in my display, lol I have i would say about 250lbs total, but I have a 150g system

you could add rock to a sump/refugium.

[michika]

You have PM about the meter.

I'll go with the rock method for now, see what happens, and I guess go from there. Photos tonight of the before/after.

As for adding more rock to my sump, its too full already. I'm going to see if I can't rearrange it to fit some more in.

[adidas]

ya if you have room it wouldn't hurt to add more biological filtration.

[michika]

The deed is done!
Negative things;
- lights went out before I could do the water change
- lights out before I could clean the debris from the bottom

Positive things:
- I changed the overflow from two strainers to a strainer and an emergency overflow, I would say it cut the water noise by about 75%
- New aquascape
- more rock in the sump
- cleaned out more dead skeletons
- hand picked off the GHA
- confirmed that there is truly no more cyano! Hurray
- I changed the position of most everything in the tank, clams etc to hopefully fit better with my lighting set up.
- There are photos, although they are for tomorrow, when the water change is done.
- I removed one large rock plus the ugly rock from the left side.
- I added more rock to the sump/refugium, its now so full it looks painful
- I also have more extra ugly dry rock to add to the system in the future

So far I think the change is a success visually, and I hope that helps with everything else.

[Skimmerking]

cath pm me a picture im curious, i thought about something... do you clean your filter socks and if so what are you cleaning them with

[michika]

Okay some photos;

FTS of after the reconstruction.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0050-2.jpg

First zoas to open
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0051.jpg

Longest surviving non-fish thing I have.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0052.jpg

New crocea clam from a couple of weeks ago.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0058.jpg

Everything is a bit blue, I swapped out my MH bulb a couple of weeks ago.

[adidas]

just a thought about the GHA, how old are all your bulbs?

[michika]

Bulbs are between two and three weeks old.

[michika]

cath pm me a picture im curious, i thought about something... do you clean your filter socks and if so what are you cleaning them with

I clean my filter socks every second day and I do it with hot water and a double rinse in the washer. Sometimes I have to wash them twice.

[adidas]

Bulbs are between two and three weeks old.

ok good :)

[adidas]

I clean my filter socks every second day and I do it with hot water and a double rinse in the washer.

maybe something leeches outta the washer?

[imisky]

hey sorry for the late reply on the carbon dosing, as a rule of thumb.. i dose 0.5mls for a 10g but i started low and slowly moved up. i also made sure that i dose multiple types of carbon sources so i do not get a mono bacteria culture. i dose this every other day instead of every day like most people that use vodka and im having some what of a success with GHA. a good thing about dosing so little is i have yet to get cloudy water, nor the white film that develop on the rocks and etc..

if your still considering dosing carbon to a certain point ive sent u a PM with my MSN contact, if you use that just add me

[michika]

maybe something leeches outta the washer?

I don't know, I've had the GHA longer then the filter socks, but its something to consider. I do rinse the washer before putting the socks in. Any other ideas on washing them? I've tried it by hand, but they don't come as clean.

[adidas]

I don't know, I've had the GHA longer then the filter socks, but its something to consider. I do rinse the washer before putting the socks in. Any other ideas on washing them? I've tried it by hand, but they don't come as clean.

was thinking about it causing sps to die...

[michika]

Good point. Would you think just hand washing, even though it doesn't get them as clean, is a better choice, or are you thinking stopping using filter socks all together.

Lets assume for a second that something got onto the filter socks and into the tank killing the SPS. Any thoughts on where else I would see an impact?

[Skimmerking]

Catherine I put mine in the dish washer and with out soap, wells great...

[adidas]

Good point. Would you think just hand washing, even though it doesn't get them as clean, is a better choice, or are you thinking stopping using filter socks all together.

Lets assume for a second that something got onto the filter socks and into the tank killing the SPS. Any thoughts on where else I would see an impact?

not really sure, just looking at all possible ways a pollutant could have got in the system. maybe detergent containing phosphates was used in the washer, but u had the GHA b4 the socks so i dont know.

[michika]

I also noticed that the frags which RTNed were all from the same source.

[adidas]

I also noticed that the frags which RTNed were all from the same source.

maybe a bad source?
anything improving? more pics? :)

[michika]

Another RTN, from a different source, a m. digitata. I've had this one quite some time and it was just coloring up quite nicely.

I will try for some photos tomorrow, its pay day, and thus shopping day. I'm going to hunt around for some new rock. Any particular photo requests?

[adidas]

another rtn? :(

[michika]

Yes, and two more frags are no longer displaying polyps, they just look like empty, but colored, shells. I'll post photos in a bit, I'm in the middle of a water change.

[adidas]

hmmm doesnt sound to good...something gotta be wrong in your tank

[michika]

Some more photos;

My imperator cleaning off some algae, sweet little guy;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0027-2.jpg

My algae-eating tang (I love this guy, he eats everything but clams and coral. Couldn't ask for a better fish! My yellow damsel is also in this shot, it was one of my first 3 fish!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0038-1.jpg

RTN;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0056-1.jpg

Frags with no polyp extension;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0058-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0059-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0060-1.jpg

Clams are still happen and open;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0049.jpg

I'm still not sure why I'm experiencing RTN, its very quick and usually happens later in the evening or overnight. I am curious as to if I should just shut down this system and move everything back to my 24g cube, save for the tang and imperator angel. The GHA also doesn't seem to be coming back, any small left overs are very quickly being eaten by the tang.

I agree with Adidas, something is wrong, I just don't know what. Its like I can keep everything else, but SPS right now. Anyone else have any ideas?

[adidas]

why dont u bring some of the sps frags over, ill keep em in my tank for u and see if they recover? my sps is doing amazing. i can keep it until u are ready?

[michika]

Thank you for the offer! I'm posting in the reef forum for suggestions right now. I'll send you a PM shortly.

[adidas]

no prob. also it looks like a bit of cyano in there, have you ever used Chemi-clean?

[michika]

Nope, no Chemi-clean, I'm afraid of it actually!

[adidas]

Nope, no Chemi-clean, I'm afraid of it actually!

oh man, its great i used it once and it killed cyano and all other nuisance algae.

[michika]

I think I've terrified myself by reading too many bad accounts of its usage. Its not actually that bad, I just looked at it seems to just be on the tips of that frag and any dead frags that you can see on the background. I should probably take those out now I guess.

[michika]

Quick update;

I now only have two SPS frags that are still alive. Both still show no polyp extension.

I've decided that I won't buy anymore SPS until at least April. I still don't have any clue as to why I can no longer keep SPS. I can't figure out why things were going so well with my frags/colony until a few weeks ago. In the mean time I'm just going to let the tank chug along and see where it goes.

The fish all still seem happy and healthy, same goes for the clams and the few softies/LPS I have. Its a good sign and its something to focus on for the time being.

[michika]

I'm seeing some more subtle transformations and changes within my system. Algae growth on the glass seems to come more frequently, and in a larger quantity. My clams can't seem to get "comfortable", my small crocea, and my large derasa are regularly changing their positions. One day they orient with the MH bulb, and the next they are perpendicular.

I still want to try SPS again, but I am wary. This is the first time in probably 8 or more months in which I've actually had to put out my own money for tank supplies and livestock. My previous cube was self sustaining and I was more then able to buy all my own supplies and livestock. My funds are running out, so I guess I have to start putting my own money into the system if I want to try SPS again.

I figured out why my levels were a bit out on my last reading and I've corrected it. I use Ultra Mag reactor media in my Ca. reactor along with ARM media. The Ultra Mag needed to be replaced, along with my kalk powder in my kalk. reactor. I fixed those at the end of last week, after turning my reactors back online. So a few minor adjustments and now my chemistry is back inline.

I never thought I could go through that much media so quickly, but the last time I dialed in my Ca. reactor was after I had removed all my dead SPS, and sent my clams to a friends for care.

The thicker and more frequent algae growth on the glass was something that happened with my 28g cube. I'm seeing more and more familiar signs and correlations between my previous cube and this tank, its making me hopeful about keeping SPS again.

[michika]

This tank is not making me a happy reef keeper.

So yesterday the Snapper pump started making these squeeking noises. So yesterday evening all the pumps on the system were cleaned and then system went back online. I saw increased flow from the pump, but nothing else happened.

This morning I woke up to a quiet tank, the pump failed. It seized, but since there was no power outtage the back up battery system didn't kick on and the tank was without power and heat for who knows how long. Thankfully there were no deaths, and the temperature drop was minimal, and everything was still within acceptable levels when I noticed it.

I love my battery back up!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0005-4.jpg

So then I had to rush off to pick up a new pump. By the time I'd come home more problems had cropped up. In an attempt to remove the Snapper pump, the sump got cracked.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0004-3.jpg

I came home with a new pump, a Reeflo Dart this time instead of a Snapper. This was not a cost that I really wanted to put out for. The timing of this pump failure is bad. I've sent off an email to Reeflo to see what may be done about the pump, I've heard that their customer service is usually quite good. I hope something of benefit comes out of this.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0008-1.jpg

Pumps side by side, top is the Dart, and lower is the Snapper
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0002-2.jpg

Left is the Snapper and right is the Dart
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0003-2.jpg

Pump pictured is the Dart, and the grey portion is the Snapper's to illustrate the difference between the two.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_2-1.jpg

So now I'm spending my day supervising the replacement of a my main pump, and I'm hoping very much that nothing else breaks or stops working before I can really afford to make changes or repairs on the system.

[michika]

So I am going to tear down this tank temporarily. I have settled on the fact that my SPS deaths are related to the tank itself or the sump in some way. I've tested my water endlessly and looked at what I think are the most likely possiblities. I haven't yet set a date for this, however it will be soon.

I have also recently noticed that one side of my tank is sinking into the floor. I'll also be relocating the tank at the same time.

I've tested my Ca reactor effluent after changing out all my Ca related media and chaining up all my reactors. The water runs through my Ca reactor in this order; Ca Reactor with ARM media, Phosban reactor, Magnesium reactor then into the tank.

pH 7.6
Ca 430ppm
dKH 12
P04 0.01

The tank is still producing filamentous algae on the glass, and everything seems happy. I've fed the tank my homemade fish food for the second time today, and the fish seem to really like it. I on the otherhand can only taste and smelll garlic after having made it.

Here is the process for making the food. It contains the following; Mysis, Nori (All colors), Oyster Eggs, Garlic (crushed), Scallops, Vitamins (selcon and zoe), Squid, Krill, Spirulina flakes, Rotifers, Brine Shrimp, Cyclop-eeze, Silversides, Cuddlefish, Shrimp.

First I defrosted the frozen goods in RO/DI. I spent two hours thawing and rinsing them until the water ran semi-clear.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0033-2.jpg

Next up I peeled garlic, and lots of it. FYI this much garlic was required to make 35 cups of product.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0036-1.jpg

I added these;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0038-2.jpg

Then nori in all three colors
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0040-2.jpg

All together now
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0042-1.jpg

After the puree button
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0044.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0046-1.jpg

Now with some of the frozen goods added;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0048.jpg

All mixed together, it was very thick, and hard on the arms
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0049-1.jpg

Final product
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0050-3.jpg

My favorite tool of the day, yay for the ugly 1970s relic which has kept most of the smell from clinging into my house.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0047.jpg

[Delphinus]

That stuff looks positively vile. Yum yum!

Sorry to hear about the continued SPS deaths. It's a frustration I know well though, so I empathize. :neutral:

Apologies if this is in an earlier page, but you do have a picture of your Ca reactor to phosban reactor to magnesium reactor setup?

[michika]

I'll find a few photos of the new Ca reactor set up and post them later.

This SPS death thing has to be the tank, I can't see what else it could be. The temporary tear down is going to involve breaking down the actual tank. I may even replace it, I don't fully know yet. What I do know though is that a part of my plumbing has just sprung a slow leak, urg!

[fencer]

Thanks for making the seafood melody Catherine. If I had done it my kitchen would not look as neat as yours.

[michika]

No problem, it was pretty fun actually.

[michika]

The tank is officially coming done, and soon.

The pump disaster from March 1st, still isn't resolved. My emails to Reeflo Plumps go unanswered, and their phone number is constantly busy. I have since reached out to a local vendor to see if they have any way of getting in touch with Reeflo. I just find this absolutely uacceptable, and this is impacting my future odds of buying Reeflo negatively.

The tank will receive some new livestock today. I am sharing in a livegoods order from Ocean Aquatics today. I will be adding in more clams to this tank. I also ordered some fish, but they are for another system, my non-nano tang & larger fish friendly tank.

[michika]

FYI the information Reeflo includes with their pumps, e.g their toll free phone number is only for US residents, the correct number for Canadian residents is 719 231 2761

No progress on the pump, I finally spoke with someone and said person is telling me that their pumps don't fail, thus it must be my fault something happened. I, of course disagree and will persue the matter further, although should I see no resolution by April 15th, I will just cut my losses and move on.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

That's silly. Everything fails. The Titanic went down. I bet it used Reeflo bilge pumps.

;)

[michika]

Gold! :D

[michika]

Some positive developments have been happening lately. Reeflo finally got back to me, they are sending me a new Snapper pump. I'm pleased that there has finally been resolution, but I am still unhappy that it took almost a month of constantly chasing after them via phone and email to get someone on the phone. The pump hasn't arrived yet, but I suspect it will take a few weeks to cross from the US into Canada.

I participated in a recent order from Ocean Aquatics. I ordered 3 clams, and a fish. Here are my three clams, two baby maximas, and a larger crocea.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0154.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0155.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0145-1.jpg

[Pan]

Some positive developments have been happening lately. Reeflo finally got back to me, they are sending me a new Snapper pump. I'm pleased that there has finally been resolution, but I am still unhappy that it took almost a month of constantly chasing after them via phone and email to get someone on the phone. The pump hasn't arrived yet, but I suspect it will take a few weeks to cross from the US into Canada.

I participated in a recent order from Ocean Aquatics. I ordered 3 clams, and a fish. Here are my three clams, two baby maximas, and a larger crocea.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0154.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0155.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0145-1.jpg
You can use it in a closed loop on your big tank :)
They were cutesy little clams.

[michika]

That may be the plan! I'm not sure, I will make plans once the replacement pump actually arrives to me. I will be annoyed if I have to pay duty or something on this pump.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Wow, those clams are tiny. How big, exactly?

[michika]

I believe they fall into the xxs category. I wanted 2" or bigger, and I got 1" or possibly smaller. They are doing well though, mantles are extended and they are being target fed. They are pretty though, but I do have some reservations about if they are going to make it or not. I guess I just have to keep with the target feeding.

[michika]

This tank and I are not getting along. The overflow is making a horrible sucking sound. Its a pain, its loud, and I can't seem to fix it without taking the canopy off. I'm not strong enough or tall enough to take the canopy off by myself. The noise is driving me insane, and you can't escape it.

I have officially had enough of this tank. I think it may go up for sale after I complete my 180. I don't have any more patience for it.

[michika]

I'm looking at improving my photography skills, and bettering my knowledge with my camera. Mount Royal College is offering a few photography courses, while they aren't geared to underwater or through glass photography I'm sure there is lots to be learned. I think I will sign up for Photography 1 (http://conted.mtroyal.ca/arts/photography.shtml) and Adobe Photoshop Elements 1 (http://conted.mtroyal.ca/computers/digital_photo.shtml#elementsone).

[michika]

This arrived to me today, and Reeflo kept their word, no duties!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0189.jpg

[Pan]

This arrived to me today, and Reeflo kept their word, no duties!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/DSC_0189.jpg
Yay..now you need another one too make the close loop and one more for return...

[michika]

I have some unhappy news to report my tank is still killing SPS, so I am harboring thoughts of killing it after my 180g is up and running.

I added some SPS, and I'm starting to see the beginning of the death pattern. The polyps no longer come out on my new SPS, and I'm seeing bleaching in the tips.

I was also away this past week, and came home to dead clams. Those two tiny clams posted above died. I came home and they were buried in my new sandbed and weren't seen. I dug them out and one was gone, and the other looked like it may make it. Both are now dead.

I feel like a failure because I can't make this tank work for me, only against me. I posted up a request for help thread here. I closed my one on RC because I kept getting suggestions that were not only out to lunch, but showed that the responders hadn't even attempted to look at my tank journal thread.

On the bright side all my fish are doing well, my remaining clams are growing and sucking back the Ca like nobody's business. I've had to bump up the output on my reactors lately. I'm also liking the sandbed I added back in. It brightens up the tank, and it gives the system a whole new look.

[Delphinus]

I'm really sorry to hear this.

For what it's worth, I saw the same patterns on my 75g for the last 2 years. Everytime I thought I was in the clear, I'd try some new frags, and they'd never make it. Same thing. Start off with less polyp extension, then tip bleaching, then eventual RTN.

For what it's worth, I never really solved it either. I just basically embraced zeovit and hoped for the best, thinking that if I can't solve what ails them, perhaps I can make them so strong that they grow faster than they can die. Does it work? Well, .. maybe. I have still lost frags in the last couple months, same pattern. But at least it doesn't appear to be 100% losses (so far ... touch wood :neutral:), so there may be an improvement.

But embracing zeovit shouldn't be the solution. I just did it to grasp at a final straw and see how it would go.

So I hate to say it but I think whatever it is, may indeed not really be solvable. It's not the usual suspects of parameters, it's not nutrient buildup, it's not red bugs and it's not flatworms. (I think.) .. I believe it to be pathological in nature (ie., bacterial, protozoan or perhaps fungal). Whatever it is, it can remain latent in an otherwise SPS-fallow tank for long periods of time.

If this is the case, then I'm afraid I can only offer the suggestion that I think your idea of throwing in the towel (on the tank at least, not overall in the hobby) is really the only magic bullet solution. Start a new tank, new glass, new sand, new rock, new everything. Sell the rock to someone who wants it for a FOWLR (since clearly fish are not at risk, at least mine don't seem to be).

It is basically my plan. I'm planning on all new rock for my 280g, which is one of the reasons the tank is so delayed in startup. I didn't quite realize when I was planning a 280g that I'd be looking to buy all new rock when the time came to put water in it ... :eek: Oh well, that's neither here nor there. I'm sorry to hear of your continued frustrations. I know what it's like, because I've been there.. The worst part is I'm not really sure that I'm not still there or not, I'm just hoping for the best.

[michika]

I think you are right, the 180 will have all new rock and sand. I'll get seeder sand rock from trusted sources and go from there. Not really I cost I want to pay, but in the end its probably the best way to go about doing it. Maybe a huge order from Marco rocks or something similar is in order.

I just wonder how to transfer over the livestock without moving over whatever is causing the SPS deaths. Do I QT everything between this tank and the 180? I worry that something will carry it over.

[Delphinus]

I don't know the call on that one. My intention is to keep my fish so I'm going to hope that they don't bring it over. I'll just try to swap as little water as possible when the time comes and hope for the best. It's probably not the best idea but what else can a person do?

What's Marco rock? I was thinking of ordering some Eco-Rox as it's basically Fiji rock but dry. Stuff looks wicked, and at $2.50ish per pound I'll happily take it dried...

[Pan]

I just read on another reef forum of people getting tainted silicone and it doing something similar. I will try and find the thread. But basically it said the silicone was treated with a fungicide even though it wasn't supposed to have been. Same thing fish lived corals, clams, most inverts did not. I wonder if there is a way to clip some silicone and do a test? Maybe the levels are low that only effects sps...as they are proably one of the most sensitive in the tank?

[michika]

Marco is about the same as Eco-Rox. Dry will mean its cheaper both in shipping and cost.

I'll probably do the same. Fill the 180g, get everything in line and just transfer everything over with very little water from the 28g. I'll probably devise something so I can acclimate my clams, and over time dilute the water from the 28g.

[michika]

I just read on another reef forum of people getting tainted silicone and it doing something similar.

Post the link if you find it, its worth a look or two.

[Pan]

Marco is about the same as Eco-Rox. Dry will mean its cheaper both in shipping and cost.

I'll probably do the same. Fill the 180g, get everything in line and just transfer everything over with very little water from the 28g. I'll probably devise something so I can acclimate my clams, and over time dilute the water from the 28g.
Catherine, there has been a proliferation recently of people unhappy with marco rocks on RC. Just a heads up, as he has many happy people in the past. Good thing about base rock 100 pounds usually is equiv to 200 pounds...well maybe not quite when wet :)

[michika]

I saw that about Marco Rocks. Although lately he seems to have been sorting out the problem. From what I understand some of it was growing pains, and some of it was late shipments. I'm not even sure if they can be shipped to Canada. I'm looking up Eco-Rox details now actually.

[i have crabs]

for the algae/cyano problems it shure looks like calgary tap water to me,have you tested your tds in the last while
i dont know squat about sps but is the pump oil filled? because if it was leaking what was it leaking into your water, the insides of that pump didnt look reefsafe to me.
i wouldnt look into dosing a million different things to solve something untill you knew what the problem was forshure.

[michika]

Actually the algae problem has been solved. I tested the TDS when we first got here in November, and I've borrowed a meter randomly on and off since then. Everything coming out of the RO/DI is in line. I've never tested going into the RO/DI though.

What part of the pump do you see as not being reefsafe? The pump I'm using is supposedly designed for reef/saltwater usage.

I'm not interested in doing any dosing. I don't have the time, and I think it would kill my patience and love for the hobby. I don't want reefkeeping to become a chore.

[i have crabs]

just the insides of the old pump looked a little grungie but i dont know if those parts even touch water anyway, it seems strange to me that the pump would burn out. if those pumps have any oil in them either for cooling or lube i would assume thier is a chance that something from the pump was leakin in the water since the pump was leaking water almost from the start and then al of a sudden it fries on you.

i didnt really look but i assume you have been keeping an eye on the temperature

[imisky]

most pumps for my understanding ( vortech, tunzes) both use vaseline to test there products with. i believe it was randy on reefcentral stated that vaseline is very inert in saltwater and will not react with the water. Unless its other forms of oil, the oils you find inside your powerheads are very inert. I even add vaseline to my pumps and have no SPS casualties.

[michika]

Thats a very interesting fact. I never knew that. I always just kind of assumed something inert like silicone lubricant was used. Thanks for sharing!

[michika]

A bit of a photo update. I apologize for the quality of the photos, I'm not used to the P&S camera I've borrowed. Today I changed out my luminarc reflector back to my batwing. The theory is that my reflector is causing my MH to burn the SPS I have in the system.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020572.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020573.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020575.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020580.jpg

The SPS I'm trying not to kill
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020581.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020582.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b286/michika/P1020583.jpg

After this MH reflector test my next step is picking up another ORP monitor (one that isn't broken), and then after that a ozonier.

[michika]

Well this final SPS experiment has failed. I was away last night when I cam back this afternoon everything looks horrible. I do not expect anything to last until Wednesday.

digi: some polyp extension, all flesh below has come off
acro: flesh is gone, its a white skeleton with a few pieces of skin
cap: white and dead
stag; some flesh, doesn't appeared to have changed in two days.

Next step is ORP & Ozone. After that this tank will be shut down when my 180g goes online in a month or so.

[michika]

This tank is officially down. I needs to be cleaned, and disassembled, but its out for the count. I feel very relieved to know that I don't have to fight with it anymore, and that I can stop stressing about what the next issue will be.

I will post the tank up for sale, assuming someone who has already called dibs does not want it.

[michika]

On the account that I have had no less the 8, yes 8, buyers back out on the purchase of this system let me clarify why this system couldn't keep sps.

1) The rock seemed to have lost one of its essential bacteria populations. Adding in new live rock solved the issue at the end.
2) The flow was too much with a 3600gph Reeflo Dart pump for young SPS frags.

If you look at my new 180g system, all the same rock is now in that system, and keeping SPS alive with no problems.