Help Asap!!!!

[pre-2k]

On Mon. Feb. 12/06 I did a 20% water change on my 120gal. I checked my ammonia, nitrate, nitrite and ph levels. My ph was at 8.2; nitrite is at zero; nitrate was at 20ppm; and ammonia was at 0.5ppm. A couple of days later I did another water change of 10%. My levels all remained the same. And today i did a 50% water change and checked the levels and they all are still the same. I did not add anything new to the tank in the last 2 weeks and feeding is the same (once a day), the only thing I added new was reef roids.

Tank Info:
-120gal
-170 + lbs of LR
-3-4 inches of sandbed
-1 tang, 2 yellow wrasse, 1 dragon goby, 1 zebra goby, 1 lawnmower blenny, 1 per. clown, 1 blue damsel, 1 ladder goby, 1 horseshoe crab, 1 molly, 1 leopard wrasse
-4 assorted anemones, star polyps, fox coral, pulsing xenia, button polyps, toadstools, assorted mushrooms, flower pot
-inverts
- tank has been established for 5 months
-also have a 30gal sump, protein skimmer, cannister filter, overflow box
-lighting-2-175w MH, 2-VHO actinics, 4-40w Pcs

Can anybody help me solve the levels of nitrate and ammonia in my tank???:sad:

[mr_alberta]

Did you check the levels of the source water? Another possibility is bad/inaccurate test kits.

[pre-2k]

Hi Mr. Alberta just wondering what u mean when u said source water. Do u mean tap water?

[pre-2k]

also, my test kit is new, just got it 2 months ago-its a saltwater master liquid test kit

[mr_alberta]

I mean test the water you are using to make new saltwater. Also, regardless of when you got your test kit, you should compare it to another (take a sample to the store or a buddy to test).

[pre-2k]

just tested my source water and the ph is 7.4, nitrite is zero, nitrate is zero and ammonia is 1.0ppm

[Ruth]

IMO your test kit is out of whack if your getting that high of ammonia from your source water. Are you using an RODI filter kit or just using straight tap water? My experience is that "most" tap water is not very good to use for reef keeping and I would highly recommend that you use RODI water for your source water.
If I was you I would take a water sample into your LFS and have them test it or if you have a friend with a different set of test kits have them test it to see if you get the same readings.

[Beverly]

Pre-2k's test kit is accurate. She is using Edmonton tapwater which is treated with chloramine. Chloramine is a compound of chlorine and ammonia, and there is about 1 ppm ammonia in Edmonton's tapwater. When chloramine is neutralized with, say, Prime, non-toxic ammonium is formed. Many test kits will read the ammonium as ammonia.

However, ammonium will still be processed in the tank by bacteria into nitrite then into nitrate. Really, to solve this problem, RO or distilled water should be used instead of tapwater.

[pre-2k]

going to my LFS today but this has NEVER happen b4 ???????? with tap water .................... i guess ill have to c what happen to day :cry:

[Beverly]

going to my LFS today but this has NEVER happen b4 ???????? with tap water

If you've been using tapwater all this time, you have been adding about 1 ppm ammonia/ammonium in your new salt water. In the spring, with all kinds of extra stuff in the river's water, ammonia levels probably rise above 1 ppm when they increase the chloramine levels. Your lfs may not know this, but I hope they do.

BTW, what test kit are you using? Are you using a dechlorinator along with your salt in the tapwater?

I did a quick test of unsalted tapwater using an Aquarium Pharmaceutical ammonia test kit:

Tapwater without Prime - 1 ppm ammonia

Tapwater Treated with Prime - 0 pmm ammonia

The fact is that ammonia is present in Edmonton's tapwater. After treatment with a dechlorinator, Edmonton's tapwater will have the same amount of ammonium as there was of ammonia before using a dechlorinator.

[pre-2k]

ok i got my water test n the LFS told me that its a bit high but didt tell me how high but he told me my test kit its not the best 1 i can buy (saltwater master liquid test kit) told me to get a new 1 but 4 now i have to treat my 120g tank as a new tank ..............:cry: he told me i can take all the Corals
n fish out n let the 120T sit 4 1-2 weeks with out water change n add stability ..... so what do u reefers think ????????? plz help all the Corals n fish looks good

if ne 1 like to take a look at the tank just pm me ok

thnx 4 ne help
chris

[Beverly]

Which store told you this???!!??? Did you tell them you use tapwater?

BTW, do you treat your tapwater with a dechlorinator?

Also, how long have you had your tank running?

Sorry, but I am having some trouble reading your abbreviated words and don't understand some of what you write. Could you please write in standard English :smile:

[Myanth]

Edmonton city tap water is BAD. As Bev says, ammonia will be present as well as the chlorine. Letting your tapwater sit will let the chlorine dissipate but the ammonia will be present. Use Prime to make it non-toxic.

Good luck.

[Beverly]

Because chloramine is a chemically bound compound, the chlorine will not dissapate but remain bound to the ammonia if left to sit.

Years ago, when only chlorine was used in Edmonton's tapwater, if tapwater was left to sit, indeed the chlorine would dissapate and there would be no ammonia present.

Using a dechlorinator designed for use with chloramine, such as Prime and Amquel (and probably others), will neutralize the chlorine and convert the toxic ammonia to non-toxic ammonium.

[pre-2k]

good news:mrgreen: , just tested my water and the ammonia is at zero, nitrate is at 10ppm, ph is at 8.2, and nitrite is at zero.

anyways I went to my LFS (not mentioning btw) and I spoke to someone there and this person said that something is wrong with my cycle and that I need to treat my 120gal like a brand new tank. Also this person said that I don't have a good test kit and should purchase a new one asap. Also that I should take out all my fish and corals and put them in a QT for about 1-2 weeks. Also don't do any water changes for 2 weeks. This person also told me that I should be adding bacteria and new tank stabilizing solution as directed and also to add Prime as well until my tank is stable.

So what's your opinion(s) and/or advice towards the advice given to me above?


Thanks to Mr. Alberta, Ruth, Beverly, and Myanth for your help and info!

[Beverly]

Chris,

Your tank has been set up for 5 months. It has cycled by now, unless something large has died and you haven't noticed.

However, your later tests conclude that you have 0 ppm amonia and nitrite, and 10 ppm nitrate. I don't think there is a problem with your cycle, and probably nothing has died in the tank, otherwise ammonia levels would still be at least 1 ppm.

To be on the safe side, do the ammonia and nitrite tests again today to confirm your last test results. If they continue to be 0 ppm, I would not remove anything from your reef.

There are several questions about your tank and how you treat your tapwater that have gone unanswered. These answers would sure help me better understand what's going on in your tank.

[midgetwaiter]

This person also told me that I should be adding bacteria and new tank stabilizing solution as directed and also to add Prime as well until my tank is stable.

So what's your opinion(s) and/or advice towards the advice given to me above?


There are 2 problems with the above advice.

1. There are no true LIVE bacteria products available in Canada. NONE. You would have to take something from an established tank.

2. New tank stabilizing solution does one thing. It breaks wastes into more basic components, like ammonia faster. This helps provide available food for your bacteria colonies to establish themselves in a new tank. In your specific situation, this could completely screw you over.

You need to just chill and keep an eye on things. You said it yourself, "all the fish and corals look fine". Why would you start moving everything into a QT, risking stress and damage? Take it easy, ease up on feeding and keep an eye on it, it will probably sort itself out.

[Myanth]

Thanks Bev. I had no idea that chlorine is not added but chlorimine. Learn something new everyday. I live on an acreage and add chlorine to my water but I have a carbon filter after the chlorine pump and then use a membrane nano filter after that for any disolved solids (well 70%).

[TheReefGeek]

Pre-2k, why wont you mention which LFS you talked to? We are hear to learn about the hobby, and the various LFS are a big part of the hobby.

Their advise was wrong, Bev proved why your kit showed 1ppm ammonia, she took the time to test the city water for you before and after treatment with Prime.

Long term to solve your problem you need to use distilled or RO/RODI water, not treated city water for your tank.