Moo

[EmilyB]

I thought it was maybe a need for food. However, we have been watching the tank very closely the past few days with the changes going on. Moo looked great.

How does a fish go from fine at 2pm to looking starved at 8pm. That was weird. But obviously just a sign.

Moo dropped dead tonite. Four plus years in captivity and I don't know whether the tank change was responsible. I had ever intention of repopulating the tank with coral, and there were still a lot left.

Moorish Idols eat coral, yes.

Sorry Sam. :cry:

[Nate]

sorry to hear deb, may moo rest in piece....

[Veng68]

Sorry to hear about that Deb. :(

Condolences,
Vic [veng68]

[Snappy]

Bummer:sad:

[Samw]

Sorry Deb. Its OK. What changed?

[Chaloupa]

Oh NO....so sorry to hear...your success with "Moo" is partly why I got a Moorish Idol.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Dang it Deb. Sorry to hear.

[EmilyB]

Oh NO....so sorry to hear...your success with "Moo" is partly why I got a Moorish Idol.

Keep her in a reef. I'm not sure a sudden departure of that caused Moo's demise, but I can't rule that out.

[muck]

One of the greatest Reef Fishes ever.
I so looked forward to seeing her everytime I was in Calgary.. :sad:

Rest in Peace Moo.

[Ruth]

Aww Deb that is so sad. I was so inspired by yours and Sam's success in keeping Moo in captivity and was also the reason why I decided to try. I have my "Elvis" in a reef as well and have had him in there for just about a year now. He loves zoo skirts so I always have a supply of lovely brown ones that I rotate back and forth through the sump (to allow them to grow their skirts back). He has survived getting beat to hell by a yellow tang - tank move - fin rot - and skimmer break down and still seems to be thriving. I hope I have him as long as you had Moo or hopefully longer.

[Skimmerking]

Sorry There Deb, nice fish you had there

[AndyL]

Sorry to hear deb, Moo's always going to be on my all time favorite fish list.

[Chaloupa]

thanks for the advice Deb, will make sure that there are ample coral offerings!

[Delphinus]

Sorry for your loss. Very sad. :(

[bulletsworld]

Omg! OmG! NoOoOOO not MOOOOO! Tears filled my eyes when I read this.

So sorry to hear about this Deb. Your success with Moo was also the reason why I decided to get a Moorish Idol, I named Chewie, even though I loved the name Moo. Chewie fav food was brown zoo's & sponges. Miss the guy.

I always looked so forward to seeing Moo when I came to Calgary. He was by far my favorite fish of all time. I had never seen a Moorish grow to the size Moo did. You should be really proud of your success. You took great care of Moo, Deb. Don't beat yourself up. It wasn't your fault. Moo know's you loved him.

Moo will be dearly missed by us all. Rest in the big ocean in the sky, Moo.


*SUPER HUGS DEB*


Lee

[Joe Reefer]

That sucks!

[christyf5]

:cry:

[EmilyB]

Thanks guys..:cry:

At least we can now dismiss this as a Moorish Idol thing - Apu, my Pakistani butterfly died today. I can't find anything wrong with my tests except low alk about 2. I had just started new salt, the new Kent, but I got it from J&L and thought the problems were over with that. I will test the new mix tonite.

[Ruth]

Holy Cow Deb - I'm really sorry this is happening to you. Is there any chance of lack of oxygen? I am quite sure that both of those fish are somewhat sensitive to low oxygen and IIRC you recently bought a new skimmer so just wondering if there is any chance it is not putting enough oxygen into the water. I know shot in the dark but ..................

[EmilyB]

Thanks Ruth, but no, we haven't received the new skimmer yet and the Euro is still on there working fine. I have to rule out coral starvation as well, as it wouldn't happen that fast, both fish were healthy a few days ago.

[EmilyB]

The Kent salt tested out fine.

[Willito]

That's very sad to hear Deb, and at the same time frustrating not knowing what the cause is. Can you explained in details the changes that your tank has gone through so perhaps the many minds on here can poke at some ideas. I hope we can find the cause before another bites the dust.:cry:

[christyf5]

OMG thats awful!! :neutral:

Are you running carbon? Do you think it could be residual from removing the sandbed? The fish looked so good after all that messing around we did a couple of weeks ago.

[EmilyB]

Here's the timeline.

We changed over tanks August 12th. Within the next week we removed the remaining sandbed, some each nite accompanied by a large water change.

Fish fine, eating well, etc.

The weekend Kari broke his wrists...we powerwashed the rock. (Three weeks ago? ) The corals, anemone, etc. remaining in the tank, and the fish fine.

About a week ago, the fish quit eating nori. I have since ditched it. It was cheap, but I had used it before.

Both fish literally dropped dead. I saw Moo. Didn't see Apu, but the fact he was laying on top of the rock, already seriously decomposed, and not disturbed would indicate that to me.

Missing in the picture, two tiger cukes, small. Can't remember where they ended up, and haven't found.

Carbon is in, although I don't have an optimum place to place it.

Thinking Butters may be next.

:cry:

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

I heard that if a cuke dies in your tank, it can also do a bad number on your tank. I had a friend who bought a large cuke from the LFS, & his crab attacked & cut it up that night. Lost almost everything overnight. Possible culprit?

Deb, glad I had the chance to meet your famous Moo this summer with Chin. So sorry about your loss.

Anthony

[EmilyB]

I had an incident with a pink Hawaiian cuke before, and lost my anthias, the other fish were unaffected. I guess I went on the fact that the turd cukes aren't that toxic and kept them. Maybe they are to play in this, maybe not. They could very well turn up as they have before, inside holes in the rock.

I moved Butters (the Red Sea Butterfly) to the reef tank tonite. Did another large water change as well.

[Willito]

Here's a stab at it. I think it's a combination of things changing all around the same time.
Eliminating the sand - releasing toxic nitrate and loosing buffering abilities
Blasting rocks (with freshwater I assume) - killing off vast amount of denitrifying bacteria causing a biological imbalance. Also killing whatever'ss living in/on the rocks causing more decay.
Missing cucumbers - dead, possibly releasing toxin
Large water changes - perhaps too large volume, too frequent

If you combine all these changes together, and assuming that's what took place, it becomes a very different environment for these delicate species to cope with. I don't believe changes to the aqauscape or the lack of corals contribute to their rapid decend. Lets hope whatever still swimming can cope in the new setup.

[Delphinus]

Best of luck Deb. I know what you're feeling. I hope that things pull though.

[AndyL]

Probably not ready yet - but Golds had some nice looking Moorish Idols in...

[EmilyB]

I wouldn't do that anyway. :neutral:

I was just thinking tonite tho, that if it was a water quality issue, wouldn't the starfish and snails be sensitive to that?

[EmilyB]

Just another stupid thing on my part.

The day Moo died I had brought home a new eel that I purchased from another reefer. It ate shrimp apparently. I couldn't find anything online and in the end after getting him, got Doug to search RC, since it's unavailable to me. It is a fish eater, a major fish eater.

Well, I guess I'll feed him some silversides and try and find him a new home.

[EmilyB]

To wrap up, a few more large water changes seem to have things under control. I would never believe this to have been a problem, as was suggested. However, I should say the water changes are 40-50g on a 230g tank. Not that major.

I believe it was a toxin. There was no ammonia or nitrite present in the tank.

[Johnny Reefer]

.... I believe it was a toxin. ....
My guess is it was those cukes, but then, what do I know?
Lousy lovable fish.

Cheerio Deb,

Mark.

[sumpfinfishe]

Sorry to hear about Moo Deb that's just a shame :sad:

It sounds like a combination of factors may have brought on Moo's death and not just one action.

[EmilyB]

Just to end this thread, the cukes were both found alive and well. Yesterday the red sea butterfly dropped dead on the spot. All of the other fish, etc are doing well and the tank looks better than it has in ages.

So I tested into the wee hours of the morning, tested everything under the sun.

Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0-5
ph 8.1
Phosphate 2.5

So seeing the phosphate, I wondered wtf? Reducing phosphate can be done by water changes, which is what has been happening all along, plus I have been water changing out to a rock cycling tank almost every day for weeks.

I tested the other tank. No phosphate. I tested the water change nsw, no phosphate. I tested all the foods I feed. Minimal with nori and mysis, the flake was bad. But I haven't changed feeding, probably cut way back on flake now anyway.

The only thing I could think of next was to test the rest of the remaining rock curing. Phosphates were 2.5.

[Joe Reefer]

What kind of flake where/are you using?