Overdriven NO (Canadian Man!)

[AJ_77]

Hey Jon,
Do you know what kind of output could be expected running 1 electronic ballast per 2 bulbs? And what such a wiring configuration would look like?

Because: my friend - a carpenter - is looking at making stands & canopies to help supply the local demand. I may get him to make me a proper hood, and hook up the MH in a few months. In the meantime, I need to overdrive some tubes, but wonder if I HAVE to get one ballast per bulb.

I read Victor's thread on this, but didn't get my answer.

Cheers,
Alan

[Canadian Man]

Hi Alan.
Well if you are planning on using 48" tubes than you have two options.
If you wire 1 bulb per ballast (ment for 4 bulbs) than you will get ~80w per bulb.
If you wire 2 bulbs per ballast (ment for 4 bulbs)
you will get ~ 50 w per bulb.

Kim is running 4 bulbs at 2x per bulb and it is BRIGHT
I am now running 7 bulbs at 4x each(added another one few days ago).
hope this helps
i can mail you wiring diagrams when i get home tonight if you want.

[Canadian Man]

Will do.

[FishGeek]

Me too also pls.

tanks
Simon

[AJ_77]

A diagram would be most helpful - thanks Jon.

(Hey - check out the last couple of posts in the "Next Meeting" thread.

Thanks,

Alan

[ 18 April 2002, 12:17: Message edited by: AJ_77 ]

[Canadian Man]

Will do that tonight alan.
sorry the link does not work.

[Delphinus]

Jonathan, would you mind terribly adding me to your wiring diagram mailing list, please and thank you? :D

[CHEAPREEF]

Originally posted by CHEAPREEF:
Here you guys go. Hope his shows up.
http://a8.cpimg.com/image/FA/4A/9604858-4f51-01D60172-.jpg

Clinton<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

[reefburnaby]

Hi,

If you want to connect it in 2X configuration, then you only need to connect two blue wires to one tube and two red wires to the other tube. The yellows will connect to both tubes.

Hope that helps.

- Victor.

[AJ_77]

Sure does help - thanks, Victor. Have you received much feedback since the January RC thread?

It's hard to judge the benefit of running 2X the T12's though (all my waterproof endcaps are 1.5").

It seems still worthwhile. We'll give it a go.

Cheers,
AJ

[reefburnaby]

Hi,

I get seasonal floods on my email account -- so, the idea seems fairly popular. In the US, people have trouble finding T8 supplies - not sure why since most new building construction is required to use T8s or lower power versions of T12. 40W T12s are not allowed since the early 90s. But, the feedback has been quite good. Also, T8s are harder to find in colours other than 3100K, 4000K and 6500K.

As for using T12s. I have tried overdrive T12s with the T8 ballast. I get roughly the same performance as Icecap with 3x or 2x overdrive.

The true test is long term reliability of the setup. Ballasts look fine. At 6 months, bulbs look pretty good. I might replace them to see if there is any preceivable difference. 6500K do pretty well, but actinics aren't so hot. They lasted about 2 to 3 months and their awww factor sort of fizzled out. I am using T8 actinics...I might try T12s and see if they last longer.

- Victor.

[AJ_77]

Hey Jonathan,

This is the quote from Victor's post I mentioned to you tonight:

"The Measurements:
This is for a 90 gal (48x18x24) tank. It has a 5 inch DSB and the lights are 5 inches from the water. I have two overdrive lamps - two 6500K. I will be adding a third, but it will be actinic.

My lighting measurements are the following:

At the surface, 16000 to 20000 lux.
At middle of tank, 7000 lux.
At bottom of the tank. 4500 lux.

BTW, usually 2x175W MH produce this much light. It is also...encroaching the 2x250W area."

He's running 2 lamps? I'm going to run 2 lamps, plus the 2 actinics on the other e-ballast. Why am I going to spend money I don't have right now for MH, when I can get near the output?

How cool is this? Your tank is off the charts by now, with the tubes you're running.

Alan

[Canadian Man]

Well i agree with that. the mesurements were taken with his camera on the outside of the tank so dont know how accurate they are but i do like my lighting and it works for me.

I look foreward to helping you wire that other ballast soon!

[Delphinus]

I've looked at this thread, replied, deleted that reply, replied again, deleted that reply ...

I just don't know how I want to respond, I guess.

Going with MH is not all bad. It's not as bad as you make it sound to be. Granted, the cost of the bulbs is not very attractive. But, there are always options for the creative minded. For example, look at Dez's tank, lit by single 400W bulb that didnt cost him very much. He uses a photographic blue filter that shifts the colour of the tank to something moderately comparable to a high-K bulb (not quite, but pretty close).

I guess, what it comes down to, whatever floats your boat, it's cool. I know many tanks that aren't lit by halides, and they look nice. I personally still prefer the look of point light sources .... and I think that's cool, too.

I think, if you ever do get past that initial reluctance, after a year or so you'll wonder why you ever bothered resisting. But, maybe not. It does depend on what your goals are and what you hope to have in your tank. Halides aren't a "requirement" of reefkeeping by any stretch, I happen to make them the lighting of my choice, but that's just me, and everyone's preferences will be their own.

[Dez]

Alan...

If you want to go with halides... (I heard my name mentioned smile.gif )...then a really cheap way to go is to go to the hydroponics store and buy a complete metal halide balast system (it's only $100 here in Edmonton) and use a cheap bulb. The filter I'm using is from a lighting place and they have charts to help you select what colour you want. For example, on one of the charts it says this filter will let 70% of the light through boosting a 3500K colour bulb to a 6500K bulb. If you're starting with a 4000K bulb, then your laughing. Your intensity of light goes down (only 70% of 400w), but it's cheap, and the balasts are made for those bulbs....I can't even hear any hum to the balast and it comes with the box and everything. Don't you have a 250W Metal halide already? The filters are meant to take high heat with 1000watt bulbs. I tested it on the stove, and I simply have to change the filters every 2- 3 months. But the filter costs $7 enough for 4 changes.... Are you going to be going with overdriven bulbs? On my system I've combind a whole bunch of diffent lighting, I've got the halides, I've got 4 NO bulbs 3 actinic and one daylight, and I also have a tiny PC 7200k that I found. I'm thinking of adding one of those screw in PC lights...they give off a whole bunch of light and act sort of like a point source light, giving a shimmering effect. Anyway, let me know what you decide...I always like knowing about other's systems. And I am coming on mothers day, I can bring you a frag of the pulsing stuff...One other thing is get Bob's PC light fixture and take that apart and retro fit it into your hood. That's a very easy way to fit 110w more lighting under the hood. Your tank's 4 feet right?

desmond

[ 08 May 2002, 09:00: Message edited by: Dez ]

[AJ_77]

"...a really cheap way to go is to go to the hydroponics store and buy a complete metal halide balast system (it's only $100 here in Edmonton) and use a cheap bulb."

OK - hi Des - what wattage ballast do you use? What model bulb? From the same store?

"The filter I'm using is from a lighting place and they have charts to help you select what colour you want."

What kind of "lighting place?" Photo?

"Don't you have a 250W Metal halide already? The filters are meant to take high heat with 1000watt bulbs."

Yes I do - in a spider-type reflector. How and where does the filter attach? On or near the bulb?

"Are you going to be going with overdriven bulbs? On my system I've combind a whole bunch of diffent lighting..."

I have 2 NO overdriven 2x and 2 actinic on an e-ballast, all 48 inches. My goal is to get the most light for the least cost in the smallest space. To fit MH into the hood will require carpentry. To go with more overdriven NO's is easy and cheap, for now. To go the full meal deal (retrofitted, overdriven, colour shifted, whatever combination I settle on) will require more cash than is available at this time. :(

So I budget and wait.

I'd be happy to greet you if you're in my end of town this weekend. Maybe save the frags for Eli, I have an offer for all the xenia I can handle from delphinus here. (Unless of course yours is white Fiji pom-pom; that's cool stuff.) ;) Or Rob's green brain - how much do you thin he'd take for it? smile.gif

Alan
-----------------------------
"One of these days, I'm gonna see the hands that took the nails for me."

[ 08 May 2002, 09:35: Message edited by: AJ_77 ]

[Dez]

"OK - hi Des - what wattage ballast do you use? What model bulb? From the same store?"

I bought my halides used but the guy told me it was from the hydroponics store and I checked it out and sure enough it's a $100. The bulb is from the same store...you can usually get cheap bulbs for under $50. I use a ballast meant for the 400 watt bulb...just a standard hydroponics one

"What kind of "lighting place?" Photo?"

It's actually a theatre lighting place. Eli should know a place in Calgary that sells em, I saw some of those charts in his baseme"nt

"Yes I do - in a spider-type reflector. How and where does the filter attach? On or near the bulb?"

The filter is just put on a piece of glass...it's just like a celophane sheet... It works very well..I have it about an inch away from the bulb. I've never had a problem with any kind of algae...so it's giving good light, and my acropora is reviving under that light. I got a really beat up acropora and it's been over a month and it's getting a nice pink colour to it now...it was brown when I got it...

"I have 2 NO overdriven 2x and 2 actinic on an e-ballast, all 48 inches. My goal is to get the most light for the least cost in the smallest space. To fit MH into the hood will require carpentry. To go with more overdriven NO's is easy and cheap, for now. To go the full meal deal (retrofitted, overdriven, colour shifted, whatever combination I settle on) will require more cash than is available at this time."

If you go with more overdriven NO's, then the ballasts are pretty expenxive right? In the almost $40 range? If you get the halide set up...it would cost you $100 plus a bulb, so maybe $150. In terms of carpentry, You need to raise the hood right? Well...talk to Eli, he runs his bulb like an inch above the water with no shield and he's never had a problem. I was surprised. Are you seriously wanting to get rid of your 250W halide system?

"So I budget and wait."

Yes Budgeting is a good thing...Be creative smile.gif

"I'd be happy to greet you if you're in my end of town this weekend. Maybe save the frags for Eli, I have an offer for all the xenia I can handle from delphinus here. (Unless of course yours is white Fiji pom-pom; that's cool stuff.) Or Rob's green brain - how much do you thin he'd take for it?"

My xenia is the pom-pom type....he he. I don't know what Rob would want for the green brain. He's a really nice guy and very generous. We've helped each other out and last night I actually built him a hood with PC lighting... What end of town are you in? I'd love to meet you, but I don't know if there is time...like I said, family is always first. Consider the halide option. My hood is 6 inches tall I think only. I saw a picture of your box. I started with 6 NO bulbs and now they're just sitting in my basement because I switched to halides less than a month into the hobby. NO bulbs add up and they aren't that cheap.. Thanks Alan...

des

[AJ_77]

I'm in the Valley of Indecision, but I have to do something soon. Got corals now, ;) .

Will keep the MH for now, until I know where to go with it. Have 1 more ballast for OD-ing one more tube, so that would be a snap.

As for my neighbourhood, it's called Tuscany and is at the corner of Crowchild and Stoney Trails in the NW. More west than north, almost up the hill from the Bearspaw Dam on the Bow river. (20 minutes from Eli.)

I think you have my phone #. You're right, family is first, but we'd be happy to meet you both. We're doing Mother's Day on Saturday.

Cheers,

Alan

[ 08 May 2002, 10:28: Message edited by: AJ_77 ]

[Dez]

Hmmm...Tuscany... That is far!!! I used to live in Brentwood... It's way out by Cochrane... well, I'm exagerating. As for the pom pom, you can have it. If you have something later on, that'd be great, but it's yours. It's only individual stalks that have attached onto rubble, so it should grow nicely. Have you been to Eli's? You can meet me there, I'll only be stopping there cause he won't be home, but I'll drop it off with his wife or brother. What I can do is drop off the frag at Eli's and you can pick it up from him later. I'd like to meet you though. I don't have a cell phone, but I can call you before I leave and it usually takes 2 3/4 hours to get to Eli's. I'll pack it nice in styrofoam container to keep the temperature and stuff.....

alright...I enjoy communicating with you Calgary folks...it's my home where I grew up smile.gif

des

PS... Where did you get the E-ballast for overdriving NO's, I've been thinking about doing that for a while... and how much are they?

[ 08 May 2002, 15:00: Message edited by: Dez ]

[AJ_77]

Brentwood? I grew up in Brentwood, on Bennett Crescent, off of Northmount Drive down the street from the 7-11. We have history, Des? I lived there from 1965 to 1981; my parents just moved last year.

Too cool. And hey, if you can give me an ETA for Eli's place, I'll do my darndest to be there. It would be much better to meet, and better for the frag also, yes?

Less trauma. ;)

Alan

*The ballasts are from Home Depot, regular $30, on sale from Bob for $15. smile.gif Victor (reefburnaby) names an Advance ballast in his original thread, and Jonathan uses ??? (I forget).

Have you read this? http://www.reefcentral.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=eec96deec9e792d6b8e624ffe8704bcc&threadid=48133

[ 08 May 2002, 15:13: Message edited by: AJ_77 ]

[Dez]

Yeah... I lived on Northmount Drive a block from the 7-ll (1432 Northmount Dr), and then I lived on Bachelor Cres half a block from there for like 8 years. Then I came to Edmonton...why did I ever move? I attended that church beside Brentwood Mall.... (Brentview Baptist). What is an ETA? We'd have to meet outside his house though....Cause he won't be there...hopefully you won't have snow...he he he... I'll call you with info...

des

Does Bob have more ballasts?

[ 08 May 2002, 15:11: Message edited by: Dez ]

[AJ_77]

We were neighbours. When did you move? WHY is a different story.

Sure I could wait for you outside Eli's. ETA is Estimated Time of Arrival.

Bob got a couple of ballasts when they were on sale, but they're gone now, sorry. They were Philips.

What day are you coming down?

Alan

[Dez]

I was there from I think 88 to 97... So you had moved already. I lived in Beddington heights before. I'll call you...and we'll chat more... See you Sunday

des