falling through my floor?

[draco]

i am just setting up a 90gall tank and i am scared that it is going to fall through my floor. any input. i live on the 2nd floor of an old apartment and was told that the floors were made of cement. i have heard scary stories of tanks falling through what do you think my chances are?

[andsoitgoes]

i am just setting up a 90gall tank and i am scared that it is going to fall through my floor. any input. i live on the 2nd floor of an old apartment and was told that the floors were made of cement. i have heard scary stories of tanks falling through what do you think my chances are?

It's funny - I've been freaking out about this since we set up our angelfish breeding rack. I've got wooden floors and there's a "sub" basement under - if you look at 4x15g, 44g and a 20g tank with my not so small self, a large king sized bed, etc - So far we're not dead... althogh one day I expect to come home and find everything sunken in ;)

I don't like to think about those scary stories... they're too scary! ;)

[Tarolisol]

It would only weight about 900lbs i very seriously doubt it could go through you floor.

[draco]

i am starting to feel a little better still scared though. (i always panic).:frown:

[TRIX]

If you do have a concrete floor the compresive strength (if it passed) would be a minimum of about 3000psi. The Tensile Strength is about 8%-12% of that. The shear strength of concrete is about 5% of the compressive strength. The correlation between compressive strength and flexural, tensile, torsional, and shear strength varies with concrete ingredients and environment. So basically concrete floors should handel pretty much any tank any of us would be putting on it. In any event please consult a Structual Engineer and refer to the structual plans and the test results before doing anything that would be more than the general use for that building. I will not and can not be held accountable for any damage that happens to any structure that anyone who reads this or hears about this information may cause.

[draco]

so then.... its good if it is concrete, and if it isnt. will i find out the hard way?

[demon666]

trix must be an engineer cuse i didnt understand a damn word he was saying other then concrete = more then goood enough....... the tank alone with out live rock and sand will weigh in at 900 lbs figure in minimum 90lbs lr 90lbs ls + water + fish + corals ( i know the last 2 dont weigh much but it will still add up even if it is only a few ounces) + stand + sump + fudge material (few more pounds of sand and lr) your are going to be looking @ roughly 1200lbs give or take a few factors..... on a concrete floor that should be nothing.... if it is a wood floor i would sudgest puting it on a weight bearing wall like an outside wall just because the floor joists are much stronger at that point as compaired to the middel of the room

[BCOrchidGuy]

Would you let 4 large grown adult men stand in the area where you'd put your tank? If you'd let the 4 250lbs men stand there then a 90 gallon tank shouldn't be a problem.

Doug

[andsoitgoes]

intersting article about all of this basically says "Yes, 4 250 lb men can stand in the same place at one time, even jump up and down - but having them there in the same spot for years causes a wear in the structural integrity that the floor was never designed for"

http://badmanstropicalfish.com/articles/article28.html

As I've been freaking out about this, seeing that on one side of my room I have currently 160g of water dispursed in a very, very odd way (tank stand that displaces the water upwards rather than lengthwise) and have approximately 100g sitting there plus another 60g next to it. Needless to say, it's a scary thought and I am seriously contemplating a move of some sort - however, if you look at the weight of a water bed (often 4000+ lbs) and the thought that these floors were designed for that - then there's another story entirely. And I think I like to use that to assure myself I'm not going to drown in fish poop :)

[draco]

that all makes perfect sense. and i have filled and set my rock into my new tank and started my sump. cool stuff

[Dave C]

If you don't like the "4 men standing" analogy, how about your fridge, or a freezer? Load those up with food and if they're upright that's a very small footprint & a lot of weight that never moves. Couple that with the large adult that is constantly standing in front of the fridge choosing a snack and you've got even more weight. A water bed is another good example and the average weight is greater then 1,500lbs. Then tack on the weight of the couple sleeping on it and you're up to a good ton. Mind you, it's spread over a large area, but the weight is constant and therefore comparable.

For all of the threads I've read asking about the dangers of floors giving way, I've read none about it actually happening. I'm sure it does, but there's a lot of other things that happen much more frequently that people don't worry about.

[Farrmanchu]

I've got around 70 Gallons, and 100+ lbs of rock on a smallish footprint (4x2 foot). My house is around 100 years old with foundation problems, but the tank is fine.

[TRIX]

trix must be an engineer cuse i didnt understand a damn word he was saying other then concrete = more then goood enough.......

LOL. I'm not smart enough to be an egineer but my boss is. I've learned to understand most of what they say. Take out all the big words, put together the small ones and you should get the just of what they say..

You should be good dude. I have a wood floor so I will be going out from an exterior wall with an added telepost underneath. And oh ya...... Insurance.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

My friend & I were just discussing this topic the other day & I pointed out the fact that I have never read about or heard of an actual instance when a tank has come crashing through someone's floor. Neither has he.

Especially with a concrete floor, you should have nothing to worry about.

[Tarolisol]

trix must be an engineer cuse i didnt understand a damn word he was saying other then concrete = more then goood enough....... the tank alone with out live rock and sand will weigh in at 900 lbs figure in minimum 90lbs lr 90lbs ls + water + fish + corals ( i know the last 2 dont weigh much but it will still add up even if it is only a few ounces) + stand + sump + fudge material (few more pounds of sand and lr) your are going to be looking @ roughly 1200lbs give or take a few factors..... on a concrete floor that should be nothing.... if it is a wood floor i would sudgest puting it on a weight bearing wall like an outside wall just because the floor joists are much stronger at that point as compaired to the middel of the room


For every pound of live rock you put in it probly displaces about the same amount of water so the amount of rock or sand has very little impact on the final weight.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

oh ya...... Insurance.

I just added "Renter's Insurance" to my insurance bill last week. Good call, TRIX :wink:

[andsoitgoes]

The problem with looking at things like a fridge, bathtub, washer, etc is that when the house was designed, the engineers knew "Hey, this is where the fridgei s going to go" and planned for the extra weight.

I'm guessing they didn't look at the bedroom and said "Hmm, this person might just put over 1000 lbs of water here. Let's do some super reinforcement of the floors"

As for the rock displacement, it doesn't fully displace the same amount of water, the link above has a bit of a calculation as to how that works - because of the space the rock itself occupies. Here's an explanation:

"I added 210 pounds of rock to my aquarium so now my aquarium setup weighs 210 pounds more."

In the above example, when you added the 210 lbs of rock it took up space that was previously occupied by approximately 1.5 cubic feet of water. So you've really only added 116 lbs (the "buoyant rock weight") to the total weight.
Again, like Seahorse_Fanatic said, it's something that's talked about but is never something that anyone has actually heard of. On the same note, so is a heater exploding and turning your entire tank into very expensive soup, it's just a matter of how much risk are you willing to take.

-- and saying that, I'm planning on doubling my home insurance policy ;)

[possitive k]

i live on the 3rd floor of a wood frame apartment, i have a 90gal tank, and no problem. i think you should be ok. it's not like your putting it in the middle of the room, there is more support at the walls, and you live in a concrete building so your fine.

[BCOrchidGuy]

In my humble opinion... okay maybe I should say the way I see it, a lot depends on how you distribute the weight. If you have the tank on a home made stand that has 4 1x4s as legs with nothing else supporting the weight you would want those legs to be on the supports under the floor rather than on a space between supports (trusses? maybe). If you have your legs in the 90 degree angle style... um like this "L" then you effectively cut the lbs per sq inch in half... (I think). If you build a stand that runs the legs down in the L patern then those are attached to more 1x4 or better yet 2x4 that run the length and width of the tank, with some 3/4 inch ply under them your weight is spread out over a very large area and I believe it would be supported in almost all situations. I'm not an engineer, I just remember the old analagy of a woman in a stilletto on your chest vs a sheet of plywood with some concrete on your chest the plywood wouldn't be as attractive but would be a lot more tollerable.

Doug

[bullit67]

Well I have a 315 Gal system sitting in my kitchen do the math on that

One 265 Gal tank 500 lbs
stand Cap and sump 200 lbs
Live rock 250 lbs
Live sand 200 lbs
plumbing pumps and Mis. 150 lbs

and last but not least

315 gallons of water 3150 lbs

for a grand total of 4450 lbs

Yes 4450 pounds on a second floor I did reinforce the floor since the floor joist run the length of the tank so all the weight is sitting on 2 floor joist this is about the samr as standing a large family car on its end in the kitchen I was alittle nervous at first every time my cell phone rang while I was at work I would start sweating but one year later and still no problem

[fkshiu]

Common sense and rudimentary (very rudimentary in my case) knowledge of structures dictates the following points to minimize the bizarre occuring:

1. Spread out the weight of the tank using a plywood bottom on the stand, for example.

2. Place the tank against a load bearing wall where the structure is the strongest and NOT in the middle of a room.

3. Place the tank perpendicular to the floor joists and NOT parallel to a single joist.

4. Actually have a looksee with an engineering type at the underlying structure. Just because you've got an old house doesn't automatically mean it will be in poorer shape than a newer house.

[RD]

A good read on this subject;
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/aquarium_weight.php

HTH

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Excellent read.

[andsoitgoes]

lol - uh, that's the same article I posted on page one :P

Although much more nicely formatted here! And I like the visual aids ^_^

[Mike Olson]

It all comes down to pounds per square foot that is being exerted on the floor....If its a wooden floor with the joists running parallel with the tank- you would be applying your weight over two joists...you might get some flex depending on where your main support walls are located.
I have a 180 upstairs that spans five 2x12 joists that run perpendicular to the length of the tank and the tank runs parallel to the support beam that is 4 ft away....my tank etc. weighs approx. 2300 lbs....the key is that the stand has solid wood over the entire bottom so the weight is evenly distributed (psf is spread over a 6x2 area) I would have more stress if my stand was on 4 or 6 legs. YOUR TANK IS OK..There is also no extra bracing or extra joists laid out for fridges,cabinets etc when houses are built, they are designed as a 'support system' for the entire structure.

[Funky_Fish14]

Would you let 4 large grown adult men stand in the area where you'd put your tank? If you'd let the 4 250lbs men stand there then a 90 gallon tank shouldn't be a problem.

Doug

If 4 250lb men couldnt stand in that space then there are likely some serious safety code violations:wink:

As Trix mentioned, the best thing you can do is contact a structural engineer, however in all likelyhood your tank will probably be fine there.

Chris

[scub steve]

i had a 90 gal tank in my apartment 2 story with no problems and my place is about 75 years old

[Darth Wader]

I have a 95 gallon tank in my living room and I'm on the second floor in a super old building and I'm running parallel to the floor joists but i'm clost to 2 load bearing walls. Like Fkshiu said it really depends on tank placement. If you have 2x6 or 2x8 joists and you run perpendicular you shouldnt have a problem. And if you can position it next to a load bearing wall you're pretty much good to go. Having hardwood like most older places do helps, thats a good way to spread the load.
I wouldnt worry to much, however having said that I alsmost sh!t my pants when the floor started creaking as I was filling up my tank, (good thing I got renters insurance that week).

[Jaws]

I've been kinda wondering the same thing lately. I'm on the third story of a two year old condo. I've got my 180G tank with 70G sump running parallel with a load baring wall that seperates my suite with my neighbour. The tank sits perpindicular to the floor joists and is about 4 feet away from the wall that seperates my suite from outside. I'm sorry to hijack but my question is, I've built a 3 level rack that I've designed to hold a denitrification bucket, an auto-topoff, and a refugium. I figure the whole setup will weigh just under 1000lbs. I plan on putting it right in the corner in between my tank and the building's outer wall, still against the load baring wall my tank sits against. Because my tank is already so heavy and taking up a lot of room on the load baring wall, should I be concerned about adding the extra weight to the corner? Is the amount or weight relative to the entire load baring wall or is it really only relative to what each floor joist is calculated to hold? Thanks.

[wetcoast]

I have just put an offer in on a 2nd floor condominium in Surrey. One of my conditions is that I have a structual engineer tell me how much weight I can put on my floors to support my 225 gallon fishtank that I have been planning for the past year. I have all equipment, just needed a place in town to set it up. They have scared me dearly saying that 40lb's per squarefoot is the maximum amount, and with my calculations I would probably be about 3800 pounds. It is $1000 for them to come down and assess. Spreading the weight a bit more with plywood sounds like a very good idea. The condo is less than 10 years old - so I do hope that this works out, otherwise I just bought a bunch of parts for nothing and should have just kept my old 65!

:neutral:

[Joe Reefer]

Now you know why engineer's always have sweet tanks.:mrgreen: